(2) Gosselin kids expelled from school for bullying

[JerseyJanice]

they must provide a no cost "alternative" education to attending a public school. that does'nt mean it has to be identical in how it's presented. since we have programs where homeschoolers can get free materials, and the internet distance learning is free it meets the federal mandate.

But a parent isn't able to homeschool, a tutor wouldn't have to be provided? Not everyone can afford the internet either.

My point was anywhere 6 year-olds live in the U.S., an expulsion from school wouldn't mean it was the end of their education.

 

[DMRick]

Good post Janice.

I don't think there could possibly be any accurate way to measure "explusion" in lower grades and especially in private schools.

I doubt the public is getting the whole story about these children. (BTW, I haven't read any media accounts myself--just what's on this thread.) Who is giving info about this "expulsion" to the media? And who is saying it's due to bullying? Is it the school? I seriously doubt that, especially from any of the school's administrators.

Would you send your children to a private school that gave out info about its students to the media? Even though this family is famous, no school is going to release info about behavioral records to the media.

If the info is coming from parents of other students (very likely, as other PPs have pointed out), then we don't know whether it was really an expulsion or request to remove the students and place them in an environment where they can get the attention they need.

This is a common occurrence in private schools--especially for young children. Not all schools are equipped to handle all the needs of every student. It's not called "expulsion." It's termed "asked to withdraw."

You won't see many "expulsions" of 6 year-olds because there are very few instances that would be called technically that. The parents of students this age who are too aggressive to their peers are almost always asked to withdraw because the school feels the kids are emotionally disturbed and need to be in a school that is equipped to handle that.

 

[DMRick]

What she said. Although I didn't realize it was federal, I thought it was state.

The youngster I know of has home tutors supplied by the school. Parents were not equipped to teach and they child still has the right to be taught. I am not privy to if the word used was expelled, rather than told to remove from the school, but that's (expelled) the word the parents used. The child is elementary age.

Actually, all minors without high school diplomas in the United States are entitled to a "free and appropriate education." Whatever state you live in, if your child is expelled, your local school district must provide education whether it's with a home tutor or in another school--it's federally mandated.

 

[C.Ann]

While the school is a nice school, (one of the best in the area, way better than ours) they have also have problem kids (remember the three that caused all the damage (although they were much older)..google can be your friend). Most do, since kids still behave like kids. Obviously it did spread, since I know about it. She'll have to get the particulars from the principal. I'm not giving them out.

They have a great counseling group set up. Perhaps thats another plus, if your daughter didn't know about it. Perhaps they keep things more private than this school did.

No need for you to make this personal..

 

[kidshop]

I don't think there could possibly be any accurate way to measure "explusion" in lower grades and especially in private schools.

I doubt the public is getting the whole story about these children. (BTW, I haven't read any media accounts myself--just what's on this thread.) Who is giving info about this "expulsion" to the media? And who is saying it's due to bullying? Is it the school? I seriously doubt that, especially from any of the school's administrators.

Would you send your children to a private school that gave out info about its students to the media? Even though this family is famous, no school is going to release info about behavioral records to the media.

If the info is coming from parents of other students (very likely, as other PPs have pointed out), then we don't know whether it was really an expulsion or request to remove the students and place them in an environment where they can get the attention they need.

This is a common occurrence in private schools--especially for young children. Not all schools are equipped to handle all the needs of every student. It's not called "expulsion." It's termed "asked to withdraw."

You won't see many "expulsions" of 6 year-olds because there are very few instances that would be called technically that. The parents of students this age who are too aggressive to their peers are almost always asked to withdraw because the school feels the kids are emotionally disturbed and need to be in a school that is equipped to handle that.

Might these 2 be emotionally disturbed? Is there anything in their lives that might cause them to BE emotionally disturbed, even moreso than other preemies/HO multiples?

Well, maybe Kate and Jon only ruined 2 of the 8 so goody for them! I don't know how many wake-up calls they are going to get before something tragic happens. It's hard watching them (and their 'fans') systematically dismiss every one.

 

[barkley]

But a parent isn't able to homeschool, a tutor wouldn't have to be provided? Not everyone can afford the internet either.

