Are any Disney guests average income people?

[fumanchu2488]

One thing I think is missing in this discussion is what is a WDW trip? For some, that could be a 4 night trip, for others that could mean 10. For some WDW is a multiple trip a year thing totaling 15 or 20 days. Huge differences in cost.

For me, my trip is usually 6 nights. IMO I think Disney is targeting a specific type of guest with these changes. They want people visiting who are coming for 10 days or less and willing to pay premium for extras. I don’t think they consider income of guests rather than what a family will pay. For example, if a family has a $4k budget for vacation, Disney is trying to get that family to come for 5 days instead of going to a national park for 10 days. Or they are trying to get them to come to Disney instead of a Beaches resort, which is similar cost.

 

[Pickles516]

I would argue this happens in every facet of life, abd not just WDW, Disney as a corporation cannot be made into something that it’s not. They have always driven revenue right down to its inception. Walt himself wanted it to be a place for families, but never promised to make it affordable for all families, or that all families would have the same experience

You’re not wrong, and I don’t even think that it would be desirable for all families to have the same experience. I think if you have the means, you should be able to pay for extras and live it up. My thing is that, with so many other wildly successful sources of revenue, Disney at least used to let you feel like you were someplace special once you paid to get on property. If you made 50k a year, you felt like you made 100k a year even if you were staying at a moderate. Now, if you make 100k a year you feel like you should be swiping your EBT card for Dole Whips.

 

[fumanchu2488]

You’re not wrong, and I don’t even think that it would be desirable for all families to have the same experience. I think if you have the means, you should be able to pay for extras and live it up. My thing is that, with so many other wildly successful sources of revenue, Disney at least used to let you feel like you were someplace special once you paid to get on property. If you made 50k a year, you felt like you made 100k a year even if you were staying at a moderate. Now, if you make 100k a year you feel like you should be swiping your EBT card for Dole Whips.

I would argue one thing Disney does very well is cater to different income groups. For example, they are pretty much the only theme park where you can bring your own food and drinks in. Sodas, sandwiches, snacks. As a family with picky young kids, I could bring in a bunch of uncrustables rather than spending $12 on overpriced sandwiches. I went to Busch Gardens this summer and they made us throw them away.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

, Disney at least used to let you feel like you were someplace special once you paid to get on property. If you made 50k a year, you felt like you made 100k a year even if you were staying at a moderate. Now, if you make 100k a year you feel like you should be swiping your EBT card for Dole Whips.

That I disagree with, I think hotel prices are bananas there, but outside of that, it’s not to bad. as a kid we always ate off property bc my parents just couldn’t afford it, and we stayed off site for the same reason, and that was back in the late 90’s, when both my parents worked.I just disagree with the idea that this price discrepancy is brand new, I think it has always existed, the difference is, now everyone can get together on social media and talk about how “wrong” it is, when back in the day you could commiserate with family and maybe some coworkers, but that was it

 

[Pickles516]

That I disagree with, I think hotel prices are bananas there, but outside of that, it’s not to bad. as a kid we always ate off property bc my parents just couldn’t afford it, and we stayed off site for the same reason, and that was back in the late 90’s, when both my parents worked.I just disagree with the idea that this price discrepancy is brand new, I think it has always existed, the difference is, now everyone can get together on social media and talk about how “wrong” it is, when back in the day you could commiserate with family and maybe some coworkers, but that was it

Maybe you’re right. I don’t necessarily think it’s brand new, but I still feel like it’s more pronounced. Maybe it just feels that way to me.

Edit: Your point about technology playing a role is also valid. When I was younger, you had a book or dvd or Disney’s official site to glean information from. Now, as I do research I’m more privy to people owning more DVC points than my house is worth and it blows my mind. The majority of working class people probably go in relatively blind to how other people Disney, and probably have a better experience because of it in some ways.

 

[sethschroeder]

I haven't read the full thread but I was coming o here to say I am seeing a HUGE surge in high income targeted marketing push. What do I mean?

DIS did a video earlier this week talking about a $45k party that was put on to show off this tailored event planning. You had DFB taking part in a $15k party for 10 people I think it was as well just in the last week. I also saw various people taking part in VIP tours that are content creators with the latest one pretty much never having created Disney content as they are in the Twitch/Video Game realm.

It seems Disney is more directly targeting the higher income park guest more actively than I remember seeing historically. It could be that where they used to target special events they are now targeting much more expensive experiences as a primary focus to hitting profit numbers.

 

[Pickles516]

I haven't read the full thread but I was coming o here to say I am seeing a HUGE surge in high income targeted marketing push. What do I mean?

DIS did a video earlier this week talking about a $45k party that was put on to show off this tailored event planning. You had DFB taking part in a $15k party for 10 people I think it was as well just in the last week. I also saw various people taking part in VIP tours that are content creators with the latest one pretty much never having created Disney content as they are in the Twitch/Video Game realm.

