Any non-AP parents out there??

[bellebud]

I have to say, i originally opened this thread because i was a little taken back by the title. I agree w/ another poster that hopefully the OP meant no harm and just couldn't think of another way to title it (mainstream parenting or something to that affect would have probably been what she meant), and since she saw the AP thread, kind of just went off of that and typed non-ap. It's not like AP and non-AP are the two only ways to parent... there are parents who think beating the %^&* out of your kid is best for them, but hopefully we won't see that thread started here (although it might unite the ap and non-ap posters).

As i was reading posts, I was again a little taken back by some comments such as (and i'm not exactly quoting):

"send kids to public school... GASP!"

"baby slept in crib from day one... GASP!"

I very much felt like those gasps were directed at AP moms, because if not, they would have simply said "send kids to public school" without the gasp at the end.

I posted my hello here to be a part of this thread to show people who think that all AP parents are hardcore and judgemental are not. I described myself as *ap-lite* and i'm very similar to many people here in many ways, and I just wanted to show that.

Hopefully both threads will become what they were intended to be, just a friendly place to chat with like-minded people, and I think a lot of us have a place on both threads.

 

[dfarner]

I have to say, i originally opened this thread because i was a little taken back by the title. I agree w/ another poster that hopefully the OP meant no harm and just couldn't think of another way to title it (mainstream parenting or something to that affect would have probably been what she meant), and since she saw the AP thread, kind of just went off of that and typed non-ap. It's not like AP and non-AP are the two only ways to parent... there are parents who think beating the %^&* out of your kid is best for them, but hopefully we won't see that thread started here (although it might unite the ap and non-ap posters).

As i was reading posts, I was again a little taken back by some comments such as (and i'm not exactly quoting):

"send kids to public school... GASP!"

"baby slept in crib from day one... GASP!"

I very much felt like those gasps were directed at AP moms, because if not, they would have simply said "send kids to public school" without the gasp at the end.

I posted my hello here to be a part of this thread to show people who think that all AP parents are hardcore and judgemental are not. I described myself as *ap-lite* and i'm very similar to many people here in many ways, and I just wanted to show that.

Hopefully both threads will become what they were intended to be, just a friendly place to chat with like-minded people, and I think a lot of us have a place on both threads.

Just so everyone is clear, here are some quotes taken from the AP post:

Really though, I think we should keep this thread friendly, let the "other' thread have the fighting, crying, spanking & projectile vomiting!


Ha! Well I expect him to be sitting at the kitchen table in his bumbo reading the NY Times by the next few weeks

...perhaps by 6 months when he starts solids we can transition him to the driver's seat in the car? Too early?
hehe

Yes, Bellebud, I hope that everyone can refrain from making derogatory remarks regarding one another's parenting choices.

 

[bellebud]

Yes, Bellebud, I hope that everyone can refrain from making derogatory remarks regarding one another's parenting choices.[/QUOTE]

Yes, yes... I totally agree! I also meant to say that by human nature, I'm sure I was more sensitive to reading the gasps on the non-ap thread than I would be reading something directed to non-aper's on the AP thread (does that make sense?). I'd probably be more likely to read right over it, which certainly isn't right either.

anyway, here's to parenting whichever way is best for each family... it's hard enough - let's support each other in whatever way we can.

 

[bellebud]

ya know... how do i only partially quote and keep the quote box so it looks like a quote??????????????????? I was replying to dfarner and I hate when the 'box' disappears.

 

[Juliet25]

I posted my hello here to be a part of this thread to show people who think that all AP parents are hardcore and judgemental are not. I described myself as *ap-lite* and i'm very similar to many people here in many ways, and I just wanted to show that.

I think you're right that our similarities as mothers far outweigh our differences.

I didn't co-sleep w/ DD as an infant.
I vaccinated her on schedule.
I used a stroller all the time...I never "wore" her (and I don't at all find anything wrong with that term, like a PP).
DD entered went to day care as I'm a WOHM.
DD will go to public schools.

