Anyone already post that paper FP will be gone at MK as of 1/14?

[Silock]

I'm livid. Going first week of Feb as offsite guest. Already bought our tickets and made our flight reservations months ago, so it would be a waste of money to cancel now, but I've never been so mad at Disney.

This sucks.

 

[ckelly14]

You have every right to be upset, but you are going at one of the slowest times. I think you'll be OK.

 

[morethananyonex]

I'm livid. Going first week of Feb as offsite guest. Already bought our tickets and made our flight reservations months ago, so it would be a waste of money to cancel now, but I've never been so mad at Disney.

This sucks.

Take a look at the throwaway room thread.

At the moment, you can book 1 night room only at a resort, attach your park tickets, and get the ability to book FP+ for your entire stay.

 

[mummabear]

I'm currently speaking under the assumption of no tiering, but you're right that it changes things dramatically. I think tiering would be the only way to drive people to pick up Fastpasses for attractions beyond the top six or seven.

Yes and no. Not everyones top 6 or 7 are the same. One of things I liked the sound of at the start is that meet and greets would have FP+ (at least some) for our last trip there were at least 3 meet and greets (pixie hollow, merida and toy story) that we waited over 45 minutes for, which was longer than we waited for any ride. So given multiple days in the park I may pick one E ticket ride, one meet and greet and another like Peter Pan. It depends on the people. We tour very differently with children then before we had them (never watched the parades, would only meet and greet if we happened to come across someone we liked (like Mickey) with a very short queue, very little in Fantasyland that we would ride)

 

[Planogirl]

Actually, I'm told that Universal was required by 2015 to have an RFID "chip" reservation system by the government. Apparently something with similiar aspects to MB technology will supposedly be required by all theme parks.

Why is this required by the government?

Call me delusional, but I don't think this is the final version of the system. It can't be. There's just so many unappealing aspects of it. I also don't think it makes sense for Disney to roll out a system that discourages people to spend $50 extra on their tickets for park hoppers.

I am hoping that with the elimination of FP- at all the parks, Disney can tweak FP+ to allow for more flexibility once everybody is using the system. The whole purpose of the original FP program was to keep people out of the lines and spending money. How the heck am I supposed to mindlessly spend money with my MB like they want me to if I suddenly have to wait in more lines?

I've been wondering that myself and that is true whether we are offsite or not. More lines and maybe longer lines make no sense at all.

I think it is a matter of who you talk to as to whether they are upset. Collectively, some people will be in line less, but some will be in line more.

For people who are accustomed to utilizing FP- to its fullest extent, they will not be able to collect as many as before. This will lead them to standing in line more (assuming everyone rides the same number of total rides per day). But since they are not riding the FP line now, someone else is riding in their place, shortening that persons time in line.

It turns out that at the end of the day, the amount of time people have spent in lines (with the assumption that the total number of rides ridden stays the same) will be exactly the same. Just that by shifting people to different rides and restricting how many FP's individuals can get, the average amount of time individual people stand in line goes down.

I can understand the goal. I do not make judgments pro or con.

It's not just the time in lines but how to plan. With legacy we would pick up fastpasses based on how busy certain rides were. I have no way to predict that now and it irritates me that we might end up picking attractions that don't need fastpasses at that time. Or not. Some say that you can change on the fly but will that really be possible once everyone is on the system? Only time will tell.

 

[dayvewc]

It's not just the time in lines but how to plan. With legacy we would pick up fastpasses based on how busy certain rides were. I have no way to predict that now and it irritates me that we might end up picking attractions that don't need fastpasses at that time. Or not. Some say that you can change on the fly but will that really be possible once everyone is on the system? Only time will tell.

I completely agree, there is an ebb and flow to the parks and as you tour that has an effect on which FP- you would have pulled. I was just trying to outline (in very broad strokes) the goal of being able to schedule. One Disney's underlying assumption is that if people aren't in lines, then they will be buying things. So the goal is to reduce the overall time in lines. That is why I said I wasn't making judgments about the goal. I personally think that crowd behavior is too dynamic to be modeled the way that Disney would like for this to be work as they would like it too. Doesn't mean that it will necessarily be a failure, but I don't see it being the success that they would like.

 

[Laketravis]

Take a look at the throwaway room thread.

At the moment, you can book 1 night room only at a resort, attach your park tickets, and get the ability to book FP+ for your entire stay.

Yup.

