4.5MPH ECVs -- Why?

[stargazertechie]

Strollers can't be compared to ECVs, getting hit by a stroller with a child in it, is not like getting hit by a 9kph ECV with an obese driver. A significant percentage of the ECVs have a combined weight well over the 100kg (220 pound) mark.

I guess the good news is that simple physics prevents the obese drivers to hit 9kph. The heavier you are, the harder the motor has to work.... therefore the slower your max speed.


And again... JUST BECAUSE IT CAN GO THAT FAST DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE'S DRIVING AT WARP SPEED!

 

[bouncycat]

I guess the good news is that simple physics prevents the obese drivers to hit 9kph. The heavier you are, the harder the motor has to work.... therefore the slower your max speed.


And again... JUST BECAUSE IT CAN GO THAT FAST DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE'S DRIVING AT WARP SPEED!

That's all I've been trying to say. More and more of these types of discussions are popping up, and it's getting quite old. One or two, yea, I usually ignore, but 10? It does kinda start getting personal, no one mentions that their child or themselves even ALMOST got hit, but because the ECV driver was able to stop....it gets overlooked and forgotten. Every single time I go to the parks, and it's quite a bit, I avoid hitting at least 5-10 people, and am able to stop. My chair stops quite good, and I practiced quite a bit before taking it to the parks. But, because that's a good experience, it gets overlooked. My chair is painted, so it would be easy on these boards to peg me as a bad driver, since my chair is so unique. But, no one has come forward and said a Tigger chair hit them, because I haven't. The only person I have hit and it was my fault, was my DH. It was dark, and my chair doesn't have lights like scooters do, and I misjudged my footplate, and bam. I wasn't going fast at all...since we were inline.

Anyways people, EVERYONE, watch where you're going, look down every once in a while, and please, don't treat us in chairs like we're contageous. We're not, and most of the time we got an awesome sense of humor about us. We have to living in a chair.

 

[jlevis]

I guess the good news is that simple physics prevents the obese drivers to hit 9kph. The heavier you are, the harder the motor has to work.... therefore the slower your max speed.


And again... JUST BECAUSE IT CAN GO THAT FAST DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE'S DRIVING AT WARP SPEED!

Yeah, I rarely go to "rabbit" and then only to negotiate inclines such as in The Land or into 'soarin. By the end of the day that rabbit is pretty tired. I try to keep my speed consistent with the walkers. I'm sorry that anyone is hit or injured by a careless ECV operator. I have never hit anyone BUT I have been hit by a stroller while on a scooter. The lady yelled at me, too. Most likely one of the ECV haters here. The parks are crowded folks and most people are in a hurry and are not paying attention. Those of us on a scooter are below the sight line of most walkers. The simple fact is that if you are on a scooter you really need to be on the alert for careless and inattentive walkers.

 

[deegack]

I guess the good news is that simple physics prevents the obese drivers to hit 9kph. The heavier you are, the harder the motor has to work.... therefore the slower your max speed.


And again... JUST BECAUSE IT CAN GO THAT FAST DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE'S DRIVING AT WARP SPEED!

I get that but often the ecvs that are waiting for people at the resort are set at rabbit and since no one is there to show novice users how to use them the users frequently don't realize there is a slow speed so only use rabbit. Hence why I suggested all new users should be required to meet with someone from the rental company the first time they rent to go over the basics. The man who knocked down my dh did not realize he could go slow. I turned his ECv down to rabbit. And we were stopped in line so no one jumped in front of anyone. The man simply did not know how to use the ECv.

 

[maxiesmom]

I get that but often the ecvs that are waiting for people at the resort are set at rabbit and since no one is there to show novice users how to use them the users frequently don't realize there is a slow speed so only use rabbit. Hence why I suggested all new users should be required to meet with someone from the rental company the first time they rent to go over the basics. The man who knocked down my dh did not realize he could go slow. I turned his ECv down to rabbit. And we were stopped in line so no one jumped in front of anyone. The man simply did not know how to use the ECv.

