Al Lutz Update: Disney Parks Management Changes, XPass and D23 Expo

HydroGuy

A Pirate's Life For Me
Joined
Jun 5, 2005
Messages
18,415
Al Lutz of MiceAge has a new update today that is heavy on corporate news and light on juicy rumors about the parks. Here is a link: http://miceage.micechat.com/allutz/al071211a.htm

Highlights include:

o Park management changes and what it means for Disneyland
o NextGen team
o XPass - future generation FASTPASS
o Carthay Circle Club - DCA's Club 33
o D23 Expo - what the executives will talk about



Note: Al Lutz does not work for Disney. His posts are not Disney announcements. He has solid contacts inside Disney and is helpful in giving an indication of what Disney is planning and considering. People planning vacations should be very cautious about making plans based on Al's articles. That is not what they are intended for. Rather, Al tries to give an insider view of what Disney is thinking and planning for those interested in what the future may hold. This can and does change over time.

Here is the disclaimer that Al has at the end of his article.

Keep in mind updates only get posted when there is something to report on, and not before. It takes time to confirm things, and even then we can only offer a snapshot of a continually evolving story. (People do change their minds you know.) Just like the happiest place on earth, patience is a virtue; the queue may take a while before you can enjoy the attraction.
 
Thanks Trey. Nothing like a snark from Al to get the morning creative juices going!
 
Al was particularly snarky in this one wasn't he....but I'm puzzled by this:

Weiss allowed the local leaders to run their property as they see fit, and he stayed out of the way. In that executive environment, Anaheim has had what many consider a new Golden Age for the past six years of countless new and updated attractions, new parades and night spectaculars, and well maintained facilities young and old, with the 1.2 Billion extreme makeover of DCA the big prize waiting for 2012. The reality out in Florida during that same time frame, however, was almost a complete opposite experience; and again it should be noted that Crofton was in charge of the entire property during that whole time.

Ummm....is Al aware of the billion dollar construction project around WDW's Fantsyland? That overhaul rivals DCA to a great extent, the major difference my eyes can see being that DCA is over a wider area of the park, but FL is more than doubling in size. And since it's been in the works for several years and under construction for a couple years that would put all of it in Crofton's reign wouldn't it?

Ok, back to reading more.....
 

I just hope the suits give D23 the leeway to keep on going and growing. And that Xpass thing or whatever it is really sounds like it would suck and make doing the parks one big invasion.
 
Ummm....is Al aware of the billion dollar construction project around WDW's Fantsyland? That overhaul rivals DCA to a great extent, the major difference my eyes can see being that DCA is over a wider area of the park, but FL is more than doubling in size. And since it's been in the works for several years and under construction for a couple years that would put all of it in Crofton's reign wouldn't it?

Ok, back to reading more.....

It's not a billion dollar project, and it is nowhere near the scale of the DCA makeover. The estimates I have seen put it at a $300M project. One could debate if it is similar in scope to just Carsland, but even then, I think Carsland still has the edge, with three new rides, including one amazing looking e-ticket (RSR). Fantasyland Expansion has 2 1/2 new rides (until the mine coaster was added it was just 1 really). The 2 new rides (little mermaid and 7 dwarfs) look to be very nice, but just d-tickets. The other ride is a dueling dumbo, which will add capacity, but is otherwise not much to be write home about. Don't get me wrong, I'm very excited about FLE, but at best it should be compared to the Carsland addition, not the DCA makeover.

Not to mention the expansion is only happening because TDO was forced to do it by corporate. The little mermaid is a clone of a ride TDA wanted, so TDO didn't have to bear the development cost, and even the mine coaster looks like it will probably be a duplicate of one going to Shanghai, so TDO again won't have to shoulder the entire cost.

FLE is doubling the size of Fantasyland, correct. But that is just putting it back to the size it was before 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea closed in 1994. All the land being used was previously occupied by that ride and Mickey's Toontown Fair (which itself was pathetic compared to Toontown in DL).
 
