Any new family hotels?

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Beastlie Kingdomme may in itself not be so amazing (I do think the Dragon coaster would have amazed many if it had been built at the same time AK opened) but it seems a lot of good ideas have been scraped in the name of saving money.


EPCOT the community--
Beastlie Kingdomme---

And the resorts that Disney just dropped to name a few.
----------------------------------------------------------------

Resorts that were dropped-

Asian Resort Hotel
Venetian Resort
Persian Resort



Before the MK was even built plans were in place for 4 hotels to be on the monorail line.The Grand Floridian hotel is on the land that was set aside and dedicated to be the "Future" Asian Resort Hotel (A). The "Future"
Venetian (B) Resort was going to located between the Poly (5) and the Contemporary (8). A fifth hotel was going to build on a monorail spur which ended at the "Future" Persian Resort (C). That resort would be located just to east of the Mk and North of the Contemorary and would built with much of the hotel being on /over the water of Bay Lake. So even though the GF was not built until 18 years later a hotel was planned for that area at the same time the monorail was planned.

I got this picture and my info from my"The story of Walt Disney World"
Commemory Edition Book 1971.

I have that book, too. Very interesting read and historical prospective.

 

[shanomi4]

If anything, Disney has stopped being Disney and become another Universal Studios where every ride is riding the movies. Maybe, if they went back to their old model, They'd be different and they would wow people again.

So what are you saying? I thought Disney had no competition? Above you write that Disney has become another US. Can't have it both ways! Either they are like US and are competitors, or they are not like US and have no competitors. I can tell you that we spent time at US. Had US not been there we would of spent that time and money at Disney. When we go back to Orlando we will spend even more time at US and less time at Disney. so as far as my $'s are concerned US is a competitor. Competing for my dollars and I will have no problem giving some to both parks. Laugh all you like but you are the fool if you do not think US is a competitor! Definition of competitor:
one selling or buying goods or services in the same market as another
They both are selling entertainment in Orlando. Period! But I guess I am the only one who split their time and money between DW and US.

 

[shanomi4]

It could be amazing Why don't you think so?

Look at how amazing Everest turned out.

Would it be great? Yea! Would I want to go? Yea! Would I pay to see it? yea! But would it make enough money and draw enough people to justify the expense? I am not sure. I do not know the numbers. One would need to know how much EE cost and how much increase in ticket sales and merchandising dollar has gone up to determine if even that can be justified. Don't think we have those numbers. And those numbers do tell a story that the "bean counters" look at!!

And I guess I am one of the fools that liked the lion king show. In fact, when we decide to go to a park we look at what they offer. That show, along with EE and tough to be a bug, would influence me to go to AK again. Fun show that didn’t cost much. Great business decision!

 

[YoHo]

So what are you saying? I thought Disney had no competition? Above you write that Disney has become another US. Can't have it both ways! Either they are like US and are competitors, or they are not like US and have no competitors. I can tell you that we spent time at US. Had US not been there we would of spent that time and money at Disney. When we go back to Orlando we will spend even more time at US and less time at Disney. so as far as my $'s are concerned US is a competitor. Competing for my dollars and I will have no problem giving some to both parks. Laugh all you like but you are the fool if you do not think US is a competitor! Definition of competitor:
one selling or buying goods or services in the same market as another
They both are selling entertainment in Orlando. Period! But I guess I am the only one who split their time and money between DW and US.

Sigh, yes, they are a competitor for your dollars, but no they don't offer the same type of entertainment. And Disney's scale is orders of magnitude greater.

And I can have it both ways, because I'm drawing a distinction between "Old Disney" The corporate philosophy, the methodology by which WDW was built and "New Disney©" The mega media conglomerate whose sole corporate philosophy is "double digit earnings every quarter."
WDW has no competition, because of what was built in the 70s and early 80s. New additions to Walt Disney World of today have been "dumbed down" to Universal levels. Taken as a whole though, they're still more, because of what went in to the place in the beginning.