I also BF her exclusively and we co-sleep now (though that's changing). I also NEVER spank her.

So, I'm 5 to 3 in favor of non-AP parenting. But I still identify with this parenting movement and find many of the comments here unnecessarily harsh.

 

[DisneyPhD]

I have to say, i originally opened this thread because i was a little taken back by the title. I agree w/ another poster that hopefully the OP meant no harm and just couldn't think of another way to title it (mainstream parenting or something to that affect would have probably been what she meant), and since she saw the AP thread, kind of just went off of that and typed non-ap. It's not like AP and non-AP are the two only ways to parent... there are parents who think beating the %^&* out of your kid is best for them, but hopefully we won't see that thread started here (although it might unite the ap and non-ap posters).
Hopefully both threads will become what they were intended to be, just a friendly place to chat with like-minded people, and I think a lot of us have a place on both threads.

bolding is mine because I really agree. LOL about uniting both sides. So very true!

 

[mrsltg]

You're right, I'm ruining this kind, friendly thread by saying its wrong to call people who disagree with you Nazis. It's not the name-calling that is wrong, its the pointing it out.

I do apologoize. Silly me, not like being referred to as mass murderer because I chose to BF.

Go away. Honestly, at this point you have become ridiculous. Most of the people here are discussing - happily- their experiences with their children. Why do you care if they raise their children differently than you raise yours? Your posts are mean spirited and nasty and there is no need for it. You associate more closely with AP - great for you!!! Go to that thread and talk to those women. I am sure they'll be grateful for your pov.

 

[chobie]

Go away. Honestly, at this point you have become ridiculous. Most of the people here are discussing - happily- their experiences with their children. Why do you care if they raise their children differently than you raise yours? Your posts are mean spirited and nasty and there is no need for it. You associate more closely with AP - great for you!!! Go to that thread and talk to those women. I am sure they'll be grateful for your pov.

I don't care. I never did say I cared. I never commented either way on how people raise their kids. Show me where I made a comment on how people raise their kids.


Calling people Nazis is what is nasty, not my pointing it out. And I did try to leave this alone on the last page, which you either did not see, or chose to ignore so you could call me nasty. I did try to leave, but since you want to drag me back in then I will feel free to post whatever I choose.

Nasty is as nasty does...

 

[Beccabunny]

How many times do I have to repeat myself? I DID NOT CALL BREASTFEEDING MOTHERS NAZIS!!! Chobie, I DID NOT CALL YOU A NAZI!!! I did not call anyone on this board a Nazi. The people I was referring to are people in MY OWN PERSONAL LIFE who judged me because my daughter was unable to breastfeed. Not anyone here on this board, just people I know including people who I thought were friends. I made that clear, but you chose to twist my words. Nobody has any right to decide whether or not I tried hard enough when my daughter was unable to breastfeed. I alone know how hard I tried. What I said was not directed at people who think breastfeeding is best or at breastfeeding moms in general. I wouldn't have even tried to breastfeed if I didn't think it was the best choice for my baby. This wasn't about you, Chobie, but you apparently want to make it about you. I'm sorry if you're offended by me referring to fanatical judgemental people in my own personal life as breastfeeding Nazis. I certainly didn't coin the term, but if you don't like it, then I'm sorry. But stop trying to twist it about to make it look like I referred to BF moms or anyone on this board in that way. You're very offended by a word, but obviously not at all offended by people who judge a situation just because of their own militant beliefs. You're obviously looking for an argument, but I'm done with you. I'm outta here! I have a real life to live. I wish you would go find one.

 

[dfarner]

I did try to leave, but since you want to drag me back in then I will feel free to post whatever I choose.

Nasty is as nasty does...

Please, everyone, don't indulge her anymore!!! This is madness

Bellebud-I understand what you are saying.

