Any Rumors of a New Park?

[wilde_oscar]

I recently read a blog where the writer told that Iger's recent visit to WDW was to inspect the site of the 5th park.

The blogger is Jim Hill. You can believe very little of the rumors that come from him. He is more blue sky speculation than reliable. And that visit was not to inspect the site of the 5th gate.

Beastly Kingdom is actually one of the concepts for the 5th park that I've heard of. One rumor has them expanding the idea into a whole park. Although, I doubt this rumor. I would guess something like DisneySea that they already have and can clone.

Beastly Kingdom is not a rumored 5th gate. It was originally part of animal kingdom, and if they every do build it out, it will be at AK. Disney Sea works where it is because of the local culture, cloning it in FLA would be like building a fake castle in france and telling the locals they can't have wine with lunch... oh yeah, that didn't go over well did it.

Actually, they are considering a new park outside Shanghai. That's not a rumor. Every Disney big-wig has gone on record confirming this. I watched an interview on CNBC not too long ago where they spoke with the Asian Head of all-things Disney and he said it was simply a matter of paperwork. When asked about how the current economy would play into Disney's decision to greenlight the project, the response was that it would not. China was too great an investment to neglect; that maybe HK was too expensive for most Chinese to get too, but that building something more mainland would be far more successful.

Also, Disney has to compete with that psuedo-Disneyland that already exists there. If you don't know what I'm talking about, look it up online. It's hysterical.

As for a new park in the USA, no, that isn't on the drawing boards whatsoever. FWIW, I do have Disney's America as the wallpaper on my computer right now, and I visit the park several times a day. *sigh*

The shanghai deal is moving forward, but slowly, very very slowly. you are looking at 10 years before it might be operational.

I thought that this was pretty hilarious.

Anyhow, I think that a villains/thrill park will never, ever happen because it just doesn't have the appeal to everyone. The same thing goes for the Night Kingdom. The reason why the Magic Kingdom and Disneyland are so popular is that there is something for everyone. This translates into $$$$ for the company and makes them happy.

I agree, massive renovation needs to take place before a 5th gate should ever take place. The Studios needs a shot in the arm ASAP. There's close to nothing around Muppet Vision, the Backlot Tour is in dire straights, and Pixar Place screams to be expanded. Epcot needs to redo Imagination, and Universe of Energy [although I enjoy it]. WONDERS OF LIFE needs to be made once again into an active pavillion.

The villains park was a product of Jim Hill's imagination.

I herd that HS might be getting a Monsters Inc coaster Based on the chase on the doors at the end of the movie. Also the MK will get a Mermaid ride. Ak might build the beastly kingdom as another land in the AK not as another park.
Epcot is also rumored to get a couple of E ticket attractions for future world and world showcase. Can't wait to see if the rumors are true, I hope so,I like Epcot and HS but as it stands now, to me they are half day parks.

I don't think a 5th gate will happen for a long time.

The Monsters Coaster had to be scrapped do to a technology development deal that the company building the robotics has with universal. Recreating the robotic technology is cost prohibitive. The same technology was rumored to be used in a ride based on the incredibles. this ride is also not being built.

What I don't understand is why some people seem almost violently against even the idea of a fifth park. I know there are some conservative Disney fans who want things to stay exactly the way they were as when they were kids. But, why should they rant against those who want something new. Sure, the economy is currently in the toilet, but it won't be that way in a few years. They should be planning for the economic recovery. I don't buy that WDW is "built out". I've read that they have enough land for 3 or 4 new parks. Those who say that there will "never" be a fifth gate are just wrong. I'm not saying it will be here in 2 or 3 years, but it probably will be within the next 10 years. That calls for long-range planning today.

No one is aginst a 5th gate, it is just going to be a while before the crowds reach a level where a 5th gate is cost effective. Attractions can be added at DHS and AK... the avg. length of stay is still 5 days, which means the number of attractions is just right to keep a family of 4 busy and in the parks for 5 days.

Regarding Horizons, it was VERY popular. What gave the impression it was not busy was the fact that it had a large que inside the building as well as the fact that it had a quick load ride vehicle that moved continuosly, and there was no pre-show, as in HM, to slow things down.

Horizons closed mostly because of structural issues with the building. Remember this is florida swamp land. not all of it is settling evenly. The most expensive monorail pylon is in epcot because there is a sink hole.

