A naive question about FP+ angst

[Bullseye]

And "3" was supposedly what Disney deemed to be the "average". But nobody is average. In fact, if you go by averages than half the people who post on the DIS are below average intelligence.

See how averages don't tend to make people happy?

Hmmm...I wunder witch haf I fall under?

 

[Raenstoirm]

Those in the know will know when to book FP+ if they end up selling out before the day of. They will know which attractions need FP+ and what time of the day is best to use them. They will know how to utilize touring strategies in order to see more than other guests. They will know the layout of the parks in order to better plan their FP+. They will know which FP+ seem like a good idea but are a waste (looking at you, Fantasmic).

FP+ has not made anything more fair, it has just changed who is holding the FP. There are still losers, although now it looks like it's offsite guests who don't arrive at opening, as opposed to all guests who don't arrive at opening. Those people are still being "stepped over" because of an advantage other guests have. The capacity numbers have not changed. There is still a max of X number of people who can hold a TSMM FP+ for example, they're just theoretically going to a different group of people than before.

I don't buy this argument at all. I was totally in agreement with you until I tested the system myself this fall. Looking back on what we ended up using and when, I am really surprised. Here is a list of everything we did (we flew in around noon that first day). We obviously did more rides standby and we didn't have the tiering yet to contend with. We could still pull paper FP- as well, but only pulled 3 for the entire trip.

Stepped on 20 people? Don't be obtuse.

If it is, as you say, about making customers happy, that certainly backfired, didn't it? At least with repeat clientele.

This. I was a happy customer, happily spending my money as WDW year after year, sometimes multiple times per year. As it stands today, there will be no 2014 trip. This new trend will continue until serious changes are made to the FP system. I refuse to pay more and get less. My big challenge now is finding new vacations we want to do.

You guys miss the point. Disney doesn't want us repeat visitors. Well, that is not accurate of course they want our money, but they want the once in a lifetime groups more. I see it in myself. We used to spend tons on crap, snacks and who knows what. Last trip I purchased a grand total of 1 thing. I purchased a MNSSHP pin. We used to blow $200, $300, $400 a trip on stuff and that is without any kids! Now I spend $10. We know the ins and outs and how to save money. We always stay deluxe, but I haven't paid full price for a deluxe room since 2007. We never buy the dining plan since it doesn't save us any money, etc etc. FP+ makes the once-in-a-while visitor very happy and on average that visitor is worth more.

 

[MrsSilvaStrat]

Then we would jump on the Monorail to EPCOT and immediately grab a FP for TT. Put said FP in wallet. Go have a drink or 3 in the WS, and use our TT FP.

 

[robinb]

You guys miss the point. Disney doesn't want us repeat visitors. Well, that is not accurate of course they want our money, but they want the once in a lifetime groups more. I see it in myself. We used to spend tons on crap, snacks and who knows what. Last trip I purchased a grand total of 1 thing. I purchased a MNSSHP pin. We used to blow $200, $300, $400 a trip on stuff and that is without any kids! Now I spend $10. We know the ins and outs and how to save money. We always stay deluxe, but I haven't paid full price for a deluxe room since 2007. We never buy the dining plan since it doesn't save us any money, etc etc. FP+ makes the once-in-a-while visitor very happy and on average that visitor is worth more.

I have come to the same conclusion that Disney is just not into us anymore and is focusing more on the "once in a lifetime" crowd. Increasing resort rates, park passes and the price of the DDP has less of an effect on the open wallets of the "once" folks who don't mind spending their $$ for that perfect vacation. Conversely, as park passes and restaurants prices increase my total outlay has decreased. On our last 10-day trip we used our AP that already had 10 days on it, we ate at 3 TS restaurants, I bought a pin (the 2013/2014 NYE pin) for me, a vinylmation for my DD and I paid for a lovely henna tattoo in AK for my DD. We still ended up spending about $100 per day for 3 of us but that doesn't hold a candle to an "only" family with the 10-day park hopper on the DDP with a dessert party, CRT and BBB thrown in for good measure.

 

[shalom]

FP+ makes the once-in-a-while visitor very happy and on average that visitor is worth more.

I think this is exactly Disney's reasoning. Disney values repeat customers, too, because a smart company values all their customers and because some repeat customers spend a boatload of money as well. The repeat customer who stays onsite and spends less time in the parks and more time renting boats, taking carriage rides, eating at resort restaurants, shopping at DTD, etc. can easily spend as much per day as a new customer in the parks.

The first timer who stays onsite, eats TS onsite, wanders the parks enjoying the sites and tries a variety of rides rather than just the headliners, and buys souvenirs, is going to spend considerably more money than the old hand who shows up at RD and runs from ride to ride until closing time, snatching a CS meal here and some snacks there. And that kind of first timer isn't going to add as many bodies (virtual plus actual) to the lines Disney is trying to shorten as the old hands could with FP-.

