Airline Rant

[sam_gordon]

Planning WAY ahead (right at the ~330 days required for airfare). Cheapest rate from my home to MCO is $162 (taxes & fees included) RT. Of course, that's the day AFTER we want to leave, but to do it as planned it would be $230 RT. I'll wait a day to save $350 (family of 5). That's not my rant.

So anyway, I keep going to Delta's website and putting in the days. Saturday to the following Monday. The $162 is good if we leave home at 5pm Sat (arrive at 10p). Leave Orlando at 7:30P, get home at 11:30P.

I keep hunting and find a flight leaving home at 3:15p Sat, arrive in Orlando 8:20P. Hey, that's not bad, and it's the same cost. Whoops, I forgot to put in there are 5 of us traveling. I do that and the flight jumps to $240 RT!

So, the same flight there and back, all coach seats, and if it's only one person, it's $160 RT. Five people and it's $240. I even called and talked to customer service to see if there's any leeway. Nope. You think you get anything extra for the $80 a person? Nope. Aaarrrrggghhhhh!

 

[kaytieeldr]

There aren't FIVE seats at that price. Try four. Then three. Then two. You may get one at $160 and the rest at $240; you may get two at $160 and three at $240 or the other way around; you may get four of the five at $160, with only one at the higher price.

But when you try to book five tickets and there are fewer seats at the lower rate, you get charged the higher price for all five tickets. Try it my way. Just be careful splitting children and adults - in case there's a flight change.

 

[leebee]

I agree with katieeldr. The airline doesn't have five seats available at the lower price, so they bump you all into the next highest category that has 5 seats available at the same price. You can figure out how many tickets are available at which price by using Orbitz; they usually tell you "only X available" when the price point is running out of seats. Just make sure that you book an adult with any kids traveling, even if one adult takes two kids and the other takes one. You'll all be on the same flight, it is just a question of what you are paying for each seat. Good luck!

 

[sam_gordon]

I understand it. I just don't like it. BTW, I did the "4-3-2-1" thing and there are TWO seats at the cheaper price. The plane(s) is/are still EMPTY (no one has booked). So they offer TWO seats at the cheapest price.

There are really only two different seat classes... business & coach. But they break up coach into different classes, and charge different amounts for each class. However, you don't get anything extra for spending extra $$.

 

[DebbieB]

I understand it. I just don't like it. BTW, I did the "4-3-2-1" thing and there are TWO seats at the cheaper price. The plane(s) is/are still EMPTY (no one has booked). So they offer TWO seats at the cheapest price.

There are really only two different seat classes... business & coach. But they break up coach into different classes, and charge different amounts for each class. However, you don't get anything extra for spending extra $$.

Seat classes and fare classes are 2 different things. Fare classes are the way they manage demand. If everyone paid the same amount in coach, it would not be $162, it would probably be more like $400 for the airline to make money on the flight. As they sell seats, the price goes up, probably close to $1,000 for a last minute ticket.

 

[sam_gordon]

Seat classes and fare classes are 2 different things. Fare classes are the way they manage demand. If everyone paid the same amount in coach, it would not be $162, it would probably be more like $400 for the airline to make money on the flight. As they sell seats, the price goes up, probably close to $1,000 for a last minute ticket.

Again, I get it. I really do. I just don't like it. IMO, if I have a party of 10 and there's ONE seat left at the lower price, the entire party should get that price.

Would it make more sense for the airline to say we're going to offer our lowest prices from 11 months out (331 days for Delta) to 10 months out. From 10 months to 9 months, the price goes up a little bit (regardless of whether any seats sold). 9 months out, it goes up more. Etc, etc, etc. This would encourage folks to book early. Someone needs to change their plans, fine, hit them with the $50 fee for each ticket (plus the difference in ticket cost) like they do now.

Hey, if people can complain about Disney changing something, I should be able to complain about this, right?

 

[jlewisinsyr]

You can complain, but I think most of the posters on here don't really respect or understand the complaint, it all comes down to supply and demand. Why should the airline sell you all the tickets at a lower price, when there may be only 1 at that price?

If they did that, then the revenue for the flight will not be sufficient.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I understand it. I just don't like it. BTW, I did the "4-3-2-1" thing and there are TWO seats at the cheaper price. The plane(s) is/are still EMPTY (no one has booked). So they offer TWO seats at the cheapest price.

There are really only two different seat classes... business & coach. But they break up coach into different classes, and charge different amounts for each class. However, you don't get anything extra for spending extra $$.