It's not a billion dollar project, and it is nowhere near the scale of the DCA makeover. The estimates I have seen put it at a $300M project. One could debate if it is similar in scope to just Carsland, but even then, I think Carsland still has the edge, with three new rides, including one amazing looking e-ticket (RSR). Fantasyland Expansion has 2 1/2 new rides (until the mine coaster was added it was just 1 really). The 2 new rides (little mermaid and 7 dwarfs) look to be very nice, but just d-tickets. The other ride is a dueling dumbo, which will add capacity, but is otherwise not much to be write home about. Don't get me wrong, I'm very excited about FLE, but at best it should be compared to the Carsland addition, not the DCA makeover.

Not to mention the expansion is only happening because TDO was forced to do it by corporate. The little mermaid is a clone of a ride TDA wanted, so TDO didn't have to bear the development cost, and even the mine coaster looks like it will probably be a duplicate of one going to Shanghai, so TDO again won't have to shoulder the entire cost.

FLE is doubling the size of Fantasyland, correct. But that is just putting it back to the size it was before 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea closed in 1994. All the land being used was previously occupied by that ride and Mickey's Toontown Fair (which itself was pathetic compared to Toontown in DL).

Part of the 1.2 Billion is the expanded, now known as Toy Story parking lot. Retheming the DLH, well, a complete renovation. So the DCA chunk of money was spread beyond the park.

Don't forget, like AL omits to make a point, WDW has expanded more than the being worked on FLE. It also got TSM when DCA got TSMM. It got a new DVC, may be buildling another, though just weak rumors indictate so. It is building a new value resort. It's redoing a large chuck on DTD. WDW hasn't been at a stand still while DCA is changing and growing. It just hasn't had focused work on a single large area.
 
It's not a billion dollar project, and it is nowhere near the scale of the DCA makeover. The estimates I have seen put it at a $300M project. One could debate if it is similar in scope to just Carsland, but even then, I think Carsland still has the edge, with three new rides, including one amazing looking e-ticket (RSR). Fantasyland Expansion has 2 1/2 new rides (until the mine coaster was added it was just 1 really). The 2 new rides (little mermaid and 7 dwarfs) look to be very nice, but just d-tickets. The other ride is a dueling dumbo, which will add capacity, but is otherwise not much to be write home about. Don't get me wrong, I'm very excited about FLE, but at best it should be compared to the Carsland addition, not the DCA makeover.

Not to mention the expansion is only happening because TDO was forced to do it by corporate. The little mermaid is a clone of a ride TDA wanted, so TDO didn't have to bear the development cost, and even the mine coaster looks like it will probably be a duplicate of one going to Shanghai, so TDO again won't have to shoulder the entire cost.

FLE is doubling the size of Fantasyland, correct. But that is just putting it back to the size it was before 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea closed in 1994. All the land being used was previously occupied by that ride and Mickey's Toontown Fair (which itself was pathetic compared to Toontown in DL).

Ok, I thought I'd read several times that the two park projects were running about the same cost, but yeah, if you throw in a parking lot and hotel then CA is going to be more money, lol.

But the point remains that all these FL improvements came in during the leadership of Meg.....so I'm not quite seeing his point that she did nothing to expand or improve WDW. Yeah, some of the rest of WDW has been going downhill, but the same could easily be said about DLR. I guess I'm wondering if he's got some other reason to dislike Meg so vehemently. And what did he expect, new management comes in and of course they start by mixing up the job responsibilities for everyone....happens every day in corporate America, why not at Disney. Staying status quo is not good for business, any business.
 
With each mention of the Xpass program, I feel like I need to plan for a trip right before it gets rolled out so I don't have to stress about that. I can see the positives to that program, but it just seems too rigid. I like planning ahead, but I have so many great memories at either resort that came from doing something on the fly. I wouldn't always tour like that, but it has its perks.
 