People are not violently against a 5th park, most would cheer if one was announced. Rather they are realistic in their expectations. Yes, I'm sure sufficient land is available at WDW for several more parts but realistically would there be a good return on investment for a new park? Upgrading and maintaining the current parks in order to maintain Disney's image is probably a better use of the money that would be put into a 5th park. Disney has shown that only make investments based on the anticipated ROR and right now that's definitely in DVC and overseas parks and will be for the foreseeable future.

Expect more attractions to be announced next year. There is still the possibility they will build another mountain coaster in AK.

 

[yitbos96bb]

People are not violently against a 5th park, most would cheer if one was announced. Rather they are realistic in their expectations. Yes, I'm sure sufficient land is available at WDW for several more parts but realistically would there be a good return on investment for a new park? Upgrading and maintaining the current parks in order to maintain Disney's image is probably a better use of the money that would be put into a 5th park. Disney has shown that only make investments based on the anticipated ROR and right now that's definitely in DVC and overseas parks and will be for the foreseeable future.

You know, I was thinking of this thread...

The other thing we are over looking is DISNEY is developing a lot of things, just not at WDW. I mean, they completely are re-doing Cali Adventure. They just finished the HK Park a few years back. They have developed a few new parks around the world in the last Decade. They are adding two new Cruise ships.

Beyond that at WDW, They put in two new E ticket rides in the last 3 years with EE and TSM.... and have added BLT and AKV and redid the Tree Houses, So its not as if they are NOT spending money... Its just NOT that much in the Theme Parks. I agree with KY Mickey... I'd rather see the money spent improving the Theme Parks. I still feel service levels have dropped from a Decade ago and at that point they were down from previous years as well.

There have been a lot of cost cutting moves that take away from the Magic... outsourcing of more eateries to third parties... closing rides, etc. The ride closings I could even live with, if they put new stuff in their place... I hated that Toad closed, but at least they replaced it with a ride. But 20,000 leagues was replaced by a Meet and Greet... the Skyway sits empty, Wonders of Life sits empty, The hunchback stage... etc. That is the stuff that REALLY hurts long time hard core Disney fans... It feels like a betrayal at times. I know they aren't obligated to do anything for us, but it doesn't mean it doesn't hurt. The conglomerate expansion has come at a cost, and that cost seems to be the parks. I'd rather see them shed ABC and some other divisions and return to the philosophies from 10-20 years ago.

 

[yitbos96bb]

I think JH was just repeating a rumor... I heard of the Villains park in 1998 when I was a College Program student at DAK. From what I understand, this has been around for a long while. Either way, while I think it would be cool, I agree its got a .000000001% chance of ever happening.

As to your attractions post, I hope your right. USA TOday has an article on Theme Park attractions opening in the next couple of years... and the Disney section was embarrassing, listing just American Idol... Comparing it to Seaworld, Cedar Point, Universal and heck, even Six Flags, it was pathetic. It will be nice if you are right. I'd love to see another Mountain Coaster at AK.

 

[mitros]

The blogger is Jim Hill. You can believe very little of the rumors that come from him. He is more blue sky speculation than reliable. And that visit was not to inspect the site of the 5th gate.



Beastly Kingdom is not a rumored 5th gate. It was originally part of animal kingdom, and if they every do build it out, it will be at AK. Disney Sea works where it is because of the local culture, cloning it in FLA would be like building a fake castle in france and telling the locals they can't have wine with lunch... oh yeah, that didn't go over well did it.



The shanghai deal is moving forward, but slowly, very very slowly. you are looking at 10 years before it might be operational.



The villains park was a product of Jim Hill's imagination.



The Monsters Coaster had to be scrapped do to a technology development deal that the company building the robotics has with universal. Recreating the robotic technology is cost prohibitive. The same technology was rumored to be used in a ride based on the incredibles. this ride is also not being built.



No one is aginst a 5th gate, it is just going to be a while before the crowds reach a level where a 5th gate is cost effective. Attractions can be added at DHS and AK... the avg. length of stay is still 5 days, which means the number of attractions is just right to keep a family of 4 busy and in the parks for 5 days.



Horizons closed mostly because of structural issues with the building. Remember this is florida swamp land. not all of it is settling evenly. The most expensive monorail pylon is in epcot because there is a sink hole.



Expect more attractions to be announced next year. There is still the possibility they will build another mountain coaster in AK.

Wow, you must have a lot of time to kill.............................

 

[wilde_oscar]

Wow, you must have a lot of time to kill.............................

if you know how to type and use multi quote, it is actually very easy.

