Advantages to Larger Group Size?

[WishUponAStarryNight]

A few of the more recent discussions have got me thinking. Are there advantages to traveling in the larger ABD-sized groups (up to 40ish) vs. the smaller groups (12-20)? My own experience is limited to a group of 18 and I'd like to get the perspective from those who have done both the larger and smaller group tours. Itinerary and service aside, what was better about the larger groups? If you've done only ABD trips and have had a range of group sizes, what did you perceive to be the advantages and disadvantages of the different group sizes? Thanks.

 

[Calfan]

I've commented a lot on this and was going to refrain from responding, but since no one has responded to your original post yet after a good chunk of the day has passed, I'll offer my thoughts. My three ABDs have all been large (34, 42 and 49), so I can't comment on a small ABD, But I have done small-group tours ranging from 10-15 guests with Nat Geo, Thomson Family Adventures and Austin Adventures. I think one advantage of a large group is that there are just more people to socialize with and to find folks with whom you share common interests (beyond the obvious love of travel and perhaps a love of Disney with ABDers). I have not run into this yet really with my smaller group trips, but it has definitely occurred to me that in a smaller group, there is nowhere to hide if for some reason you just don't get along with the other one or two families, couples, etc. that are in your group. Like I said, this has not yet been an issue for me in the 6 small-group trips I have done to date (one of my Nat Geo hiking trips seemed like it might have that issue in a bizarre kind of way but it turned itself around almost as bizarrely as it arose...). Honestly, for me, that is the only advantage I can really think of for a large group. The obvious disadvantage for me is that all of the logistics just take longer (bathroom breaks, getting everyone on and off the bus or other transport, taking family photos of everyone, more sample size for the chronically late arrivers) and cut into time that could be spent on substantive touring or activities. It's also easier, I think, to be more spontaneous with a small group and maybe change things up on the fly based on group input since a smaller group is more nimble. One other possible disadvantage with a larger group is that it might preclude access to a site or venue that just can't handle the large numbers. I think for the most part ABD gets around this by splitting larger groups up into two (which I don't like in general, which is another thing I don't like about the larger group sizes), but I think this issue did cause the ABBA museum to be axed from our Baltics cruise ABD add-on (which had the 49). CaliforniaGirl09's family and I ended up ditching part of the regular ABD activities so we could actually visit the ABBA museum.

 

[WishUponAStarryNight]

Thanks. I love this board because I’m learning so much about so many destinations, but I’m not entirely sold on ABD. I appreciate the idea that more people affords a better opportunity to meet like-minded people. Do larger groups mean access to better hotels or more exclusive events?

I’ve been waiting for DS to be old enough to take one of these trips since I received a brochure in the mail when I was pregnant, and now that he is, I’m struggling a bit to see the value. I know why I pay more for DCL, but I’m not there yet for ABD.

 

[upbeatred]

I think some of the group size, depends upon your destination. A larger group in general is a disadvantage in my opinion. There is much less room on the bus, longer waits for bathroom stops, more chance of having a travelers that are late or not into following the group rules. I actually think a larger group means you have less access to special events and the best hotels. Having said all that, if there was a date and trip I really wanted to go on, I would not rule it out with a larger group. There are certain trade offs for group travel, no matter the size. And if a large portion of the group is kids and you are traveling with a child, they might really enjoy lots of others to hang with. I am going to China in a few weeks with ABD and 25 people. I chose this date on purpose because it was a smaller group. T

 

[aggiedog]

This doesn’t address group size, but I have friends that do an ABD every year. They love it. For them, besides the benefit of Disney service, is that they are both busy doctors, with two busy teens, who don’t want to make the travel arrangements themselves, and who are frankly not confident enough to travel abroad on their own. (They wouldn’t entertain the idea of a DCL Baltic cruise because “all those foreign countries”) For them, the ABD model is perfect.

No judgment, as everyone has different needs and expectations.

 

[Calfan]

Thanks. I love this board because I’m learning so much about so many destinations, but I’m not entirely sold on ABD. I appreciate the idea that more people affords a better opportunity to meet like-minded people. Do larger groups mean access to better hotels or more exclusive events?

