All things George Zimmerman...

[Elinor Dashwood]

He had to have. From looking at the crime scene photos, the fight seems to have occurred two units in. I looked it up, the smallest units in the complex are about 20 feet wide.

I agree, somehow he ended up on that sidewalk between the townhouses. Now whether he ran down them because Trayvon confronted him remains to be seen. He may be telling the truth, that was heading towards his truck but obviously he didn't get there. Again, that clubhouse camera would show if there were a confrontation on that cut through path. I'm very curious to see it but I read that both attorneys are trying to keep certain evidence sealed, I'd imagine this would be one of them since it's probably crucial to the case. The 7-11 video didn't show much, other than what appears to be a normal looking 17 year old buying things.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I agree, somehow he ended up on that sidewalk between the townhouses. Now whether he ran down them because Trayvon confronted him remains to be seen. He may be telling the truth, that was heading towards his truck but obviously he didn't get there. Again, that clubhouse camera would show if there were a confrontation on that cut through path. I'm very curious to see it but I read that both attorneys are trying to keep certain evidence sealed, I'd imagine this would be one of them since it's probably crucial to the case. The 7-11 video didn't show much, other than what appears to be a normal looking 17 year old buying things.

It doesn't seem Zimmerman running down the path is part of his story. Everything I've read or heard is Martin confronted him, punched him, he fell to the ground and Martin got on top of him.

 

[jujube]

He had to have. From looking at the crime scene photos, the fight seems to have occurred two units in. I looked it up, the smallest units in the complex are about 20 feet wide.

I thought someone said they didn't go between the houses?

It doesn't seem Zimmerman running down the path is part of his story. Everything I've read or heard is Martin confronted him, punched him, he fell to the ground and Martin got on top of him.

There have been comments in articles stating Zimmerman was breathing hard.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I thought someone said they didn't go between the houses?



There have been comments in articles stating Zimmerman was breathing hard.

I meant they didn't run between the townhouses the way depicted in your graphic. Zimmerman's call with dispatch is supposed to have ended at the end of that main sidewalk which intersects the path. There was a map on the other thread that showed Zimmerman's path while he was on the phone with dispatch.

It was the girlfriend who says they were breathing hard. It was when she heard them speak to each other. That would indicate both were moving in such a way to cause them both to be breathing hard when they met up.

There has nothing said which has Zimmerman running from Martin before or after the verbal confrontation.

 

[jujube]

I meant they didn't run between the townhouses the way depicted in your graphic. Zimmerman's call with dispatch is supposed to have ended at the end of that main sidewalk which intersects the path. There was a map on the other thread that showed Zimmerman's path while he was on the phone with dispatch.

It was the girlfriend who says they were breathing hard. It was when she heard them speak to each other. That would indicate both were moving in such a way to cause them both to be breathing hard when they met up.

There has nothing said which has Zimmerman running from Martin before or after the verbal confrontation.

I read that the 911 operator said Zimmerman was breathing hard.

 

[djm99]

I read that the 911 operator said Zimmerman was breathing hard.

both were.

 

[CowboyCO]

Its not unlikely at all, when the not dead person said his head was repeatedly bashed against a sidewalk. The CSI were probably there for hours after the shooting. With the sidewalk thing such a big part of his story I'm sure they would have checked for blood there. Blood evidence isn't lost within a matter of hours,(it can even be detected after being washed with bleach) they could have gone back the next day.

An investigator can't swab an entire sidewalk, but if they can see something, or know a specific area to search they can test for trace blood and then take DNA swabs if they know where to look... Since it had been raining, there may not be any visual evidence, especially if Z's wounds didn't bleed onto the sidewalk.

 

[djm99]

Now that we've had time to see evidence - and it appears that TM was not wearing a bluetooth headset - does this change things for you? Does it still seem likely that TM attacked Z while on the phone with his girlfriend with one of his hands occupied with his phone?

 

[jujube]

Now that we've had time to see evidence - and it appears that TM was not wearing a bluetooth headset - does this change things for you? Does it still seem likely that TM attacked Z while on the phone with his girlfriend with one of his hands occupied with his phone?

How do you know Martin didn't throw down his phone and then hit Zimmerman?
We have seen some evidence. There is still a lot that has not been released. So far, nothing has come out that either proves or disproves definitively what Zimmerman has said.

 

[CowboyCO]

Now that we've had time to see evidence - and it appears that TM was not wearing a bluetooth headset - does this change things for you? Does it still seem likely that TM attacked Z while on the phone with his girlfriend with one of his hands occupied with his phone?

His girlfriend has stated that she heard Trayvon ask a question and Zimmerman respond with a question then the sound of "grass". Sounds like Trayvon dropped the phone to get his licks in. Since there is no evidence of any injury to Trayvon from the fight (other than the abrasion on his knuckle), a reasonable person would likely believe that Martin dropped his phone in order to strike Zimmerman in the face, which is consistent with both Zimmerman's statement given to police investigators and his documented facial injuries.

 

[sunshinehighway]

Now that we've had time to see evidence - and it appears that TM was not wearing a bluetooth headset - does this change things for you? Does it still seem likely that TM attacked Z while on the phone with his girlfriend with one of his hands occupied with his phone?

