Arthritis and allergy medicine (Fexofenadine /AKA Allegra) ?

[bcla]

Uggh tremors, I had a scary thing with my heart & maybe vasovagal last summer probably autoimmune as my body was healing from surgery so the last thing I want is more scary stuff. I felt like a fainting goat anytime I got warm & don't want a repeat.

I have been breaking the 180 into roughly 1/3 pieces & even that makes me feel like I chugged a whole caf coffee all day, I don't do well clearing medicines and suspect a 24 hr 180 would mean I'd be up 2 full days.

I did call the Dr and will video tomorrow for some fine tuning

I don’t know exactly what to call it. I used to describe it as “the shakes”. I’d feel kind of spaced out and jittery, but not like a sedative or with a stimulant. I wasn’t really shaking heavily but my whole body just felt odd. Never had that feeling with 60 mg, which I would typically only take once a day, but if my allergies were really bad I might take it with Benadryl, which doctors and pharmacists said was OK.

Ideally I would take the 60 mg dose, but scoring a caplet perfectly isn’t easy and a pharmacist said in half should be good enough for me. But there are 60 mg versions. Maybe I’ll order it later. There’s name brand Allegra 12 Hour, but it’s a lot more than generic.

https://www.amazon.com/HealthA2Z®-Fexofenadine-Hydrochloride-Antihistamine-Non-Drowsy/dp/B0BLW8DJKB/

 

[LuvOrlando]

You might have a lower level MCAS (non-anaphylactic); it's unfortunately not really testable to get an exact diagnosis, it's more the assessment of symptoms and a some bloodwork looking at histamines, lipids, and proteins.

Also, the problem with low histamine diets is that there isn't any real science-based consensus on what kinds of foods are actually low histamine. That is, you could look at 10 different websites and get a number of answers on whether a particular food item is "safe" to eat. Here is a scientific review if you'd like to have a look:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8143338/
That's not to say that it isn't worth some trial and error to see what works for you. Just that it WILL take some trial and error.

Hmm, well the list provided is pretty much a list of things that give me migraines, I could add more but it is close enough to think that there is def a link. In general, I avoid these things already because I take the migraines as a nope.

Alcohol is the absolute worst where it's not an allergy exactly but my ears burn hot red and my face sometimes gets a bit numb. I can't have much, I giggle quickly & can't clear it so it's like I'm a teen who snuck into my parents stuff which is very glamorous BTW.

Mother nature made it so that all the fun stuff smites me, which I find very amusing to be honest - keeps me out of trouble

 

[LuvOrlando]

I don’t know exactly what to call it. I used to describe it as “the shakes”. I’d feel kind of spaced out and jittery, but not like a sedative or with a stimulant. I wasn’t really shaking heavily but my whole body just felt odd. Never had that feeling with 60 mg, which I would typically only take once a day, but if my allergies were really bad I might take it with Benadryl, which doctors and pharmacists said was OK.

Ideally I would take the 60 mg dose, but scoring a caplet perfectly isn’t easy and a pharmacist said in half should be good enough for me. But there are 60 mg versions. Maybe I’ll order it later. There’s name brand Allegra 12 Hour, but it’s a lot more than generic.

https://www.amazon.com/HealthA2Z®-Fexofenadine-Hydrochloride-Antihistamine-Non-Drowsy/dp/B0BLW8DJKB/

I've been imperfectly snapping the 180 we have with my tooth so I think there could be room for improvement

 

[bcla]

I've been imperfectly snapping the 180 we have with my tooth so I think there could be room for improvement

I still don't get why most medications aren't dosed by weight. It seems odd since many children's meds (including Allegra) are liquid and where there's a dosage by age and/or weight. I remember hearing from someone that it didn't make that much of a difference, but it didn't make much sense that a 275 lb man should take the same dose as a 120 lb woman.

When my wife was on meds for gestational diabetes, they even worked on customizing the dosage.

