75 Valedictorians in one class???

[mickman1962]

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/1146192921221610.xml&coll=7

There is no way that a challenging school environment can have 1 in 7 students with a 4.0 gpa. This is a failure on the part of the schools.

My 12 year old nephew makes the honor roll with a grade of 50 in math, his 100 in gym makes up for it. What exactly are we trying to teach our kids today?

 

[Puffy2]

It has to do with a lot of factors.

It's increasing more difficult to be admitted to the top colleges so there is pressure on high schools (by parents and students) to practice "grade inflation" . Afterall, no one wants to ruin a kid's chance at a bright future. Of course, most of those getting grade inflation are the squeeky wheels (parents and students willing to whine the loudest). Did you know that even Harvard has been accused of grade inflation and that other schools (graduate schools, etc... take this into account when viewing a Harvard graduate's transcripts?)

What's with GPAs in the 4.1 - 9 range??? "Extra points" are given to students for various reasons (maybe it was supposedly an honors or AP class, maybe bonus points were given, etc....) How are college admission reps supposed to sort all that out when traditionally 4.0 was as high as you could go?


The practice lessens the meaning of a GPA for college admission reps, who then must place more emphasis on test scores (SAT, SAT II, ect...), extra curricular activities, essays, and other items that make a student stand out.

 

[froglady]

The practice lessens the meaning of a GPA for college admission reps, who then must place more emphasis on test scores (SAT, SAT II, ect...), extra curricular activities, essays, and other items that make a student stand out.

ITA Everyone involved complains about standardized testing, but it's the only way that you can really compare schools all across the nation. Unfortunately, it hurts students who don't test well, and rewards students who are smart, but not motivated. This is why AP and IB classes are given so much weight these days; everyone has to take the same test, unlike traditional honors classes that were designed by individual schools. It's also a reason for adding the essay portion to college boards; too many students were being taught how to "guess" logically, and taught information that would most likely be on the test. (Most common similes, math problems, etc)

 

[cats mom]

GPA and class ranking is certainly getting very complicated.

In addition to the whole weighted/non-weighted GPA thing, our school district just changed to a system where only certain core classes in math, lang. arts, science, and social studies are used to determine class rank.

It was in an effort to stop kids who didn't take as many classes, or those who padded their schedules with easy A classes from ending up ahead of kids with a tougher, full schedule. Sounds fair, right?
But it was the IB kids/parents who fought it because they wanted every one of their classes to count. Go figure.

My senior year in college they added a whole section to our transcripts to give a better picture of what our grade really meant. I wish I could find mine because I can't remember exactly what was included. IIRC it showed how many people were in the class as well as a breakdown of the grade distribution.

So that A in student government, where everyone in the class received the same grade, may not have meant as much as the B in advanced statistics where only one person got an A and half of the class either failed or dropped.

Now how many future employers would take the time to decipher all of it (the advanced stats course would come in handy there) rather than just ask for proof of graduation and maybe GPA I don't know.
But I found it interesting.

Of course basing decisions on ACT, SAT scores opens a whole other can of worms. Won't even go there.

 

[olena]

What a riot! At Chris's school, they use grade deflation and use a strict curve. In one case, the highest grade was a 90 and there was only one of those. Most everyone gets a C. It may be harsh, but so is the real world.

 

[Papa Deuce]

What a riot! At Chris's school, they use grade deflation and use a strict curve. In one case, the highest grade was a 90 and there was only one of those. Most everyone gets a C. It may be harsh, but so is the real world.

Here is a unique idea.... give the exact grade the student earns.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Most high schools will weight the AP classes higher than a regular class, I do not see an issue with that, that is fair.

The issue I see is that they "claimed" if you had a 4.0 you were automatically a "Valedictorian". That is bizzaro.

Here at dd's school your PERCENTAGES determine your GPA for class rank. Now her High School is competitive and my dd will not even come close to top 10% due to the number of kids in honors classes, making straight 100% to compete for the top 10%, which is a 5.0 & up. (Not sure of all the exact details yet, dd is a freshman.)

Also note that this ranking ONLY includes the core classes, not "extra electives", only certain ones, but again as a "freshman" mom, I don't quite get it all yet.

Her report card does NOT have letter grades, only percentages. Is this common for your HSchooler?

 

[mickman1962]

Here is a unique idea.... give the exact grade the student earns.

Then you would have to do like NY does and lower what a passing grade is. I think it is done to a 50 for the math regents. No child left behind, good in theory, bad in practice.