It seems Disney is more directly targeting the higher income park guest more actively than I remember seeing historically. It could be that where they used to target special events they are now targeting much more expensive experiences as a primary focus to hitting profit numbers.

I think it may actually be the opposite in regard to the content creators - it’s the same reason kids watch unboxing videos of toys they’ll never get or play through a of games they’ll never own: content creators make the bulk of their money off the people who can’t afford those experiences. People who can afford those experiences don’t watch them on YouTube l, they just go live them.

 

[sethschroeder]

Those of us who are low income who go to Disney Parks are able to do so because we make sacrifices in our day to day lives and work 2 jobs or over time and save money over a long period of time.

I think it depends on how you define low income. Also if I remember correctly you are from the UK which wouldn't correlate as well to the US which is what my perception is based around.

Not to make light of it because everyone has their own struggles but when you come to the US your money is worth more. Its basically like when I moved to Texas in my past and I joked I got a 5% pay raise since income taxes went away. In the US there have been surveys and like 10-15% of people have never even traveled outside their State they were born in.

Do you know how much it is to go skiing?
The resorts are Disney high , just like Disney we can get a motel style room for $200 as a budget room. We eat in the room , but every thing is high cause it has to be brought up a mountain. The lift pass is $500+ plus the rental cost. Vacationing is expensive

I would say though Ski vacations are for the elite. Just like people will say WDW is for the rich. Vacationing is not expensive, its those two specific examples which are expensive.

Where I am at its huge to go camping and some of the primary vacation locations were built off the density of good camping which now have resorts as well to give people options if they want something more upscale or less "roughing it".

None of our vacations are in the same ballpark as WDW as far as cost. Pre-lockdown, I priced out my dream vacation which was live-aboard diving on the Great Barrier Reef. Even with the expensive flights, it was much cheaper.

I will say we got a great deal going to Alaska last second on a cruise. That being said if you are planning 12-24 months out it will be more expensive.

I can also say I walked to in Walmart and the whole meat sections was "clearanced". I was like WOAH what is going on and when I looked at the pricing it was a 40% price increase on the sticker price vs a couple months ago.

With these vacation places I think the same will be said. They are trying to charge more and while some people will pay more its yet to be seen how many will and if they can keep these inflated prices or will need to come back down to more in the range of a normal price uptick.

I know for me I don't plan on booking anything far out and will just look for last minute deals for anywhere other than WDW (since I own DVC and in a sense my "deal" is already locked in).

 

[sethschroeder]

I think it may actually be the opposite in regard to the content creators - it’s the same reason kids watch unboxing videos of toys they’ll never get or play through a of games they’ll never own: content creators make the bulk of their money off the people who can’t afford those experiences. People who can afford those experiences don’t watch them on YouTube l, they just go live them.

I slightly disagree. In my experience many (younger professionals that I know) view these content creators as reviews and the 21st century travel agents (aka people you turn to in order to figure out where you should travel).

There is a big push to see more varied and unique things than just going to Vegas or going to Napa. People watch them to be able to see what the experience is, what it is about, and if they should use their very limited time on said experience/location.

Example I would have never just went to Alaska on a cruise in a Haven Suite on NCL if there wasn't content specifically targeting this (never thought I would go on a NCL cruise and knew nothing about them until I randomly saw a video on the Haven specifically). Its also why you see these locations paying/giving/inviting these vloggers. Yes 95%-99% of the viewers are just along for the ride but when you are dealing with selling to the higher end you are going to get lots of eyeballs in your marketing that could never afford you.

Example with conventional ads online you are lucky to get 2% click rate on ads so having a 10/20/30 min video that people sit through where even 0.5% of the audience is your target is actually a well placed ad for your thing likely. (To be clear I am talking about huge channels not a channel with 100 followers so that 0.5% adds up on a video with 100k views)

 

[Sparkly]

Nowhere else in the world has this entitlement issue where people expect to take multiple trips per year staying onsite for cheap.

 

[Miffy]

In answer to the thread's title--yes, this post is by an average-income person who's a Disney guest.

This year, though, is an anomaly because we didn't get our usual 2 trips to WDW in 2020, so we didn't mind (too much) spending more than usual for 2 trips--if we even do trip #2--this year.

Ask me again next year.

 

[Pickles516]

In answer to the thread's title--yes, this post is by an average-income person who's a Disney guest.

This year, though, is an anomaly because we didn't get our usual 2 trips to WDW in 2020, so we didn't mind (too much) spending more than usual for 2 trips--if we even do trip #2--this year.

Ask me again next year.