 

[chobie]

How many times do I have to repeat myself? I DID NOT CALL BREASTFEEDING MOTHERS NAZIS!!! Chobie, I DID NOT CALL YOU A NAZI!!! I did not call anyone on this board a Nazi. The people I was referring to are people in MY OWN PERSONAL LIFE who judged me because my daughter was unable to breastfeed. Not anyone here on this board, just people I know including people who I thought were friends. I made that clear, but you chose to twist my words. Nobody has any right to decide whether or not I tried hard enough when my daughter was unable to breastfeed. I alone know how hard I tried. What I said was not directed at people who think breastfeeding is best or at breastfeeding moms in general. I wouldn't have even tried to breastfeed if I didn't think it was the best choice for my baby. This wasn't about you, Chobie, but you apparently want to make it about you. I'm sorry if you're offended by me referring to fanatical judgemental people in my own personal life as breastfeeding Nazis. I certainly didn't coin the term, but if you don't like it, then I'm sorry. But stop trying to twist it about to make it look like I referred to BF moms or anyone on this board in that way. You're very offended by a word, but obviously not at all offended by people who judge a situation just because of their own militant beliefs. You're obviously looking for an argument, but I'm done with you. I'm outta here! I have a real life to live. I wish you would go find one.

No, I am very offended by that. If you were to read the BFing a toddler thread I brought up that issue many times about how I think it is wrong that women feel bullied into BF and I'm not denying that mentality exists.

I have said several times that judging goes both ways and I don't like it. Unlike, you and others however, I do not keep trying to insist that the people who are against my parenting styles are more judgmental or more likely to bash, Even though from my experience it seemed like people who did not BF, co-sleep etc were more judgmental, I'm assuming that it just seemed that way because those comments had more of an impact on me.

 

[dfarner]

ya know... how do i only partially quote and keep the quote box so it looks like a quote??????????????????? I was replying to dfarner and I hate when the 'box' disappears.

It's tricky sometimes. Quote the whole box and then erase what you don't want, but be sure you don't erase the [ ] at the beginning or end. Does that make sense?

 

[Karel]

I used a front pack with my middle child because he was not the type to amuse himself on the floor. He hated the stroller, he hated the swing. Holding him was great but I couldn't get much done in the house with one hand, so he hung out in the front pack. I had a sling type thing but I could never get the hang of it and was always afraid he would fall out. Now my oldest loved floor play and exploring and watching the world go by. With my youngest --well, I don't remember much. After having three babies in three years it really came down to day to day survival. She was a happy and good baby, just went with the flow.

I think many many parents put their child's needs instead of their own wants. That's the essence of being a parent...I don't think it needs a fancy label. Lots of people make those choices a million times a day. But I don't think a parent has to deny their own wants every single time.

Take co-sleeping - I like sleeping in my own bed with my husband. I don't see it a great need on the child's part to be a part of that bed. They are certainly welcome at times but I need to sleep well to be a good parent so they have slept in their own bed since three or four months old. Being kicked in the stomach by my active daughter does not make me find her more adorable.

Also, I BF for several months for each child. I do understand that there are early benefits. But I think those benefits start to fade after a year or so. I can't really see at all why someone needs to do it to preschool age.

 

[maxtomsmom]

The current statistics still show a 50/50 trend still leaning towards a movement of not circ. There are some studies suggesting possible benefits of circ'ing however the thought around them is their reality. There are studies showing a reduction in STD, particularly AIDS. There are also studies that have been around for a while suggesting a decrease in UTI for boys who are circ'd. The rate of UTI is already low to begin with which is one of the reasons this study isn't a huge find.

I'm not talking about local pediatricians and what Dr. Joe around the corner said. That can be very much based on the opinion of that doctor. Many doctor's recommend things that they personally think are a good idea but may not be supported by the national organization for that speciality.

The AAP has changed it's stance on circ. The rate has moved to 50/50 with it continuing to move. Those are facts.

The person asked a question about the US. I answered THAT question. There are areas where the circ rate is extremely high. You may find an area where 90% are cric'd but then you will find another area where it's 90% not circ'd. You can't look locally but nationally in order to speak about the rate in the US.