No sympathy. Airlines are businesses. Any business's (ideal) goal is to operate at a profit. They generally can't do that by offering all seats at loss-leader prices.

You say you found flights on a different day that DO meet your price criteria. Since you don't like that there are only two seats available on this flight at the lowest price (and seat availability ISN'T necessarily an indicator of fare buckets), you should book your flights for the other day instead.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Would it make more sense for the airline to say we're going to offer our lowest prices from 11 months out (331 days for Delta) to 10 months out. From 10 months to 9 months, the price goes up a little bit (regardless of whether any seats sold). 9 months out, it goes up more. Etc, etc, etc. This would encourage folks to book early.

No. Not everybody can plan 330 days in advance; plus sometimes airlines have sales.

Someone needs to change their plans, fine, hit them with the $50 fee for each ticket (plus the difference in ticket cost) like they do now

It's been a while since you've flown? That's $150 per ticket to make changes to nonrefundable fares - plus any additional cost of the actual fare.

 

[sam_gordon]

You can complain, but I think most of the posters on here don't really respect or understand the complaint, it all comes down to supply and demand. Why should the airline sell you all the tickets at a lower price, when there may be only 1 at that price?

Got another commodity that you get charged more per piece the more you buy?

 

[DISNEY1975]

I understand it. I just don't like it. BTW, I did the "4-3-2-1" thing and there are TWO seats at the cheaper price. The plane(s) is/are still EMPTY (no one has booked). So they offer TWO seats at the cheapest price.

There are really only two different seat classes... business & coach. But they break up coach into different classes, and charge different amounts for each class. However, you don't get anything extra for spending extra $$.

Ive been checking my flights since they came out..about 9 months ago. Around the 5 month mark, I started getting itchy as they prices were going up. I hung on and now, at my 3 month mark, the prices are cheaper than ever. I would wait if I were you. All website articles say booking on a Tuesday afternoon thru Wed at the 3 month mark will be cheapest...I found that to be true.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Got another commodity that you get charged more per piece the more you buy?

It's not the more YOU buy - it's the more THEY sell. As availability DEcreases, price INcreases.

 

[sam_gordon]

No sympathy. Airlines are businesses. Any business's (ideal) goal is to operate at a profit. They generally can't do that by offering all seats at loss-leader prices.

So you think someone will come out and purchase all 100 seats on a plane in order to get the cheap price?

You say you found flights on a different day that DO meet your price criteria. Since you don't like that there are only two seats available on this flight at the lowest price (and seat availability ISN'T necessarily an indicator of fare buckets), you should book your flights for the other day instead.

I'm sure I will go with another flight to get the cheaper tickets. And again, this is an EMPTY plane. EVERY seat is available.

No. Not everybody can plan 330 days in advance; plus sometimes airlines have sales.

You're right, not everyone can plan that far out. But according to your previous post, you think the planes will sell out at the cheaper price. So which is it? Will the planes sell out at the cheaper price, or not everyone can plan that far ahead? If *I* can plan out far, why shouldn't I benefit? The airline benefits... they get my money... guaranteed! Look at it this way... you sell widgets. And 331 days from now, they disappear. Poof, no more. Would you rather sell 5 of them now for $100 or offer them for $300 10 months from now and see if anyone wants them? Yes, airlines have sales. I don't want to wait, I like planning ahead.

It's been a while since you've flown? That's $150 per ticket to make changes to nonrefundable fares - plus any additional cost of the actual fare.

So again, if the plane sells out 11 months out, the odds are in favor of someone needing to change plans... so the airlines still get the $$.

Oh, and you're right. Airlines are businesses. So are gas stations. People complain about gas prices too.

 

[sam_gordon]

Ive been checking my flights since they came out..about 9 months ago. Around the 5 month mark, I started getting itchy as they prices were going up. I hung on and now, at my 3 month mark, the prices are cheaper than ever. I would wait if I were you. All website articles say booking on a Tuesday afternoon thru Wed at the 3 month mark will be cheapest...I found that to be true.

Can't do it. As much as I'd like to, I'd be a nervous wreck not having plane tickets at 3 months out.

The price for the later flight time (which we'll probably go with) is $160 RT (INCLUDING fees!). Take out the fees (~$40), and you're looking at $60 for a one way ticket. PLUS, I get to select my seat, AND (I think) get a free checked bag for each ticket since I have a frequent flyer card. I really shouldn't complain.

 

[kaytieeldr]

So you think someone will come out and purchase all 100 seats on a plane in order to get the cheap price?