My point was anywhere 6 year-olds live in the U.S., an expulsion from school wouldn't mean it was the end of their education.

not being able to homeschool does'nt qualify you for a free tutor nor does lack of internet (the school's will point out there's free internet at the public library but if push comes to shove and it's battled out in court the school can always pop for one of those internet only cheapo computers and pay the 9.95 a month to provide service. ends up being a world less expensive than a private tutor.


the school district we used to live in did the private tutor thing but then they figured out that some parents were having their kids get purposely expelled just so they could get one on one instruction. they dropped that alternative so the only way you got a private tutor at home was if you were medicaly home bound (like recovering from surgery), or you could do the alternative independant study program which was basicly homeschooling but the kiddo had to meet with his/her tutor AT THE DISTRICT OFFICE for maybe an hour a week (and they were just keeping tabs on the kid completing assignments).

 

[LiberalPrincess]

Might these 2 be emotionally disturbed? Is there anything in their lives that might cause them to BE emotionally disturbed, even moreso than other preemies/HO multiples?

Well, maybe Kate and Jon only ruined 2 of the 8 so goody for them! I don't know how many wake-up calls they are going to get before something tragic happens. It's hard watching them (and their 'fans') systematically dismiss every one.

I think "ruined" is a pretty harsh term to apply to 6 year olds, especially since we don't know the specific details. Maybe this will be a wake-up call, you never know.

 

[LiberalPrincess]

What she said. Although I didn't realize it was federal, I thought it was state.

The youngster I know of has home tutors supplied by the school. Parents were not equipped to teach and they child still has the right to be taught. I am not privy to if the word used was expelled, rather than told to remove from the school, but that's (expelled) the word the parents used. The child is elementary age.

This is a bit OT, but there was a flurry of articles a few years ago about the finding that pre-kindergarteners are expelled from schools at three times the rate of K-12 students. One of the explanations was that preschool programs are generally voluntary, and teachers and administrators are able to expel disruptive students with a minimum of paperwork. I think that private schools would also have a lot more leeway than public schools.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4655651

 

[DMRick]

I was responding to you saying (her school I know, others I don't, but I assume many on this thread have had expulsions in their schools):

'I've heard about/seen some detentions, a couple of suspensions (all in junior high school and up - both public and private schools), but never "expelled" - and certainly not at 6 years old'.

I was pointing out that it happens it many schools, even if you haven't heard about it, even good school districts like the you have mentioned that your GD goes to in the past (I did not give any hint of the school name, and I do agree it's a great school). I did mention in an earlier post it was elementary school, and yes, I know there are several. Many times you can find stories, if the kids were charged with something, but hopefully most schools do not comment on it and I hope the G's school did not either.

You still haven't clarified which school it is though - elementary (which there are several of), middle school, or high school.. And I guess I don't understand why you're making this personal - about my DGD's school district.. She's not a Gosselin (thank God), so I don't see where you're going with this..

Just for the heck of it, I did do a search of all the elementary schools and I found one expulsion in 2008 (I believe) of a Special Ed student - in one of the other elementary schools.. Obviously she wouldn't know about that..

So again - why is this about my DGD and the "possibility" of an explusion in one of the many schools in that district??

 

[DMRick]

How do you know where her granddaughter goes to school??!!

She told me. We live in the same general area. How else would I have known?

 

[kidshop]

This is a bit OT, but there was a flurry of articles a few years ago about the finding that pre-kindergarteners are expelled from schools at three times the rate of K-12 students. One of the explanations was that preschool programs are generally voluntary, and teachers and administrators are able to expel disruptive students with a minimum of paperwork. I think that private schools would also have a lot more leeway than public schools.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4655651

In these economic times, do you really believe private schools just dismiss students and their tuitions b/c of minor reasons? I don't what the tuition is, but I think it's pretty hefty.

The school had to weigh this heavily. They knew the story would get out, the students having a reality show and all.

 

[C.Ann]

I was responding to you saying (her school I know, others I don't, but I assume many on this thread have had expulsions in their schools):

'I've heard about/seen some detentions, a couple of suspensions (all in junior high school and up - both public and private schools), but never "expelled" - and certainly not at 6 years old'.
.

