PM EMH drops from THREE Hours to TWO Hours

[Colleen27]

Just because you do not find it to be true does not mean it is not, as I said nobody knows read data from Disney.

I did not go in January but I did after Labor Day and most of the rides were just a walk on, just my experience, not a scientific data of course. As for TSM, FP do not fly out in a morning anymore, according to many peoples reports, during busy times they were still available around 3-4PM, only logical to assume you will have even better luck during slow times. Soarin was also available around 3PM, I assume when TT will reopen, situation may be even better. So, yes you can do much more during slow time then during July, one of the main reasons people go.

As for less available during slow times, you get what you pay for, if it's not enough, pay more and get more.

That's news to me. They were gone by 11 on the day after Memorial Day on our last trip, and that was with a 10pm park close. In the slow season, with 25% fewer FP to distribute based on the earlier closing, I'm sure they go just as quickly. I haven't seen more than one or two reports of longer availability and I've never seen one that had FPs available at 4pm; what I saw reported was along the lines of being able to get them at 11-12 where they used to be gone around 10.

And how far is the "you get what you pay for" argument supposed to go? You only pay less for one element of the vacation - room rates - while park tickets and other costs remain the same. And you already get significantly less of an experience for the money. That's hardly justification for even further cuts.

 

[TLSnell1981]

I guess at least you had inexpensive tickets and better souvenirs to compensate for missing out on so much.

But, why should there be a decline, across the board (hours/quality/services/events/decorations/etc.), especially when prices have increased? I think, some cuts are are directly linked to deep discounts and other promotions (that have no significance to me).

Most of all..I hate, seeing the lost wages.

 

[KellyNY]

That's news to me. They were gone by 11 on the day after Memorial Day on our last trip, and that was with a 10pm park close. In the slow season, with 25% fewer FP to distribute based on the earlier closing, I'm sure they go just as quickly. I haven't seen more than one or two reports of longer availability and I've never seen one that had FPs available at 4pm; what I saw reported was along the lines of being able to get them at 11-12 where they used to be gone around 10.

And how far is the "you get what you pay for" argument supposed to go? You only pay less for one element of the vacation - room rates - while park tickets and other costs remain the same. And you already get significantly less of an experience for the money. That's hardly justification for even further cuts.

I was there over Independence Day and they were available in afternoon as I said, and I did saw other reports stating just the same but as I said you are free not to believe me.
As for getting less for your money, I do not think that you are getting less considering what you pay and you are free to go during other times. I spend more just to be able to see Independence Day fireworks, my choice and I did EMH only one day, my choice again, I did not ask to return my money even so I paid for the perk. Nobody is forcing anyone to stay when park hours are shorter, your choice, nothing else.

 

[wookiebeck]

Result:
Save 4 hours out of 350 in on-line CM wages (some in overtime) per week, across the board.

That is a rough wages savings of ONE-point-one percent. (.011) or (1.1%)

Is this the kind of powerful cost-cutting that will "make or break" the bottom line for Disney Parks?

It sure can be. Execs and stockholder's next question is "1.1% of what number?" (Example only) weekly wages for 5000 CM's at $10/hr equals $2Million (did not research these numbers, feel free to plug in better ones if you know them). Then 1% saves $20k per week or $1Million per year!

Bean counters know exactly what one hour of labor and overhead (electricity, AC, etc.) costs. Cut four of those hours off each week and the savings goes straight to the bottom line (or to help finance FLE, however you want to look at it).

 

[TLSnell1981]

.

And how far is the "you get what you pay for" argument supposed to go? You only pay less for one element of the vacation - room rates - while park tickets and other costs remain the same. And you already get significantly less of an experience for the money. That's hardly justification for even further cuts.

And with DVC...the difference is just a few points a day, except Christmas and Easter.

 

[Robo]

It sure can be. Execs and stockholder's next question is "1.1% of what number?" (Example only) weekly wages for 5000 CM's at $10/hr equals $2Million (did not research these numbers, feel free to plug in better ones if you know them). Then 1% saves $20k per week or $1Million per year!

Bean counters know exactly what one hour of labor and overhead (electricity, AC, etc.) costs. Cut four of those hours off each week and the savings goes straight to the bottom line (or to help finance FLE, however you want to look at it).

If you want to look at that figure, bring in the TOTAL amount paid in this category, vs. the "savings."
The figure is insignificant.

That's why percentages are much better for comparison than "numbers."

If a retailer offered up a "sale" of 1.1% Off, I'd not walk across the street to
take advantage.

It's piffle.

 

[KellyNY]

If you want to look at that figure, bring in the TOTAL amount paid in this category, vs. the "savings."
The figure is insignificant.

That's why percentages are much better for comparison than "numbers."

If a retailer offered up a "sale" of 1.1% Off, I'd not walk across the street to
take advantage.

It's piffle.

When they work on projects they pay number not % so what they save is pretty significant. And if you want speak % then what is % of onsite guests even use emh, and what % stay for 3rd hour any season, and what % will actually get upset to the point of leaving offsite.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

If you want to look at that figure, bring in the TOTAL amount paid in this category, vs. the "savings."
The figure is insignificant.

