All The New Developments

[DisneyHeather]

I'm excited to use the new technology and am hoping we'll be doing so on our trip in December. We only do WDW every other year or so since we're in CA and do Disneyland more often because it's cheaper to get down there.

I really don't think we get more than 2 or 3 FP per day on a normal trip so maybe that's why the limit doesn't seem like such a bad thing to me. We're not a commando touring family. I can understand though why someone who's used to having multiple FP's a day and more than one for the same ride would be unsure of how happy they'd be with the new system of only being able to have 3 FP+

I think for the most part we all need to see how it goes but if we get to use the new system we'll go into it with a positive attitude which I think will help us to not have our trip be unhappy if things go wrong. I'm not saying there will not be frustration if there are problems with it but I feel you can choose how you respond to things in a way that will help keep the trip magical.

 

[Rileygirl]

There is nothing wrong with a company making a profit, why else would it run?
And, I believe that disney viewed the entire Next Gen to be very profitable indeed. However, there have been already some 'glitches' that has impacted on the profitability of MM+, as far as I can see.

1. Casino Chip: Disney was hoping that the magic bands would be able to be a 'swipe' and pay without a pin code for anything under $50 but that is not the case. Slows down check out time, makes lines longer, needs more staff. Only marginally I am sure, but in the grand scheme it adds up.

2. Disney appears to be WAAAYY behind on the roll out and implementation of MM+. There are many issues with the system, and its probably costing them a ton of money in IT. Its also causing them a little bad PR. (We must remember that our private little community is barely a ripple in the pond so to speak) And not a fact, but a rumour: the cost is eating into the new attraction budget, so it may be a while longer before we see anything really new at WDW, except 7dmt. We dont know that for a fact though. And there is some evidence of 'prep work' at AK (moving the FOTLK)

3. Many people have quite vaild concerns regarding the IT aspect of this entire system. The concept of this system can work wonderfully for some people, maybe even most people. However, if the IT cant catch up to the concept, it could be a bit of a clusterfudge. I think this is a relevant concern.

4. On CF's thread, he brings up 'security issues'. I really dont know what he means by that, but perhaps its something to do with ticket media, lost days, or ways around the system. All of these things could be costly to Disney.

Reference Ride capacity. Disney has OHRC's for a reason. And they probably run their headline attractions at maximum OHRC all the time. The only way to produce more fp+'s is to increase the ratio of fp+s compared to standby line.

MichiganDVC: I almost always think the opposite of what you say, but I find that you bring up some great points frequently. One was on a thread that was closed a few days where you were talking about how good this fast pass system was going to be for the general disney goer. And I 100% agree with that. I think they are going to love the system (if IT does a half decent job) and its going to result in a much nicer vacation for them. And, I think that a big % of Disney vacation goers are exactly who they are targeting with this new system. It will be very positively recieved, I think. And disney wants to make the majority happy, dont you think? Thats just good economic sense.

And, this new system will work for some of the disboarders with they way THEY vacation, and the way THEY do the theme parks. And thats great. Actually, it will probably work pretty good for me (I think) because we are not multiple ride people, and only pull 3 or 4 in a day, and frequently give a set away out of that 3 or 4. And, I am a planner, and I enjoy planning. But I also know how to change things on the fly, due to park conditions, rides down, weather, sick kids, whatever.

But, I think that for some people on the disboard, this system may not work out so good. If they like multiple rides on headliners, or go last minute but love to ride all the attractions, or whatever, they are maybe not going to be in such a great position.

And, I think, my speculation is, that even in IT heaven, a perfect world, where disney could implement this system with no technological errors or problems, this new system is going to cause a DRAMATIC change in standby lines. Not just for the headliners, but everything on the grid. I dont think this will happen instantly, but as more people are 'on the grid' then its going to really change things up. I think standby lines are going to be awful, from everything from HM at 10 am in the morning, to small world at 8 pm. But, thats just my speculation and opinion. Time will tell!

 

[Pinkdiamond816]

See, and this is the problem. You have mentioned things as though they are fact, and they might be.... but through the constant stream of speculation and "I know someone who knows someone, etc.." it is so hard to remember what has been confirmed and what is likely, but unknown, and what is whild speculation, ya know?

We probably need a sticky that is 100% confirmed information. Of course, it would be basically a three-line post and otherwise empty

Actually I am a corporate employee, and I have confirmed for you what is fact and released for public knowledge. Along with my 2cents on the matter.