Realistically, Disney knows they're going to have a mix of customers, some big spenders, some not, because they can't attract enough big spenders to keep the parks going. So does Disney want type two customers to disappear? No. But I bet they'd be a lot happier slowing them down a bit! Does Disney want more of type one? You bet. FP+ could theoretically accomplish both goals.

 

[mom2rtk]

So we have concluded that WDW is into the once-in-a-lifetime visitor.

DLR is into the local AP crowd.

I think it's time for them to build a park right in the middle of the country for the dependable once-a-year crowd.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

So we have concluded that WDW is into the once-in-a-lifetime visitor.

DLR is into the local AP crowd.

I think it's time for them to build a park right in the middle of the country for the dependable once-a-year crowd.

Amen! How about Columbus, OH?

 

[mom2rtk]

Amen! How about Columbus, OH?

Nope. My idea so I'm suggesting the KCMO metro area. It gets a little cold here in the winter, but just think of all the Frozen tie-in possibilities! Of course then I would be an AP holder and complain about how it caters to once a year visitors!

 

[BuckeyeBama]

Nope. My idea so I'm suggesting the KCMO metro area. It gets a little cold here in the winter, but just think of all the Frozen tie-in possibilities! Of course then I would be an AP holder and complain about how it caters to once a year visitors!

 

[ilovemk76]

Were people not already doing that before FP+? It would seem so based on the crowds.

You completely missed the intent of the entire post. Those who did this before will now have to compete in a more level sandbox and they are pissed.

 

[famy27]

Nope. My idea so I'm suggesting the KCMO metro area. It gets a little cold here in the winter, but just think of all the Frozen tie-in possibilities! Of course then I would be an AP holder and complain about how it caters to once a year visitors!

Will it be enclosed like the proposed Universal park in Moscow?

 

[mom2rtk]

Will it be enclosed like the proposed Universal park in Moscow?

Sure. Sounds like a great plan!

 

[ilovemk76]

What does that last line even mean? Are you implying that the playing field is now level for everyone so no one guest has an advantage over another (or 20 others)? That is just completely false.

Those in the know will know when to book FP+ if they end up selling out before the day of. They will know which attractions need FP+ and what time of the day is best to use them. They will know how to utilize touring strategies in order to see more than other guests. They will know the layout of the parks in order to better plan their FP+. They will know which FP+ seem like a good idea but are a waste (looking at you, Fantasmic).

FP+ has not made anything more fair, it has just changed who is holding the FP. There are still losers, although now it looks like it's offsite guests who don't arrive at opening, as opposed to all guests who don't arrive at opening. Those people are still being "stepped over" because of an advantage other guests have. The capacity numbers have not changed. There is still a max of X number of people who can hold a TSMM FP+ for example, they're just theoretically going to a different group of people than before.

Disney can now sell it as a perk to keep their resorts full. The difference is that Disney gets to decide who gets the advantage not the ones who were abusing the old system (wallet full of FPs that had all expired).

I think a FP+ that let me walk into Fantasmic when the stadium was near capacity and I was led to the best seats in the stadium was a perfect use for a FP+. I also had TSMM.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think a FP+ that let me walk into Fantasmic when the stadium was near capacity and I was led to the best seats in the stadium was a perfect use for a FP+. I also had TSMM.

I'm just curious when you had this stellar Fantasmic FP+ experience? You might want to check out what has changed since then.

 

[ilovemk76]

I'm just curious when you had this stellar Fantasmic FP+ experience? You might want to check out what has changed since then.

Thanksgiving to early December.

That post was putting me down when she was very misinformed. She was not in my trip and would not know whether is was a good FP+ for us. As of right now, I would not do it but that could always change in the future.

 

[mom2rtk]

Thanksgiving to early December.

That post was putting me down when she was very misinformed. She was not in my trip and would not know whether is was a good FP+ for us. As of right now, I would not do it but that could always change in the future.

Just don't claim that FP+ is better because of that experience.

You can no longer choose both TSMM and Fantasmic.

And they no longer hold a section open at Fantasmic for FP+. You are let in at the same time as standby via a second line. From there, it's every man for himself.

 

[Raenstoirm]

Amen! How about Columbus, OH?

Washington DC?? We were supposed to get Disney America way back in the day. Let's get back to that idea!

 

[Mad Hattered]

So we have concluded that WDW is into the once-in-a-lifetime visitor.

DLR is into the local AP crowd.

I think it's time for them to build a park right in the middle of the country for the dependable once-a-year crowd.

I'd be down with that. We would RULE that place.

Not to mention that the offsite restaurants would ROCK! Yummo!

 

[mom2rtk]

I'd be down with that. We would RULE that place.

Not to mention that the offsite restaurants would ROCK! Yummo!

I thought you might support my Missouri plan.

 

[Laketravis]

Texas is in the middle. Like, right in the middle. Smack dab in the middle.