And don't mistake my comments for suggesting that Universals attractions aren't in some ways good. I'm not talking about the specifics of any one attraction. I'm talking about the overall philosophy that drives the whys and the whats of the park. With Universal, it has always been 100% corporate synergy. With Disney, yes, synergy was important, but it was also so so much more. (MJMcbride, if you're reading, this is why I dislike character additions)

 

[shanomi4]

Sigh, yes, they are a competitor for your dollars, but no they don't offer the same type of entertainment. And Disney's scale is orders of magnitude greater.)

Never said they offer the exact same entertainment. But they are competitors.

 

[disneyfan67]

as long as it's not a room full of video games, but instead, a true hall of "Innoventions" there's so much potential for Epcot, but it requires the investment to continue evolving.
Evolution is what keeps families coming back. They see something spectacular EVERY time they come.
Why can't that translate to tomorrowland at the MK? Or (dare i say it?) a beastly kingdom at AK or an interactive "movie making" experience at MGM?
why are MGM and AK ho-hum to some? because they are HALF-FINISHED - the bean-counters closed the checkbooks!
MK is dangerously close to becoming stagnant - especially if they keep shuttering attractions and unique shops, ruining classics with annoying birds, and opening things like Stitch.

Disney is a multibillion dollar entertainment conglomerate whose reason for existance is to create experiences that excite the imagination. Saying it's too hard in this day and age to truely excite people is ridiculous and laughable.
People do it all the time. People whose first goal isn't their golden parachute or their "industry clout."

But by all means, continue to make excuses for why Disney can't be what it used to be, why we should come to expect Mission: Space to have it's budget slashed and any actual learning removed and The Seas to get nothing innovative, but a weak Nemo overlay. How dare we expect more from them?


Of course, Even Disney sneaks one through. Soarin Over California is really amayzing. Too bad they couldn't afford to finish of the theming.
Oh and lets not forget Indy in 1996. Didn't have any problems wowing guests. Still doesn't have any problems wowing guests. And that's to say nothing of Spiderman, it's protege' over at Universal. Even Pirates and Haunted Mansion still spark the imagination after 40 years.

Good points made by all here and some don't want to admit or realise that Disney is starting to make the same mistakes that is currently dooming the Six Flags company. Also a reason why attendance figures are down at Universal Orlando. I understand you have to please the shareholders more than ever in this day and age, but Disney is in danger of becoming stale and just another theme park that you can find anywhere in America. I don't scrimp and save and pay a small fortune to find that at WDW, I go because there's nothing else quite like it. When I go to MK and see more attractions being removed than being built and older ones becoming stale like Indy Speedway, then I worry. Kevin Yee of Mice Age writes a great column named "Declining by Degrees" and points a lot of this out in his regular columns. I understand some attractions come and go and cost too much to be maintained, but you just don't remove them and let the buildings just sit there. The Sky way ride for example, I understand some of the reasoning for removing it, but are you telling me Disney can't come up with a newer, high tech version of it? Same with the area that held the "20,000 Leagues under the Sea" ride, that is now a cheap looking Winnie the Pooh play area for little kids. That's not imagination or wowing your guests, that's becoming scared, cheap and running you product into the ground for the quick, short term profit. Why can't WDW have the Hunny Pot ride that Toyko Disneyland does? It's an awesome ride from what I've seen and here's a video of it below. When I look at that ride it makes me mad that we can't have that here in America, where the Disney theme parks were invented.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K01-kPT4t8I&mode=related&search=


Nothing would be cooler than to go to MK and see the version of the HKDL Autopia that is state of the art compared to the noisy, smelly Indy Speedway we currently have. I've seen pictures of their version of Autopia and it's futuristic and environmentally friendly. They use quiet, basically pollution free electric cars and it's one of the few good things people write about concerning that park. The track lay out is pleasant and the landscaping is unique. Here is video that I found on You Tube and I think that ride looks a lot better than the version currently in Florida. Just ignore the people talking in the video though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIOYcGhgcrU&mode=related&search=



Or how about an updated, high tech version of the Sky way ride that would make people look up and be amazed at the beauty and design of it. Disney could easily build it, but I think is happier with keeping the costs down and staying with the status quo. They probably figure the guests have enough to do, why spend more and throw in a "Stitch's Great Escape" type of attraction here and there to fill the void. I understand a park getting mature, but that doesn't mean if has to get cheap and stale.