But some of the claims are that the human body is tolerant of different levels of medications, and it was more about safety than efficacy. But in my case I just couldn't take the 24 hour dose of Allegra. It's one size fits all and there are always so many variables including weight, age, body type, gender, etc. But my understanding of most nonprescription meds is that the most important thing is that an adult dose doesn't harm anyone.

 

[DLgal]

I still don't get why most medications aren't dosed by weight. It seems odd since many children's meds (including Allegra) are liquid and where there's a dosage by age and/or weight. I remember hearing from someone that it didn't make that much of a difference, but it didn't make much sense that a 275 lb man should take the same dose as a 120 lb woman.

When my wife was on meds for gestational diabetes, they even worked on customizing the dosage.

But some of the claims are that the human body is tolerant of different levels of medications, and it was more about safety than efficacy. But in my case I just couldn't take the 24 hour dose of Allegra. It's one size fits all and there are always so many variables including weight, age, body type, gender, etc. But my understanding of most nonprescription meds is that the most important thing is that an adult dose doesn't harm anyone.

Something like Allegra actually has a daily upper limit of 720mg. That 180mg dosage is "safe" for everyone 12 and up. But for awhile, I was on 3 of them per day, due to stubborn allergic hives. My allergist told me I could take up to 4 daily, 2 every 12 hours. I never got that to that point.

 

[LuvOrlando]

Something like Allegra actually has a daily upper limit of 720mg. That 180mg dosage is "safe" for everyone 12 and up. But for awhile, I was on 3 of them per day, due to stubborn allergic hives. My allergist told me I could take up to 4 daily, 2 every 12 hours. I never got that to that point.

Did it bother you at that high dose?

 

[bcla]

Something like Allegra actually has a daily upper limit of 720mg. That 180mg dosage is "safe" for everyone 12 and up. But for awhile, I was on 3 of them per day, due to stubborn allergic hives. My allergist told me I could take up to 4 daily, 2 every 12 hours. I never got that to that point.

I won't pretend to understand all the different dosages, but I do remember talking to a pharmacist. The same one who said it was safe to split a tablet. He looked up what they had or could order with a prescription, and they had 30, 60, and 180 mg. And it's strange because it's possible to get a prescription version even if the medication itself has gone nonprescription. I think in that case it might be possible to get insurance to pay for it. But I know what works without causing me to feel odd.

But yeah - doctors probably have more information on different dosages. My cousin is married to a doctor, and I remember when I pulled out some pain medication. One was a nonprescription pain reliever and when he saw the dosage he laughed and said that he would typically prescribe a dosage 4-6 times that.

 

[DLgal]

Did it bother you at that high dose?

No

 

[bcla]

Did it bother you at that high dose?

I can't speak for anyone else, but the problem with an excessive dose of an antihistamine is dry nose. But that can be more tolerable for me than the alternative. I mentioned my shaky feeling after just taking 180 mg. I'm not sure if maybe 120 mg would have been OK for me, but that's apparently the nonprescription 24 hour dose for fexofenadine in the UK.

And with the non-sedating and low-sedating antihistamines, high doses apparently result in higher chance of sedation. The newer antihistamines supposedly don't enter the brain unless the dosage is raised. I remember an article on how ineffective loratadine (Claritin) is at the recommended 10 mg dose. My doctor said that he almost always prescribed Allegra over Claritin because his patients reported that it worked better. There was this article in the New York Times that referenced studies that for most users Claritin was effective at 40 mg per day, but also resulted in drowsiness. But the manufacturer fought really hard to keep it from being labeled as sedating. That was their selling point.

https://www.nytimes.com/2001/03/11/magazine/the-claritin-effect-prescription-for-profit.html​