If you are comfortable with your decision so be it...whether you did it or not.

Statistics always make me question several things: Who ran the study? For what purpose did they chose to run the study? Where was the study conducted? I'm curious about where some of these pockets of high circum. occurs. In rural areas? In more urban areas? Does economics play a role? Education? Like a previous poster had said, it is high in my area as were are in a wealthy county (which we are not one of them) and most choose to circum. However, there is a large Latino population and most do not choose it. So it is that because our nation is increasingly becoming more diverse which means the trend could be changing? We did it for several reasons. 1. Our nephew had so many problems that he later became circum for medical reasons and it was much worse to do it at 6 rather than as a newborn. 2. My neighbor growing up wasn't and he was the only one. So many boys teased and tortured him (I guess they saw in the locker room). I felt so bad for him.

 

[emh1129]

I think part of the way this thread made it onto the wrong foot is the title.

I agree.. I'm sure it was unintentional, but it started an "us vs. them" mentality, which is sad

My post here earlier was just to clear up misinformation- many people here wanted to say that they were "non-AP" but didn't even really understand what AP really means (i.e. nothing to do with vaccinations and circ'ing!!!).

Although I am an "AP" parent (although I just do what feels right for our family and comes naturally), I respect that all parents choose what they feel is best for their children and family. I just wish that all parents showed respect and open-mindedness. We all come from different backgrounds and have our own life experiences coming into this thing we call parenthood, and that will lead us to make different choices.
Most parents know the basic facts and research out there (I would hope) and we can decipher that and take from it what we will.
I am hurt when someone tries to make me feel badly about breastfeeding, for example. With the knowledge that I have, though, I feel that it is in my daughter's best interest health-wise (and mine, too, since it can lower breast cancer rates) and so I am committed to it. Nobody wants to be made to feel badly about their choices

 

[4littlemonkeys]

On to the co-sleeping thing. If you do it, fine, it is your choice. I have personally seen (I work in the emergency room) 4 infants who were smothered to death by co-sleeping parents. Although people say it "never happens" it does. This would be the main reason I would not choose to co-sleep. I don't think I could live with myself..................

There was a study once that showed that the majority of co-sleeping deaths were caused by inappropriate co-sleeping arrangements.

Co-sleeping should never be done by somebody with a sleep disorder, obese, drinking, alcohol, OTC medications that may cause drowsiness. There are many who also say no smoking as well. There are also "rules" for how the bed itself is set-up.

Another thing to note is that co-sleeping can be blamed for deaths of infants that are actually placed in the adult bed by themselves.

What people forget is that the crib is not a safe place either. There are children who die in cribs due to the crib being older (slats too far apart peeling paint), crib placement (too close to a cord), suffocation from blankets or stuffed animals, vomiting and aspiration. There are also studies linked cribs to an increased risk of SIDS.

There are risks both places and I think a lot of people forget that. I honestly think it's easier to point a finger at co-sleeping because it's different and not the social norm. People are used to cribs and that's their comfort level but there are deaths associated with crib use.

There are studies supporting bother sides. Most studies regarding this issue have groups that say the studies are flawed so it's really hard to determine what the true data would be. It's also important to know that when looking at the data that many of the deaths are caused by parents not following the safety practices for co-sleeping. Most people are aware of the crib "rules" because it's more widely known. When people co-sleep without knowing the "rules" there certainly will be a higher risk for death. When rules are followed the rates are extremely low.

Co-sleeping is safe but ONLY when the proper rules are followed...just like crib use. You have to follow the safety rules or you put your child at risk...crib or co-sleeping.

 

[Mkrop]

I am not focusing on any one topic here I feel this way about any study or stats. I am suspicious of any study or stats becasue too many times then can be skewed to favor whatever topic and sometimes it is even the way the questioned is asked or phrased that can screw up stats. I just dont trust them!

 

[baybemama]

Just so everyone is clear, here are some quotes taken from the AP post:

Really though, I think we should keep this thread friendly, let the "other' thread have the fighting, crying, spanking & projectile vomiting!