The Xpass thing does NOT sound like something good at all. Sure, if you plan your visit down to the moment, it would be a great tool, but I have never done that and never will. That's what makes DL so great, is that it's not like WDW where you have to have your whole day mapped out to maximize your trip. The first time I went to DL, I didn't have a plan at all, just went early and rode as much as I could and I loved it. Planning a trip to death just doesn't make it fun for me.

I hope Disney remembers that the DL experience is different for everyone and forcing people to experience it one way will kill the magic for a lot of people.
 
Well, if X pass lets you input the rides you want and then get fastpasses that you can use after the return window, it would be just magical!
 
If things go well out at the new main entrance turnstiles, those will be opened this weekend, with a new access route into the park behind Soarin’ opening up shortly thereafter.
Did i read it right...the new turnstiles are set to open this weekend??? I just might get to see the new DCA entrance in two weeks?? :woohoo: I wonder when the re-routing will take place....hopefully after my trip!
 
As I read the XPass thing, I recalled our most recent trip where my daughters both got sick and had fevers. We had to leave the parks and skip a day. What about that XPass creators? I also don't like that it is almost forcing you to book a package through Disney in order to have "special" opportunities to optimize your park time. Uggg, don't like it at all. If it was an add-on, fine. But only available with WDTC packages, not fine.
 
Interesting article, but it really makes me wonder what the Disney Executives are smoking? :rotfl2: With some of the stuff they are doing at the F&W Festival in Florida, the fact that they canceled it in CA, now this stuff?

I agree with the other posters, that XPass thing does sound horrible! Disney just wants to know where to expect everyone to be throughout the day so that they can herd us around easier!

I'm really looking forward to this year's D23 Expo, I really hope that they have lots of great surprises this year and that it is not the last one. There are lots of people coming from all over. However having attended both Destination-D events, while there might have been more people at the Florida Event, the Californians have much more of an excitement. People didn't start lining up at the Contemporary with anywhere near the exuberance and zeal that they did at the DLH. No wonder they have a hard time getting much excitement outside So Cal, we are the most exciteable crowd in the country!

I think they are missing the point if they think they can "create" a new Club 33 in DCA. While I don't know a lot about it's history, I don't think that Club 33 started out with all the notariety that it has today. That is something that is built over time and with it's reputation. I don't think people really go there because they think the food will be that great, and that they want a fine meal. They want to go there so that they can say, "I went to Club 33". It's just not going to be the same if they open a new club, call it "exclusive" and then expect all those who couldn't get into Club 33 to be happy about getting into the "other club". By this logic they could keep opening clubs, calling them exclusive and sell out the memberships again and again.

Only time will tell.

Thanks for posting the update Hydroguy!
 
I think they are missing the point if they think they can "create" a new Club 33 in DCA. While I don't know a lot about it's history, I don't think that Club 33 started out with all the notariety that it has today. That is something that is built over time and with it's reputation. I don't think people really go there because they think the food will be that great, and that they want a fine meal. They want to go there so that they can say, "I went to Club 33". It's just not going to be the same if they open a new club, call it "exclusive" and then expect all those who couldn't get into Club 33 to be happy about getting into the "other club". By this logic they could keep opening clubs, calling them exclusive and sell out the memberships again and again.

Only time will tell.

I think Club 33 was a lot more well known after Windows 95 was released. And I don't think everyone is an alchoholic that is ready to die for a drink in DL so that's why they signed up.

I'm sure if they open up a new club and offer the 33 waitlist first chance many would take it. Maybe a blend join Carthay Club and get a one time visit to club 33 in the second year of membership to sweeten the deal. Or get a dual membership that allows 33 but not until you get down the list, but allows Carthay Circle right away.

How they haven't opened more clubs like this you got me. Why doesn't the MK in WDW have one? For that reason why doesn't it have a Blue Bayou?
 
