The DIS Dad's Club XII: Oh... There You Are Perry!

[dvczerfs]

Hi guys. Feeling like I'm finally over my "Post Disney Depression" and am feeling up to posting again. And to think, it only took 3 months for the PDD to subside. Hope that ya'll will let me re-activate my membership.

hi greg!!! welcome back!!!

Don't they get health insurance? I know that some can be a lot to put up with, but if you measure it against working at McDonald's, ... My hope is to retire from my current job around 50 and move to Orlando. I could work at WDW for some extra cash and get discounts. It would be a pay cut, but may be worth it.

i watched those clips about working for the mouse, it sounds like they are offered insurance but they have to pay for some or all, it wasnt clear. briana works at mcds. shes not planning on making it her career but she has been there almost two years and she makes $8.75 hour. she is what they call a crew trainer. (she has a title!) she can work in any area in the rest. from counter, drive through, cook, and put the stuff together. these jobs all have fancey names and areas. she is also offered health insurance but she is covered under me. mcds gets a bad wrap but she seems to enjoy it and drives a 2010 colbalt that she paid for on her own. most of her managers were all people who started there as a regular crew member and got promoted with in the rest. briana does like working "behind the wall" anymore, shes getting like her dad. the stories she tells about some of the people that come in. theres a guy who comes in every day, orders the same thing every day. gets his food and opens the wrapper, his pickles have to be laying smoothe on the burger. no wrinkley pickles!!!! he will return it if the pickles are not laying smoothe.

 

[dvczerfs]

hay, dont look now but those phab. phighting phillies are beating the mets!!!!! wahooooooo!!!! there bustin this baby wide open!!!!! bring on the yankees!!!!!! they will be lucky to get out of the first round! more of my tax money at work.

 

[DisDadDoc]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Hi Chris --

You are asking that our boys behave at a higher standard because they are scouts. OK, I agree with that objective. But, are current behaviors outside what is normal for 11-17 year old boys? You are expert in these areas, but my experience is that boys this age are not nice to each other. As we press the Scout Law, we are swimming against the current. Isn't that the underlying foundation of Boy Scouts?

That doesn't mean that I am giving up. Just the opposite ... we press the Scout Law so that as boys mature it will be part of their make-up. And, maybe we help some boys mature earlier.

But, we are dealing with natural behaviors. Cub Scout parents need to hear that there is nothing abnormal about the boys in Troop XXX. This troop should have a positive reputation because we clearly center around the Scout Law, and provide tons of opportunities for boys to practice it. Aim for the higher standard, but let's not allow negative talk because we aren't to that lofty, magical place.

Reputation still out there? Many Cub Scout parents haven't dealt with teenage boys yet, and don't know what's typical. Our response needs to be clear that Troop XXX boys are not abnormal. In fact, most of them are better than normal. Very few of them are "worse" than normal.
Physical acts that intimidate younger scouts: I absolutely need to know about this, and I need to address this immediately.
Verbal acts that intimidate younger scouts: I need to know some specifics, and we need to judge if it's talk beyond what's normal. Again ... I will continue working to have all the boys be nice. But, I don't think we should tolerate that Boy Scouts acting like normal boys gets chatted up around Avon as if Troop XXX is a bunch of bullies.
Ridicule, Harass, Humiliate: I need to know if any of these things happen outside what's normal teasing ... and certainly anything that is physical or threatening.

We now have new patrol alignment and new patrol leaders (actually, several repeating PLs which is a great thing). Patrol Leader training will be scheduled, with behavior as an important topic.

We will plan to frequently break into patrol sessions. I agree it's more productive.

[District Trainer] ... have you met him? I doubt that he is the answer.

Assistant Scoutmasters in the Patrol Advisor role ... we continue to define this role and ASMs are gradually embracing it. The continuity of some PLs with their Patrol Advisors may help move this along.

Let me know if you have other suggestions, observations, concerns.

 

[wasnotafan]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Sorry to say, I think you assessed it properly. Hang tough for the sake of your Cubs. Bullying is not uncommon, but it is not normal behavior and should not be tolerated.