I’ve been waiting for DS to be old enough to take one of these trips since I received a brochure in the mail when I was pregnant, and now that he is, I’m struggling a bit to see the value. I know why I pay more for DCL, but I’m not there yet for ABD.

In my experience, larger groups have not meant better (but to be fair, usually not worse either, except in my ABBA museum example) access to hotels or venues. I should also caution, though, that smaller doesn’t necessarily mean cheaper than ABD. Austin Adventures and Thomson might have been marginally less expensive than ABD, but Nat Geo is pretty equivalent. And Natural Habitat which we are using for Botswana next year is noticeably more than ABD with a group max of 7. There are definitely more budget-friendly group tour providers out there though.

 

[TeeKo]

Our first ABD was to Scotland on the old itinerary. It included a chartered flight to the Isle of Lewis and private viewing of the crown jewels, a private dinner in Edinburgh Castle. There was the singular opportunity to canoe in Loch Ness. I remember DH and I saying that going with ABD was like gathering a like-minded group together to all chip in and charter a plane or rent a castle. It felt like assembling a group of 30 or so people afforded the opportunity to get something that may be cost prohibitive in a group of just 9 or 10.
We have enjoyed more ABDs since then but I can't say our subsequent ABD trips felt like we were buying a unique opportunity by banding with 30 or 40 others. We've got a trip booked with Thomson Family next. We'll see what a group of 10 to 12 looks like

 

[Calfan]

Our first ABD was to Scotland on the old itinerary. It included a chartered flight to the Isle of Lewis and private viewing of the crown jewels, a private dinner in Edinburgh Castle. There was the singular opportunity to canoe in Loch Ness. I remember DH and I saying that going with ABD was like gathering a like-mind group together to all chip in and charter a plane or rent a castle. It felt like assembling a group of 30 or so people afforded the opportunity to get something that may be cost prohibitive in a group of just 9 or 10.
We have enjoyed more ABDs since then but I can't say our subsequent ABD trips felt like we were buying a unique opportunity by banding with 30 or 40 others. We've got a trip booked with Thomas Family next. We'll see what a group of 10 to 12 looks like

Really good point about the Scotland ABD! We did that one its first year, in 2013, and you are absolutely correct that I don't think that charter flight to Lewis would have happened with fewer than 30 or so people. But it's kind of a six of one, half dozen of the other data point in favor of a larger group, because ABD eliminated that part of the Scotland itinerary by year 3 I think (maybe even in year 2), and I think you are correct that I haven't seen similar unique things in other ABD itineraries that would demand such a critical mass. Loved that Scotland trip

 

[Networth]

We have taken one ABD (the Southern California escape) and we really enjoyed it. We clicked with some people and not so much with others so to echo the poster before me, the variety of travelers with a large group is a plus. Also we love Disney and it seemed most of the ABD group did as well, so it was easy break the ice with that topic of conversation.

As to why ABD, well my wife and I are both busy in graduate school, me with my Doctorate in Nursing and hers with her Masters in Nursing (guess how we met lol). We work part time still at the hospital until we finish school, and have licenses to practice as NP's. We will have no debt once we graduate, leaving money for things such as children and vacations. I have very little time to plan trips beyond our yearly visit to WDW. Anything as detailed as international travel would eat up to too time to plan and coordinate, plus it’s nice knowing it’s all handled.

One huge thing for us is my wife’s travel concerns. She hates being in a big city, let alone overseas, without guidance. Where as I love to travel, she needs a “safety net” so to speak. If we go with ABD she feels okay traveling abroad. She likes the “Disney bubble” and “Disney service" on the go, she gets the dose of culture but knows the Mouse and the guides are with in range always. So the happy medium for both of us is ABD (this is something we both realized on our first ABD). Some times things in life are worth the cost, as long as you find value in the product.

We have are 2nd ABD booked for London/Paris next August with DLP add-on. Good luck with your decision.