 

[fannatic]

The blog that I read about a 5th park was not from Jim Hill. It was from a blogger named Matt Hart. He's still standing by his story. He mentioned that it would not be Night Kingdom/Jungle Trek or Villains. I'm sure they have other concepts in development besides DisneySea. But, that one would seem the most logical. I'm sure that this is all for future planning. I've heard different rumors about expansion at the existing parks like: The Fantasyland makeover with The Little Mermaid Ride, the Monsters Inc. Coaster and Cars Land for DHS, and even Mysterious Island from DisneySea for AK. It's just a matter of the economy turning the corner.

 

[yitbos96bb]

You have a link to this blog? Google does not return a blog written by a Matt Hart... However, it does return that Matt Hart was a former senior exec for Disney...Senior VP and Treasurer... I'm find that is probably not a coincidence, so please post a link...

http://people.forbes.com/profile/matthew-j-hart/83255

The blog that I read about a 5th park was not from Jim Hill. It was from a blogger named Matt Hart. He's still standing by his story. He mentioned that it would not be Night Kingdom/Jungle Trek or Villains. I'm sure they have other concepts in development besides DisneySea. But, that one would seem the most logical. I'm sure that this is all for future planning. I've heard different rumors about expansion at the existing parks like: The Fantasyland makeover with The Little Mermaid Ride, the Monsters Inc. Coaster and Cars Land for DHS, and even Mysterious Island from DisneySea for AK. It's just a matter of the economy turning the corner.

 

[fannatic]

The blog is named something like July17,1955.com. The rules just said that I don't have enough posts to post a link. But, try the blog name. I'll try posting it again at a later time.

 

[yitbos96bb]

The blog is named something like July17,1955.com. The rules just said that I don't have enough posts to post a link. But, try the blog name. I'll try posting it again at a later time.

I've seen that same article/rumor on some other sites. I do think he is reporting a Jim Hill story. Its from Feb.

I wouldn't hold my breath on this.

 

[ChrisFL]

I beg to differ... Toad was a very popular ride. I remember the protests and such when they closed it. I also remember going on it on almost a daily basis for 6 months in its last year. Its still a very popular attraction in Disneyland

Horizons was very popular too. As was the Skyway and 20,000 leagues... Many of those were closed due to budget issues and repair issues... not lack of popularity.

You also have the case with some rides where new management takes over and doesn't like the ride and works to get it out of there. Or an idiot in a suit decides to try and turn a beloved people mover attraction in Disneyland to a thrill ride and fails miserably.

Toad closed because Disney didn't think they could sell merchandise with Mr. Toad and they didn't want to build another building, etc., I heard it directly from park officials...very few people are really aware of the real story of Mr. Toad, and obviously Winnie the Pooh is very popular and sells lots of merchandise.

 

[Condorman]

I heard it directly from park officials...

Bus drivers don't count.

 

[yitbos96bb]

Toad closed because Disney didn't think they could sell merchandise with Mr. Toad and they didn't want to build another building, etc., I heard it directly from park officials...very few people are really aware of the real story of Mr. Toad, and obviously Winnie the Pooh is very popular and sells lots of merchandise.

That doesn't mean that Mr Toad was not popular. It was an extremely popular ride and was protested... still the only ride I know of to have daily protests.

I remember the Shirts "Ask me why Mickey is killing Mr Toad"

Yes I heard the same reason... I believe there is truth in there... Pooh was a hot commodity... Of all the Fantasyland rides that could be converted, Toad was less marketable than Snow White and Peter Pan and Lion King (which is now Philharmagic) in terms of merchandise sales, so they gutted a popular attraction to sell more merchandise... when the crappy puppet show of the Lion King should have been the one to go (and I love the Lion King, but that show was poor). Ironically, the decision to sell merchandise was short sighted... while the merchandise was more segmented and specialized at the time, now its becoming homogenized across the parks, so you could have thrown any merchandise into the gift shot.

To sum it up, Disney destroyed a beloved, popular attraction to sell merchandise instead of building a new building like they should have. Or to make it even easier... many higher up Disney officials are idiots who had no business working or running a theme park and are responsible for some of the stupider decisions over the last 10-15 years.

 

[ssawka]

Horizons was very popular too. As was the Skyway and 20,000 leagues... Many of those were closed due to budget issues and repair issues... not lack of popularity.