The places that deliver ECVs to the resort will show you how to use them, if they are asked to. People need to ask! I would never hop onto a motorcycle and just ride off without having lessons. Why do people do it with ECVs? I hate to say it, but it is a pretty stupid thing to do, to rent one and not ask to be shown how to use it. And you can't always fix stupid.

 

[deegack]

The places that deliver ECVs to the resort will show you how to use them, if they are asked to. People need to ask! I would never hop onto a motorcycle and just ride off without having lessons. Why do people do it with ECVs? I hate to say it, but it is a pretty stupid thing to do, to rent one and not ask to be shown how to use it. And you can't always fix stupid.

I know. Mil is renting one for our upcoming trip and I insisted she meet with someone to get trained. However in the age of computerized records it's easy to say, you have never rented with us before we need to meet with you and train you. If you are a regular ECv user it should take five to ten minutes to show that you can operate the machine. If you are a novice a bit longer to get the basics. Then the next time you rent you can have it dropped off. Its safer for everyone including the company. If dh was hurt and we wanted compensation, you bet your sweet bippy I would go after the rental company who allowed a man who did not know the basics of operating a machine to drive it in a crowded theme park. Liability waivers are simple to get around. Any lawyer just out of law school can do that.
I also think stroller people should meet with renters. I saw one guy beating his rental stroller because he couldn't figure out how to fold it. I showed him.

 

[North of Mouse]

The OP should ask ECV manufacturers for the answer to the original question. People at Disney rent what's available, and have no say in the ECV's features. I understand that Disney-furnished ECVs reach a slower max speed.

There is a weight range for people operating an ECV, and those of higher weight need more power to push forward. More power is also needed for inclines. A battery that is weak from age or lack or charge requires more power. Combine incline and heavier weight, and a high amount of power is called for.

One could look at the ECV panel and see the Turtle-to-Hare control as a speed control. But it is also a power control for factors listed above.

While we're at it, why do Segways go so freakin' fast? Woe be the day guests have them at WDW.

Regarding guests having Segways at Disney - that has already been decided. As a safety issue, Disney (and lawyers LOL) has said NO. I'm thankful for that too. We just got back, and some of the ECV's that zoomed by past us walking briskly should have gotten a speeding ticket and don't get me started on all the ones that had babies and older children on their laps. If this is a no-no, it surely is not being enforced

 

[connie1042]

I do not usually use an ECV, but have when needed. The last time I used one, I swear, I could walk faster then the ECV. This was rented at Epcot. It was not that I wanted to go really fast, I just wanted to move. People kept walking around me, because I was going so slow. I thought maybe I just had a bad scooter, but when I turned it in, they said it was fine. So I will use my own 2 feet, unless I really need one.

 

[NotUrsula]

Yikes!!! That's all I gotta say about those!! 69mph and the other 2 wheeled scooter isn't really what a person with mobility issues would need. I know I can't go fast on mine without hurting myself with jerky movements. That's just crazy!!!

I'm in a group with others with my type of MD on facebook, and we all have interesting ways of "pimping our rides" One person had their scooter painted camoflauge, and for me, I have mine painted in Tigger stripes!! My powerchair AND my AFO leg braces!!

Oh, absolutely; I thought that the mood around here needed lightening.

My point was that compared to these kinds of "modifications", 4.5 mph is really not worth getting exercised about. I mean, really, when someone can put training wheels on a street scooter, claim that it is a mobility scooter, and actually get the thing inside a Disney theme park, I figure that the Rabbit setting on a rental is the least of the safety issues we all need to watch out for.

 

[cameyer85]

The places that deliver ECVs to the resort will show you how to use them, if they are asked to. People need to ask! I would never hop onto a motorcycle and just ride off without having lessons. Why do people do it with ECVs? I hate to say it, but it is a pretty stupid thing to do, to rent one and not ask to be shown how to use it. And you can't always fix stupid.