Just don't let the morality police in that thread pull you over......they've got some pretty bright lights and loud sirens but no badges.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Again, I think this should be looked at as a step in a process. First, they have to get rid of paper FP completely, then they can work on prebooking for offsite guests (and AP holders without room reservations, for that matter). Maybe for offsite guests they can start by working with guests with reservations at some of the hotels with which Disney has working relationships.

As a PP said, for an offsite guest to prebook he would have to link some sort of ticket to his MDE account, just like onsite guests do now. That guest could make reservations for as many days as the number of remaining days on the ticket.

It doesn't make sense (to me anyway) that this is a logical step in the process towards offsite prebooking. They could start working with Swan and Dolphin guests if they wanted to test offsite...and they did...using same-day kiosks.

 

[Silock]

Take a look at the throwaway room thread.

At the moment, you can book 1 night room only at a resort, attach your park tickets, and get the ability to book FP+ for your entire stay.

There are four of us adults. Would they even allow a split like that?

 

[rt2dz]

Well, we spent a lot more $$$$, before dining prices increased and quality/choice decreased. The prices are unreasonable, unacceptable and ridiculous. IMO I'm no longer impressed with the merchandise either. Guess, I'll save more money by eliminating park hoppers and reducing the frequency of our visits.

Ditto

 

[dayvewc]

Again, I think this should be looked at as a step in a process. First, they have to get rid of paper FP completely, then they can work on prebooking for offsite guests (and AP holders without room reservations, for that matter). Maybe for offsite guests they can start by working with guests with reservations at some of the hotels with which Disney has working relationships.

As a PP said, for an offsite guest to prebook he would have to link some sort of ticket to his MDE account, just like onsite guests do now. That guest could make reservations for as many days as the number of remaining days on the ticket.

It doesn't make sense (to me anyway) that this is a logical step in the process towards offsite prebooking. They could start working with Swan and Dolphin guests if they wanted to test offsite...and they did...using same-day kiosks.

I'm just curious how they could do that? If they have access to the S&D reservations systems to identify the MDE accounts of the guests, it wouldn't be an offsite test. If they don't have access to the S&D reservation systems, how would they identify the MDE accounts of S&D guests to allow them to test the system?

 

[Shaden]

It's not just the time in lines but how to plan. With legacy we would pick up fastpasses based on how busy certain rides were. I have no way to predict that now and it irritates me that we might end up picking attractions that don't need fastpasses at that time. Or not. Some say that you can change on the fly but will that really be possible once everyone is on the system? Only time will tell.

Yup among all the other stuff that makes FP+ inferior to FP- .. this is KEY.

 

[Laketravis]

Just an observation but it seems the "I'm sure this will turn out fine" crowd is getting smaller and the "This really sucks!" crowd is getting bigger.

If that is any indication of the feedback those CM's with "Research" name tags are getting, I suspect that Disney isn't using that feedback to tweak the system but rather primarily how to present this entire concept differently to future guests.

There is a very astute post by someone who just got back in regards to MB and FP. One of the observations they made was a condition that I don't think Disney is going to find an easy solution for, and that is guests who dispute the "Blue Mickey"...please read that thread for details, but it is a major and unanticipated flaw with FP+

Personally, I don't think there is a lot of mystery to each action Disney takes; each incremental step of implementation is not so much a test as it is a phase in, and the reality of what we see is the reality of what it will be.

I don't feel like I'm explaining this very well, but in essence I don't think Disney is just throwing the alpha out there for testing ... they are throwing out the beta and it would take major faults to justify minor tweaks.

AK is done, and what we see is pretty much the final product. Given that, what they've announced for MK is pretty much the final product. Same goes for HS (just remove legacy FP) and EP (just remove legacy FP) and offsite guests (same-day is as good as it gets).

Yes, we'll see. But the feedback to the DIS is growing in negative nature, and it will be very interesting if not captivating to see how this develops over the next few weeks.

 

[wisblue]

Just an observation but it seems the "I'm sure this will turn out fine" crowd is getting smaller and the "This really sucks!" crowd is getting bigger.

I think a lot of this has to do with people who think this will turn out fine, or at least don't think it's the end of the world, getting tired of being berated by the usual members of the "this really sucks" crowd, and leaving them alone to wallow in their misery.

 

[Laketravis]

I think a lot of this has to do with people who think this will turn out fine, or at least don't think it's the end of the world, getting tired of being berated by the usual members of the "this really sucks" crowd, and leaving them alone to wallow in their misery.

