At the world now, went to DVC tour today, didnt buy here is why

[nolanboys]

things like people paying dirt cheap prices for ssr, we should not
be in competition with. of course, vice versa for ssr rooms.

We bought a SSR resale contract this spring. We thought about buying into DVC for 5 years and thoroughly researched. We were able to buy more points for less money than what Disney offered. We are not in competition with you for the first 5 mo of the year. That's what your membership at BLT got you - just as I get 5 mo of no competition for the THV. I personally do not want to stay at the same resort every time we go to WDW - I like variety and even prefer to do split stays. No matter where I would have bought in, I would still want to try different resorts. We did tour SSR and loved it. We bought it for the longer contract (also looked at OKW) and lower dues. I may want to try BLT in the future, but the points needed to stay there will deter me from doing it frequently. We bought into DVC for it's flexibility to stay at different resorts. Even when we weren't members, we tried a different resort each time.

 

[jsivigny]

Nolanboys...well said. Flexibility, value, up front costs, annual dues rates, home resort benefits all factor into the equation on how to purchase.

 

[Dean]

now,i am taking an interest in this "gift". our points , cost more than
our first house. no body gave us a thing. & we build our fortunes
one dollar @ a time. however, all we expect, is to be able to have
a one-bedroom , mk . view [ just like we were promised-, does not
have to be the best or the highest] , and we will be very happy.
booking @ 11mos..

If you were promised that you could reserve every time, you were promised something the system cannot guarantee. Depending on how you approach it and when you want to go, you may be successful every time or you may not. There are no guarantees there and you should not expect any.

things like people paying dirt cheap prices for ssr, we should not
be in competition with. of course, vice versa for ssr rooms.

I'm not really sure what you mean by this. IMO, the price paid per se has nothing to do with the options or rights available. It may end up being true that some have less options than others due to how they bought if they take away system benefits for resale and that will end up being a different price. You're never in competition with other members inside the 11 month window and you always are at 7 months or after.

however, i think there are some very capable people here working
for disney. dvc, by it very nature is different than a time share, if
it potential was recognized. maybe for example dvc should take
away any resort exchanges but make it possible for owners to do their
own exchanging.

I would disagree that Disney is much different than many other timeshares other than it's location for some of the resorts. I think it's more that you've assumed it's different more than it is. Some other systems are just as flexible and in some ways, more so. I'd love it if we could list the timeshare directly with RCI or II, that option would be best for those of us who have memberships in one or both already but it would be worse for those who want the option or want to exchange rarely.

the way we see our purchased...we brought a blt room for 60 years.
we didn't do this to make money off it but to used it for our disney
vacations.

IMO, it's irrelevant why anyone bought or why they cont to own. All that matters in the end is what the rules are and how they work or don't work for a given group.

and this is also where i have concerns over renters. they stuck out
@ our first trip and were more aggressive/abusive toward the things
i saw. "renting" was an issue that disney neglect to informed us.
[ very much like someone selling an house with a major fault that is
hidden.] so @ first, i was not a fan of this dave guy. but after
reading all the problems here, i think disney needs to defers renting
thru such professionals, so "control measures" in place. to prevent
rip offs.[ both ways], & limit the manipulation. though i was unsuccessful
in getting specifics, his success rates left me with the conclusion that
renting can be done if set up right. which he seem to have accomplished.

Once again it's because you failed to read the paperwork (POS) which clearly states that renting is a guaranteed right of ownership (within guidelines). Plus you've been a member of DIS long enough prior to buying that you should have known about renting from here as well.

renters here have alarmed me, by their intentions. one example, they
know they are not supposed to go to towl but over & over , they
posted how they are going to try. very similar to the brazilians . no respect
for the rules or other guests. then i read those sneaking in on the bridge
to watch fireworks, were also leaving all their trash. it just my opinion, but
the lake views + castle should always go to blt owners first, dvc
owners next then renters if any left over. nor do we want to have a
room that was trashed.

I think you're making assumptions that simply are not true. First, I see no evidence that the average owner treats DVC as well as they do their own things, some do, but not on average. Even for owners, it's almost exactly like a rental car, anyone that wants to make the case otherwise is kidding themselves. I also see no evidence that those renting are more abusive than owners and have seen some evidence that renters, esp those that are only going once or twice, are more appreciative and careful than owners. In addition, I've discussed this issue now with 3 different Marriott Vacation Club resort managers, all said they didn't see any difference based on owner vs renter (cash or from owners) but that they did see a difference based on demographics. None had formal information, just their impression based on experiences. Basically a family tended to do much better than a room full of spring break teens.