EXACTLY! you hit the nail on the head..you cant fix stupid ! The first time I rented a scooter it was waiting for me at my resort..they wheeled it out and said here you are..I said thats very nice but can you please show me how to use it? Like stated above...I didn't buy my motorcycle and just jump on....I needed lessons and same with the scooter...I am very aware of my surroundings while on my motorcycle likewise on a scooter while at WDW.

 

[jlevis]

... The man who knocked down my dh did not realize he could go slow. I turned his ECv down to rabbit. And we were stopped in line so no one jumped in front of anyone. The man simply did not know how to use the ECv.

Just nit picking but "rabbit" is the top power setting. You can't turn it down to rabbit you can turn it down to turtle the lowest setting.

 

[jlevis]

... And you can't always fix stupid.

So true, stupid people who don't watch where they're walking or where they are pushing their strollers or are so busy talking on their cell phones they run into others , including people on ECV's. Or are so drunk on the booze they've brought in that they miss the bush they are peeing in or they get into fights. Frankley, I've seen more stupid behavior by the able bodied than by those on ECV's or wheelchairs. But, we're an easy target.

 

[deegack]

Just nit picking but "rabbit" is the top power setting. You can't turn it down to rabbit you can turn it down to turtle the lowest setting.

Not to not pick but does it really matter when he was going fast enough to knock over my 6'7" 240 pound husband and narrowly miss my 16 month old daughter. He caused enough damage to my husband that we had to leave the park and go back to the room so he could rest his back (previous injury was aggregated).
I have been hit by strollers and other people but never with enough force to push me never mind my much larger husband to the ground.
I blame the person who rented te ECv without learning how to use it, I blame the rental company who rented it to him without teaching him the simple basics and I blame wdw for knowingly allowing the ecvs to be dropped off at their hotel without the rental agency meeting the person renting it to make sure they understand how to use it.

 

[maxiesmom]

I blame the person who rented te ECv without learning how to use it, I blame the rental company who rented it to him without teaching him the simple basics and I blame wdw for knowingly allowing the ecvs to be dropped off at their hotel without the rental agency meeting the person renting it to make sure they understand how to use it.

Any rental company does not have to make sure the person doing the renting knows how to use whatever it is they are renting. They don't take you out behind Hertz for a road test.

Holding Disney accountable is equally ridiculous. It is not up to them to teach their guests how to use ECVs, just like it is not up to them to teach us how to put on life jackets or how to use our cameras. The only one to blame is the person on the ECV for their lack of knowledge.

Personal responsibility is a dying thing. People look to blame everyone and anyone but themselves.

 

[POOHsie]

Not to not pick but does it really matter when he was going fast enough to knock over my 6'7" 240 pound husband and narrowly miss my 16 month old daughter. He caused enough damage to my husband that we had to leave the park and go back to the room so he could rest his back (previous injury was aggregated).
I have been hit by strollers and other people but never with enough force to push me never mind my much larger husband to the ground.
I blame the person who rented te ECv without learning how to use it, I blame the rental company who rented it to him without teaching him the simple basics and I blame wdw for knowingly allowing the ecvs to be dropped off at their hotel without the rental agency meeting the person renting it to make sure they understand how to use it.

You can blame the rental agency for not showing the renter how the equipment works.

You can also blame the renter's family, who might know the renter isn't qualified to operate the ECV but rents one anyway so they don't have to push the person in a wheelchair (it's a lot of physical work in the Florida heat).

You can't make Disney responsible for rental equipment dropped off at their hotels. If Disney was involved in overseeing the rental ECV rider's equipment training, that would imply that somehow Disney would be liable if the ECV renter was careless and harmed someone. I could imagine the lawsuits people would try if they thought they could get Disney to pay. You'd have people at the parks lining up to be hit by a rental ECV so they could cash in!

 

[deegack]

Any rental company does not have to make sure the person doing the renting knows how to use whatever it is they are renting. They don't take you out behind Hertz for a road test.

