Animal welfare advocate & dolphin swims

[HarborBlvd]

Like most anything, there's always a current bandwagon to hop on, be it blood diamonds, dolphin killing, etc. The interesting thing to me is how this always brings about a sudden rash of "concern" on so many people's part. The sincerity of that concern is what's debatable. Very few people care about a cause enough to actually research it on their own and consider opposing viewpoints. But when it's presented to them in an entertainment format (ie: a movie such as The Cove or Blood Diamond), suddenly hoardes of closet activists come out of the woodwork. I appreciate that there are those who fight for the rights of whatever cause is trendy at the moment, but how many people still feel passionate about it once the hype and media have died down? It's "cool" to fight for the dolphin's rights today because you learned all about it in an Oscar-winning movie. But a year from now, will you still care? That's my gripe.

Do your research. Invest some time and learn about the dolphin encounters you're interested in. Learn where they aquire their animals and how they treat them. I know several organizations, including The Seas at Epcot, don't require or guarantee that their animals participate. Don't make a blanket assumption that all dolphin pens, zoos, etc. are evil and should be scorned just because you're on a media-high. It's entirely possible that some of these places are reputable for treating their animals well and providing excellent living standards for them.

I've never done a dolphin encounter, but I've always wanted to. We'd like to do it next time we visit WDW. I think it'd be an experience I'd always remember. I feel confident in Disney, that they wouldn't offer an experience, or endorse one in another country, that wouldn't stand up to the same high standards we've come to expect from them.

 

[act1980]

Like most anything, there's always a current bandwagon to hop on, be it blood diamonds, dolphin killing, etc. The interesting thing to me is how this always brings about a sudden rash of "concern" on so many people's part. The sincerity of that concern is what's debatable. Very few people care about a cause enough to actually research it on their own and consider opposing viewpoints. But when it's presented to them in an entertainment format (ie: a movie such as The Cove or Blood Diamond), suddenly hoardes of closet activists come out of the woodwork. I appreciate that there are those who fight for the rights of whatever cause is trendy at the moment, but how many people still feel passionate about it once the hype and media have died down? It's "cool" to fight for the dolphin's rights today because you learned all about it in an Oscar-winning movie. But a year from now, will you still care? That's my gripe.

Do your research. Invest some time and learn about the dolphin encounters you're interested in. Learn where they aquire their animals and how they treat them. I know several organizations, including The Seas at Epcot, don't require or guarantee that their animals participate. Don't make a blanket assumption that all dolphin pens, zoos, etc. are evil and should be scorned just because you're on a media-high. It's entirely possible that some of these places are reputable for treating their animals well and providing excellent living standards for them.

I've never done a dolphin encounter, but I've always wanted to. We'd like to do it next time we visit WDW. I think it'd be an experience I'd always remember. I feel confident in Disney, that they wouldn't offer an experience, or endorse one in another country, that wouldn't stand up to the same high standards we've come to expect from them.

It's not just how they are treated that bothers me, it's the fact they they are not meant for what they are being used for. I personally find it cruel. I don't really care for the shows at Seaworld either. We as humans shouldn't be playing around with powerful mammals that still have their natural built in instinct (hence why that poor woman got killed) I just feel that they are not meant to entertain us, it's just the bigwigs in these corporations that are benefiting from all this IMHO. I won't be going to Seaworld again now, I didn't care for it much before anyway

 

[OregonDisneyDreamer]

Like most anything, there's always a current bandwagon to hop on, be it blood diamonds, dolphin killing, etc. The interesting thing to me is how this always brings about a sudden rash of "concern" on so many people's part. The sincerity of that concern is what's debatable. Very few people care about a cause enough to actually research it on their own and consider opposing viewpoints. But when it's presented to them in an entertainment format (ie: a movie such as The Cove or Blood Diamond), suddenly hoardes of closet activists come out of the woodwork. I appreciate that there are those who fight for the rights of whatever cause is trendy at the moment, but how many people still feel passionate about it once the hype and media have died down? It's "cool" to fight for the dolphin's rights today because you learned all about it in an Oscar-winning movie. But a year from now, will you still care? That's my gripe.