 

[WishUponAStarryNight]

Thank you all for your points of view. At the end of the day, I think it will come down to itinerary and cost for me. ABD won’t have an edge simply because it’s Disney. I know ABD isn’t the only company that can provide magical experiences. It’s one on a list of providers with one con on the spreadsheet because of group size. Of course, dynamic pricing doesn’t exactly help, either.

 

[sayhello]

Really good point about the Scotland ABD! We did that one its first year, in 2013, and you are absolutely correct that I don't think that charter flight to Lewis would have happened with fewer than 30 or so people. But it's kind of a six of one, half dozen of the other data point in favor of a larger group, because ABD eliminated that part of the Scotland itinerary by year 3 I think (maybe even in year 2), and I think you are correct that I haven't seen similar unique things in other ABD itineraries that would demand such a critical mass. Loved that Scotland trip

I had 18 on my Adult Only Scotland trip, and we still went to the Isle of Lewis. (And this was in year 2, 2014). I checked my brochures, and they eliminated it for 2016 - year 4.

Honestly, I have to admit it's another benefit of the Adult Only itineraries. They're usually during the shoulder season, and generally do not run with large groups. So far, 4 of my trips have been Adults Only - AZ/Utah with 14, Alaska with 15, Greece with 18 and Scotland with 18. 4 have been family trips, and most all been pretty full - the Med cruise add-on with 39, The Danube River cruise with up to 40 per excursion, Prague with 40, and China with 24, which was a great number. I don't really count London/Paris, because that was a DIS exclusive trip, and they capped it at like 27.

I guess that might have to count as part of the reason I prefer Adult Only trips. Although it's not helping for Iceland, nor would it have helped for Japan!

Sayhello

 

[AquamarineSteph]

My first ABD had 12 people. It was the trip of a lifetime.

Since then, I've done ABD tours with FAR more people. I think you lose some of the camaraderie with the larger groups. I also think it means that the guides can spend less time on the group and more time (for the guides) has to be spent on those requiring more attention. That's just an observation, of course. YMMV.

I've traveled with other tour groups that have tour sizes from 8 to almost 30. Smaller groups mean the guide or guides can devote more personal attention to the travelers, but it also means less time (as a group) getting on/off the bus/transport, more time seeing things.

This is just personal opinion. Other people will have other opinions.

 

[Bobo912]

I've had ABD group sizes of 16, 33, 36, 40 and 44. I don't see any advantage to the larger group size. The larger the group is, the more time standing around waiting on everyone instead of seeing the country you are visiting. And sometimes the activities/facilities are not meant to accommodate such a large group which creates an uncomfortable situation for everyone. I'm sure we've been lucky with our fellow travelers, but there was more camaraderie with the smaller groups than the larger ones. I found it harder to get to know anyone in the group sizes over 40. The group of 40 had one large family that accounted for half the group and the tended to keep to themselves and received a lot of attention from the guides. For both trips with over 40 people, one of the planned activities was omitted with no explanation. I would have asked about it, but like others have mentioned on this board, I didn't notice until a day or two later. Could be a coincidence, or could be that we spent to much time waiting for everyone to use the restroom at the previous stop.

 

[DCPhotoGal]

I think the sweet spot for ABD trips would probably be about 28 for me. I have been on trips with both larger and smaller groups and I found both ends to be undesirable. (and I have to agree with the previous posters about that amazing private plane experience on the Scotland trip--I think that is still my favorite ABD day)

On our smallest trip there were only 4 families (14 people) and I found such a small group a little limiting socially, especially by the end of the 12 days. One family had two parents and a son age 5, another was a mom and her college aged-daughter, and the other family had three older teens. My 12- and 14-year old girls missed having other kids their own age on this trip, which has been one of the benefits of our larger trips. At meals you were always with the same people, and didn't have as many opportunities to mingle and talk with different folks as different meals. It was also harder to distance yourself from any personalities that you might want to avoid (for example on that trip we traveled in several small buses/vans that didn't have any extra seats.

On the flip side there is definitely a disadvantage to have 35+ people, as I was describing from our Alaska trip earlier this month. It was a big issue with the bathroom/outhouse stops. I don't really mind traveling with the larger groups in terms of the bus rides or even at the activities. I think ABD does a good job dividing the groups in half as needed to make it more manageable.

