2023 Point Charts Released

[Wakey]

Theres a TPV for resort studios, costs more than a deluxe.

This just doesn’t seem right to me. It won’t be much of a problem at first as the new rooms are new and many will be tempted to book them just to see what they are about.
5 years down the line, you can book a normal DVC room now with Murphy sofa bed (negating any negativity about a sofa bed) which turns into a sofa in the day, and has a kitchen.
Original members bought in knowing the number of units and the rooms they will get.
Families I am sure will long term much rather have a room with a kitchen in. Many couples would do as well. We believe DVC rooms are significantly superior to standard hotel rooms.
Then along come DVC who want as cheap a solution as possible to sell some more units so design them with no kitchens to save on cost as no plumbing needed.
If they were cheaper points wise, fine, could be another option without loading pressure on the old superior units, but they are the same or more expensive.
In my view this will, long term, increase the pressure on the proper DVC units. This could leave some unlucky members who thought they were buying a booking window with a DVC unit with a kitchen having to settle for one without as a newer member has come in and taken the kitchen room. All because DVC decided to sell more units, not put kitchens in, and also keep points high.
This just doesn’t sit right with me at all.
Next we will be told resale restrictions apply to the new unit sales (joke, I hope not and doubt that as it’s in the old condo association, otherwise that will cause a whole heap of issues.)

 

[robotsneedlove2]

I have 3 Fixed/Guaranteed Weeks at CCV (44/runDisney, 47/Thanksgiving most years, and 48/holidays) that each cost 118 points to purchase -- which included a 10% premium at the time the resort opened.

In 2023, those same weeks are now:
44: 123 points
47: 127 points
48: 118 points

These shifts in point charts means I'm no longer "paying" a premium on my FW, and I "get" 14 points in 2023 if I keep/use those weeks.

I have fixed week 49 at PVB, which cost me 130 points to purchase. In 2023 that week now costs 139 points to book!

Looking back to 2108 it was only 118 points to book week 49. A 21 point increase over 5 years.

 

[hhisc16]

2022 VGF chart was updated as well...

 

[Sandisw]

This just doesn’t seem right to me. It won’t be much of a problem at first as the new rooms are new and many will be tempted to book them just to see what they are about.
5 years down the line, you can book a normal DVC room now with Murphy sofa bed (negating any negativity about a sofa bed) which turns into a sofa in the day, and has a kitchen.
Original members bought in knowing the number of units and the rooms they will get.
Families I am sure will long term much rather have a room with a kitchen in. Many couples would do as well. We believe DVC rooms are significantly superior to standard hotel rooms.
Then along come DVC who want as cheap a solution as possible to sell some more units so design them with no kitchens to save on cost as no plumbing needed.
If they were cheaper points wise, fine, could be another option without loading pressure on the old superior units, but they are the same or more expensive.
In my view this will, long term, increase the pressure on the proper DVC units. This could leave some unlucky members who thought they were buying a booking window with a DVC unit with a kitchen having to settle for one without as a newer member has come in and taken the kitchen room. All because DVC decided to sell more units, not put kitchens in, and also keep points high.
This just doesn’t sit right with me at all.
Next we will be told resale restrictions apply to the new unit sales (joke, I hope not and doubt that as it’s in the old condo association, otherwise that will cause a whole heap of issues.)

Nothing to prevent them from adjusting the point charts down the road either. They had to include the resort studios for 2023 and adjust the 2022 chart. Keeping the same allowed them to determine total points sold.

But, that doesn't mean down the road, say in 2024, after having some data on what books when and how fast, that we won't see the resort studios different than the deluxe studios.

I agree it is a change to the DVC model that many of us would never have given thought to. But, if they are doing it, and doing it this way, they must have some data that they will be enough to prompt people to buy at a heavy studio resort. Poly sold that way, so they know it can happen.

In this case, they must believe that its location will outweigh the room design. I would have loved to find out that some of the rooms have connecting doors like Poly because that to me, would help compensate for the loss of the 1 and 2 bedrooms.