Ha! Well I expect him to be sitting at the kitchen table in his bumbo reading the NY Times by the next few weeks

...perhaps by 6 months when he starts solids we can transition him to the driver's seat in the car? Too early?
hehe

Yes, Bellebud, I hope that everyone can refrain from making derogatory remarks regarding one another's parenting choices.

Hey everyone, I was just browsing through here and noticed this post....I was the one who wrote about my son being at the table in his bumbo and I just wanted everyone to know that I was in NO WAY commenting on a non-ap parenting style! I didn't even think that was how it would be taken...if anything, it was my OWN projection of how I think my son is a genius and was just making a joke of how I fully expect him one day to just be all grown up! PLEASE don't think this was me being judgemental because I'm surely not!

 

[Aristomommy]

I am not focusing on any one topic here I feel this way about any study or stats. I am suspicious of any study or stats becasue too many times then can be skewed to favor whatever topic and sometimes it is even the way the questioned is asked or phrased that can screw up stats. I just dont trust them!

I rely on research to make clinical decisions in my job, so I know research can give us valuable information in many instances. Instead of going into a lengthy lecture, I will just say this: a properly constructed study is difficult (not impossible) to skew as controls are put into place. Most researchers are not there to prove their viewpoint, but to discover trends. One study alone doesn't make me change my mind on an issue, but several well constructed studies will. If an organization such as AAP changes their recommendation on an issue it's based on more than one study.

 

[maxtomsmom]

I truly think doing what is best for you and your family is the way to go. Everyone has their reasons and before we are quick to judge (what right does anyone have to judge anyway?), let's not forget that most parents want to raise happy, healthy and caring individuals. No one person learns the same way and no one style of parenting works the same.


I BF both my babies until they suffered from GERD and had to have rice cereal in their milk in order to keep it down. The poor things both had it so bad that neither could sleep flat after they ate until it was under control. BF did not seem to prevent or help them as we were told it would. Seeing your tiny infant projectile vomit like he was on the Exorcist and re-acting Linda Blair's infamous scene was enough to put me over the edge. After 3 months with the first one, I had to put cereal in my milk which meant pumping all the time. I had to stop. It finally got under control at 8 months. He had an episode every day. My second was worse, but we stuck it out longer and used medication to combat it. Had to stop it at 5 months as he really did not tolerate thin liquids. He had to see a specialist. Both are healthy and fine. We limit sugar, rarely eat processed foods, drink and eat organic as often as we can, but they are still active crazy nuts. Just like 6 and 3 year old boys tend to be.


Never co-slept past 4 months because DH snores so horribly that he woke them up all the time which meant I was up all the time. I don't function well on 2 hours of sleep. In fact my second one had to sleep on his stomach. Yes, all the research out there says SIDS has gone down since the Back to Sleep campaign, BUT he aspirated twice. I know Infant CPR and unless you have had to bring your child back to life no one questions our decision. (The doctor suggested I teach other moms what to do) The thing is I haven't been certified in over 15 years in any CPR - Highly recommend it for anyone. Once he slept on his stomach, DS2 slept and did he ever like he was trying to catch up on it. It was wonderful. Really! Slept 6 hours the first night. I was soooo scared, but his chances for survival were higher on his stomach than on his back.

Had a sling, a carrier and held them. They turned out not to be lap kids, my second is more likely to sit on my lap, but being a wiggler it isn't for long.

I never experienced negative comments or looks from anyone about BF. I could care less if they did. My SILs who did not BF did get a lot of H--- from people in the hospital, but I don't think they cared. My one SIL, from Peru, actually threw an unopened nipple top at one of the Lactation Nurses as she told my SIL that my nephew would have a lot of problems if she didn't BF. When she first politely said, "Sorry, I still choose not to do it," the nurse made a comment about her being Hispanic. That flew her off the handle and with the high emotions from just giving birth threw a nipple. Such a fun story to talk about during the holidays. She's crazy!