It hasn't stopped you from posting

And I don't mean that in an inflammatory manner.

There really are more less than glowing trip reports lately, even by hard count.

 

[Shaden]

Just an observation but it seems the "I'm sure this will turn out fine" crowd is getting smaller and the "This really sucks!" crowd is getting bigger.

I think a lot of this has to do with people who think this will turn out fine, or at least don't think it's the end of the world, getting tired of being berated by the usual members of the "this really sucks" crowd, and leaving them alone to wallow in their misery.

Actually Wisblue I have to disagree -almost- totally. I think that is certainly a portion of it ... BUT, big but.

We have seen several posts of late of people who were very or somewhat "positive" or "optimistic" about FP+. Who have then used/experienced it, and then come back to the boards and posted their experience and said, basically, it sucks.

We have had at least one person (at least that I read) compare their initial experience during testing of it being "awesome" to a more recent experience where it ... again 'sucked'.

I am sure there are people who have stopped posting their support, but I am sure there are also people who have stopped posting their concerns. What is more interesting to me is the posts from people who were all happy and positive about it, who have come back and after experiencing it, posted serious concerns about the new system. As well as people who were on the fence who hadn't registered a positive or negative opinion, coming on and explaining how the system didn't work as well as the old did for them ...

That really does seem to be the pattern.

 

[PlayaMan]

I think a lot of this has to do with people who think this will turn out fine, or at least don't think it's the end of the world, getting tired of being berated by the usual members of the "this really sucks" crowd, and leaving them alone to wallow in their misery.

And given human nature of how the good reports often do not get even posted.

 

[wisblue]

It hasn't stopped you from posting

And I don't mean that in an inflammatory manner.

It hasn't stopped me completely, but I have been posting a lot less since I had my own positive experience over the Christmas holidays.

I have shared my experiences, and have been told that (1) my opinions are invalid because I expected to have a positive experience before my trip, (2) I can't see how anyone can think FP+ is a negative for them, and (3) I am "pathetic" because I don't think that tiers at DHS and Epcot make it impossible to ride more than one headliner without waiting in a long line.

I don't think a lot of the regular and most frequent posters want to hear any differing opinions or any experiences that are inconsistent with their ideas. They just want to reinforce each other's misery and laugh at each other's jokes about how terrible this all is. A lot of people don't care to fight that, and I am pretty much joining them.

 

[Laketravis]

And given human nature of how the good reports often do not get even posted.

While that really is true in a global sense, the DIS boards have a long standing reputation of flowery optimism. At least, that's what I've seen over the year. We could always count on an almost overwhelming reaction of support in response to something even slightly negative.

And there was absolutely nothing wrong with that. I'm just saying that recently it seems like that isn't the case, that more and more are tempering their reaction with a bit less enthusiasm, and some are downright expressing a reversal of opinion.

I'm not pre-disposed to or hope for some sort of massive Disney failure. I'm really not, and I think there is some much deeper, more analytical and less personal discussion on some other threads about long term Disney strategy and the competitive pressures they face. But in terms of the "I love Disney because it's Disney" crowd, many more seem to be disappointed of late.

Man, I really hope Disney reads these boards and even though it might represent a small portion of their market they see it as concentrated feedback.

 

[PlayaMan]

Actually Wisblue I have to disagree -almost- totally. I think that is certainly a portion of it ... BUT, big but.

We have seen several posts of late of people who were very or somewhat "positive" or "optimistic" about FP+. Who have then used/experienced it, and then come back to the boards and posted their experience and said, basically, it sucks.

We have had at least one person (at least that I read) compare their initial experience during testing of it being "awesome" to a more recent experience where it ... again 'sucked'.

I am sure there are people who have stopped posting their support, but I am sure there are also people who have stopped posting their concerns. What is more interesting to me is the posts from people who were all happy and positive about it, who have come back and after experiencing it, posted serious concerns about the new system. As well as people who were on the fence who hadn't registered a positive or negative opinion, coming on and explaining how the system didn't work as well as the old did for them ...

That really does seem to be the pattern.

People are less likely to posts good experiences in general. It is human nature.

Then you add in the dynamic of getting affirmation by the more vocal veteran Dis'ers.

I think it is a bit early in the game for a pattern even to be established.

Can you provide links to this poster you mentioned whose opinion went from excited to "it sucked"? It would be interesting to see how their opinion changed.