Not trying to be rude, but do you mind if I ask what you consider average, and where abouts you live? And how long these trips generally are?
We’re a ~120k/yr household with 4 kids in the NY metro area, and 2 trips to Disney in a year is unfathomable to me.

 

[shawthorne44]

Annual pass at USO doesn't include parking and provides access to half the parks. Factor in parking and your 10 day trip is going to be a lot more expensive. Also factor in that you will probably be a lore more bored at USO after 3 days.

Yes Disney deluxe hotel prices are outrageous. But there are also options at staying in values/offsite which bring the price down significantly.

Flights, food, transportation will be near identical for both options.

Once you factor them all in, a 7 day trip to USO is very close in price to WDW.

Some passes do. We got the Preferred (which is still in the $300's). It includes parks parking and early entry. At WDW, if you have a car they WILL charge parking, either at the parks or at your resort. So, an extra $250 for parking at WDW.

Our first USF trip was Feb 2020, we paid less than $700 including all fees for a 2/2 condo for 7-8 nights (I forget)

Food was a lot cheaper at USF. Although a trip now wouldn't be, since they stopped the QS plan. Probably because it was easy to save money on it. You can also get a soda refill cup that works in the parks.

We definitely didn't get bored at USF. On the annual pass, we did three trips totally about 4 weeks. In fact, I'm a bit worried we'll get bored at WDW and USF will call to us (our pass expired). Hopefully WDW will bring all the entertainment back by Feb.

 

[RamblingMad]

Can you please provide a rough breakdown of those costs. I'm actually quite curious.

Really.

An annual pass to all of the NPs costs $80 a year. I went for a week. So my cost to get in was $80/7. And I plan to go more parks this year. It's costs over a hundred dollars to get into WDW for one day. And annual passes for WDW cost over a thousand dollars. If you're a senior, you pay a one time fee of $80 for the rest of your life to get into NPs. Food costs less in NPs too. Of course, you can bring in your own food. We rented an airbnb that cost me $450 for the week when I split it with my friends. It had room for 15 people. Transportation to the parks is what is it.

https://www.nps.gov/planyourvisit/passes.htm

 

[CanadaDisney05]

Our first USF trip was Feb 2020, we paid less than $700 including all fees for a 2/2 condo for 7-8 nights (I forget) [/qu

Food was a lot cheaper at USF. Although a trip now wouldn't be, since they stopped the QS plan. Probably because it was easy to save money on it. You can also get a soda refill cup that works in the parks.

We definitely didn't get bored at USF. On the annual pass, we did three trips totally about 4 weeks. In fact, I'm a bit worried we'll get bored at WDW and USF will call to us (our pass expired). Hopefully WDW will bring all the entertainment back by Feb.

Really.

An annual pass to all of the NPs costs $80 a year. I went for a week. So my cost to get in was $80/7. And I plan to go more parks this year. It's costs over a hundred dollars to get into WDW for one day. And annual passes for WDW cost over a thousand dollars. If you're a senior, you pay a one time fee of $80 for the rest of your life to get into NPs. Food costs less in NPs too. Of course, you can bring in your own food. We rented an airbnb that cost me $450 for the week when I split it with my friends. It had room for 15 people. Transportation to the parks is what is it.

https://www.nps.gov/planyourvisit/passes.htm

I mean, your not really comparing apples to apples. You can easily find cheap air bnbs near wdw and split it with friends too. You also didn't include flights, food, rental car, other entertainment. I'm sure over 7 days you spent more than the national park entrance fee on entertainment. It just may not have been at one spot.

Disney tickets are only over $100/ day if you go for 3 or less days. 7 day tickets are about $500. 10 day tickets aren't much more.

Flights to mco are going to be on par or cheaper with most other airports.

Food is relatively expensive at Disney. But I don't personally find it unreasonable considering your in a theme park and a major tourist destination. Canadas Wonderland for example charges 17.99 for a hotdog and a small fry at a quick service.

My point is, if you factor in flights, hotels, food, transportation, even if a trip to a national park ends up being cheaper, the difference isn't that significant. Maybe 20% cheaper overall?

 

[RamblingMad]

I mean, your not really comparing apples to apples. You can easily find cheap air bnbs near wdw and split it with friends too. You also didn't include flights, food, rental car, other entertainment. I'm sure over 7 days you spent more than the national park entrance fee on entertainment. It just may not have been at one spot.

Disney tickets are only over $100/ day if you go for 3 or less days. 7 day tickets are about $500. 10 day tickets aren't much more.

Flights to mco are going to be on par or cheaper with most other airports.

Food is relatively expensive at Disney. But I don't personally find it unreasonable considering your in a theme park and a major tourist destination. Canadas Wonderland for example charges 17.99 for a hotdog and a small fry at a quick service.