Here are the Facts I know are public knowledge:

MyMagic+ and Fastpass+ are in the test process. Fact.

Legacy FP is going away. Fact. CM's are now confirming to the public.

Their are FastPass Collections, meaning you can't only pick headliners. Fact. Look at all the testings. Notice how you can pick the "Action Collection" at HSH that includes ToT, RnR but NOT TSMM. There is another package to get TSMM. You won't find a collection that puts Soarin' together with Test Track. Again this is all for now, and in testing. Maybe that will change for full roll out. But FastPass+ is currently very well designed to distribute crowds and not let the major headliners fill up immediately. I mean really, who wouldn't pick all the headliners first, leaving nothing but People Mover Fastpass+ behind for those who aren't in the know...(not that People Mover is an option, I'm just making a point about the silly stuff they put in there...)

Now as for the tiers, that I will admit to I have not seen in black and white writing. Only heard tell. But I've had some strong clues and looking at what they are doing, I would agree with the rumored assumption that some iteration of MyMagic+ will include tiered FP+. So a day guest with a one park on day ticket may only get 3 FP+, but a DVC member may get 5 with multiple parks per day as an option. THIS IS SPECULATION. But there's been enough talk about it that I would put money on this being the case.

Seriously though, THE BIGGEST FACT OF ALL EVERYONE NEEDS TO KEEP IN THE BACK OF THEIR MIND.....
This is still IN TESTING....the Fastpass+ experience may end up being completely different from what we are seeing happen in the parks right now. The powers that be are honestly listening to the testers and the CM's working with the system to make adjustments.

So as much as there is a tantrum building up inside of me that they are taking away my ability to gather up three or four FP for ToT in the morning, then hop to MK and get FP for SM later that night...or the fact that I may lose sleep trying to plan what order I need to reserve my FP+ 210 days before I even go on vacation and what if I actually have to wait more than 20mins for a ride....because I'm that crazy disney lady....I'm not going to walk in to Guest Relations and complain about it.

Hopefully it will be great and we will all wonder what we ever did without it. Maybe some people will stand in front of a blazing sunset and declare "As God as my witness I will never go to Disney World again!"

But for now, these are some facts I know and wanted to share with likeminded disney folks.

 

[UNCFanatik]

Reference Ride capacity. Disney has OHRC's for a reason. And they probably run their headline attractions at maximum OHRC all the time. The only way to produce more fp+'s is to increase the ratio of fp+s compared to standby line.

yes, they do have OHRCs for a reason but that doesnt mean they always run their headline attractions at maximum OHRC for one reason or another. Or they couldn't increase their OHRC at certain headline attractions lilke Soarin for instance. They could easily produce a similar movie or fix the one they have with all the current issues and cut some time off the show that would not be noticeable for their guests.

When they refurbed TT for example. Are the attraction ride times exactly the same as before?

Increasing OHRCs would produce more FP+s. Adjusting the ratio is not the ONLY way. I am not as convinced as you are they they currently run the headliners at maximum at ALL times. Ride Capacity is not a constant that Disney has zero control over.

 

[Rip]

MY main argument is not that people are assuming the worst. It's that they've worked themselves up to actually believe the worst is going to happen, for sure, and are scheduling their trips around it and/or threatening to cancel trips. When the only fact we know is that we DO NOT KNOW how it will work.

So for your undeniable fact above....I am denying that it is a fact that " FP+ will negatively impact those not wishing to micro-manage what rides they want to ride at a given time 2 months down the road." That is opinion. It might be a very educated opinion. It might even be the extremely educated opinion of a Cast Member, or an IT person, or even Ms. Cleo!

It is still an opinion. Like mine.

Nope, it's fact. Unless they magically increase ride capacity.

 

[Rip]

Per my discussion with one of the disney execs at the bay lake tower when we were just there from 7/21-7/27 and I beta tested the FP+ system, there will be no regular fastpasses once the system is rolled out in full. That system is old/antiquated and will be removed from the parks.

I'm honestly shocked anyone believes otherwise.

 

[Rip]

I think this is a great thread to hear opinion of someone who is a DVC member and get their perspective/opinion which is just as valuable as anyone else's

Except it isn't. It's based on nothing but speculation and speculation that is 100% incorrect.