Did i read it right...the new turnstiles are set to open this weekend??? I just might get to see the new DCA entrance in two weeks?? :woohoo: I wonder when the re-routing will take place....hopefully after my trip!
Well, you read that Al have heard that..... And remember that Al is NOT Disney so it may or may not happen this weekend. Consider it hearsay.

...I also don't like that it is almost forcing you to book a package through Disney in order to have "special" opportunities to optimize your park time. Uggg, don't like it at all. If it was an add-on, fine. But only available with WDTC packages, not fine.
Almost like it's a marketing tool or something..... :rolleyes1

- Dreams
 
I think Club 33 was a lot more well known after Windows 95 was released. And I don't think everyone is an alchoholic that is ready to die for a drink in DL so that's why they signed up.

Never heard about this was there a Windows 95 - Club 33 app or something?

I'm sure if they open up a new club and offer the 33 waitlist first chance many would take it. Maybe a blend join Carthay Club and get a one time visit to club 33 in the second year of membership to sweeten the deal. Or get a dual membership that allows 33 but not until you get down the list, but allows Carthay Circle right away.

The problem with Club 33 is that none of the members have any indication of canceling their memberships anytime in the forseeable future. Evidently less than a handful of spots open up each year and the list got longer than anyone in their forseeable lifetime will be offered membership, so they closed the list. I'm not sure that Membership in a second class club would entice many people. Even with a one time possibility of going to Club 33 an intiation fee of several thousand dollars would probably not entice many people to join. I think I heard that the Club 33 initiation is $12,500 or something like that, annual dues range from $3000-5000 per year.

How they haven't opened more clubs like this you got me. Why doesn't the MK in WDW have one? For that reason why doesn't it have a Blue Bayou?

I think you need a local clientele with large pocketbooks to maintain a club like that. WDW has a lot of tourists and not nearly as many locals as DL. From what I've heard Tokyo DL is the only other park with a Club 33. Besides WDW has so many awesome restaurants why cloud the matter with an exclusive "members only" club that only some people can go to...especially if you can't use the DDP there! People would be upset. I think V&A's fits that bill without needing a membership.

There is no Blue Bayou, because they don't have NO square and Walt always said that those two should go hand in hand at DL if BB is closed POTC will be and likewise, both are required for the magic. BTW they never intended for POTC to be at the MK in WDW. They had plans for a whole nother ride, which sounded really cool it was a Western Version of POTC. Same elements, you ride through a desert serene scene, soon to stumble upon a western town where the locals are enjoying their drink, then they set the town on fire and bad guys raid the town. They told us about it at Destination-D40. But when MK opened the guests asked, "where's the Pirate Ride?" so often they had to put in POTC instead fo the planned Western Adventure or whatever they called it in the Blue Skye process.
 
I wonder if corporations and such might not be tempted to join the Carthay Circle Club as a perk to clients. Isn't that a large percentage of the Club 33 membership? It might not have the exact same cache as Club 33, but if it comes with all the perks, it might fit the bill. It could be an exclusive spot to wine and dine clients. And if the food is better than Club 33 AND there is a lounge to hang out, it might be workable.

Club 33 was a wonderful experience and a real treat to a Disney nerd like myself, but I was not blown away by the food. I had eaten at Napa Rose during the same trip and NR was much better in the food department. Also, there is no bar area to order drinks and relax. I think if Disney really delivers on the food and drink aspect, throws in the same perks, and if the initial fees are lower than Club 33, they will get members.

The rumors are that people on the waiting list for Club 33 were asked if they would be interested in joining CCC instead. If Disney goes ahead with CCC, my guess is they got enough positive response.
 





Receive up to $1,000 in Onboard Credit and a Gift Basket!
That’s right — when you book your Disney Cruise with Dreams Unlimited Travel, you’ll receive incredible shipboard credits to spend during your vacation!
CLICK HERE









DIS Facebook DIS youtube DIS Instagram DIS Pinterest DIS Tiktok DIS Twitter DIS Bluesky

Back
Top Bottom