 

[Matty B13]

This just doesn’t seem right to me. It won’t be much of a problem at first as the new rooms are new and many will be tempted to book them just to see what they are about.
5 years down the line, you can book a normal DVC room now with Murphy sofa bed (negating any negativity about a sofa bed) which turns into a sofa in the day, and has a kitchen.
Original members bought in knowing the number of units and the rooms they will get.
Families I am sure will long term much rather have a room with a kitchen in. Many couples would do as well. We believe DVC rooms are significantly superior to standard hotel rooms.
Then along come DVC who want as cheap a solution as possible to sell some more units so design them with no kitchens to save on cost as no plumbing needed.
If they were cheaper points wise, fine, could be another option without loading pressure on the old superior units, but they are the same or more expensive.
In my view this will, long term, increase the pressure on the proper DVC units. This could leave some unlucky members who thought they were buying a booking window with a DVC unit with a kitchen having to settle for one without as a newer member has come in and taken the kitchen room. All because DVC decided to sell more units, not put kitchens in, and also keep points high.
This just doesn’t sit right with me at all.
Next we will be told resale restrictions apply to the new unit sales (joke, I hope not and doubt that as it’s in the old condo association, otherwise that will cause a whole heap of issues.)

This is why it should have been a separate Resort, not an add-on.

 

[Lorana]

I have fixed week 49 at PVB, which cost me 130 points to purchase. In 2023 that week now costs 139 points to book!

Looking back to 2108 it was only 118 points to book week 49. A 21 point increase over 5 years.

I’m not sure whether to like or cry on these: on one hand, our FWs are proving to be a huge value. On the other, a 21 point increase in that week over 5 years is insane.

 

[kilik64]

I’m not sure whether to like or cry on these: on one hand, our FWs are proving to be a huge value. On the other, a 21 point increase in that week over 5 years is insane.

Gotta figure it will be more stable now going forward (at least for the next few years), I'd assume thats a product of moving from 5 seasons to 7 mainly and shifting around point values for different seasons.

 

[CarolMN]

a 21 point increase in that week over 5 years is insane.

I don't like it much, either, but in all fairness, the changes do seem to reflect the higher demand we all see for Fall & early December.

I'm looking forward to seeing some of the inevitable analyses around the changes (too lazy to do any myself).

Now all I need to make a decision on our first add-on purchase since 1999, is the pricing. If it maks you feel any better, we'll be booking the resort studio category. Would love to spend 2-3 nights at the GF before we settle into our 1B at the BWV.

 

[RoseGold]

Theres a TPV for resort studios, costs more than a deluxe.

That's what I get for reading this on mobile and while on a call LOL. Yes, there are standard, lake, and theme park. Standard and lake identical pricing to current studios, theme park a slight premium. I guess what I said about waitlist was wrong.

This is much less premium than I expected! But, my club level dream is still dashed.

I don't think this was a conscious decision about rooms, I think this was the cheapest moneygrab possible, but the output is still great IMO. A bunch of studios at non-crazy point pricing. So many members are trying to book studios, studios, studios. This is a fantastic addition to overall DVC, and I LOVE IT as a VGF owner.

 

[TTA Rider Matt]

As a studio warrior, the first thing I noticed is that BWV standard studios in summer keep dropping, now just 92 points a week! 87 for the same time frame at OKW. A lot of separation being created between these resorts and SSR which held strong over the 100 threshold. The new point charts continue to be great for summer travelers, and some of those numbers in the fall and Easter/Christmas week are crazy high.

 

[PsycProfPlum]

This just doesn’t seem right to me. It won’t be much of a problem at first as the new rooms are new and many will be tempted to book them just to see what they are about.
5 years down the line, you can book a normal DVC room now with Murphy sofa bed (negating any negativity about a sofa bed) which turns into a sofa in the day, and has a kitchen.
Original members bought in knowing the number of units and the rooms they will get.
Families I am sure will long term much rather have a room with a kitchen in. Many couples would do as well. We believe DVC rooms are significantly superior to standard hotel rooms.
Then along come DVC who want as cheap a solution as possible to sell some more units so design them with no kitchens to save on cost as no plumbing needed.
If they were cheaper points wise, fine, could be another option without loading pressure on the old superior units, but they are the same or more expensive.
In my view this will, long term, increase the pressure on the proper DVC units. This could leave some unlucky members who thought they were buying a booking window with a DVC unit with a kitchen having to settle for one without as a newer member has come in and taken the kitchen room. All because DVC decided to sell more units, not put kitchens in, and also keep points high.
This just doesn’t sit right with me at all.
Next we will be told resale restrictions apply to the new unit sales (joke, I hope not and doubt that as it’s in the old condo association, otherwise that will cause a whole heap of issues.)