Although the F.D.A. advisory committee recommended approval of loratadine, Straus remained skeptical. In the conclusions of a 321-page ''medical officer review'' dated Nov. 9, 1987, he described the proposed 10-milligram dose of Claritin as ''minimally effective versus placebo'' and added that 40 milligrams appeared to be ''the minimum effective dose.'' He also argued that the label ''must include sedation as an adverse reaction and include warnings to this effect.'' A former F.D.A. official, who requested anonymity, said that the agency informally asked Schering to test a higher dose of loratadine but lacked the regulatory authority to mandate it.​

I used to take Actifed for allegies when I was in high school. They had these cool ads with former astronauts claiming that they had them available on missions, although I was thinking it would be like driving the Lunar Rover drunk. But it worked great at stopping my running/itchy nose and watery eyes.

I tried a nonprescription version of Zyrtec on an overseas trip. It worked on the allergies, but it felt like I was taking Benadryl or Chlor-Trimeton.

 

[KPeterso]

My son’s semi regular unexplained outbreak of hives seemed untreatable until we changed doctors and they suggested Zantac. Seemingly a miracle. Started clearing up within the hour. After years of waiting these outbreaks out with an epi-pen at the ready.

Well that is very interesting. I have chronic unexplained hives and nothing seems to help. They always take a while to go away - dealing with in 3 spots right now. So now, I am intrigued about trying Zantac. Will discuss with the doctor next time I see her.

 

[mom2rtk]

Well that is very interesting. I have chronic unexplained hives and nothing seems to help. They always take a while to go away - dealing with in 3 spots right now. So now, I am intrigued about trying Zantac. Will discuss with the doctor next time I see her.

I'm not sure about the current status of Zantac. I know it was pulled from the market for a while but don't know the whole story. Definitely worth checking out. It's just a different approach and was so welcome to us after trying Benadryl and Zyrtec unsuccessfully. It really was amazing.

 

[princesscinderella]

Well that is very interesting. I have chronic unexplained hives and nothing seems to help. They always take a while to go away - dealing with in 3 spots right now. So now, I am intrigued about trying Zantac. Will discuss with the doctor next time I see her.

It could be a gluten/celiac related rash. I have autoimmune hashimotos and celiac and going GF has solved so many issues I was having. To see if this is your issue the best way is a complete elimination diet of gluten for a month and then binge on it for a day after the elimination and see how you feel.

 

[DLgal]

Well that is very interesting. I have chronic unexplained hives and nothing seems to help. They always take a while to go away - dealing with in 3 spots right now. So now, I am intrigued about trying Zantac. Will discuss with the doctor next time I see her.

This is how my allergies present. I get a tiny scratchy throat, but no other symptoms except random hives. Allegra works, but I gained a lot of weight on it after 3 years of daily dosing. My allergist offers a once monthly injection for chronic idiopathic hives. I might go that route. Right now I'm just putting up with the hives. My appetite has decreased dramatically since I stopped the Allegra.

 

[DLgal]

It could be a gluten/celiac related rash. I have autoimmune hashimotos and celiac and going GF has solved so many issues I was having. To see if this is your issue the best way is a complete elimination diet of gluten for a month and then binge on it for a day after the elimination and see how you feel.

I tried this, it was not gluten related for me. Still got the hives on a diet of mostly eggs, chicken breast, potatoes, and fruits/veg. I have no food related allergies. Had the whole panel done. My allergies are environmental.

 

[KPeterso]

I'm not sure about the current status of Zantac. I know it was pulled from the market for a while but don't know the whole story. Definitely worth checking out. It's just a different approach and was so welcome to us after trying Benadryl and Zyrtec unsuccessfully. It really was amazing.

Oh I forgot that was removed from the market. Will still discuss with the doctor if there is something with a similar active ingredient that might help.

It could be a gluten/celiac related rash. I have autoimmune hashimotos and celiac and going GF has solved so many issues I was having. To see if this is your issue the best way is a complete elimination diet of gluten for a month and then binge on it for a day after the elimination and see how you feel.

