Air Canada cutting 2,000 jobs, trimming capacity

[bavaria]

Didn't seem such a mega-profit at the end of the day..

And it is NOT a profit at the end of the day. Those comparing AC fares to American carriers are missing the point that the US airline industry is in crisis. Those fares in the US are underpriced and have been underpriced for a long time. They need to move those fares up to somewhere in the realm of the fares paid in Canada in order to stop bleeding money.

Canadian, European, and Asian carriers are certainly feeling the higher fuel costs, but not at the same rate as the American carriers. They are paying for years of underpriced fares and a travelling public which has come to expect underpriced fares and balks at paying anything remotely sensible. Hence the 'pay per use' fees that US carriers are implementing - they are trying anything to increase revenues.

 

[minnie56]

And it is NOT a profit at the end of the day. Those comparing AC fares to American carriers are missing the point that the US airline industry is in crisis. Those fares in the US are underpriced and have been underpriced for a long time. They need to move those fares up to somewhere in the realm of the fares paid in Canada in order to stop bleeding money.

Canadian, European, and Asian carriers are certainly feeling the higher fuel costs, but not at the same rate as the American carriers. They are paying for years of underpriced fares and a travelling public which has come to expect underpriced fares and balks at paying anything remotely sensible. Hence the 'pay per use' fees that US carriers are implementing - they are trying anything to increase revenues.

Actually, your words are pretty much his words...and he made a remark that concerned me...he said he would NEVER fly Southwest. But he would fly Jetblue.

 

[bavaria]

I would never fly Southwest. But I would fly Jetblue.

SW does not at all meet my personal needs and comfort zone. JB could (and JB is actually partially owned by Lufthansa, as much as current US regulations allow for foreign ownership)

 

[minnie56]

I would never fly Southwest. But I would fly Jetblue.

SW does not at all meet my personal needs and comfort zone. JB could (and JB is actually partially owned by Lufthansa, as much as current US regulations allow for foreign ownership)

I didn't know that! Lufthansa is a great airline!
I do Jetblue often..to New York City and of course Florida..
My daughter is using them hopefully to Boston soon as well.

 

[wee-haggis]

They need to move those fares up to somewhere in the realm of the fares paid in Canada in order to stop bleeding money.

Don't even mention something like that (they might listen)

I know your not a fan of SWA...but their methods of operation has to be admired (similar to Easyjet and RyanAir in the UK).
Personnaly I could care less if I get a seat back TV or a meal etc or any other extras.ust get me from A to B in good time and safely. (this is of course my personal opinion based on a flying time of 2hrs 30 mins to WDW)

 

[wee-haggis]

They need to move those fares up to somewhere in the realm of the fares paid in Canada in order to stop bleeding money.

Don't even mention something like that (they might listen)

I know your not a fan of SWA...but their methods of operation has to be admired (similar to Easyjet and RyanAir in the UK).
Personnaly I could care less if I get a seat back TV or a meal etc or any other extras.ust get me from A to B in good time and safely. (this is of course my personal opinion based on a flying time of 2hrs 30 mins to WDW)

 

[minnie56]

It's where they are making up the shortfall if they aren't making the money that bothers me!

 

[declansdad]

I would never fly Southwest. But I would fly Jetblue.

SW does not at all meet my personal needs and comfort zone. JB could (and JB is actually partially owned by Lufthansa, as much as current US regulations allow for foreign ownership)

When you say comfort zone, are you speaking of physical comfort?

What are the differences between the two?

 

[bavaria]

When you say comfort zone, are you speaking of physical comfort?

What are the differences between the two?

No, I'm referring to the things I personally value in my carrier of choice

• international frequent flyer program
• interline agreements
• advance seat selection
• flies to my most common locations
• lack of premium cabin and/or seating

Price isn't top of my list and I don't care about IFE or meal service. I do know what motivates me, and choose service providers that meet my personal needs. That way I avoid disappointment by having expectations that cannot be met.

We all have different needs and motivators - those are mine

 

[declansdad]

Thanks

 

[MrMarv]

Can someone shed some light and/or opinions on why Air Canada's customer service is so bad?

Also, is Air Canada owned by the Canadian government?

 

[bavaria]

Believe it or not, part of the AC issue goes back to the absorption of Canadian into AC. There were some huge union issues, and some people still haven't gotten over that. There are a lot of territorial feelings within the carrier, and still divisions of the former CP vs former AC staff. Add cultural differences and things do sometimes get very interesting.

AC is owned by ACE Holdings. The airline has absorbed several regional carriers over the years, and that too has still led to divisions within the company.

Its predecessor TCA was created by a crown corporation back in the 1930's. For decades there was a different 'feel' to CP and AC; CP was more the western, innovative carrier while AC was the central/eastern corporate carrier. (Canadian Pacific was actually started as a bush airline) I am fascinated with the history of aviation and airlines, and these have two very different profiles.

I don't find AC service that horrible, but I don't fly them as often as I used to as my travels have changed. I have had run ins with some of the old timers in various cities, but I have also had some very good service from others.

 

[minnie56]

They are a Public Company, not Government owned anymore.
I worked for Wardair..also bought by AC soooo many years ago. Still know many, many ex-Wardair employees with Air Canada to this day. Very distinct divisions still-for sure. I have no probs really with AC..those taxes are the big ouch tho! I tell you though--I know their Maintenance is good, and frankly-to me-that matters.

 

[bavaria]

And for all that people grumble about AC, Aeroplan is still a decent FF program. I keep my miles across three programs, and my Aeroplan account is kept well funded although I don't actually fly the airline very often (and I don't believe that I have ever used my AC miles to book an AC flight!)

 

[minnie56]

Yes--it is
As I sit here with 400,000+ miles. I looked yesterday at some flights..but they want that and MORE it seems for where and when I want to go! Grrr...

 

[bavaria]

I tend to use my Aeroplan miles to book on Lufthansa, and sometimes on other Star Alliance carriers. If you are going to Europe, for instance, look at flying LH to FRA or MUC and connecting onwards on a Star Alliance carrier.

I don't book my vacations more than 0-14 days in advance, and Lufthansa tends to load extra award inventory last minute, so it usually works in my situation. Even when I have booked months in advance in hopes of being able to take the trip, I have found LH availability.

 

[minnie56]

I wanted to use points for the non-stop to Rome this Sept--LH was avail with connections.., The AC one went POOFF pretty fast! Turns out I am going with my friend and her AC hubby--so it's all good in the end but stilllll....then I dreamed--maybe-perhaps-what if-we could go to Barbados this Christmas --yeah sure, for ALL that and more points! I haven't given up on Aeroplan yet--but I do get frustrated that what I want is NEVER available for minimum redemption.

 

[MrMarv]

Thanks everyone.

I've seen some scary replies regarding the enormous amount of fees & taxes tht are tacked on to every ticket; the next time I visit either Toronto or Montreal, I'll undoubtedly fly to a nearby US city such as Albany or Detroit, and take a bus or Amtrak.