well said. Though I'm a bit surprised the resort studio rooms weren't more expensive than they are.

Those new resort studio rooms with theme park view are a whopping 54 points per night on the weekend in the busiest season!

 

[Cyberc1978]

As a current VGF owner I’m unsure if this will decrease or increase the value of our ownership.

a bunch of new rooms will make them easier for non owners to book, therefore decreasing the value.

if most new rooms are tpv then the cheaper alternatives will book fast and leave the more expensive tpv rooms to non owners this could potentially increase the value.

What do you think?

 

[tjkraz]

As a current VGF owner I’m unsure if this will decrease or increase the value of our ownership.

a bunch of new rooms will make them easier for non owners to book, therefore decreasing the value.

if most new rooms are tpv then the cheaper alternatives will book fast and leave the more expensive tpv rooms to non owners this could potentially increase the value.

What do you think?

It's likely only about 15% of the new rooms (28?) at most will be theme park view. One long side of the building faces the lake in the general direction of the current DVC building. The other side faces in toward the quiet pool. Those seem easily classified as Lake vs Standard View. Only the small end cap faces toward MK.

I'm not sure there's anything here to help increase value. One of the greatest benefits to owning VGF was its small size and difficulty of securing reservations at 7 months. If the deluxe studios emerge as significantly more popular than resort studios, that could create an interesting dynamic among owners. But it's very similar to Jambo vs Kidani and I don't see where that really impacts overall value of owning AKV.

From a value perspective, I think this addition is neutral-to-mildly negative (because it adds so many more rooms, making studios easier to book at 7 months.) But I don't think it's anything close to a "sky is falling" situation.

 

[JETSDAD]

As a current VGF owner I’m unsure if this will decrease or increase the value of our ownership.

a bunch of new rooms will make them easier for non owners to book, therefore decreasing the value.

if most new rooms are tpv then the cheaper alternatives will book fast and leave the more expensive tpv rooms to non owners this could potentially increase the value.

What do you think?

I think standard will book first, then TPV, then lakeview. I think there are around 28 TPV rooms on the end if it stays as it is with the current building. It should probably be similar to the way BLT books up and non-owners will mostly be able to get LV rooms. I don't think there will really be an affect on the value however that will be more an issue to do with whatever price they sell direct at.

 

[PsycProfPlum]

I think standard will book first, then TPV, then lakeview. I think there are around 28 TPV rooms on the end if it stays as it is with the current building. I think it will be similar to the way BLT books up and non-owners will mostly be able to get LV rooms. I don't think there will really be an affect on the value however that will be more an issue to do with whatever price they sell direct at.

I imagine it might take a year or two for things to shake out and for the points to get balanced properly based on demand. It's not going to be as exclusive for sure and it will likely show a lot more demand for 1BR and 2BR as there were be many more owners but no additional rooms in those categories. With respect to studios, some people might prefer the new layout and closer location to the main building, so that's tougher to judge but should be something point balancing can solve.

On the whole, I think this could have been a lot worse than it is. I was really worried about them setting the points much higher just to have more to sell without regard to the effects on the current owners. At least that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[RoseGold]

I'm not sure there's anything here to help increase value. One of the greatest benefits to owning VGF was its small size and difficulty of securing reservations at 7 months.

Of course this is great for VGF value. The low (well, not higher than VGF1) point chart means point pricing will be high. I think this chart leads to $275 direct pricing, and DVC will be able to get it.