 

[cm8]

Agree.. I would check resale.. research.. then make the best educated decision I could.

This, I think we would be interesting in doing the same

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

i did not assume nothing except what others reported as facts.
then only , making a conclusion based on many reporting the
same thing. however, based on our own experiences, you will
have to take my word or chose not to believe. [ the thing about
reality, it can be depended on to support one in the future. &
it is real easy to recall the truth.]

as for competition, talking about rooms selection. owners should
have the right over others. for example, there are all kind of
"groupings" @ any resort. those who are owners should have
right to "first requests"...then other owners. renters' requests
should be last. it is easy for us to get the revs @ blt. however,
as many others observed here, certain locations & rooms are
more desirable than others. [ we knew this as soon as we saw
blt, and this was something we asked about on what we
could expect. that has not changed.]

now i been listening to the other argument, that "other" owners
renters are in line for best rooms same as the owners per check in,
just the way dvc has always been done. too bad. maybe, for
some ,but this was a pre-sale topic that we made sure of, before
buying. if guides did not work for dvc, then i wouldn't have
expected this. [ per resales market]. if you own @ ssr, then
you should have the first choice there but not @ blt. that was
the point, not "booking times". to me, it is the same as getting
first choice for the tree houses, a real benefit. if you have the
same op to have the rooms with partial mk views then why
shouldn't blt owners have the same chance @ tree houses?
[ same for all the resorts with their special perks, & it is
self evident that blt's perk is location, & why i think others
are trying to block it. ]



just wondering n.boys...., i don't doubt your feelings toward the
resort you own at. [ when we evaluated ssr, there were many things
we felt "matched" our desires. however, our choice was stronger
for how we plan to "do" our wdw vacations.] but how often have
you stay @ ssr & then @ the other resorts? do you feel
blt owners should have the same chance @ the tree houses for
having the same exchange for a partial mk view when booking
lake views? [ i hope you express your feelings] tia.


...i am not good @ doing internet "talk".
however,my observations are not meant to be personal or based on
a single reflection. instead , it are the trends that i think is the
most reliable "source". for example, the recent thread about towl
lounge...i felt had strong merit. who's really knows how special
the poncho was? what i read, the org. poster felt it was stolen.
at first, i felt it was an accident. but that was before another
poster, stating "how easy" to sneak up.
* i was alarmed, because of the implications. [ guests who
think nothing of breaking the rules, & going to this extent,
are also more likely to take advantage of others' property? did
she care about taking a space that others paid for? in
specfic details, she explained how she "skipped" all the
security measures, for otehrs to read...& those facts revealed
what others could expect from her. ]

we have had many negative experiences of disney guests stealing
from us. on the pc. cruise when the cleaning worker left our
door opened, another guest stole my lil'girl's "princess peach's
game system. caught a woman using one of those scooter trying
to "steal" her tinker bell 's laynard. just this trip, @ ak , i knew
a woman leaving her small kids to sit by my daughter , was
up to something. we didn't find out until the next ride, & her
sunglasses were stolen. we do not think those breaking
the laws is something to do with disney. disney is in the people
business, & anytime there are large groups , there are risk
factors.

 

[nolanboys]

just wondering n.boys...., i don't doubt your feelings toward the
resort you own at. [ when we evaluated ssr, there were many things
we felt "matched" our desires. however, our choice was stronger
for how we plan to "do" our wdw vacations.] but how often have
you stay @ ssr & then @ the other resorts? do you feel
blt owners should have the same chance @ the tree houses for
having the same exchange for a partial mk view when booking
lake views? [ i hope you express your feelings] tia.

