A naive question about FP+ angst

[DisneyChristmas]

We were at WDW in December 2013, and I understand the issues with tiering and FP+ at just one park per day.

But when I read posts from people who used to get 6 or more vintage FP each day, I wonder how they could juggle their times and brains to keep track of it all. Were most people pulling tons of fast passes in the morning but using them later than the printed time window throughout the day?

Please don't flame me. Last month we had to hustle to make the times on our three FP+ each day.

 

[Mad Hattered]

We were at WDW in December 2013, and I understand the issues with tiering and FP+ at just one park per day.

But when I read posts from people who used to get 6 or more vintage FP each day, I wonder how they could juggle their times and brains to keep track of it all. Were most people pulling tons of fast passes in the morning but using them later than the printed time window throughout the day?

Please don't flame me. Last month we had to hustle to make the times on our three FP+ each day.

I can only speak for us:

Before they started making people "officially" return during the time stated on the physical FP we would arrive at rope drop...grab a FP for the ride we wanted to ride most (if you got them early you could pull another one within 45 minutes after that...not 2 hours)...hop on said ride, maybe a couple of times. Put said FP in the wallet.

Then we would ride the next biggest FP attraction according to us and pull another one for that one (45 minutes after we pulled the first one). Put said FP in wallet...and off we go. After that we would grab another one that was disconnected from the system. Put said FP in the wallet. Now it's like 10:45 and I have 3 FPs in my wallet and I have already ridden those rides multiple times.

Now we head off to short waits at HM or POTC. By the time we get off those we can grab another one. So we go grab one for Splash. Put said FP in wallet. Go get some lunch, wish we were in a park that sold beer, and then maybe stroll through a Treehouse or make fun of people in line for a Dole Whip...it differed.

Oh, look..the window is up...grab another one for SpaceM. Put said FP in wallet.

Then we would jump on the Monorail to EPCOT and immediately grab a FP for TT. Put said FP in wallet. Go have a drink or 3 in the WS, and use our TT FP.

Jump on the Monorail back to MK and use all of our FP that I had to physically get out of my wallet whenever we wanted. That was a typical 2 day park. Our touring style averaged 3 parks per day so that was a slowed down day. We pulled as many as 10 FP in one day on a 3 park day.

It may seem like we didn't stop to smell the roses but we did. We just had it down to a science (and we are far from local and have never had APs) and figured out how to make it work for us. I'm pretty sure I did screw about 20 people out of a FP (not really...because they were never gone for the day) on any given day while we were in town. Considering the thousands of people who visits the parks on any given day, I don't think that is a bad ratio.

And since "no one really used FP anyway" I had no guilt whatsoever in our touring style. There are no kids involved, we don't waste a FP on Soarin or TSMM and we've ridden PP more times than should be allowed...so we weren't pulling from that pool.

So, with said, I am not a fan of the current system. If they tweak some things then it might work a little bit better. But nothing changes the fact that it will always be less (at a higher price) than what it offered us in the past.

And I really do apologize to the possible 20 people I screwed over on one of our good days.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

At MK last summer we pulled 9 FPs. It wasn't hard for us. We didn't use any of them late. We pulled one. When the time came to use that one, we pulled another one before riding with the first one. It wasn't until late afternoon before we had to worry about pulling new ones before we were able to use the one we already had. It didn't feel like we ran around. There may have been once or twice that we moved from one side of the park to another to use a FP but that was only for favorite rides that we were repeating.

 

[Mad Hattered]

At MK last summer we pulled 9 FPs. It wasn't hard for us. We didn't use any of them late. We pulled one. When the time came to use that one, we pulled another one before riding with the first one. It wasn't until late afternoon before we had to worry about pulling new ones before we were able to use the one we already had. It didn't feel like we ran around. There may have been once or twice that we moved from one side of the park to another to use a FP but that was only for favorite rides that we were repeating.

We adapted when the return time was enforced..we didn't like it...but we worked with it. We could still grab a lot if we stuck to one park, much like you did. Now to limit that to 3 max in one park? No thanks.