 

[AirGoofy]

i watched those clips about working for the mouse, it sounds like they are offered insurance but they have to pay for some or all, it wasnt clear. briana works at mcds. shes not planning on making it her career but she has been there almost two years and she makes $8.75 hour. she is what they call a crew trainer. (she has a title!) she can work in any area in the rest. from counter, drive through, cook, and put the stuff together. these jobs all have fancey names and areas. she is also offered health insurance but she is covered under me. mcds gets a bad wrap but she seems to enjoy it ...

That's good to know. I didn't know they offered health insurance. I know there is a difference between the franchise owned and the coorporate owned in what they offer and can do for their employees and customers. I wasn't intending to pick on McDonald's, I was just going for another big employer.

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

But, we are dealing with natural behaviors. I need to know if any of these things happen outside what's normal teasing.

I removed all his crap and summarized his response. As I speculated before, clearly, he believes that these behaviors are a normal passage of life for children. I understand a certain amount of hazing goes into joining a fraternity and can only guess about how a police SWAT or military squad would go about assimilating new members. But, those are adult groups. Why do children have to be teased to be scout members? I have never been a scout so am not sure what is required, but I do not think that is an acceptable form of child/group development. You are not going to change his opinion.

 

[dvczerfs]

That's good to know. I didn't know they offered health insurance. I know there is a difference between the franchise owned and the coorporate owned in what they offer and can do for their employees and customers. I wasn't intending to pick on McDonald's, I was just going for another big employer.



I removed all his crap and summarized his response. As I speculated before, clearly, he believes that these behaviors are a normal passage of life for children. I understand a certain amount of hazing goes into joining a fraternity and can only guess about how a police SWAT or military squad would go about assimilating new members. But, those are adult groups. Why do children have to be teased to be scout members? I have never been a scout so am not sure what is required, but I do not think that is an acceptable form of child/group development. You are not going to change his opinion.

why not, we pick on her all the time! want fries with that! than she says,"ya, what year is the car you drive." than i say i could afford a limo and a driver if we didnt have a kid.

 

[dvczerfs]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Hi Chris --

You are asking that our boys behave at a higher standard because they are scouts. OK, I agree with that objective. But, are current behaviors outside what is normal for 11-17 year old boys? You are expert in these areas, but my experience is that boys this age are not nice to each other. As we press the Scout Law, we are swimming against the current. Isn't that the underlying foundation of Boy Scouts?

That doesn't mean that I am giving up. Just the opposite ... we press the Scout Law so that as boys mature it will be part of their make-up. And, maybe we help some boys mature earlier.

But, we are dealing with natural behaviors. Cub Scout parents need to hear that there is nothing abnormal about the boys in Troop XXX. This troop should have a positive reputation because we clearly center around the Scout Law, and provide tons of opportunities for boys to practice it. Aim for the higher standard, but let's not allow negative talk because we aren't to that lofty, magical place.

Reputation still out there? Many Cub Scout parents haven't dealt with teenage boys yet, and don't know what's typical. Our response needs to be clear that Troop XXX boys are not abnormal. In fact, most of them are better than normal. Very few of them are "worse" than normal.
Physical acts that intimidate younger scouts: I absolutely need to know about this, and I need to address this immediately.
Verbal acts that intimidate younger scouts: I need to know some specifics, and we need to judge if it's talk beyond what's normal. Again ... I will continue working to have all the boys be nice. But, I don't think we should tolerate that Boy Scouts acting like normal boys gets chatted up around Avon as if Troop XXX is a bunch of bullies.
Ridicule, Harass, Humiliate: I need to know if any of these things happen outside what's normal teasing ... and certainly anything that is physical or threatening.

We now have new patrol alignment and new patrol leaders (actually, several repeating PLs which is a great thing). Patrol Leader training will be scheduled, with behavior as an important topic.

We will plan to frequently break into patrol sessions. I agree it's more productive.

[District Trainer] ... have you met him? I doubt that he is the answer.

Assistant Scoutmasters in the Patrol Advisor role ... we continue to define this role and ASMs are gradually embracing it. The continuity of some PLs with their Patrol Advisors may help move this along.

Let me know if you have other suggestions, observations, concerns.

you hit the nail on the head there doc. i like the part about the cub parents havnt dealt with teenage boys. i guess the cub dads were born into this world as an adult and was never 11-17 boy themselves. much less to know what is right and wrong. when i was 15 and you picked on someone younger than you, you got picked on for picking on someone younger than you.