I guess I am confused by your question. We personally prefer to be away from the parks when we are not in them. We tend to relax more instead of go, go, go. SSR, AKV, and OKW appeal to us more for that reason. THat being said, we also like to try the other resorts. The points at each resort are different and BLT lake views are more than SSR. So if I do get a BLT lv and there happpens to be a partial mk view, I'm still spending more points than I would have at SSR. I can't even try to do that until the 7 mo mark. You could book that BLT room before me and request a room. I know there is a thread for BLT that shows what the room view is from many of them. I don't understand why you say "same exchange"?I know if I want to get a treehouse - which is what works well for my family - I have to call early. It is the same for AKV concierge, BWV boardwalk view, OKW grand villa to name a few popular categories of rooms. People buy into those resorts for that purpose. I feel like we researched well before we made this purchse and got the most bang for our buck at a resort that has a type of room we love. Again, you have 5 mo before I can impact your ability to book at your resort. And if the categories of the rooms at BLT are not what they are supposed to be, that needs to be taken up with MS or the CMs upon check-in. I have nothing to do with how DVC places a room in any given category. Oh, and I plan on doing a split stay for most trips if possible and if we are staying a week. Had I bought into any other resort, that would still be my plan. If it doesn't work out - for example, I only want a dedicated 2 bdrm with 2 qu beds- so no BWV - than I will have a lovely stay only at SSR. Sorry if this didn't answer your question.

 

[Dean]

i did not assume nothing except what others reported as facts.
then only , making a conclusion based on many reporting the
same thing. however, based on our own experiences, you will
have to take my word or chose not to believe. [ the thing about
reality, it can be depended on to support one in the future. &
it is real easy to recall the truth.]

It's hard to know for sure when you are so vague about such topics. However, you stated on a previous thread that you were made promises that were not coming to pass and had/were complaining to Disney about it to the tune you insisted that you be able to sit down with DVC and your guide on the matter, IF IIRC. You also stated above that Disney failed to inform you about renting, which is what I was referring to, and I'm pointing out they did in the form of supplying you with the POS which clearly defines that renting is allowed.

as for competition, talking about rooms selection. owners should
have the right over others. for example, there are all kind of
"groupings" @ any resort. those who are owners should have
right to "first requests"...then other owners. renters' requests
should be last. it is easy for us to get the revs @ blt. however,
as many others observed here, certain locations & rooms are
more desirable than others. [ we knew this as soon as we saw
blt, and this was something we asked about on what we
could expect. that has not changed.

now i been listening to the other argument, that "other" owners
renters are in line for best rooms same as the owners per check in,
just the way dvc has always been done. too bad. maybe, for
some ,but this was a pre-sale topic that we made sure of, before
buying. if guides did not work for dvc, then i wouldn't have
expected this. [ per resales market]. if you own @ ssr, then
you should have the first choice there but not @ blt. that was
the point, not "booking times". to me, it is the same as getting
first choice for the tree houses, a real benefit. if you have the
same op to have the rooms with partial mk views then why
shouldn't blt owners have the same chance @ tree houses?
[ same for all the resorts with their special perks, & it is
self evident that blt's perk is location, & why i think others
are trying to block it.

No argument that owners at a given resort should have first crack though I'd include an owner renting out their points as the same as an owner using it themselves. And they do have the right to reservations using the home resort priority. I believe DVC should do more to benefit those owners in terms of unit assignment preferences. Unfortunately that's the way the system works right now

just wondering n.boys...., i don't doubt your feelings toward the
resort you own at. [ when we evaluated ssr, there were many things
we felt "matched" our desires. however, our choice was stronger
for how we plan to "do" our wdw vacations.] but how often have
you stay @ ssr & then @ the other resorts? do you feel
blt owners should have the same chance @ the tree houses for
having the same exchange for a partial mk view when booking
lake views? [ i hope you express your feelings] tia.

As I mentioned above, I'm very pro owners at a given resort having more priorities and others less. However, when you have a direct booking system, you are bound by that. Once the 7 month window opens, any units, not matter how desirable, become available to the general DVC membership. Even canceled reservation are treated this way to a degree subject to the limitations and structure of the wait list which is functional but not perfect.

...i am not good @ doing internet "talk".
however,my observations are not meant to be personal or based on
a single reflection. instead , it are the trends that i think is the
most reliable "source".