 

[Planogirl]

We always stayed within the return time but only because that suited our touring style. At MK we used to pull a fastpass first thing and then go to attractions that we knew we could do before our return time. Then we would pull the next fastpass and finally we would use the first one. We would do this throughout the day and usually just got around 4 or 5 fastpasses in total. However we had a good feel for what needed fastpass and would adjust on the fly if some rides seemed particularly busy or even if they were unusually quiet.

 

[scooter7487]

We hate the new system! Once we figured out our strategy we got several fp (at least 6/7) and returned during the window once they enforced that. I have older kids 16/13 but we did this even when they were younger. As the years went by it became a game for my boys they would map out their strategy and were old enough to take the cards and go get the fp as my wife and I would enjoy the "boring" as my oldest puts it people watching or walking through the shops. It was fun watching my kids work together and enjoy their plotting. That is now gone. Went in dec. and my kids were not thrilled to get 3 that we secured prior to arriving. I won't say what my oldest said when we had to pick between soarin and test track. It will be uglier when I tell them um now we have to pick between rocking roller and tsm

 

[surferdave]

Before I only had to keep up with the time of the one fastpass I had in my pocket at the time (well that and ADRs, which I never liked); the others didn't come into play until I pulled them.

 

[crostorfer]

It was actually very, very easy. We always stayed within our time window as well, we never "cheated".

 

[ancestry]

Well with the previous system in most cases you only had one or maybe two fast passes at a time so there really wasn't anything to keep up with. We usually travel at moderate crowd times (not very busy times) and would frequently pull 8 or more fast passes a day and over multiple parks since we always have park hopper tickets. The limit of 3 and being limited to one park with the daily fast passes is frustrating. However I will say that I like the fact that we can schedule fast passes for the evening and not have to get up early to pull fast passes.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think part of what made the old system easy is that you didn't pull the FP at all unless 1) the line warranted it and 2) the return time fit where you were at the time and what you were planning do to between now and that time.

Now you have to select your times in advance so it's not possible to know where you will be in the park 2 months from now or how your day is going, or whether the line will warrant using one of your 3 slots. Yes, I understand you can make changes but that depends on 1) cooperative wireless and app and 2) availability of a desirable replacement.

It also helped in the MK that 3 FPs were disconnected, allowing you to hold them simultaneously with another FP (Mickey, Dumbo, Barnstormer).

 

[Axel]

We always remained in our window for FP return times and never really found the need to pull a ton of FPs. An example of our old touring plans at each park would be:

HS- arrive at rope drop, dad (who doesn't do thrill rides) goes and gets TSM FPs, everyone else goes to standby RnR and ToT, by the time we're done TSM FP is good, take the long way to TSM and grab a Star Tours FP, ride TSM, watch the Muppets, ST FP is good, ride ST, standby Beauty and the Beast, lunch, standby Indy, standby LMA, catch Little Mermaid or GMR as a filler before standy Fantasmic! (FP total: 2 minimum, more if we wanted to re-ride RnR/ToT.)

EPCOT- arrive at rope drop, I (the fittest) trot to get Soarin' FPs, meet family by the Seas, standby Nemo, hang out in the aquarium, return to the Land, ride the greenhouse boat, FP for Soarin' is good, ride Soarin', walk to Test Track, grab a TT FP, standby Ellen and Mission Space, TT FP is good, ride TT, standby Spaceship Earth, head to WS, lunch, standby everything in WS. (FP total: 2 minimum, more if we wanted to re-ride TT/Soarin'.)

MK- arrive at rope drop, I trot to Fantasyland and grab FPs for Peter Pan, standby Small World to Pooh to carousel to Philharmagic, FP for PP is good, ride PP, grab FP for HM, standby BTMRR-PotC-Jungle Cruise-Tiki Room, FP for HM is good, grab FP for Splash Mountain, ride HM, lunch, standby BLSRS and Laugh Floor, grab FP for Space Mountain, go ride Splash, shop on Main Street, dinner, go ride Space, head to TotW for Wishes!. (FP total: 4.)