On the KTTK tour in January, the CM told us that 20,000 leagues was closed because it was the most expensive attraction at MK to maintain, and not everyone could take advantage of it. (i.e. It could not be made handicap accessible)

 

[yitbos96bb]

On the KTTK tour in January, the CM told us that 20,000 leagues was closed because it was the most expensive attraction at MK to maintain, and not everyone could take advantage of it. (i.e. It could not be made handicap accessible)

Isn't that what I said ;-)

It still sucks they closed that ride... and now its back at DL but not at WDW in Nemo form...

I actually think they could do a cool Nemo ride on this concept at Animal Kingdom. They used to have the boat ride around the tree at DAK but it failed due to lack of interest. I always thought bringing that back like the Nemo Subs, but instead of Subs, use "Glass Bottom" boats. You can use the same technology they used at the living sees...

The trick would be planting things in the river without draining the whole thing... but I think they could do it. I'm sure smarter people than I could come up with the nuts and bolts.

 

[hiwaygal]

Sorry if this is 'off-topic' but my husband and I were talking the other day about rumors of a 5th park and I knew I'd find a thread here about it.

We were thinking that Disneys 'best bet' for a new park would be something geared (almost exclusively) to extreme thrill rides. I love Disney and all, but the 'thrill' rides they have now don't quite meet the limits of what is out there.

I wonder if Disney would consider this based on the thought that older kids and young adults are going to Universal for the thrills. And consider parks like Cedar Point and others known for their coasters and thrill rides...Disney doesn't really compete in those markets. And I can only imagine how incredible the theming would be surrounding those extreme rides!

It would take a lot of time and a lot of money...but I'm wondering if Disney thinks it's worth it to keep more people on property.

 

[NoLineOntheHorizon]

Sorry if this is 'off-topic' but my husband and I were talking the other day about rumors of a 5th park and I knew I'd find a thread here about it.

We were thinking that Disneys 'best bet' for a new park would be something geared (almost exclusively) to extreme thrill rides. I love Disney and all, but the 'thrill' rides they have now don't quite meet the limits of what is out there.

I wonder if Disney would consider this based on the thought that older kids and young adults are going to Universal for the thrills. And consider parks like Cedar Point and others known for their coasters and thrill rides...Disney doesn't really compete in those markets. And I can only imagine how incredible the theming would be surrounding those extreme rides!

It would take a lot of time and a lot of money...but I'm wondering if Disney thinks it's worth it to keep more people on property.

I love the thrill rides, too, but Disney does not have to compete with the other parks in that regard. They are a top draw without having to resort to cloning another theme park to compete. I feel like the attraction to Disney is about something else, not the thrills.
By the way, last time I went to Universal, I was very unimpressed and there were only like two rides that I really enjoyed. Plus, the park was not very crowded and this was in the middle of the summer. I was surprised. I feel like Universal is one-dimensional. It's fun, but not somewhere I would go over and over.
Disney has depth and has that something else that other theme parks can't put their finger on, and I hope they remember that whenever they do think about adding new rides, or a new park.

 

[5Princes]

It would be nice to have something different. I really don't want to see another ride like Buzz and TSM.

 

[W.E.D.]

I'd heard, AWHILE back, that they were planning an "exclusive"-type park, that would have a much higher ticket price and would cater almost totally to DVC members. It would not be part of the PH package.

I know they've been putting a lot of $$ into DVC stuff, so I've been wondering if this could actually be a possibility. I would hope not, as it seems sort of elitist, IMHO.

 

[doconeill]

I'd heard, AWHILE back, that they were planning an "exclusive"-type park, that would have a much higher ticket price and would cater almost totally to DVC members. It would not be part of the PH package.

I know they've been putting a lot of $$ into DVC stuff, so I've been wondering if this could actually be a possibility. I would hope not, as it seems sort of elitist, IMHO.

I think you are taking about Night Kingdom/Jungle Trek, but there was nothing DVC-related about it that I ever heard. It was meant to be something on the level of Discovery Cove.

That was a Jim Hill-fueled rumor as well, and has likely been shelved or buried if it ever actually made it out of the research phase.

 

[fannatic]

I think the Jungle Trek/Night Kingdom is a bit elitist, as well. I think that Jim Hill said that they used this exclusive "park" to lure Four Seasons to the property. They're still building the Four Seasons, but apparently they're mad that Disney shelved or scrapped the park. I think that Jim Hill said something like that Disney is going to try to win back their core guests instead of trying to woo the high rollers. When they do a new park, I'm hoping it's a regular theme park like the other four. I know a lot of that has to do with me being an Annual Pass holder, but so be it.