In the Chicago land area in the mid 70's Marriott built a theme park near my hometown and for the most part, they copied Disney's design in a lot of it. My sister and I worked in that park for many summers when Marriott owned it and while it wasn't Disney world, it still was a fairly nice place to go. Marriott sold the park in the mid 80's to the Six Flags group and it's been down hill ever since. I bought season passes a couple of years ago for my kids and was shocked at the condition of that place. It looks like a dirty Walmart with giant roller coasters that most family members can't go onto together. I see Papa Johns pizza places selling food in the park and employees don't wear themed outfits anymore, but blue shirts and tennis shoes, plus have bad attitudes to match it. The food isn't good anymore, it's all the same, but just as expensive and there's nothing special or unique to the place. Sound Familur? The park looks run down in many places and they cut back on so many of the services the used to provide. I don't want Disney becoming another version of Six Flags and they risk doing so, if they allow the prospect of making a quick buck over the ideas that got the Disney theme parks popular in the first place. I'm a big fan of Disney and it's theme parks, but no way am I blinded by my loyalty to see that changes need to be made

 

[YoHo]

Never said they offer the exact same entertainment. But they are competitors.

So is my Television set and the Box of Legos and My Digital camera. All entertainments that compete for my time. Doesn't mean that I can draw useful information by comparing them to WDW.

 

[YoHo]

I understand you have to please the shareholders more than ever in this day and age

You do have to please the shareholders, but most companies please the shareholders by creating products and services at the highest level possible.

The shareholder excuse is a misnomer anyway. Shareholders will only express their discontent when things are so very bad that they have to. Further, Disney is held largely by institutional investors who can afford the long view. They aren't daytraders trying to make a quick buck. It's Disney itself that can't see past the quarterly report. It's not Wall Street's fault. Maybe if Disney went back to long term growth strategies, people like Warren Buffet would become Bullish on the stock again.

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Would it be great? Yea! Would I want to go? Yea! Would I pay to see it? yea! But would it make enough money and draw enough people to justify the expense? I am not sure. I do not know the numbers. One would need to know how much EE cost and how much increase in ticket sales and merchandising dollar has gone up to determine if even that can be justified. Don't think we have those numbers. And those numbers do tell a story that the "bean counters" look at!!

And I guess I am one of the fools that liked the lion king show. In fact, when we decide to go to a park we look at what they offer. That show, along with EE and tough to be a bug, would influence me to go to AK again. Fun show that didn’t cost much. Great business decision!

We love the Lion King show and Tough to be a Bug, too!

 

[shanomi4]

So is my Television set and the Box of Legos and My Digital camera. All entertainments that compete for my time. Doesn't mean that I can draw useful information by comparing them to WDW.

Universal and Disney are both theme parks. They both promote there parks to families. They are both in Orlando. They both have themed rides. They both have roller coasters. Logically, no matter what the vision was in the past, they are competitors. I am sorry that you can not see that. They can both be vastly different, but they are going after the same dollar. The dollar that people set aside for a vacation. But you can't seem to understand that. Thanks for playing and sorry to say I do not have a consolation prize for you. Better luck next time!!

 

[disneyfan67]

We love the Lion King show and Tough to be a Bug, too!

I have nothing against those shows and I like them. Disney does need to add more attractions though to AK and they certainly have enough room to do so. AK is the largest of all the theme parks, yet has the least amount of E ticket rides. They shouldn't have to take out any current attractions they currently have to add a new one. According to the Modern Marvels program on the Discovery Channel, AK has enough land to house MK, Epcot, and MGM all inside the property AK sits on, with room left over. I have no problem with the park except for that Dinoland area which looks like a cheesy carnival area and that same spinning roller coaster that Six Flags has and calls the Ragin Cagin. Expedition Everest is a top notch attraction and more similar, is needed to make it an all day park. As it sits right now, my family and I can go through it and be done by 2 or 3 pm. I hope Disney has more on the drawing boards for it, because the park is a neat concept and deserves more.

 

[shanomi4]

We love the Lion King show and Tough to be a Bug, too!

I thought I was the only one from what I read here!

Funny.....I think I see a pattern. Universal is sliding...Six flags...Disney...and other themed parks....Maybe people are just finding other things to do for vacations Cruises for one
But I guess I would be pulling at strings if I suggest that cruises are competing for vacationers dollars?