 

[gypsydoodlebug]

I lost valedictorian because I got a B in gym the semester I was diagnosed with asthma. That stunk. We had three valedictorians and three salutatorians (inc. me). We also had 37 people flunk out out of 356 because of one senior English teacher who was TOUGH.

Dang. That was back 1994 -- I don't know HOW they do it now. 75 in one class. Can you imagine commencement ceremony speeches??

 

[MouseWorshipin]

GPA and class ranking is certainly getting very complicated.

In addition to the whole weighted/non-weighted GPA thing, our school district just changed to a system where only certain core classes in math, lang. arts, science, and social studies are used to determine class rank.

It was in an effort to stop kids who didn't take as many classes, or those who padded their schedules with easy A classes from ending up ahead of kids with a tougher, full schedule. Sounds fair, right?
But it was the IB kids/parents who fought it because they wanted every one of their classes to count. Go figure.

My senior year in college they added a whole section to our transcripts to give a better picture of what our grade really meant. I wish I could find mine because I can't remember exactly what was included. IIRC it showed how many people were in the class as well as a breakdown of the grade distribution.

So that A in student government, where everyone in the class received the same grade, may not have meant as much as the B in advanced statistics where only one person got an A and half of the class either failed or dropped.

Now how many future employers would take the time to decipher all of it (the advanced stats course would come in handy there) rather than just ask for proof of graduation and maybe GPA I don't know.
But I found it interesting.

Of course basing decisions on ACT, SAT scores opens a whole other can of worms. Won't even go there.

Colleges take note. Good colleges know what the schools are doing. They can tell the difference between a kid in a tough school and one in an easier school. They can tell the difference between kids who get As in Advanced Algebra and those that get As in AP Calculus (or Statistics, which our schools don't have.)

And the DO take the standardized test scores into account. So all those kids who are truly bright and who learn more in tougher classes WILL come out ahead!

DS is living proof. Princeton-bound!

And his acceptance letter came in a very thin envelope...one sheet, actually. The first paragraph said, "Yes!" The second paragraph said he'd been accepted and there'd be a package on the way. So don't fret over "thin envelopes" like everyone says.

 

[RitaZ.]

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/1146192921221610.xml&coll=7

My 12 year old nephew makes the honor roll with a grade of 50 in math, his 100 in gym makes up for it. What exactly are we trying to teach our kids today?

Really? In our district, in order to make the honor roll, each class grade has to be a B or above. The overall GPA doesn't count to make the honor roll.

 

[mickman1962]

Really? In our district, in order to make the honor roll, each class grade has to be a B or above. The overall GPA doesn't count to make the honor roll.

That's the way it should be.

 

[momof2inPA]

That'll be the longest graduation ceremony in history.

 

[monarchsfan16]

That's pathetic
I graduated from high school last spring.
Our rank was weighted. We had GPA's on a 4.0 scale for just grades in general, but there was also a 12 point scale that allowed AP classes, etc to be weighted higher than remedial classes. We had a possible 4 levels of classes, although not all subjects had all 4 levels. There was remedial, average, college prep, and honors/AP (levels 1-4). Our transcripts had both the typical 4.0 scale gpa on them, and our weighted gpa's, and our class rank which was determined by weighted gpa. There was no way someone in a level one (remedial class) could be valedictorian. We had one person in each rank spot. Ours was actually a highly competitive class. The difference that separated number one and number 10 in our class was the difference that separated numbers 1 and 2 in the class before. The competition was absolutely rediculous. I think to make honor roll you had to have a 3.0 unweighted average, or higher (high honors was 3.5-3.84 and principal's list was 3.85-4.0). A 3.0 was a B average. You could make honor roll if you did well in lower level classes, but your rank suffered with each level class you dropped. Which means that by getting a B+ in college prep algebra 2, I had a lower rank than someone who got the same in honors algebra 2

 

[RitaZ.]

My SIL is Director of Admissions for one of the colleges of a well known university in Miami and we've talked about this before. She said that there are really two things that colleges look at when making admission decisions. The SAT or ACT scores and gpa. If that criteria is met, the student is accepted and the essay really isn't read. When a student is borderline (meaning their gpa and test scores aren't strong), they read the essay. She said that the essay is most useful when it comes to applying for scholarships. As for the standardized tests (like the FCAT in FL), they don't look at those at all.

Colleges and universities know what to look for. You know, I'm going to forward that link to my SIL.

 

[trip]

That'll be the longest graduation ceremony in history.

Not necessarily, at the school my DD's attended the valedictorian/ salutatorian didn't automatically make a speech. Anyone in the top 10% could write a speech and present it to a panel of teachers on the senior committee. The two top speakers earned the right to speak at graduation. They had a class size of 550.