That's why percentages are much better for comparison than "numbers."

If a retailer offered up a "sale" of 1.1% Off, I'd not walk across the street to
take advantage.

It's piffle.

So are you saying you think it is for cost cutting reasons or it isn't?

And if it isn't, then why? Maintenance issues?

 

[Robo]

So are you saying you think it is for cost cutting reasons or it isn't?

And if it isn't, then why? Maintenance issues?

I can guess, based on years of seeing these kind of things
happen in multiple businesses.
It can be quite disruptive, if not downright destructive.

A management decision that appears (on the surface) to be
significant for "saving" without much customer "disappointment."

-They also calculated this kind of move with the early monorail closures.
It didn't go over so well with guests.
In fact, they made some reversals.

- I've seen corporate middle management's go-to plan
of "do something... do ANYTHING" for decades.
No stretch of the imagination, there.

My calculations:
Disney has decided to cut the parks being open by 3-4 hours a week.
Divide that by the average posted number of hours they are open in a week,
and you've got a percentage number.
Granted it's rough, but give-or-take, it's close enough.

It's a savings to Disney in staff and on-line attraction operations of roughly 1.1%
(One and one tenth percent) per week.

But-
This is a direct loss for the on-property GUESTS (the EMH perk) of
about 21% cut, if you count AM EMH
about 30% cut, if you count only PM EMH (and many guests ONLY do PM EMH.)


The actual IDEA of EMH was to offer "fewer guests in the park."
That IS what EMH is all about.
It's the reason they could market it as a benefit to resort guests.

So, they DO operate EMH with fewer guests.
(And, have done so for literally years.)
Then, somebody ELSE (who likely was not IN on the creation of EMH)
looks and sees... fewer guests in the park!

"Shazam!... I could save some money here!"

And, the original idea is lost in the shuffle.


How many of us have not seen many of those kind of things happen
where we work?

Some new policy that we watched being formulated
comes IN...
Works just fine for X years...
Change managers...
"Why do we need that?"
Bang! Policy's gone.

Shame.

 

[KellyNY]

I can guess, based on years of seeing these kind of things
happen in multiple businesses.
It can be quite disruptive, if not downright destructive.

A management decision that appears (on the surface) to be
significant for "saving" without much customer "disappointment."

-They also calculated this kind of move with the early monorail closures.
It didn't go over so well with guests.
In fact, they made some reversals.

- I've seen corporate middle management's go-to plan
of "do something... do ANYTHING" for decades.
No stretch of the imagination, there.

My calculations:
Disney has decided to cut the parks being open by 3-4 hours a week.
Divide that by the average posted number of hours they are open in a week,
and you've got a percentage number.
Granted it's rough, but give-or-take, it's close enough.

It's a savings to Disney in staff and on-line attraction operations of roughly 1.1%
(One and one tenth percent) per week.

But-
This is a direct loss for the on-property GUESTS (the EMH perk) of
about 21% cut, if you count AM EMH
about 30% cut, if you count only PM EMH (and many guests ONLY do PM EMH.)

The actual IDEA of EMH was to offer "fewer guests in the park."
That IS what EMH is all about.
It's the reason they could market it as a benefit to resort guests.

So, they DO operate EMH with fewer guests.
(And, have done so for literally years.)
Then, somebody ELSE (who likely was not IN on the creation of EMH)
looks and sees... fewer guests in the park!

"Shazam!... I could save some money here!"

And, the original idea is lost in the shuffle.

How many of us have not seen many of those kind of things happen
where we work?

Some new policy that we watched being formulated
comes IN...
Works just fine for X years...
Change managers...
"Why do we need that?"
Bang! Policy's gone.

Shame.

Sorry not buying cutting to just cut, they also have years and years of experience and also data available to know how many actually use those hours. And emh is to let onsite use park without offsite, not to operate for tiny %. If not enough use it, there is simply no need. It may upset those who use 3rd hour but strictly from this thread many of them totally agree it is waste and only few actually claimed they will leave.

 

[Robo]

If EMH ends before midnight, there is no difference in crowd levels. It's when they range into the 1am, 2 and 3am time that you see a measurable decline in crowd levels.

Those last late hours (that we personally love) are now being cut.

The raison d'être of EMH.

 

[mom2rtk]

You are free to believe whatever you want, every time someone posts about longer availability, some just disreagard it as anecdotal stories, so what is the point for me to waste my time. I saw those reports, you did not, OK then. If someone wants to keep running to TSM at RD to get a FP, up to them. Just wish I did not listen to horror FP stories before my trip, 3days of RD were absolutely not needed for my family.

Sorry but I travel only in the off season. And I have never seen a TSMM FP available at 3 or 4 in the afternoon. Same for Soarin.

And your experience the week after Labor Day is not indicative of anything across the board. That is probably the single slowest week of the year.

We have been in September, October, November, December and January. I have yet to encounter an empty park without lines.