My point is, if you factor in flights, hotels, food, transportation, even if a trip to a national park ends up being cheaper, the difference isn't that significant. Maybe 20% cheaper overall?

I drove to UT. I spent at most $150 in gas and split it with other people in my vehicle. The entrance fee was for a car load of people. We had a person that had a senior pass, so no one else paid a dime. We hiked in the National Parks and cooked dinner at our airbnb. We didn't do anything else of entertainment other than play pool at the airbnb and cornhole outside. We're all camping people.

My total out of pocket was less than $700 dollars. including the money I spent on the one meal I was assigned to cook for the group It's like 80% cheaper.

Now, I can also drive to DL. It's actually closer, so I would spend less on gas. But it's still more expensive.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

I drove to UT. I spent at most $150 in gas and split it with other people in my vehicle. The entrance fee was for a car load of people. We had a person that had a senior pass, so no one else paid a dime. We hiked in the National Parks and cooked dinner at our airbnb. We didn't do anything else of entertainment other than play pool at the airbnb and cornhole outside. We're all camping people.

My total out of pocket was less than $700 dollars. including the money I spent on the one meal I was assigned to cook for the group It's like 80% cheaper.

Now, I can also drive to DL. It's actually closer, so I would spend less on gas. But it's still more expensive.

This is why I asked for the breakdown. It was basically a local camping trip split with several people. That is why it was so cheap. That's fair. But camping locally vs flying to WDW with a family has always been significantly cheaper. That has nothing to do with any general direction or recent change of policy at WDW, which is what we are talking about.

Sure, some people may opt to go camping vs family vacation at WDW due to the rising cost. But I highly doubt that's the trade off the masses will be deciding between. It's like saying that if Ferrari raises their price by 10%, Ferrari owners will opt for a Toyota Corolla next time. The two are completely different classes of cars. Just like a week flying to WDW is a different class of vacation than camping locally.

And don't get me wrong. I drive a Corolla, not a Ferrari. It's okay to prefer the cheaper one.

 

[npatellye]

Not trying to be rude, but do you mind if I ask what you consider average, and where abouts you live? And how long these trips generally are?
We’re a ~120k/yr household with 4 kids in the NY metro area, and 2 trips to Disney in a year is unfathomable to me.

Another post by an average income person. Our income is average for the rather expensive shoreline area of CT where we live. The mean income in our town is over $149k, with the median being $129k. We have 2 kids, both of whom are in public elementary school. We did a trip in November 2020 for 8 nights (we were in the parks for 7 days), another in May 2021 for 9 nights (we were in the parks for 8 days), and we have one coming up from the end of December 2021 to early January 2022 (it will be 10 nights). We have DVC and Gold passes, though we likely won’t renew our passes again now that the older one will soon be at a point where she can’t miss school for vacations. We fly and check our bags. The last two trips we had to fly Southwest because of credits from our cancelled May 2020 flights. Previously, we usually flew either JetBlue or Southwest. The December trip, we are trying out our first ULCC with Avelo.

 

[RamblingMad]

This is why I asked for the breakdown. It was basically a local camping trip split with several people. That is why it was so cheap. That's fair. But camping locally vs flying to WDW with a family has always been significantly cheaper. That has nothing to do with any general direction or recent change of policy at WDW, which is what we are talking about.

Sure, some people may opt to go camping vs family vacation at WDW due to the rising cost. But I highly doubt that's the trade off the masses will be deciding between. It's like saying that if Ferrari raises their price by 10%, Ferrari owners will opt for a Toyota Corolla next time. The two are completely different classes of cars. Just like a week flying to WDW is a different class of vacation than camping locally.

And don't get me wrong. I drive a Corolla, not a Ferrari. It's okay to prefer the cheaper one.

I didn't go camping. It would be even cheaper if I went camping. We rented out an airbnb house that slept 15.

Trading off Disney for a National Park is a fair vacation comparison.

If you want to get mad, compare a Disney vacation in the 90s with median salary then to a Disney vacation now with the median salary today. It's ridiculously more expensive.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

I didn't go camping. It would be even cheaper if I went camping. We rented out an airbnb house that slept 15.

Trading off Disney for a National Park is a fair vacation comparison.

If you want to get mad, compare a Disney vacation in the 90s with median salary then to a Disney vacation now with the median salary today. It's ridiculously more expensive.

I mean, if we're going to play that game, why waste your money on travelling to a national park? Setting up a tent in your backyard will be a fraction of the cost. You can even split the cost of the tent with 15 of your neighbour's.

Again, I'll reiterate. At no point in history has a 7 day trip to WDW been comparable cost to 7 days camping (or splitting a vacation rental with several different families) with no entertainment costs built in. So to compare it to current day WDW with the argument that the increases in prices will drive people to national parks as an alternative makes no sense.