 

[hakepb]

yes, they do have OHRCs for a reason but that doesnt mean they always run their headline attractions at maximum OHRC for one reason or another. Or they couldn't increase their OHRC at certain headline attractions lilke Soarin for instance. They could easily produce a similar movie or fix the one they have with all the current issues and cut some time off the show that would not be noticeable for their guests.

When they refurbed TT for example. Are the attraction ride times exactly the same as before?

Increasing OHRCs would produce more FP+s. Adjusting the ratio is not the ONLY way. I am not as convinced as you are they they currently run the headliners at maximum at ALL times. Ride Capacity is not a constant that Disney has zero control over.

They definitely don't run max capacity on headliners on busy days. On July 4,2012 I was late for my SciFi ADR because I got stuck in Aerosmith's studio for 25+ min while they (said they) added another car into RnR.

I'm not sure why they didn't plan to run RnR at max capacity on one of their busiest days of the year.....

 

[Rip]

I don't agree with the assertion that all the rides are all full capacity and nothing can be done by Disney to increase capacity. People act as if ride capacity is a fixed constant. I think they can increase capacity by different methods on certain attractions to accommodate more FP+s in the future.

Again, my opinion and speculation just based on ride mechanics and ride times

All rides are obviously not at full capacity all the time, but ride capacity is a fixed constant.

 

[Robbi]

CF, thanks for your post. It's easy to understand your frustration.

 

[Cyrano]

Folks thread is for discussing the new developments.

Continued posting of off topic, quirky responses will be deleted immediately and your participation on this thread removed.

 

[Squidgyness]

Now as for the tiers, that I will admit to I have not seen in black and white writing. Only heard tell. But I've had some strong clues and looking at what they are doing, I would agree with the rumored assumption that some iteration of MyMagic+ will include tiered FP+. So a day guest with a one park on day ticket may only get 3 FP+, but a DVC member may get 5 with multiple parks per day as an option. THIS IS SPECULATION. But there's been enough talk about it that I would put money on this being the case.

I there any evidence to suggest a tiered system? All I remember was tom staggs mentioning in a blog post that it would be available for offsite and AP guests too, nothing about a different level of fastpass.

Now, onsite guests will get a wristband and offsite a ticket. But I haven't heard anything about varying fastpass access. That seems like a sure fire way to annoy a hell of a lot of guests at once.

 

[WDSearcher]

I just find it funny that one of the main arguments against people that aren't a big fan of the proposed changes is that we're "assuming" X, Y and/or Z. Yet those in favor are doing the exact same thing.

It is an undeniable fact that FP+ will negatively impact those not wishing to micro-manage what rides they want to ride at a given time 2 months down the road. The extent to which it negatively impacts us is what we do not know. No one knows if the current FP system will even exist once this is fully implemented. If it is, no one knows how many FPs will be removed from the available pool due to FP+.

Bottom line, unless Disney magically increases ride capacity for each and every individual ride by using up their cache of pixie dust, people like me aren't going to like it.

This (bolded) is the argument I don't understand. If I plan a trip to, say, NYC, at the very least I'm going to plan which Broadway plays I want to see, and what nights to see them. And I'm probably going to think about other attractions -- Ellis Island, say ... or the Twin Towers Memorial -- and arrange for tickets or viewing times. And if it's peak season or the week before the Tonys or if the thing I want to see is popular, then I know that I'm going to have to make those decisions months before I go. I can't just show up Friday afternoon to get my ticket for the hottest show in town. I can't show up on 9/11 without a pre-scheduled time and expect to see the Twin Towers Memorial. I have to think well in advance and reserve times and buy tickets. That does not mean, however, that I have to micro-manage the entire vacation.

How is this different? I'm planning a vacation to WDW and I'm two months out. I'm starting to think about what order I want to do the parks, park days vs. non-park days, etc. Basic planning. I decide that Tuesday is DAK day, and I know that I want to ride EE before lunch as opposed to after, and I want to do Kali last so that I won't be soaked all day and Poof! I have my FPs for those with barely no drama at all. I don't have to micromanage my entire day to choose those two things. I can still wander and make last-minute decisions and spend six hours on the tiger trail if I want. If anything, I'm afforded a more relaxing day because I know going in when I'm going on my two must-dos -- I don't have to wait until I get to the park and find out what the return times are for FP that day. No rushing to the FP machine. No waiting around to get the "right" FP time so that I CAN do Kali last and EE before lunch. The entire rest of my day is la-di-dah, as you wish. It's planned, but not micro managed.

You can plan one or two things a day without it turning into pervasive, over the top, micro-managed touring.