This is the product buyers are looking for. DVC is now too expensive for the old sales pitches about pinching money. If you're buying a five figure timeshare with $100+/day theme park tickets, you aren't trying to save money by heating up a frozen pizza. You can book another accessible studio for grandma, and you can all walk/roll to the park. This is fantastic all around. It's not like they're trying to sell treehouses. This is a product directly competing with a $800/night room. It's brilliant. DVC can sell the Jiminy out of this.

 

[Dobermanns]

As a current VGF owner who primarily books studios (we have no two-legged kids, and I travel solo to WDW 75% of the time), I have no use for the kitchenette. I go to WDW to eat at my favorite TS restaurants.The two beds are appealing because sometimes I invite a friend to stay with me.
As far as value of the resort. Eh we bought DVC so we could stay at a deluxe resort for cheaper than cash, and our points are part of my retirement planning (to use, not an investment), so it really doesn’t matter

 

[Sandisw]

Of course this is great for VGF value. The low (well, not higher than VGF1) point chart means point pricing will be high. I think this chart leads to $275 direct pricing, and DVC will be able to get it.

This is the product buyers are looking for. If you're buying a five figure timeshare with $100+/day theme park tickets, you aren't trying to save money by heating up a frozen pizza. You can book another accessible studio for grandma, and you can all walk/roll to the park. This is fantastic all around. It's not like they're trying to sell treehouses. This is a product directly competing with a $800/night room. It's brilliant. DVC can sell the Jiminy out of this.

The chart, to me, supports a more reasonably priced direct price to start because, no matter what, this resort is now studio heavy, and no longer as unique as it once was. Prior to the announcement, most often, they had VGF points in stock and very few times was a waitlist needed.

I also think we will see adjustments down the road and the resort studios will not be the same as the regular studios. If anything, I think we may see a rise in number of points needed to buy direct as a new buyer so they can specifically use this chart, and a lower price to encourage people.

But, at least the release of the charts at least answers one question and confirms there has been no change to the announcement this is the same association.

 

[RoseGold]

But, at least the release of the charts answers at least answers one question and confirms there has been no change to the announcement this is the same association.

Yes, you're right. Talk about burying the lede. This is the headline.

Though no one has seen the paperwork yet. There might still be some surprises.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I’m not sure whether to like or cry on these: on one hand, our FWs are proving to be a huge value. On the other, a 21 point increase in that week over 5 years is insane.

Have to look to see if they went over the minimum increase allowed in a single year this time as that all happened pretty much in the past 2 years. It needed to but it also needs to follow the POS.

Off the top of their head does anyone recall what the limit is in a single night change year to year? It appears it needs to be more than 10% to be allowable for the described Poly change. My recollection is that it is in the 10, 11 or 12% range.

As a studio warrior, the first thing I noticed is that BWV standard studios in summer keep dropping, now just 92 points a week! 87 for the same time frame at OKW. A lot of separation being created between these resorts and SSR which held strong over the 100 threshold. The new point charts continue to be great for summer travelers, and some of those numbers in the fall and Easter/Christmas week are crazy high.

It's been too long in coming. I think they saw us being beat down by Disney Parks and figured now was the time to finally take it on. I mean what's one more thing on top of AP's can be bought or not, FP gone, Genie+, paid access etc. Just rip that band aid off.

Of course this is great for VGF value. The low (well, not higher than VGF1) point chart means point pricing will be high. I think this chart leads to $275 direct pricing, and DVC will be able to get it.

This is the product buyers are looking for. DVC is now too expensive for the old sales pitches about pinching money. If you're buying a five figure timeshare with $100+/day theme park tickets, you aren't trying to save money by heating up a frozen pizza. You can book another accessible studio for grandma, and you can all walk/roll to the park. This is fantastic all around. It's not like they're trying to sell treehouses. This is a product directly competing with a $800/night room. It's brilliant. DVC can sell the Jiminy out of this.

They apparently have a difficult time selling an $800 room at GF which is why DVC gets the building but we'll see. In most cases DVC sells at a fairly similar pace no matter where the resort is at WDW. There's nothing intrinsically more upscale about these rooms than they've historically done and those looking for higher end will still head for the 4 Seasons.