 

[stitchrulz]

We've always gone in September (except one year in November), and many times the wait for Soarin is well north of 60 min. We've actually not done TSM yet because the stand-by wait is always insane, and there's not enough for us personally to do at HS to wait around to use FP. So, it's not like the parks are a ghost town or anything in the off-season. Disney took care of that with "free" dining.

 

[KellyNY]

Sorry but I travel only in the off season. And I have never seen a TSMM FP available at 3 or 4 in the afternoon. Same for Soarin.

And your experience the week after Labor Day is not indicative of anything across the board. That is probably the single slowest week of the year.

We have been in September, October, November, December and January. I have yet to encounter an empty park without lines.

I think you misunderstood my post. I used Labor Day example to tell about my experience with short or no lines but I was not talking about TSM or Soarin. 3-4PM availability for those rides is observation from my Independence Day trip, AKA trip after enforcement. And reports I am talking about are also post March 7. I suggest that during slow times situation may be even better. As for empty parks, September-January has every season mixed up, I do not know when your dates were but there are plenty of reports of short or no lines during value dates.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think you misunderstood my post. I used Labor Day example to tell about my experience with short or no lines but I was not talking about TSM or Soarin. 3-4PM availability for those rides is observation from my Independence Day trip, AKA trip after enforcement. And reports I am talking about are also post March 7. I suggest that during slow times situation may be even better. As for empty parks, September-January has every season mixed up, I do not know when your dates were but there are plenty of reports of short or no lines during value dates.

Sorry, I did misunderstand. You're saying FP's for Soarin and TSMM were available after 3 or 4 PM the week of Independence Day?

And I seek out low crowd times to travel. And I have yet to find the week where there are no lines. All of those months I mentioned have some of the lowest crowd times of the year, and still we wait in lines if we don't use FP.

 

[KellyNY]

Sorry, I did misunderstand. You're saying FP's for Soarin and TSMM were available after 3 or 4 PM the week of Independence Day?

And I seek out low crowd times to travel. And I have yet to find the week where there are no lines. All of those months I mentioned have some of the lowest crowd times of the year, and still we wait in lines if we don't use FP.

After 4pm, not from my experience, they were running out somewhere between 3PM and 4PM, yes the week of Independence Day, who would think it is even possible.
Those months you mentioned do have value seasons but also other seasons, including holiday season. I wonder what your experience will be this year and how it will compare with previous years. After enforcement we did not really have value season yet, will be interesting to see reports.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

According to the TP line app, TSM FP's ran out today around 3pm. There is a report at 2:48pm of 9:10pm FPs.

However, according to same app, Soarin FP's ran out today around noon.

Not too many FP reports today at MK, but Splash was had them for a 7:30pm return at 4:30.

AK had EE FP's only 40 minutes out at 3:30.

 

[mom2rtk]

After 4pm, not from my experience, they were running out somewhere between 3PM and 4PM, yes the week of Independence Day, who would think it is even possible.
Those months you mentioned do have value seasons but also other seasons, including holiday season. I wonder what your experience will be this year and how it will compare with previous years. After enforcement we did not really have value season yet, will be interesting to see reports.

As I said, I seek out low crowd times. So we have never done a peak crowd time. Always a week that is reported to expect low crowds. Never Thanksgiving or Chrstmas. Always the weeks before when kids are still in school (except mine of course...)

All bets are off for this year though. We're going the second week of December, our favorite time to go. The Fantasyland Expansion should be newly open when we go though, so who knows how it will be. My preparation has been to plan our park days and party days carefully to seek out the lowest crowds possible. However, I do know Disney is one step ahead of us. So even though we will be in a recommended park in a fairly slow season, I expect to see lines. Lots of them.

 

[KellyNY]

As I said, I seek out low crowd times. So we have never done a peak crowd time. Always a week that is reported to expect low crowds. Never Thanksgiving or Chrstmas. Always the weeks before when kids are still in school (except mine of course...)

All bets are off for this year though. We're going the second week of December, our favorite time to go. The Fantasyland Expansion should be newly open when we go though, so who knows how it will be. My preparation has been to plan our park days and party days carefully to seek out the lowest crowds possible. However, I do know Disney is one step ahead of us. So even though we will be in a recommended park in a fairly slow season, I expect to see lines. Lots of them.

I guess I misunderstood you this time. Well, it is good that you are expecting worse as then you may be pleasantly surprised or not, who knows, we will see.

 

[Phatoomch]

If you want to look at that figure, bring in the TOTAL amount paid in this category, vs. the "savings."
The figure is insignificant.

That's why percentages are much better for comparison than "numbers."

If a retailer offered up a "sale" of 1.1% Off, I'd not walk across the street to
take advantage.

It's piffle.

If you are going to compare then you need to state what type of retailer. A clothing retailer? Of course I'd cross the road as a couple of bucks off a dress isn't a deal breaker. However, if I were in the market to buy a fancy shmancy boat for 1m then 1.1% would be a deal breaker

For joe public, 1 hour less emh is such a small thing, but for Disney its a deal breaker.