Do your research. Invest some time and learn about the dolphin encounters you're interested in. Learn where they aquire their animals and how they treat them. I know several organizations, including The Seas at Epcot, don't require or guarantee that their animals participate. Don't make a blanket assumption that all dolphin pens, zoos, etc. are evil and should be scorned just because you're on a media-high. It's entirely possible that some of these places are reputable for treating their animals well and providing excellent living standards for them.

I've never done a dolphin encounter, but I've always wanted to. We'd like to do it next time we visit WDW. I think it'd be an experience I'd always remember. I feel confident in Disney, that they wouldn't offer an experience, or endorse one in another country, that wouldn't stand up to the same high standards we've come to expect from them.

As far as my feelings go, the "rash of concern" comes from being made aware of a situation or issue that I previously did not know about. Just because an issue is addressed in the mainstream and becomes "trendy" should not undermine the importance of the cause. I wasn't aware of the slaughter of dolphins or the anxiety captive dolphins exhibit prior to watching the Cove just as I was absolutely unaware of the meat-packing industry prior to reading Fast Food Nation.

I agree with you that people need to be rational and research things on their own, but I disagree with you that a topic being "trendy" makes it less of an issue.

 

[FJS961]

Like most anything, there's always a current bandwagon to hop on, be it blood diamonds, dolphin killing, etc. The interesting thing to me is how this always brings about a sudden rash of "concern" on so many people's part. The sincerity of that concern is what's debatable. Very few people care about a cause enough to actually research it on their own and consider opposing viewpoints. But when it's presented to them in an entertainment format (ie: a movie such as The Cove or Blood Diamond), suddenly hoardes of closet activists come out of the woodwork. I appreciate that there are those who fight for the rights of whatever cause is trendy at the moment, but how many people still feel passionate about it once the hype and media have died down? It's "cool" to fight for the dolphin's rights today because you learned all about it in an Oscar-winning movie. But a year from now, will you still care? That's my gripe.

Do your research. Invest some time and learn about the dolphin encounters you're interested in. Learn where they aquire their animals and how they treat them. I know several organizations, including The Seas at Epcot, don't require or guarantee that their animals participate. Don't make a blanket assumption that all dolphin pens, zoos, etc. are evil and should be scorned just because you're on a media-high. It's entirely possible that some of these places are reputable for treating their animals well and providing excellent living standards for them.

I've never done a dolphin encounter, but I've always wanted to. We'd like to do it next time we visit WDW. I think it'd be an experience I'd always remember. I feel confident in Disney, that they wouldn't offer an experience, or endorse one in another country, that wouldn't stand up to the same high standards we've come to expect from them.

Wanted to do a dolphin encounter for a long time, finally just did it in Cozumel and it was a wonderful experience. No regrets. Everyone is entitled to their opinion for sure, if you aren't comfortable with it, don't do it.

 

[Shell54]

The Cove is very difficult to watch. I couldn't finish viewing all of it..my husband did and it affected us both. I have always boycotted circuses and never knew enough dolphin encounters to make an informed decision, i feel like I know more now. Based on my own feelings about the ethical treatment of all animals, I would never do one.

 

[lark]

Like most anything, there's always a current bandwagon to hop on, be it blood diamonds, dolphin killing, etc. The interesting thing to me is how this always brings about a sudden rash of "concern" on so many people's part. The sincerity of that concern is what's debatable. Very few people care about a cause enough to actually research it on their own and consider opposing viewpoints. But when it's presented to them in an entertainment format (ie: a movie such as The Cove or Blood Diamond), suddenly hoardes of closet activists come out of the woodwork. I appreciate that there are those who fight for the rights of whatever cause is trendy at the moment, but how many people still feel passionate about it once the hype and media have died down? It's "cool" to fight for the dolphin's rights today because you learned all about it in an Oscar-winning movie. But a year from now, will you still care? That's my gripe.

Sounds like you had a lot to get off your chest. Not realy sure it's responsive to this thread or OP's question.

The Cove is a documentary. It shows, pretty simply, what happens to the 199 remaining dolphins after the 1 is selected and culled out of the heard to be sold to the dolphin facilities. What's to research? Can I say for a fact that the dolphins at dolphin encounter were purchased from the Tiaji cove? Nope. Just not sure. They might. They might not. Doesn't matter to me -- that's not the point. But it might to others. Make your own decision.

