50% borrowing restriction

[RobDoc]

A question just crossed my mind if banking/borrowing restrictions could go into place just for the 2042 resorts? Or if they could make different home priority booking periods for them much like they have done in the circumstance of a new resort opening and owners there might be given 2 -4 weeks priority. Or if they'd have to make the adjustments system wide to accommodate the ending of the 2042 contracts.

Good question and I don't know the answer.

I believe that when new resorts have opened and reservations were not accepted until within 11 months, owners were given a token booking advantage over other DVC Members.

I believe that they could make different banking/borrowing rules unique for resorts expiring on 01/31/2042 and not have them apply system wide for those with later expirations.

With OKW having 2042 and 2057 expirations, I expect that all OKW owners will be subject to the same limitations for banking/borrowing over the last few years before 2042. I also expect that they will begin pushing OKW sales soon - as they only have 35+ years remaining to fill up ownership and for the bulk of that, those memberships can't start until February 1, 2042.

Interesting issues to resolve going forward.

Stay tuned.

 

[wench]

The borrowing restriction is a joke. Don’t get me wrong, I understand the intention behind it. But the effort to balance the system back out is completely wasted when DVC has continued to sell OTUP that flood back into the market. If they really wanted to fix it, they would stop selling extra points. But, that makes them extra money, so they won’t.

I myself have a small contract of 100 points per year. For my stay in April 2022 I would have had enough points to cover my stay completely (excluding my Galactic Starcruiser nights) if I could have borrowed from my last 50 points. But, instead I had to spend more than $300 in OTUP & book 1 night in a value. It’s just not fair for them to force us to buy points to book a stay that we’ve already bought as part of our contract.

 

[Sandisw]

The borrowing restriction is a joke. Don’t get me wrong, I understand the intention behind it. But the effort to balance the system back out is completely wasted when DVC has continued to sell OTUP that flood back into the market. If they really wanted to fix it, they would stop selling extra points. But, that makes them extra money, so they won’t.

I myself have a small contract of 100 points per year. For my stay in April 2022 I would have had enough points to cover my stay completely (excluding my Galactic Starcruiser nights) if I could have borrowed from my last 50 points. But, instead I had to spend more than $300 in OTUP & book 1 night in a value. It’s just not fair for them to force us to buy points to book a stay that we’ve already bought as part of our contract.

I get that it seems like hypocrisy....however, the OTU points are current UY points that DVC/DVD own....those points could be used to simply reserve rooms and then they sell them for cash...which takes more rooms out of the system for other owners.

But these points do not add more points...they simply keep them in the system for owners to buy vs. cash guests getting access to more DVC rooms.

 

[wench]

I get that it seems like hypocrisy....however, the OTU points are current UY points that DVC/DVD own....those points could be used to simply reserve rooms and then they sell them for cash...which takes more rooms out of the system for other owners.

But these points do not add more points...they simply keep them in the system for owners to buy vs. cash guests getting access to more DVC rooms.

In that case wouldn’t it be more fair for them to freeze cash rooms & OTUP, rather than points borrowing? They could allow owners access to rent the rooms they own with their existing points & get through the backlog. They won’t do that though, because that won’t make them any extra money.

Normally, I’m very understanding of the way they do things. They’re a business & they have to make money. But, this particular practice I just don’t agree with.

 

[RoseGold]

This rule is making the website not work for a long time now, and they know it. DVC doesn't care about inconveniencing you, but they do care about inconveniencing themselves.

I expect the rule to be lifted soon. I think implementing it has caused too much headache.

 

[skippytx]

I don't think they'll remove the rule until 2023. Just conjecture on my part, but the snowball effect of almost 4 months of closure, plus a ton of people banking points into future use years means the equilibrium is thrown off. They might do it next year since the 2020 points will be out of the system by then, but I'm not counting on it.

 

[Sandisw]

In that case wouldn’t it be more fair for them to freeze cash rooms & OTUP, rather than points borrowing? They could allow owners access to rent the rooms they own with their existing points & get through the backlog. They won’t do that though, because that won’t make them any extra money.

Normally, I’m very understanding of the way they do things. They’re a business & they have to make money. But, this particular practice I just don’t agree with.

They have the right to use their points like the rest of us so I am not sure how it’s not fair when they are an owner as well. No different than all the owners out there right now renting or transferring to others for a fee.

They can’t use points from two different owners for the same room. That would violate the rules. There is no legal way for them to book a room with their points and let another owner also book the same room.

As it is, they have offered other owners their points as extended points when owners were at risk of losing expiring points. They did not have to do that.

Lots of international owners are getting extra points to use until May 2022 because of travel bans after their own points have expired.

IMO, in that case, they have gone above and beyond. I know, it’s frustrating, but being a points based timeshare they have an obligation to keep the system in check and limiting borrowing is doing just that.

 

[wench]

They have the right to use their points like the rest of us so I am not sure how it’s not fair when they are an owner as well. No different than all the owners out there right now renting or transferring to others for a fee.

They can’t use points from two different owners for the same room. That would violate the rules. There is no legal way for them to book a room with their points and let another owner also book the same room.

As it is, they have offered other owners their points as extended points when owners were at risk of losing expiring points. They did not have to do that.

Lots of international owners are getting extra points to use until May 2022 because of travel bans after their own points have expired.

IMO, in that case, they have gone above and beyond. I know, it’s frustrating, but being a points based timeshare they have an obligation to keep the system in check and limiting borrowing is doing just that.

Considering DVC to be just another owner like the rest of us is a big stretch. At best I would say owner/operator which puts a lot more obligation on them. I would love to know what restrictions they’ve put on their own point usage in the pandemic. Is that information that is published out there somewhere?