I have actually been tested for Celiac. My Dad was diagnosed with it in his 80s (try explaining it to him why we had to change some of the things he most likes such as bread for a peanut butter sandwich) about 2 years ago because he has a very persistent low iron level despite taking a very high dose iron pill. I was tested since it can run in families, but my test came back negative for Celiac. Maybe time for another chat with the doctor about that too.

 

[princesscinderella]

Oh I forgot that was removed from the market. Will still discuss with the doctor if there is something with a similar active ingredient that might help.



I have actually been tested for Celiac. My Dad was diagnosed with it in his 80s (try explaining it to him why we had to change some of the things he most likes such as bread for a peanut butter sandwich) about 2 years ago because he has a very persistent low iron level despite taking a very high dose iron pill. I was tested since it can run in families, but my test came back negative for Celiac. Maybe time for another chat with the doctor about that too.

There are a lot of false negatives with the celiac blood test, the only true way to know for sure is an endoscopy.

 

[princesscinderella]

I tried this, it was not gluten related for me. Still got the hives on a diet of mostly eggs, chicken breast, potatoes, and fruits/veg. I have no food related allergies. Had the whole panel done. My allergies are environmental.

That really stinks maybe your laundry detergent? Glad it wasn't gluten related, it sometimes really stinks having to eat GF. I miss a hot krispy creme donut.

 

[KPeterso]

This is how my allergies present. I get a tiny scratchy throat, but no other symptoms except random hives. Allegra works, but I gained a lot of weight on it after 3 years of daily dosing. My allergist offers a once monthly injection for chronic idiopathic hives. I might go that route. Right now I'm just putting up with the hives. My appetite has decreased dramatically since I stopped the Allegra.

Another interesting thought - need to get in to see the allergy doctor again and see if shots might make sense now. I do take Allegra in the morning and Zyrtec in the evening daily (yes, this was what my doctor wanted me to do). And I can have Benadryl anytime I want as needed. In addition to my chronic hives issue, I do have a ton of environmental allergies (I laugh at those who complain about seasonal allergies) as well as one skin allergy to an item used as a fragrance booster in a lot of soaps, body washes, and detergents. I have eliminated every product I can find that could possibly have the skin allergy and use free and clear for everything that touches my body. So I really do not believe the hives are from it anymore since it would be even more widespread than it is currently. My friends all laugh and say I am allergic to being outside and life. Sadly, they are not far off sometimes.

 

[DLgal]

That really stinks maybe your laundry detergent? Glad it wasn't gluten related, it sometimes really stinks having to eat GF. I miss a hot krispy creme donut.

Nah, its literally just ALL the trees, grasses, and weeds outside. I live in an area with perpetual spring, so it's an issue. I'm allergic to almost everything outside as well as dust, animals, etc. This started over 20 years ago when I would break out in hives when exercising, but only happened outdoors. I never had allergies as a child. It got considerably worse when we moved into our current home from VA. I am surrounded by plants here.

I did have an endoscopy in 2017 to check for Celiac. It was negative. I just have terrible IBS.

 

[LuvOrlando]

Another interesting thought - need to get in to see the allergy doctor again and see if shots might make sense now. I do take Allegra in the morning and Zyrtec in the evening daily (yes, this was what my doctor wanted me to do). And I can have Benadryl anytime I want as needed. In addition to my chronic hives issue, I do have a ton of environmental allergies (I laugh at those who complain about seasonal allergies) as well as one skin allergy to an item used as a fragrance booster in a lot of soaps, body washes, and detergents. I have eliminated every product I can find that could possibly have the skin allergy and use free and clear for everything that touches my body. So I really do not believe the hives are from it anymore since it would be even more widespread than it is currently. My friends all laugh and say I am allergic to being outside and life. Sadly, they are not far off sometimes.

Seems there is now research into allergies being somehow linked to our neurological systems. Maybe try to find the biggest hospital system you can find and look for an allergist there,starting to look like things are more intertwined than thought.