Holding Disney accountable is equally ridiculous. It is not up to them to teach their guests how to use ECVs, just like it is not up to them to teach us how to put on life jackets or how to use our cameras. The only one to blame is the person on the ECV for their lack of knowledge.

Personal responsibility is a dying thing. People look to blame everyone and anyone but themselves.

A car rental company makes sure a person has a valid license to drive a car before they rent them one. They won't rent my 11year old nephew a car. By requiring a valid license they are in effect giving a driving test.
Disney has rules and regulations about every thing. They can easily require the rental company to meet you or set the ECv to slow like they do for their in park rentals.
If my dh has sustained a more severe injure or if my dd has hit (and she was inches away from being hit) you bet you butt I would be including both Disney and the rental company in the lawsuit as well as the driver of the ECv.

 

[maxiesmom]

A car rental company makes sure a person has a valid license to drive a car before they rent them one. They won't rent my 11year old nephew a car. By requiring a valid license they are in effect giving a driving test.
Disney has rules and regulations about every thing. They can easily require the rental company to meet you or set the ECv to slow like they do for their in park rentals.
If my dh has sustained a more severe injure or if my dd has hit (and she was inches away from being hit) you bet you butt I would be including both Disney and the rental company in the lawsuit as well as the driver of the ECv.

Except that to my knowledge no type of license or testing is required by law to operate an ECV. Just because it would be the smart thing to do, doesn't make it legally required. So you would have had a hard time proving anyone but the operator of the ECV was responsible.

You may think Disney should require some sort of test, but they don't, and they don't have to.

 

[deegack]

Except that to my knowledge no type of license or testing is required by law to operate an ECV. Just because it would be the smart thing to do, doesn't make it legally required. So you would have had a hard time proving anyone but the operator of the ECV was responsible.

You may think Disney should require some sort of test, but they don't, and they don't have to.

Never said someone had to have a test to use an ECv. Nope, simply said that the agency should be required to meet the person renting the ECv. Disney allows the agency to drop off and even store ECv on their property. At that point they become involved in the transaction. It's been several years since I practiced law, but every first year law students learns about negligence. It is a fairly straight line from the uneducated driver to the rental agency to Disney. It happens all the time. You go after the deep pocket because as the innocent victim, and doesn't get much more innocent than standing still in line holding your daughters hand, you want to be able to recover your damages ie medical bills, lost wages etc. Why do you think we have warnings on thing like the coffee you drink may be hot or in my car manual there is a warning that I shouldn't drive with my head out the sunroof. Because in these cases the company was found negligent in some manner.

and at least one company that delivers to WDW requires you meet with them to get the ecv. So its not an impossible task.

 

[NotUrsula]

Except that to my knowledge no type of license or testing is required by law to operate an ECV. Just because it would be the smart thing to do, doesn't make it legally required. So you would have had a hard time proving anyone but the operator of the ECV was responsible.

You may think Disney should require some sort of test, but they don't, and they don't have to.

No, but as they are private property, they could. There are lots of ways that a basic safety rules "test" could be administered before someone is allowed to operate a motor vehicle inside a park; it would only take a few minutes and could be done online in advance, and/or with a kiosk system.

I don't want to deprive anyone of the use of an ECV if using one will enrich the person's park experience, but it *is* a heavy motor vehicle, and with the crowd levels that are just about always present in the parks these days, adding some safety procedures would seem prudent. IME, the folks who are most dangerous on an ECV are the same folks who would be dangerous behind the wheel of a car; folks who have vision and reaction-time issues that make it pretty unsafe for them to operate a motor vehicle of any kind. (And yes, I understand that the tiller of an ECV operates as a dead-man switch. That could make a difference in certain limited situations, I know, but situations like that are fairly few and far between.)

 

[sdzman]

With the adult obesity rate expected to hit 42% in just a decade we can all expect to see more ECVs crawling along....just think about the movie WALL-E.