If he were talking on his actual phone and not using some type of headset and he were planning to attack Zimmerman, it doesn't make sense. You don't go up to someone planning to attack them with a phone up to your ear.

There are a quite a few things about the evidence that has been released and Zimmerman's story, as we currently know it, that don't seem likely.

 

[djm99]

If he were talking on his actual phone and not using some type of headset and he were planning to attack Zimmerman, it doesn't make sense. You don't go up to someone planning to attack them with a phone up to your ear.

There are a quite a few things about the evidence that has been released and Zimmerman's story, as we currently know it, that don't seem likely.

That was really my point. It's common sense here. Now, whether or not TM hit Z first is another story, but the whole TM attacked from behind sounds like BS to me, especially now knowing he was talking on the phone at the time. It seems like TM was the one taken by surprise. And his question of Why are you following sounds like the most reasonable question one could ask if someone was indeed being followed by a stranger. Once I learned there wasn't a Bluetooth, I was convinced Z isn't being honest about the chain of events that night. With one hand being occupied by phone, doesn’t make sense that TM was planning to beat up this guy. These things, those untruths are going to land him in jail. I'm assuming this is some of the inconsistencies (in his story) I keep reading about. All my opinion of course.

 

[torinsmom]

He could have definitely dropped the phone vs. having it knocked out of his hands. If he was pushed hard enough for the phone to fall, then I would think he would have injuries from where he hit the ground--a scrape, abrasions, etc.

The lack of injuries on TM just doesn't support GZ starting the actual physical fight. It doesn't sound like from the gf's recollection of the conversation that he started the verbal confrontation either.

 

[djm99]

Im not saying who hit who first. I dont know that answer. Im arguing that TM didnt hide and wait to jump Z. With him on the phone it just doesnt make sense. This is 2nd portion of his version of events that I think he is lying. The first being TM circling his car saying whats up homie.

 

[torinsmom]

Im not saying who hit who first. I dont know that answer. Im arguing that TM didnt hide and wait to jump Z. With him on the phone it just doesnt make sense. This is 2nd portion of his version of events that I think he is lying. The first being TM circling his car saying whats up homie.

I haven't read where GZ said TM was hiding. Actually, other than leaks, I don't think we have heard any of GZ's statements yet.

Maybe he wasn't hiding, but the two ran into each other accidentally, when TM was not heading home, and GZ was not heading to his truck. Somehow there was a meeting and then the confrontation began. It doesn't really change the fact that it appears that GZ was on the ground, having his nose broken and some sort of damage being done to his head, while TM seems to have no injuries except the knuckle abrasion and the fatal gunshot wound.

 

[djm99]

Im not saying who hit who first. I dont know that answer. Im arguing that TM didnt hide and wait to jump Z. With him on the phone it just doesnt make sense. This is 2nd portion of his version of events that I think he is lying. The first being TM circling his car saying whats up homie.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I haven't read where GZ said TM was hiding. Actually, other than leaks, I don't think we have heard any of GZ's statements yet.

Maybe he wasn't hiding, but the two ran into each other accidentally, when TM was not heading home, and GZ was not heading to his truck. Somehow there was a meeting and then the confrontation began. It doesn't really change the fact that it appears that GZ was on the ground, having his nose broken and some sort of damage being done to his head, while TM seems to have no injuries except the knuckle abrasion and the fatal gunshot wound.

According to the testimony at the bail hearing, Zimmerman did say he was heading back to his truck.

 

[torinsmom]

According to the testimony at the bail hearing, Zimmerman did say he was heading back to his truck.

He may have been at that point. I mean, he couldn't be standing in the same place and run into TM, right? TM would have had to come back for that to happen. GZ had to be moving, and it could have been back in that direction, since after 2 minutes, I would have assumed TM was long gone, in his position. I'm still not sure why he wasn't long gone. You guys say he wasn't hiding, but if he wasn't hiding, what was he doing?

 

[sunshinehighway]

He may have been at that point. I mean, he couldn't be standing in the same place and run into TM, right? TM would have had to come back for that to happen. GZ had to be moving, and it could have been back in that direction, since after 2 minutes, I would have assumed TM was long gone, in his position. I'm still not sure why he wasn't long gone. You guys say he wasn't hiding, but if he wasn't hiding, what was he doing?

I have no idea what he was doing. If he was hiding, it doesn't make sense that he was hiding to jump Zimmerman because he was on the phone. Also, if Martin approach him from behind and left (as I've read), he had to be lurking in the shadows in the yard of a unit.

I'm curious as to what Zimmerman was doing on the path at all. If he listened to dispatch and stopped following, why did he go down the path? If he was walking back to his car, how far did he walk down the path? If I'm judging the distance right from the photos and the fight happen at the second townhouse, he's 40ish feet down that path.

 

[sbell111]

Now that we've had time to see evidence - and it appears that TM was not wearing a bluetooth headset - does this change things for you? Does it still seem likely that TM attacked Z while on the phone with his girlfriend with one of his hands occupied with his phone?

Why does the technology matter? Why do you believe that his hands were occupied with his phone? The phone's earphones were found near the body, so it's not unreasonable to believe that Martin was using them. It certainly would explain why the GF thought that he was on a headset and why Zimmerman didn't report that he was talking on a phone during his call to the police.