 

[twokids0204]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Sometimes it's like pissing in the wind.

 

[dvczerfs]

Sometimes it's like pissing in the wind.

 

[DisDr.]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Hi Chris --

You are asking that our boys behave at a higher standard because they are scouts. OK, I agree with that objective. But, are current behaviors outside what is normal for 11-17 year old boys? You are expert in these areas, but my experience is that boys this age are not nice to each other. As we press the Scout Law, we are swimming against the current. Isn't that the underlying foundation of Boy Scouts?

That doesn't mean that I am giving up. Just the opposite ... we press the Scout Law so that as boys mature it will be part of their make-up. And, maybe we help some boys mature earlier.

But, we are dealing with natural behaviors. Cub Scout parents need to hear that there is nothing abnormal about the boys in Troop XXX. This troop should have a positive reputation because we clearly center around the Scout Law, and provide tons of opportunities for boys to practice it. Aim for the higher standard, but let's not allow negative talk because we aren't to that lofty, magical place.

Reputation still out there? Many Cub Scout parents haven't dealt with teenage boys yet, and don't know what's typical. Our response needs to be clear that Troop XXX boys are not abnormal. In fact, most of them are better than normal. Very few of them are "worse" than normal.
Physical acts that intimidate younger scouts: I absolutely need to know about this, and I need to address this immediately.
Verbal acts that intimidate younger scouts: I need to know some specifics, and we need to judge if it's talk beyond what's normal. Again ... I will continue working to have all the boys be nice. But, I don't think we should tolerate that Boy Scouts acting like normal boys gets chatted up around Avon as if Troop XXX is a bunch of bullies.
Ridicule, Harass, Humiliate: I need to know if any of these things happen outside what's normal teasing ... and certainly anything that is physical or threatening.

We now have new patrol alignment and new patrol leaders (actually, several repeating PLs which is a great thing). Patrol Leader training will be scheduled, with behavior as an important topic.

We will plan to frequently break into patrol sessions. I agree it's more productive.

[District Trainer] ... have you met him? I doubt that he is the answer.

Assistant Scoutmasters in the Patrol Advisor role ... we continue to define this role and ASMs are gradually embracing it. The continuity of some PLs with their Patrol Advisors may help move this along.

Let me know if you have other suggestions, observations, concerns.

Chris,
Sorry your having to deal with this without much support. I don't suppose it would do any good to approach this from a legal standpoint? You touched on the legal definition of bullying... I would have concerns that if the bullying continued or escalated, there could be a potential liability for the pack. I am not a lawyer... but parents can be litigious especially if their child is harmed or they think the boy scouts have deep pockets.

Also... I totally agree with you that there should be zero tolerance within the pack for bullying. Other "boys will be boys" behaviors are not tolerated (smoking, drinking, etc.) and neither should this.

Overall, the boys should have respect for each other and the pack/troop and live up to the higher standard.
Best of luck.

 

[DisDadDoc]

Chris,
Sorry your having to deal with this without much support. I don't suppose it would do any good to approach this from a legal standpoint? You touched on the legal definition of bullying... I would have concerns that if the bullying continued or escalated, there could be a potential liability for the pack. I am not a lawyer... but parents can be litigious especially if their child is harmed or they think the boy scouts have deep pockets.

Also... I totally agree with you that there should be zero tolerance within the pack for bullying. Other "boys will be boys" behaviors are not tolerated (smoking, drinking, etc.) and neither should this.

Overall, the boys should have respect for each other and the pack/troop and live up to the higher standard.
Best of luck.

Thanks for your support guys! Actually, Phil, since I have no leadership in the Troop, it's not something I need to worry about, but the legal aspect may explain his defensiveness..

 

[RodBelding]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

[/I]

Sometimes it's like pissing in the wind.

Thanks for your support guys! Actually, Phil, since I have no leadership in the Troop, it's not something I need to worry about, but the legal aspect may explain his defensiveness..

Chris, if you want we could probably get a group of 4-5 disdads together and just bully this guy ourselves to show him what it really is? I'm sure we'd cut an imposing figure rolling up to his house in a minivan with mickey ear antennas, all piling out with fistfuls of bacon... Just a thought...