I don't really see much "activism" in this thread. I see people like me saying, "boy, I didn't know that," and deciding as a result they are not personally comfortable with doing a swim with the dolphins, in direct response to a very specific question from OP asking precisely about that. Do whatever is comfortable for you. If you have info that would make OP more comfortable, I think that's fair game in this thread. A rant about speculation that people who see the movie and don't want to do dolphin swims any more are not true activists or might lose luster for the position over time seems neither responsive, relevant nor helpful to OP's question.

 

[CandyMandy]

Just a perspective on all the circus bashing apparent here: some of you might benefit from googling the Ringling Center for Elephant Conservation. Compare their record at getting Asian Elephants to successfully reproduce to that of any zoo in the world.

ANY.

 

[Presley]

I have interacted with dolphins in other parks. I also have seen literally hundreds swimming in the open ocean. I will never do a dolphin interaction in a park ever again - unless I am helping them escape.

 

[Shell54]

Just a perspective on all the circus bashing apparent here: some of you might benefit from googling the Ringling Center for Elephant Conservation. Compare their record at getting Asian Elephants to successfully reproduce to that of any zoo in the world.

ANY.

This facility has failed a USDA inspection and has also been referred to as being like an elephant puppy mill. Do we really need more elephants in captivity? If the answer if yes..a careful, discretionary, breeding program is better than what this circus does.

 

[Blanche_Neige]

I have the same concerns as the OP regarding the Dolphin encounters. Ever since I was a little girl I have always wanted to swimming with Dolphins. I mean who doesn't like dolphins!!!

Like many others here I have seen the movie The Cove and found it quite disturbing. They lure the Dolphin into this cove, the ones that are not sold to zoo, marine parks, etc are slaughtered for food.

After seeing the Cove, I vowed never to swim with Dolphin. A few weeks after that my DH rented "Food Inc" another eye opener documentary but this time on the agriculture specifically Meat production (chicken, beef, and pork). It was horrifying!!! I didn't eat meat for weeks after that. I have never looked at meat the same way again...

Bottom line there is many horrific things that happen everyday in order to accommodates our "needs", from our food, cosmetics, drugs, clothes, etc. it doesn't mean to go about life with your eyes closed and ignore all of it you have to do what you are comfortable with.

BTW I have since asked my husband to stop renting these types of movies

to everyone here who are against zoos does that mean that you do not go to Animal Kingdom? or Epcot, they do have thank with Dolphins?

 

[Kim&Chris]

Great thread.

About ten years ago, we did the dolphin swim at Discovery Cove, and I walked away feeling very sad and guilty.

I'll NEVER do that again.

OP, I think you'd probably feel just as sad and guilty afterwards. I also refuse to go to circuses, and have very mixed feelings about zoos.

 

[CandyMandy]

This facility has failed a USDA inspection

No, while the USDA has cited Ringling several times for issues with elephants (which no one is making excuses for) they have never "failed" the Center for Elephant Conservation. In fact, the latter holds certification from almost every major veterinary and zoological association.

and has also been referred to as being like an elephant puppy mill.

By who? PETA? Since we're now on the subject of canines, perhaps someone can explain why PETA staff has been charged with felony animal cruelty for killing and dumping stray dogs.

http://www.consumerfreedom.com/pressRelease_detail.cfm/r/109-peta-employees-face-31-felony-animal-cruelty-charges-for-killing-dumping-dogs

Do we really need more elephants in captivity?

Given habitat desctruction in the third world, if you care about the survival of the species, yes.

If the answer if yes..a careful, discretionary, breeding program is better than what this circus does?

It seems like the issue some have with the Ringling program isn't the fact it is wildly successful, far more effective at actually raising elephant fertility (which is extremely hard to do) than anything PETA or Humane societies have ever been involved in.

No, it has a lot more to do with the fact it's a program run by a private enterprise which happens to have the label "circus" in it's name.

Of course, Disney -- which has captive, breeding elephants at AK -- gets a free pass from the same crowd.

 

[Makayna]

Sounds like you had a lot to get off your chest. Not realy sure it's responsive to this thread or OP's question.