AK: arrive at rope drop, Dad (doesn't do rollercoasters) gets FPs for the safari while mom and I standby EE, standby Kali, FPs for safari are good, ride safari, watch FoW, lunch, catch FotLK, grab FPs for Dinosaur, catch Nemo (LOL), standby PW, FPs for Dinosaur are good, ride Dinosaur, leave for dinner elsewhere. (FP total: 2).

This is why I'm not entirely convinced our touring plans will be changed by FP+, but I do expect longer standby lines since people will no longer be able to do as a PP said and pull a large handful of FPs and come back at their leisure rather than in their window.

 

[pens4821]

As a non regular I think it's a good thing they're limiting the FPs to 3. I just don't see the need for people to near 10 FPs. With FP+ you can ride things in the AM and use your FPs for later in the day (like we did). If you want to ride the ride more than twice, well then you have to stand in the hour or two line.

I know FP+ gets a lot of flack, and I'm not singling anyone out in this post or anything (and I know people are going to hate my thoughts), I just think that Disney is finally trying to keep things fair. FP+ has a couple flaws (tiers and hopping) but I think it's a wonderful system.

 

[Laketravis]

I think part of what made the old system easy is that you didn't pull the FP at all unless 1) the line warranted it and 2) the return time fit where you were at the time and what you were planning do to between now and that time.

Now you have to select your times in advance so it's not possible to know where you will be in the park 2 months from now or how your day is going, or whether the line will warrant using one of your 3 slots. Yes, I understand you can make changes but that depends on 1) cooperative wireless and app and 2) availability of a desirable replacement.

It also helped in the MK that 3 FPs were disconnected, allowing you to hold them simultaneously with another FP (Mickey, Dumbo, Barnstormer).

The "old" system wasn't perfect. But one thing it was good at was accommodating variable levels of planning; if you were a casual park goer and only wanted 1 FP, that's all you utilized. If you were commando style and wanted 6, it was possible with some planning.

The person with 1 was content, the person with 6 was content. Now, you have to choose 3 whether you want 1 or 6.

And "3" was supposedly what Disney deemed to be the "average". But nobody is average. In fact, if you go by averages than half the people who post on the DIS are below average intelligence.

See how averages don't tend to make people happy?

 

[nugov2]

The "old" system wasn't perfect. But one thing it was good at was accommodating variable levels of planning; if you were a casual park goer and only wanted 1 FP, that's all you utilized. If you were commando style and wanted 6, it was possible with some planning.

The person with 1 was content, the person with 6 was content. Now, you have to choose 3 whether you want 1 or 6.

And "3" was supposedly what Disney deemed to be the "average". But nobody is average. In fact, if you go by averages than half the people who post on the DIS are below average intelligence.

See how averages don't tend to make people happy?

I agree!! We had at least 8 FP in MK. It was mid June. My oldest grabbed a second FP for space after dinner and was able to use it before we went to our tomorrowland terrace fireworks party. It was nice to have the option to pull more if you wanted to. We waited in no long lines and never felt like we were rushing around trying to get FP. I know there were times where they ran out or I am sure people felt they had to race and fight with the masses to get one, but I think that wasn't the norm. I don't get the change. Doesn't mean it might not work out in the end, but as I have stated many times I am glad we did WDW last summer and have a few years of other vacations before we will be looking to go back. I would not want to be there this summer in this mess knowing what I know(how to use paper FP in a successful way). I get that there are a lot of people who enjoy the new system, but IMO there is just too high of a failure rate being reported for the kind of money it costs to go to WDW. We love the atmosphere of WDW, but I don't pay those park prices just to stroll down Main Street and eat dole whips. We like rides and lots of them.

 

[mom2rtk]

As a non regular I think it's a good thing they're limiting the FPs to 3. I just don't see the need for people to near 10 FPs. With FP+ you can ride things in the AM and use your FPs for later in the day (like we did). If you want to ride the ride more than twice, well then you have to stand in the hour or two line.