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

I think the sweet spot for ABD trips would probably be about 28 for me.

You and I have very similar sweet spots. I think mine for a family trip is 25ish.

I read through this thread earlier and didn't have a chance to post so sorry for the late response. I think my ideal group size is driven more by the number of families/groups rather than actual number per se (with the caveat that it not be above 30). For a family trip like ABD, I think 7-8 "families," which would include single travelers, couples, and families with kids/teens so that you end up with lots of different people to talk to. This is basically on par with the number of groups on the adult hiking trips I've done, which tend to be singles or couples. So the numbers are much less (14-16) but you still end up with 7-8 different groups to talk to if that makes sense.

 

[Cousin Orville]

You and I have very similar sweet spots. I think mine for a family trip is 25ish.

I read through this thread earlier and didn't have a chance to post so sorry for the late response. I think my ideal group size is driven more by the number of families/groups rather than actual number per se (with the caveat that it not be above 30). For a family trip like ABD, I think 7-8 "families," which would include single travelers, couples, and families with kids/teens so that you end up with lots of different people to talk to. This is basically on par with the number of groups on the adult hiking trips I've done, which tend to be singles or couples. So the numbers are much less (14-16) but you still end up with 7-8 different groups to talk to if that makes sense.

I'd probably agree with this as well. The biggest downside of large groups for me is remembering the names of 35-40 people. I'd say 20-30 is ideal. We've had 2 ABD's with less than 15. One was outstanding, one was probably my least favorite as far as guest dynamics (no one really mingled or formed that ABD family). So, my jury is out as far as small groups. We've done some privately arranged trips as well and have had fabulous times, but it's a very different experience compared to ABD. I wouldn't say it's better or worse. Part of the fun of ABD or other group trips is meeting new friends and experiencing things together.

 

[WishUponAStarryNight]

Are there certain trips that tend to run with smaller groups (and not get canceled)?

 

[lpm23]

For us with our daughter's being only 6 and 8, the bigger groups give us more chances they will find other kids of similar age or kids they can become friends with. I would be very nervous going with only a very small group which is one of the reasons I keep going back and forth in trying Thomson. I agree with above that 25-30 is probably ideal. We have definitely had some interesting personalities on a few trips and it was nice to have other options for people to hang out with. Our Wyoming trip was on the larger side and I didn't really see any downside at all. However, in NYC I did feel like we spent a bunch of time waiting for people to use the bathroom etc.

 

[Calfan]

For us with our daughter's being only 6 and 8, the bigger groups give us more chances they will find other kids of similar age or kids they can become friends with. I would be very nervous going with only a very small group which is one of the reasons I keep going back and forth in trying Thomson. I agree with above that 25-30 is probably ideal. We have definitely had some interesting personalities on a few trips and it was nice to have other options for people to hang out with. Our Wyoming trip was on the larger side and I didn't really see any downside at all. However, in NYC I did feel like we spent a bunch of time waiting for people to use the bathroom etc.

Thomson is quite good about trying to match up families with similar aged kids. You might talk with them a bit about your concerns before making a decision.

 

[CrazyZeus1]

We've done ABDs with 9 people all the way up to 40 people. I will say it's the group dynamics that make a difference MUCH more than the group size for us. Are the people showing up on time? Are people meshing well together? We've had small groups with 1 family who was perpetually late and it was super frustrating, we've had a group of 39 that was the most amazing group of people I've ever met and every single one is someone we still miss! Larger groups are easier to find friends in sometimes.... with 9 or 11 people, sometimes it's hard to all "gel" when nobody can really avoid anyone. hahah. On other small trips, it was one amazing little family and worked perfectly. Some large groups run smooth as butter, some large groups can be a little more challenging. We've always found guide attention to be equal no matter what the size (both attention to our family as well as attention to trip detail).

For us, the trip size really doesn't matter. We've always felt like ABD does a good job of moving groups, whether small or large, and maximizing all the ABD has to offer!