Also, they didn’t extend points for all owners, just some of them. I personally lost a good number of points when my April 2020 vacation to DLR was cancelled due to the shutdown. Because I have a Dec use year they decided that I wasn’t deserving of an extension as most other use years were considered to be.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Considering DVC to be just another owner like the rest of us is a big stretch. At best I would say owner/operator which puts a lot more obligation on them. I would love to know what restrictions they’ve put on their own point usage in the pandemic. Is that information that is published out there somewhere?

Also, they didn’t extend points for all owners, just some of them. I personally lost a good number of points when my April 2020 vacation to DLR was cancelled due to the shutdown. Because I have a Dec use year they decided that I wasn’t deserving of an extension as most other use years were considered to be.

Mmm, yes. VGC closed for months and months and no special accommodations for owners there beyond what was given to everyone all while still being given to internationals. I don't get the decision making.

 

[Sandisw]

Considering DVC to be just another owner like the rest of us is a big stretch. At best I would say owner/operator which puts a lot more obligation on them. I would love to know what restrictions they’ve put on their own point usage in the pandemic. Is that information that is published out there somewhere?

Also, they didn’t extend points for all owners, just some of them. I personally lost a good number of points when my April 2020 vacation to DLR was cancelled due to the shutdown. Because I have a Dec use year they decided that I wasn’t deserving of an extension as most other use years were considered to be.

Actually, they do own points like the rest of us and are bound by the same rules as the rest of us, including being able to use them to book rooms.

All those points DVD requires via ROFR can indeed by used by them for cash rooms. All those points they maintain ownership of are theirs to use. The points not yet sold are theirs..many of the points given to owners were indeed those RIV points. Some don’t like it. I understand that but those points are part of the system and eligible to be used in whatever way DVC/DVD wants to use them

The only restriction they put on their points was no extension. They let banked points they owned expire during the closure.

That was published back in April 2020 when they announced the extension of expiring points for many owners. And yes, there were certainly some owners who didn’t get the same extension as others based on UY or resort. But many many owners did. DVC could have done nothing for owners but instead gave away a lot of free points they owned to help as many owners as they could..and still are for international owners

Of course, they are limited to the borrowing restriction as well.

Again, my comments were related to OTU points and those are not adding more points to the system for current travel period like borrowing would. Each are completely different situations in terms of the impact on the balance of points in the system.

 

[Sandisw]

Mmm, yes. VGC closed for months and months and no special accommodations for owners there beyond what was given to everyone all while still being given to internationals. I don't get the decision making.

It was very surprising there was no official policy for VGC. But I know of a few owners who were indeed given extended points who owned there.

However, it was case by case, like it is currently with international. And those that I know had it happen after the info about Aulani was posted, not when the initial extensions were announced.

I agree it should have been more consistent for VGC, especially when they remained closed for almost a year longer than WDW resorts.

 

[Ruttangel]

As an international owner DVC seem to have given a hard deadline of using double banked points by 31st May 2022.
Makes you wonder why they didn’t announce 1st Jun 2022, I guess must be leaving it until 2023

 

[Aussie RJ]

Mmm, yes. VGC closed for months and months and no special accommodations for owners there beyond what was given to everyone all while still being given to internationals. I don't get the decision making.

FYI, as an international. I was told a flat out “No” to an extension and have since rented out over 1000 points I would have preferred to keep. I’m sure I could have kept calling and found the one CM to finally feel sorry for me but the lack of consistency around these matters is disgusting.

 

[Ruttangel]

FYI, as an international. I was told a flat out “No” to an extension and have since rented out over 1000 points I would have preferred to keep. I’m sure I could have kept calling and found the one CM to finally feel sorry for me but the lack of consistency around these matters is disgusting.

Sorry to hear that, so you got no offer to extend to 31May 2022?
My points were only expiring 31 Jan 2022 so not much of an extension really and I've still had to rent out

 

[Aussie RJ]

Sorry to hear that, so you got no offer to extend to 31May 2022?
My points were only expiring 31 Jan 2022 so not much of an extension really and I've still had to rent out

Mine were April use year, banked from 2020. I guess they saw fit that 31st March 2022 was long enough.. two months would not have made a difference but they seemed to make it up as they go which I see as the issue.

 

[Madame]

We are international and got exactly 3 usable points extended. Most of us (if FB groups are anything to go by) have been renting our points out to Americans, so I’m not so sure this glut of extended international points isn’t fictitious.

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

Sorry to hear that international owners were negatively impacted, but it sounds like at least a lot have been able to rent the points to avoid losing a lot of money on them. Perhaps the silver lining is that those points have been getting used and won't overload the system. Once international travel starts back up, it should be beneficial to both international and domestic visitors for there to be fewer surplus points still competing for availability.

 

[sndral]

I don't think they'll remove the rule until 2023. Just conjecture on my part, but the snowball effect of almost 4 months of closure, plus a ton of people banking points into future use years means the equilibrium is thrown off. They might do it next year since the 2020 points will be out of the system by then, but I'm not counting on it.

I’m curious how RCI factors into this. I suspect a lot of owners opted to extend the life of their points via depositing them into RCI, but don’t know how that works - does DVC not deposit bookable villas into RCI until the DVC owner actually books a property via RCI, if so that may impact inventory for the next 2 years, or does DVC make a villa available when the DVC owner initially puts their points into RCI, if so then it should have no delayed future impact.

 

[Aussie RJ]

Credit where it's due.. We called Member Services (to load points) and whilst we were on the phone I asked if we could extend 105 points which we just received on a new resale contract.. Member Services said they would fill in the forms and commence the extension. Even more interesting is borders are now open, I would have thought the undocumented points extension policy would be finished.

 

[Tornat]

surprised they extended anyone points , we bought our contract few months before the covid thing started and they made us eat our first year points, paid the thing off in full day we bought it.