 

[GoHerd1028]

Chris, if you want we could probably get a group of 4-5 disdads together and just bully this guy ourselves to show him what it really is? I'm sure we'd cut an imposing figure rolling up to his house in a minivan with mickey ear antennas, all piling out with fistfuls of bacon... Just a thought...

Great Idea! I'm in!

 

[DisDadDoc]

Chris, if you want we could probably get a group of 4-5 disdads together and just bully this guy ourselves to show him what it really is? I'm sure we'd cut an imposing figure rolling up to his house in a minivan with mickey ear antennas, all piling out with fistfuls of bacon... Just a thought...

Thanks, guys. I could take him, but that would be proving the other side of the argument...

 

[RodBelding]

Great Idea! I'm in!

Thanks, guys. I could take him, but that would be proving the other side of the argument...

Can we still ride around in a minivan with fists full of bacon?

 

[DisDadDoc]

Can we still ride around in a minivan with fists full of bacon?

Yes!

 

[Disney Commando]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

Hi Chris --

You are asking that our boys behave at a higher standard because they are scouts. OK, I agree with that objective. But, are current behaviors outside what is normal for 11-17 year old boys? You are expert in these areas, but my experience is that boys this age are not nice to each other. As we press the Scout Law, we are swimming against the current. Isn't that the underlying foundation of Boy Scouts?

That doesn't mean that I am giving up. Just the opposite ... we press the Scout Law so that as boys mature it will be part of their make-up. And, maybe we help some boys mature earlier.

But, we are dealing with natural behaviors. Cub Scout parents need to hear that there is nothing abnormal about the boys in Troop XXX. This troop should have a positive reputation because we clearly center around the Scout Law, and provide tons of opportunities for boys to practice it. Aim for the higher standard, but let's not allow negative talk because we aren't to that lofty, magical place.

Reputation still out there? Many Cub Scout parents haven't dealt with teenage boys yet, and don't know what's typical. Our response needs to be clear that Troop XXX boys are not abnormal. In fact, most of them are better than normal. Very few of them are "worse" than normal.
Physical acts that intimidate younger scouts: I absolutely need to know about this, and I need to address this immediately.
Verbal acts that intimidate younger scouts: I need to know some specifics, and we need to judge if it's talk beyond what's normal. Again ... I will continue working to have all the boys be nice. But, I don't think we should tolerate that Boy Scouts acting like normal boys gets chatted up around Avon as if Troop XXX is a bunch of bullies.
Ridicule, Harass, Humiliate: I need to know if any of these things happen outside what's normal teasing ... and certainly anything that is physical or threatening.

We now have new patrol alignment and new patrol leaders (actually, several repeating PLs which is a great thing). Patrol Leader training will be scheduled, with behavior as an important topic.

We will plan to frequently break into patrol sessions. I agree it's more productive.

[District Trainer] ... have you met him? I doubt that he is the answer.

Assistant Scoutmasters in the Patrol Advisor role ... we continue to define this role and ASMs are gradually embracing it. The continuity of some PLs with their Patrol Advisors may help move this along.

Let me know if you have other suggestions, observations, concerns.

This Guy is a piece of work, he really dosen't care and is not showing leadership, Since Christopher has all the letters he sent and all the letters recieved, what I would suggest is to forward them to someone a few levels up above this guy who has more responsiblity and see what he thinks about the situation As of now if something happened to one of the kids in the troop on this matter, the higher ups are accountible in a lawsuit since no action was taken

If you get in touch with someone a couple levels higher I think you might see a total turn around in the matter, unless this guy is just that dence

 

[RodBelding]

Yes!

Awesome. I'm good then!




Just some humor to lighten the mood... I don't envy your position Chris. But you are fighting the right fight, and the scouts who benefit from your concern are lucky to have you in their corner.

 

[BigTikiDaddy]

My Scoutmasters Response. Thoughts? This is as close to "shut the f*ck up" as we get in Connecticut. Don't think it is going to have the effect that he desired...

This is really sad. Sooner or later something ugly is going to happen, and it sounds like then and only then will this guy take action, when it is too late.

 

[dvczerfs]

anyone else cant sleep because they are leaving for wdw in 22 hours , 45 min.???