It doesn't matter what I think. I'm not an airline. What matters is what the airlines project. Your airline apparently projects it can afford to sell two tickets at $162, and then the next X tickets need to be sold at $240.

I'm sure I will go with another flight to get the cheaper tickets. And again, this is an EMPTY plane. EVERY seat is available.

Again, 'available seats' isn't necessarily an indication of seat availability. While it does appear to be on your specific itinerary, again, the airline is offering two seats at the lowest fare.

I'm actually surprised the seat chart is showing every seat available. AirTran, JetBlue, Delta, United... all START with blacked-out seats. Bulkhead seats are always blocked. Exit rows may or may not be. AirTran blocks out the "B" seat on all its flights to start, and several rows at the back of every plane. JetBlue blocks half the seats in the back row. United blocks a LOT of seats - for its Elite members. I'd think the other legacy airlines would be similar to Delta and United :confused2

You're right, not everyone can plan that far out. But according to your previous post, you think the planes will sell out at the cheaper price.

No. You'll have to point out where you think I said that. I'm fairly lucid - it's mid-afternoon - and I can't find where I said that.

 

[sam_gordon]

I'm actually surprised the seat chart is showing every seat available. AirTran, JetBlue, Delta, United... all START with blacked-out seats. Bulkhead seats are always blocked. Exit rows may or may not be. AirTran blocks out the "B" seat on all its flights to start, and several rows at the back of every plane. JetBlue blocks half the seats in the back row. United blocks a LOT of seats - for its Elite members. I'd think the other legacy airlines would be similar to Delta and United :confused2

The chart shows every seat as either 'available' or 'preferred available'. Clicking through the website shows the 'preferred available' are for certain members of their elite members.

No. You'll have to point out where you think I said that. I'm fairly lucid - it's mid-afternoon - and I can't find where I said that.

Sorry, I was referring to where you said "Why should the airline sell you all the tickets at a lower price, when there may be only 1 at that price?"

Let's say a flight has 100 seats. The airline knows they need to make $20,000 ($200/seat) to make $$. They could do that by selling 50 seats @ $100 and 50 seats @ $300, or any other ratio. Now, they've apparently figured they can sell 2 seats at $100, say 10 more at $150, 10@200, 10 @ 250, etc, etc. My OPINION though is let a party book at the lowest price available at the time they book. That might mean the next price tier (or two) might be eliminated. I think it would even out over the number of seats.

ETA: All that being said, I think you and I can go around and around each stating the same thing. I'm not looking for sympathy (ok, maybe a little ), but I'm not as upset as maybe I sound like.

 

[kaytieeldr]

ETA: All that being said, I think you and I can go around and around each stating the same thing. I'm not looking for sympathy (ok, maybe a little ), but I'm not as upset as maybe I sound like.

Good... because you just need to take a look at my 'sidebar' - where my name, tag, avatar, etc., are - to see this board's unofficial motto You get facts here. They may not be what posters want to hear, but travel is too serious a matter to coddle even new DIS members - NOT that you're asking to be coddled!!!!

 

[Alexander]

Ive been checking my flights since they came out..about 9 months ago. Around the 5 month mark, I started getting itchy as they prices were going up. I hung on and now, at my 3 month mark, the prices are cheaper than ever. I would wait if I were you. All website articles say booking on a Tuesday afternoon thru Wed at the 3 month mark will be cheapest...I found that to be true.

This is all dependent upon the time of year and region of the country you are flying from. If I want to fly from the Northeast to Orlando Presidents Week, I need to book 330 days out to get a decent rate. They have never gone down that week from Upstate NY in the 10 years I've been flying at that time. Also if we want to fly over the April break we need to book wwwaaayy early or we end up paying much higher prices. Everyone in this area is looking to get away from the snow and schools are off almost across the state at the same time.

 

[Tara]

Can't do it. As much as I'd like to, I'd be a nervous wreck not having plane tickets at 3 months out.

There's a big difference between "can't" (don't know exact dates yet, don't have the money yet) and "won't" (too nervous to wait).

 

[sam_gordon]

There's a big difference between "can't" (don't know exact dates yet, don't have the money yet) and "won't" (too nervous to wait).

I waited 10 hours (was going to book last night and wife said "wait until tomorrow") and prices went up $20.

Don't get me wrong. The tickets are still cheaper than what we'd normally pay by about $100/ticket. That's why I felt comfortable booking. I find it hard to believe they'll drop the prices 3 months out. I could be wrong, but am not willing to take the chance.