 

[MichiganDVC]

Could someone point me to this 'talk' about a tiered system? All I remember was tom staggs mentioning in a blog post that it would be available for offsite and AP guests too, nothing about a different level of fastpass.

Now, onsite guests will get a wristband and offsite a ticket. But I haven't heard anything about varying fastpass access. That seems like a sure fire way to annoy a hell of a lot of guests at once.

Exactly. Nothing firm about tiers. Wild speculation only.

I, for one, would have no problem with tiers, so long as they aren't based on factors I cannot change. If onsite people get more FPs in exchange for EMH, I'm not sure if that would work better for me, but I'm ok with it.
And if I think I really want that, maybe it will convince me to pay a little extra and stay onsite.

 

[WDSearcher]

No, what I meant was: why haven't they increased capacity, sped up rides, etc., to increase capacity already? What is so special about FP+ that will make them take advantage of all of these opportunities to increase capacity?

Because the rides don't operate in a vacuum. You have to look at full-park operation. If Star Tours is suddenly pumping guests out twice as fast as normal, those guests have to go somewhere. They need stuff to do. They'll want to eat or go to other shows or attractions (that may not be able to speed up or adjust capacity) or have other diversions to occupy them until their next ride or attraction experience. If you dump all those people out of Star Tours and you don't have the capacity for them anywhere else, then you're stuck with a bunch of people milling around with nothing to do. If you slow the ride loading or the operation down just a tad, that buys time for other things to load and run and dump and dovetail in.

From an overall park perspective, it's better to have a guest actively engaged, even if that engagement is standing in line, than it is to have a guest in transit, without the capacity to allow them to do anything.

 

[Rip]

This (bolded) is the argument I don't understand. If I plan a trip to, say, NYC, at the very least I'm going to plan which Broadway plays I want to see, and what nights to see them. And I'm probably going to think about other attractions -- Ellis Island, say ... or the Twin Towers Memorial -- and arrange for tickets or viewing times. And if it's peak season or the week before the Tonys or if the thing I want to see is popular, then I know that I'm going to have to make those decisions months before I go. I can't just show up Friday afternoon to get my ticket for the hottest show in town. I can't show up on 9/11 without a pre-scheduled time and expect to see the Twin Towers Memorial. I have to think well in advance and reserve times and buy tickets. That does not mean, however, that I have to micro-manage the entire vacation.

How is this different? I'm planning a vacation to WDW and I'm two months out. I'm starting to think about what order I want to do the parks, park days vs. non-park days, etc. Basic planning. I decide that Tuesday is DAK day, and I know that I want to ride EE before lunch as opposed to after, and I want to do Kali last so that I won't be soaked all day and Poof! I have my FPs for those with barely no drama at all. I don't have to micromanage my entire day to choose those two things. I can still wander and make last-minute decisions and spend six hours on the tiger trail if I want. If anything, I'm afforded a more relaxing day because I know going in when I'm going on my two must-dos -- I don't have to wait until I get to the park and find out what the return times are for FP that day. No rushing to the FP machine. No waiting around to get the "right" FP time so that I CAN do Kali last and EE before lunch. The entire rest of my day is la-di-dah, as you wish. It's planned, but not micro managed.

You can plan one or two things a day without it turning into pervasive, over the top, micro-managed touring.

You're seriously comparing this?

Broadway plays = fixed seating and scheduled performances. Rides, not so much. You're really comparing a Broadway play to POTC.

Savvy?

 

[MichiganDVC]

How is this different? I'm planning a vacation to WDW and I'm two months out. I'm starting to think about what order I want to do the parks, park days vs. non-park days, etc. Basic planning. I decide that Tuesday is DAK day, and I know that I want to ride EE before lunch as opposed to after, and I want to do Kali last so that I won't be soaked all day and Poof! I have my FPs for those with barely no drama at all. I don't have to micromanage my entire day to choose those two things. I can still wander and make last-minute decisions and spend six hours on the tiger trail if I want. If anything, I'm afforded a more relaxing day because I know going in when I'm going on my two must-dos -- I don't have to wait until I get to the park and find out what the return times are for FP that day. No rushing to the FP machine. No waiting around to get the "right" FP time so that I CAN do Kali last and EE before lunch. The entire rest of my day is la-di-dah, as you wish. It's planned, but not micro managed.

You can plan one or two things a day without it turning into pervasive, over the top, micro-managed touring.