I have noticed your posting style is different and I often have trouble following your points both due to your style and that you do not quote or respond directly. However, accounting for all of that and giving you every benefit of the doubt I can, I have found your posts to be insulting at times and likely you mine as I responded accordingly.

for example, the recent thread about towl
lounge...i felt had strong merit. who's really knows how special
the poncho was? what i read, the org. poster felt it was stolen.
at first, i felt it was an accident. but that was before another
poster, stating "how easy" to sneak up.
* i was alarmed, because of the implications. [ guests who
think nothing of breaking the rules, & going to this extent,
are also more likely to take advantage of others' property? did
she care about taking a space that others paid for? in
specfic details, she explained how she "skipped" all the
security measures, for otehrs to read...& those facts revealed
what others could expect from her. ]

we have had many negative experiences of disney guests stealing
from us. on the pc. cruise when the cleaning worker left our
door opened, another guest stole my lil'girl's "princess peach's
game system. caught a woman using one of those scooter trying
to "steal" her tinker bell 's laynard. just this trip, @ ak , i knew
a woman leaving her small kids to sit by my daughter , was
up to something. we didn't find out until the next ride, & her
sunglasses were stolen. we do not think those breaking
the laws is something to do with disney. disney is in the people
business, & anytime there are large groups , there are risk
factors.

Unfortunately there are many unscrupulous people out there and some are DVC members. In many ways Disney seems to bring out the worse in many people, just stand in the lobby and watch/listen to people complain about rooms, preferences, etc. That's one of the reasons I pointed out the error in your assumption that DVC members would treat the villas/etc better than renters, the information simply doesn't bear it out given the set up nor does common sense. The exception MIGHT be a timeshare where you had the same unit every time but those type of timeshares are not very common any more. While I've owned them in the past, I no longer own any of them and haven't in 5 years.

 

[quandrea]

No need to rush things, I would first compare what's available on the resale market and also learn all you can about how DVC works etc.

Also, if you live in the US, I think you can buy pretty much anytime you want, especially resale. If you live outside the US, like me, Disney will only work with you while you are there, but resale still should be possible. So no need to rush things.

I live in Canada, and we did the deal via phone. No need to rush.

 

[luvlivn]

I live in Canada, and we did the deal via phone. No need to rush.

Something to note though..if you are buying direct from Disney there is only one or two Canadian provinces that you can do the deal from, without being in Florida..

Resale purchase was wonderfully easy from Canada...

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

o0ps, i forgotten about this thread. so sorry,



...when deciding on blt, it was quick, 2009. however, we had
already been window shopping since 2002. i thought our
primary reasons would matched up with the majority here, but
that turned out not to be the case. 4-ex. , one of our
reasons....came from what my parents passed on....chose
quality , over a few dollars more. therefore, the blt connection to
magic kingdom, meant a great value over going resales.
however, i can see why ....other resorts would have
different quality "issues" , that would make it a better deal for
them.

i also think ssr isolation is a bonus, a big bonus.
the tree houses also rank high with me. but our disney vacations
is all about family get~together , and that was more important
over all. also we did the 2008 pc cruise & we like something
that could get us some trade value for disneyland. we have
done dcl cruises, & with the ships going west, also made
us lean in that direction.


what we don't have, is the same outlook or expectation for the rooms.
per say, as long as the room is clean & we're on disney property, we
pretty darn happy. we "adjust" to the room. some of my favorite times
were made up. port orleans, early morning walks ....by the inlet, &
watching the wildlife. @ cor. spr., the was an old retiree driving the golf
cart. i spent times riding with him & picking up guests , passing out his
disney stickers. that was alot fun.



i also saw, you like to bounce around. if that would have been"best"
for us...would have gotten 3- "100" point contacts @ 3 different
resorts. in that way, we would rotate each year, all around. we
thought long & hard, toward animal kingdom. you mentioned blt
requiring extra points. that is why we switched all our extra points
to blt.

fate. our table mates during the 08 pc cruise, are dvc members ,
@ ssr. we ran into her @ mk , of all places. her input also had an
effect on us buying @ blt. we also had a very special trip @ that
wing back in 2006.

mr d., i have read many of your responses because they come across
as being accurate and covering details others are missing. obviously,
you have insights of a professional. my guess, you have been doing
it for a long time. i have no background in timeshares. however, i am
in the "people business", & it has helped me figure out some of the
dynamics regarding dvc. furthermore, some of the things being
revealed here as a "group @ large" are very alarming to our investment.

for ex. the guides.

a guide isn't the same as salesperson. many responded with that
comment regarding problems. webster define one who lead or directs
another on his way. # 2.manage. sales is not the same. it would be a
tort for dvc to used this instead of salesperson because they are
making monies off any guide making bogus promises. we trusted
disney to place a greater value on their integrity than tricking us
into something the guide had no intentions honoring.