Still no need to make this personal.. There is a lot I could say about your area - in regards to more than schools - but I won't.. Let's be civil and keep this on topic - the Gosselin children being expelled from school..

Thanks..

 

[LiberalPrincess]

In these economic times, do you really believe private schools just dismiss students and their tuitions b/c of minor reasons? I don't what the tuition is, but I think it's pretty hefty.

The school had to weigh this heavily. They knew the story would get out, the students having a reality show and all.

I can only speak from personal experience, and the private schools around here are ludicrously difficult to get into with extremely long waiting lists. So, yes, I believe that they would dismiss students for other than extreme reasons. Particularly students that have the potential to bring negative attention via a national television show.

 

[DMRick]

Go ahead..I know all about the inner area of my city and the horrible High school and the drug problems. Most larger city's have the same areas. We have a 50% graduation rate in our public schools. That is just horrible. That's why my kids went to private school and moved out of the area to raise their children. We try our best to work with the mission and those less fortunate. I love my neighborhood and my neighbors, most families have been here for 30-40 years, which is a good neighborhood and I plan on dying here.

I did not mention any info that would allow anyone to figure out what school district I am talking about. It's more general...saying, hey you may not know anyone personally, but most schools, even the good ones have had expulsions. I would be willing to bet that most people on this thread have problems in their schools. Your Gd's their Gd's and their children. The Gosselins school would be no different. It's what the G's do with the info now, that matters most, IMO.

Still no need to make this personal.. There is a lot I could say about your area - in regards to more than schools - but I won't.. Let's be civil and keep this on topic - the Gosselin children being expelled from school..

Thanks..

 

[C.Ann]

Particularly students that have the potential to bring negative attention via a national television show.

While this makes sense (and I think has crossed the minds of everyone) why only 2 - as opposed to all of 8 them?

 

[LiberalPrincess]

While this makes sense (and I think has crossed the minds of everyone) why only 2 - as opposed to all of 8 them?

Because the other ones didn't do anything to warrant expulsion? I am certainly not of the opinion that the kids didn't do anything and this was just a malicious expulsion, I just think there are a lot of other factors in play that should be considered.

 

[C.Ann]

I love my neighborhood and my neighbors, most families have been here for 30-40 years, which is a good neighborhood and I plan on dying here..

That's nice, but it wasn't really necessary for you to offer up any other info, because as I said, I would not.. I think we can discuss the Gosselin children without getting personal..

 

[barkley]

I can only speak from personal experience, and the private schools around here are ludicrously difficult to get into with extremely long waiting lists. So, yes, I believe that they would dismiss students for other than extreme reasons. Particularly students that have the potential to bring negative attention via a national television show.

boy that's not the case in allot of other places-private school enrollments are plummeting. the expensive one that had the wait list where we used to live (people would camp out to get an application b/c they only handed out so many a year) has lost so many students they are selling off peices of the property to stay afloat.

ds's (which is not pricey at all) has no 4th, 5th or 6th graders at all this year they knew they probably would'nt have any 4th graders b/c they had no 3rd graders last year, but man were they surprised when they not only got no new enrollments but several families had to pull out alltogether (and we are talking die hard devoted families to this school system, despite generous scholarships they just could'nt afford it anymore).

interesting thing is allot of private schools don't anticipate a return to higher enrollment when the economy rebounds for some people. some people who have'nt experienced public schools since they were kids were'nt aware that in some areas there are stellar ones, and the services are superior to what their private schools offered. what became a transfer out of financial necessity is now becoming a better alternantive.

 

[luvsmickeymouse]

I can only speak from personal experience, and the private schools around here are ludicrously difficult to get into with extremely long waiting lists. So, yes, I believe that they would dismiss students for other than extreme reasons. Particularly students that have the potential to bring negative attention via a national television show.

I agree with this. Private school doesn't have to keep a student. Public education is a different story. Even if a child got expelled from a public school, the district has to educate them. And if a private school keeps bullies, etc. the enrollment will go down because the school won't have a very good reputation.

 

[C.Ann]

I had a thought a little while ago.. I wonder what it's like when the 6 children are getting ready for school in the morning and the other 2 aren't allowed to go along - particularly with their own siblings of the same age?

I wonder if they're sad about it - or if they prefer being at home?