The Cove is a documentary. It shows, pretty simply, what happens to the 199 remaining dolphins after the 1 is selected and culled out of the heard to be sold to the dolphin facilities. What's to research? Can I say for a fact that the dolphins at dolphin encounter were purchased from the Tiaji cove? Nope. Just not sure. They might. They might not. Doesn't matter to me -- that's not the point. But it might to others. Make your own decision.

I don't really see much "activism" in this thread. I see people like me saying, "boy, I didn't know that," and deciding as a result they are not personally comfortable with doing a swim with the dolphins, in direct response to a very specific question from OP asking precisely about that. Do whatever is comfortable for you. If you have info that would make OP more comfortable, I think that's fair game in this thread. A rant about speculation that people who see the movie and don't want to do dolphin swims any more are not true activists or might lose luster for the position over time seems neither responsive, relevant nor helpful to OP's question.

I watched the documentary, and I have to say that what happened in the movie is incredibly sad and disturbing. However, those dolphins were killed for food. Just as the movie showed that one aquarium where you could literally eat dolphin and watch the show at the same time. People EAT dolphins in other countries! And those dolphins would be killed for food whether there were any dolphin shows/interactions or not!

While I don't generally put dolphins and cows in the same category (because, to me, dolphins are WAAAAAY smarter and way more friendly and are just on a different plane than cows), in some countries, eating dolphin is practically the same as us eating beef.

Yes, they kill all the dolphins not selected for the shows and interactions. At least the ones selected for the shows and interactions get to LIVE! If there were NO shows/interactions, even those dolphins might not be as lucky.

And if you're against the "treatment" of these animals in the shows and interactions, it's no different really than owning a dog, especially a big dog. The same could be said for dogs: "they have instincts, and they need to roam free and shouldn't be "caged" up in a house with humans!" The animals in the majority of these facilities are cared for by trained scientists. Most of them use Ocean water, rotate them out with other dolphins after an hour or two, and the animals are fed well and receive the best medical treatment possible. I'm sure there are SOME places that do not do this, but most do.

While the movie was exceptionally heart-wrenching, and appeals to every facet of your being, the cold, hard reality is that those dolphins would probably die anyways because the problem isn't the Sea World and the dolphin encounters... the problem is that people in some countries like to eat dolphin. Until that changes, dolphins will continue to be slaughtered for food.

 

[Page4]

I would bet that more sea life is harmed or killed from cruise ships than dolphin encounters. ...Just a thought.

 

[lark]

I'm not the board police, but for what it's worth, this thread seems to me one that isn't likely to be active much longer.

OP kind of asked a particular question -- I interpreted it as "I lean toward animal rightsy kind of thinking, will I have regrets if I do a dolphin swim." Some of us answered -- hey, if my experience is relevant, you might. Others have indicated the reasons why the lines between treatment of dolphins at dolphin encounter and other creatures or whatever are blurry, or made similar arguments, and tried to give OP reasons why the swim is ok.

Personally, I think that's a really interesting discussion and directly relevant to the cruise board given the prevalence of these swims. It would be, solely IMHO, a shame if it gets shut down because of hijacking or going too far off topic. Just my thought. Seems only a matter of time, at this point.

 

[miatamel]

I am the OP. I want to thank everyone so much. I thought each post was well thought out and well stated, even the more--ahem--pointed ones. Sometimes I feel entirely too wishy-washy and uneducated in my beliefs and I found excellent reasoning in all viewpoints.

We will not be doing a dolphin swim or encounter in Nassau.

 

[Makayna]

I am the OP. I want to thank everyone so much. I thought each post was well thought out and well stated, even the more--ahem--pointed ones. Sometimes I feel entirely too wishy-washy and uneducated in my beliefs and I found excellent reasoning in all viewpoints.

We will not be doing a dolphin swim or encounter in Nassau.

While I am/was on the side of the argument that says the dolphin swims are OK, I think you made a very, very, very good decision for your family and I hope you have a WONDERFUL time on your trip!

 

[Shell54]

I am the OP. I want to thank everyone so much. I thought each post was well thought out and well stated, even the more--ahem--pointed ones. Sometimes I feel entirely too wishy-washy and uneducated in my beliefs and I found excellent reasoning in all viewpoints.

We will not be doing a dolphin swim or encounter in Nassau.

Have a wonderful cruise, there are so many more awesome things to do