one of the biggest thing i realized reading here? these guides don't
have sop's & are getting a good one is very difficult. ours made
a huge commission off us because of the number of points we
brought. the fact that he thought nothing about dumping us,
before our first revs.. it should mean, our monies, go to another
that would be willing to help us. also just be reading/gathering
info here, most are owners & they are doing things they
should not...

even though i don't always agree with your observations , does
not mean i don't respect them. and another reason we did buy,
our previous experiences with disney & their preference to do
problem solving & corrective measures. i don't mind working with them.
so if you know of an accomplished guide, we would be willing to change.







thank you also for your observations. yes, i think your assessment
is correct as it is sad. the lady @ animal k., bothered me most because i
noticed her behaviors as being suspicious & failed to catch her. fyi,
i am paying more attention to those displaying out of the ordinary
behaviors.

 

[Dean]

We've been involved in timeshares since 1994, DVC was our first experience and is our first love.

for ex. the guides.

a guide isn't the same as salesperson. many responded with that
comment regarding problems. webster define one who lead or directs
another on his way. # 2.manage. sales is not the same. it would be a
tort for dvc to used this instead of salesperson because they are
making monies off any guide making bogus promises. we trusted
disney to place a greater value on their integrity than tricking us
into something the guide had no intentions honoring.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the idea that guide equals salesperson, it does with DVC, plain and simple. No liability with them using this terminology. You've alluded to this issue with the guides several times and while I respect your right to not disclose details, you can't have it both ways. You can't use it as an issue, keep referring to it but not disclose the specifics, at least not reasonably. As I told you before, I think you have had unreasonable expectations in some of these areas and holding DVC to a higher standard certainly borders on that as well.

...when deciding on blt, it was quick, 2009. however, we had
already been window shopping since 2002. i thought our
primary reasons would matched up with the majority here, but
that turned out not to be the case.

I don't think you're alone in the idea that you made assumptions on members reasons for buying and owning. On the extreme, some even bought simply to rent out, dumb choice in my book, but their choice never the less. Don't forget though that people's situations change over the years. We've been members over 16 years and our choices, options and knowledge has change dramatically over that time, esp over the last 11 years.

one of the biggest thing i realized reading here? these guides don't
have sop's & are getting a good one is very difficult. ours made
a huge commission off us because of the number of points we
brought. the fact that he thought nothing about dumping us,
before our first revs.. it should mean, our monies, go to another
that would be willing to help us. also just be reading/gathering
info here, most are owners & they are doing things they
should not...

As a rule I feel most guides are good at what they do, are fair, are appropriate and are honest. However, some don't quite live up to expectations and those will be gone before a long period of time. I don't know specifics but I'd be willing to bet that DVC has the most stringent training program and the best SOP both in appropriateness and in practice including discipline to the guides that stray. But they are not perfect and the pressures will be more going forward than in the past. You had a bad experience for whatever reason though my guess is it was more on your end than actually the guide but no way to know for sure at this point, maybe not ever. I say that because your other posts related to this and similar subject suggest you have expectations that are different than most.

 

[Jason@dvcstore]

Can someone convince me I am crazy for not buying?

$120/point for Bay View. I am looking for around 250ish points. I am a complete noob at this timeshare thing. They were offering a 10% discount on purchase price and a years points for this year before march of next year when you get 2011 points.

I just dont understand why I wouldnt buy secondary market. I may not understand all this, I like the idea and I like the flexibility, but I think the price is too steep for the current market

they wouldnt even talk about anything than Bay View, wouldnt show me numbers on Animal kingdom or sarasota

Any and all advice welcome. Here until Saturday

Thanks

I think you should take your time. Please feel free to visit The Timeshare Store, Inc.® at www.dvcstore.com and you can see our listings. You can also send us an email at sales@dvcstore.com with your full name and we can add you to our distribution list. We receive about 150 to 180 new listings every month and our inventory is constantly changing.

Jason

 

[photobob]

i haven't read this entire thread, my apologies if this has been covered.

Buy where you want to stay!

The only way I would buy BLT would be if BLT is the place I want to stay and you plan far enough ahead to make your reservations before the seventh month mark. Currently the main benefit to owning at a given resort is being able to book earlier than owners who have different home resort than do you. If you are a person that doesn't make reservations before the seven month mark, under current DVC rules it doesn't matter where you buy. If that were the case the cheapest points you could find would be your best option.