I know FP+ gets a lot of flack, and I'm not singling anyone out in this post or anything (and I know people are going to hate my thoughts), I just think that Disney is finally trying to keep things fair. FP+ has a couple flaws (tiers and hopping) but I think it's a wonderful system.

A lot of people can't afford a trip to Disney. It's not fair. So Disney should lower their prices.

This isn't about fairness. Disney thinks they can make more money this way. It really is that simple.

 

[prudence64]

I had no idea people were pulling so many GPS in the old system. I thought you had to wait 2 hours in between pulls so didn't even think that was possible. We only got 2-3 per day under the old system and that was fine for us, but we didn't have expectations to do anything more than once or to see everything.

 

[nugov2]

A lot of people can't afford a trip to Disney. It's not fair. So Disney should lower their prices.

This isn't about fairness. Disney thinks they can make more money this way. It really is that simple.

Exactly. The people who think WDW changed this so that the so called FP hoarders and abusers who got large amounts can no longer are being naive. I would be shocked if this isn't something they changed so they can start charging for them. I of course liked free better...who doesn't, but I will gladly pay for FP in our future trip if that is an option. I think WDW sees all these other parks charging for something they gave for free and this is there way to transition people to that system. They still will get some free, but the rest will be an upcharge.

 

[morethananyonex]

My family didn't necessarily get tons of FP, but what we did do is repeat rides (please don't hurt me!), pull FP in multiple parks, and pull more than 1 FP from what's now tier one attractions. We pulled more than 3 in MK, probably about 6 or so but that's MK.

It was very easy to pull TSMM upon arrival for example, and get RnRC later in the day. Can't do that anymore. It was also easy to grab Soarin' and TT in the same day, even multiple times, along with Maelstrom if you wanted it. Can't do that anymore either.

It was easy to grab FP at whatever your morning park was and then grab evening ones at MK, can't do that anymore. It was easy to grab a FP for all the MK mountains as well as other attractions such as PP, Buzz, etc in the MK. Can't do that anymore.

There are tons of restrictions FP+ creates that did not exist in the past. It goes way beyond the limit of 3. It creates new opportunities like choosing your own time, but overall FP- works better for my family.

 

[MinniesYooHoo]

I just don't see the need for people to near 10 FPs. I just think that Disney is finally trying to keep things fair.

So simply because YOU don't see the need for 10 FPs, nobody else would? We routinely pulled, on average, 8-10 FPs a day, used the system properly (Returned within the time alloted) and FAIRLY. What was unfair about legacy FP? Will someone please explain this to me?

 

[MinniesYooHoo]

My family didn't necessarily get tons of FP, but what we did do is repeat rides (please don't hurt me!), pull FP in multiple parks, and pull more than 1 FP from what's now tier one attractions. We pulled more than 3 in MK, probably about 6 or so but that's MK.

It was very easy to pull TSMM upon arrival for example, and get RnRC later in the day. Can't do that anymore. It was also easy to grab Soarin' and TT in the same day, even multiple times, along with Maelstrom if you wanted it. Can't do that anymore either.

It was easy to grab FP at whatever your morning park was and then grab evening ones at MK, can't do that anymore. It was easy to grab a FP for all the MK mountains as well as other attractions such as PP, Buzz, etc in the MK. Can't do that anymore.

There are tons of restrictions FP+ creates that did not exist in the past. It goes way beyond the limit of 3. It creates new opportunities like choosing your own time, but overall FP- works better for my family.

100% agree!!!!!
But to refer to the bolded statement:This is what drives me insane! How in the heck do I know where I'm going to be in any given park at any given time on any given day?!?! And why oh why do I want to book a ride that far out? And why oh why can I no longer ride with friends staying offsite because they don't have prior access to FP+ and cannot get theirs day of to coincide with my ride time?!?! To refer to a PP: How is THIS fair?