I had this exact problem during my last trip this July. Went to AK and wanted to do Kali last, but couldn't get there during the "right" FP time and the return window was too late and so I've still never been on it. Had I been able to, I would have scheduled Kali as my ONLY FP, because I can rope drop Safari and I'm too much of a chicken to go on EE again...

 

[MichiganDVC]

This (bolded) is the argument I don't understand. If I plan a trip to, say, NYC, at the very least I'm going to plan which Broadway plays I want to see, and what nights to see them. And I'm probably going to think about other attractions -- Ellis Island, say ... or the Twin Towers Memorial -- and arrange for tickets or viewing times. And if it's peak season or the week before the Tonys or if the thing I want to see is popular, then I know that I'm going to have to make those decisions months before I go. I can't just show up Friday afternoon to get my ticket for the hottest show in town. I can't show up on 9/11 without a pre-scheduled time and expect to see the Twin Towers Memorial. I have to think well in advance and reserve times and buy tickets. That does not mean, however, that I have to micro-manage the entire vacation.

I've been wanting to ask this in threads, but never got around to it. What other types of vacations are people going on that require zero advance planning?!
Seriously, for everyone who is upset about FP+ equaling over-the-top planning, what vacations can you take that don't require a similar level of planning?

You're seriously comparing this?

Broadway plays = fixed seating and scheduled performances. Rides, not so much. You're really comparing a Broadway play to POTC.

Savvy?

You know that you can plan to see some Broadway shows day-of, right? It's not guaranteed that there will be availability in the one you REALLY want to see, of course. But you might get to pay a reduced price if you don't care.

Seats at a Broadway show are like FPs. There is a limited amount and many people DO plan to get theirs ahead of time. So, like TSMM or Book of Mormon, it isn't wise to show up at 8:00pm and expect to see it without booking in advance.

 

[Mkrop]

This (bolded) is the argument I don't understand. If I plan a trip to, say, NYC, at the very least I'm going to plan which Broadway plays I want to see, and what nights to see them. And I'm probably going to think about other attractions -- Ellis Island, say ... or the Twin Towers Memorial -- and arrange for tickets or viewing times. And if it's peak season or the week before the Tonys or if the thing I want to see is popular, then I know that I'm going to have to make those decisions months before I go. I can't just show up Friday afternoon to get my ticket for the hottest show in town. I can't show up on 9/11 without a pre-scheduled time and expect to see the Twin Towers Memorial. I have to think well in advance and reserve times and buy tickets. That does not mean, however, that I have to micro-manage the entire vacation.

How is this different? I'm planning a vacation to WDW and I'm two months out. I'm starting to think about what order I want to do the parks, park days vs. non-park days, etc. Basic planning. I decide that Tuesday is DAK day, and I know that I want to ride EE before lunch as opposed to after, and I want to do Kali last so that I won't be soaked all day and Poof! I have my FPs for those with barely no drama at all. I don't have to micromanage my entire day to choose those two things. I can still wander and make last-minute decisions and spend six hours on the tiger trail if I want. If anything, I'm afforded a more relaxing day because I know going in when I'm going on my two must-dos -- I don't have to wait until I get to the park and find out what the return times are for FP that day. No rushing to the FP machine. No waiting around to get the "right" FP time so that I CAN do Kali last and EE before lunch. The entire rest of my day is la-di-dah, as you wish. It's planned, but not micro managed.
You can plan one or two things a day without it turning into pervasive, over the top, micro-managed touring.

And it does seem perfect, and if you can make it so I can switch this around and have that great day on Friday bc Tues is going to be a really rainy day or really cold (we go in Dec) but then end of the week will be warmer. If I can easily switch things around and not miss out on the headliners if something comes up, than I love FP+. If I cant, and I paid all that money and I cant ride our favorites without standing in a 60 minute wait than I will be longing for FP- when I planned but I did not have to forgo flexibility.

 

[drgnfly30]

I've been wanting to ask this in threads, but never got around to it. What other types of vacations are people going on that require zero advance planning?! Seriously, for everyone who is upset about FP+ equaling over-the-top planning, what vacations can you take that don't require a similar level of planning?

If I had the funds I'd book a trip to my favorite resort in the Riviera Maya right now. I could be packed and on the plane in less than 24 hrs. No planning needed.

CF, I've been contemplating the Security issues you mentioned... I understand if you can't say but I'm assuming it really doesn't have to do with park entry or fast pass access?