 

[shanomi4]

So is my .........Box of Legos .

ahhh look who's been a good boy....yes you have, you good boy you!! Make sure you eat all your vegetables too!!

 

[YoHo]

Cruises didn't exist in the 1970s?

WDW is not a Theme Park, for HEaven's sake. It's a multipark resort with Golf Courses, spas, horseback riding, fishing etc, etc, etc. It's comparable to going to Hawaii or Going to Vegas. People choose between going to Disney and Going to Hawaii. People choose between going to Orlando and Going to Hawaii. Nobody chooses between going to Disney World and going to Universal. They choose between going to Disney World or Going to Orlando. Disney World is it's own destination seperate from Orlando in many ways. Universal is absolutly not.
They aren't comparable.

I'm not saying that people that "Go to Disney World" don't also see other things in Orlando, only that most don't or don't spend much time and effort on it. A Universal guest is orders of magnitude more likely to visit other attractions in Orlando compared to a Disney guest.

 

[YoHo]

ahhh look who's been a good boy....yes you have, you good boy you!! Make sure you eat all your vegetables too!!

Look whose being insulting. I guess when you're out of ideas, or just here to troll, that's what happens.

 

[disneyfan67]

Universal and Disney are both theme parks. They both promote there parks to families. They are both in Orlando. They both have themed rides. They both have roller coasters. Logically, no matter what the vision was in the past, they are competitors. I am sorry that you can not see that. They can both be vastly different, but they are going after the same dollar. The dollar that people set aside for a vacation. But you can't seem to understand that. Thanks for playing and sorry to say I do not have a consolation prize for you. Better luck next time!!

This was the point I made in my last post to you and why I think your behavior is troll like. Your new to this board, yet are insulting to everyone who disagrees with you. I've been a member for 3 years and lurked for 2 before that. I don't recall just jumping in with my first post and trying to cause trouble and unrest. Look what you posted above and it's rude and condescending. There's no call for how you conduct yourself. Everyone on this thread has made valid points, including you a times, yet you're the only one being rude. I just don't understand how you get off being that way on a board that you just started posting on. Either you have been here before and have been banned because of the behavior you're currently displaying. Or you don't work well with people IRL and enjoy being another Internet tough guy who hides behind the anonymity the Internet provides.

 

[shanomi4]

I I have no problem with the park except for that Dinoland area which looks like a cheesy carnival area and that same .

Well I guess the imagineers did their job great!! That was the objective..to make it look like a "cheesy carnival" ! Did you notice that it was built on asphalt ..even with the white paint...kind of like a parking lot? You do know that it wasn't built on an old parking lot, right? You may not like the theme, but obviously they did a good job as you stated just what it was suppose to be like!!! I for one liked it. I like the feeling of a Carnival, but certainly wouldn’t let my kids ride at a real Carnival. It was kind of nostalgic. I even pointed it out to the kids. To each their own!!

 

[shanomi4]

This was the point I made in my last post to you and why I think your behavior is troll like. Your new to this board, yet are insulting to everyone who disagrees with you. I've been a member for 3 years and lurked for 2 before that. I don't recall just jumping in with my first post and trying to cause trouble and unrest. Look what you posted above and it's rude and condescending. There's no call for how you conduct yourself. Everyone on this thread has made valid points, including you a times, yet you're the only one being rude. I just don't understand how you get off being that way on a board that you just started posting on. Either you have been here before and have been banned because of the behavior you're currently displaying. Or you don't work well with people IRL and enjoy being another Internet tough guy who hides behind the anonymity the Internet provides.

Nope, never been banned. May be on that road though. I am very sarcastic in real life. Life is to short to be so uptight. I have a sense of humor that is a little grayish, but that is just my way. I have been talked down to here in a intellectual way, but I don't write that way. Sorry you feel as though I have offended. Chow!

 

[YoHo]

You have offended. It's not a feeling.

 

[shanomi4]

Look whose being insulting. I guess when you're out of ideas, or just here to troll, that's what happens.

I was trying to be funny. Sorry if you take an anonymous persons words and take them to heart. I will use restraint when it comes to responding to you in the future. My apologies!!