Your thoughts on DVC

[salmoneous]

If you look at the purchase price of DVC for the minimum 160 points, along with dues over the next 20 years, you would spend over $32,000 in that time.

If you were to take the present day cost of staying at a Disney Value resort, for 8 nights per year, factor in a 4% increase each year, in 20 years you would spend less than $24,000.

While I agree with much of what you are saying in this thread, you've set up an unequal comparison.

Those 160 points that will cost you $32,000 could put you in an OKW studio for 12 nights a year. If 8 nights at a value will cost you $24,000, then 12 nights should cost $36,000, no?

 

[tidefan]

And you are exactly correct on that one. If you choose to stay in values or moderates most of the time, DVC just might not be right for you. You'll spend more on the DVC purchase and members' fees than you probably would on that moderate or value resort.

Not to throw in my .02, but I made quite a few spreadsheets comparing DVC back before we bought in this April. We ended up buying 200 SSR points. However, our take wasn't that we were necessarily "saving" money on a Disney stay, per se, but rather that we were staying in a Deluxe resort for a price that worked out to be somewhere between a Value and a Moderate (I think that in my most realistic spreadsheet, I came out to a current $ value of about $133 per night, which is right smack between the cost of a value and a moderate. Plus, they threw in an extra year's worth of points in the end which will make that figure even lower).

So, I looked at my CSR stay and figured that for a little less $$ per trip, I could be staying in a nicer place (not that CSR was bad or anything, we liked it, but we liked SSR even better!). Also, the other small thing that I really liked is having a couch in the room. I am not big on sitting on a bed to watch TV or relax...

So I guess I don't really look at it as savings, per se, but rather that I get more for my money. I wholeheartedly agree however, that if you always go in September and/or if you always stay in Values and you love those, then DVC isn't as good a bargain. But for me, who loved the Moderates, I found that it was indeed worthwhile.

 

[salmoneous]

2.There are a few DVC members who make it seem as though the only way to enjoy a Disney vacation and have it make sense is to be a member.

In all honestly, I've never seen this. I think DVC owners, as a general rule, are very quick to point out reasons why DVC isn't for everyone.

 

[Luv2trav]

In all honestly, I've never seen this. I think DVC owers, as a general rule, are very quick to point out reasons why DVC isn't for everyone.

I agree... In fact many of them have almost talked me out of joining... They really do not sugar coat what you are actually buying. I appreciate that from them because it has made me think logically and not emotionally.

 

[tidefan]

One other thing that makes a difference. Maintenence Fees differ by DVC resort. SSR's are $4.12 per point and AKV's are $4.62 per point. One factor in our buying SSR (though we like it just as much, if not more than AKL\AKV - I love me some golf...) was that for our 200 points, that $0.50 difference in MF per year worked out that we spend $100 less in MF's per year than if we had bought AKV. So the point here is that you need to take into consideration which DVC you buy into the cost analysis as well. It makes a difference...

 

[tinawv]

i do - and most all of them have better sense than to try to act like experts when they are ignorant of even the basic facts.

i'm glad you're choosing to stop trying to confuse people who sincerely want to learn about DVC...so long.

Not very nice.

 

[ChelleinNC]

We are new DVC owners as of June. We've been staying on site, deluxes always,some trips concierge. We thought about DVC for a couple of years, we even did the tour at SSR last August. Each time deciding that it was too expensive, or the kids wouldn't want to keep going back.... you name it, we used it as a reason not to buy.
This year we decided to rent points to try it out. I was very skeptical, and I'm the disney nut in our house. I was sure that I wouldn't want a kitchen or laundry to invade my vacation. Well, we stayed 9 nights in a studio at SSR, did the tour again the 1st day and went back 4 days later to sign the papers. We just made sure that we bought enough points to stay in a 1br at least from now on. I don't plan to really cook, but cereal and pb&j for DS will be helpful. I had to do laundry on this last trip anyways and i'm really looking forward to not have to carry it to the pool area and sit by myself for a couple of hours next time.
All in all, you have to do the research, know what your family is likely to do and then make the best decision you can. My biggest regret is waiting, points went from $96 in August to $104 in June.

 

[starbox]

So I guess I don't really look at it as savings, per se, but rather that I get more for my money. I wholeheartedly agree however, that if you always go in September and/or if you always stay in Values and you love those, then DVC isn't as good a bargain. But for me, who loved the Moderates, I found that it was indeed worthwhile.

ITA. I really liked the moderate resorts but hated my one stay at POP prior to joining DVC. Including dues, I spend on DVC what I spent for 10 nights in a mod each year but get alot more and actually own something of value that I could rent or sell if I needed to.

 

[boomhauer]

Those 160 points that will cost you $32,000 could put you in an OKW studio for 12 nights a year. If 8 nights at a value will cost you $24,000, then 12 nights should cost $36,000, no?

But again, we'd be talking about low season, no weekends. If you wanna make the same comaprison with Values, it'd be far less than $36,000, since low season rates are currently $74 per night.

Also, that was based on $91 per point. That price is now up to $104 per point. Also doesn't include finance charges.

 

[chalee94]

But again, we'd be talking about low season, no weekends. If you wanna make the same comaprison with Values, it'd be far less than $36,000, since low season rates are currently $74 per night.

Also, that was based on $91 per point. That price is now up to $104 per point. Also doesn't include finance charges.

well, no...12 nights at OKW in the summer, including 2 weekend nights, is 164 pts.

also, resales are available at SSR in the $81-85 range and at OKW (for fewer years) in the $70-75 range. annual dues at both are fairly low as well...

regardless of all that, we are still basically in agreement on the comparison to value hotels: unless your schedule is flexible enough to avoid weekends completely, you almost certainly will pay more for a DVC studio than a value room...or at least the difference would be minimal enough to discourage making a financial commitment to DVC. (i would also agree that financing is generally not a good idea, BTW.)

OTOH, someone who argues that deluxe rooms are comparable to DVC from a numbers standpoint simply hasn't bothered to look at the numbers. (although i would agree there are nonfinancial reasons to be willing to pay more at deluxes, if the differences are worth it to you.)

i think the comparison with moderates would generally be favorable but you would need to take each case individually to work out the numbers. look at how you generally vacation and compare that to the costs of a contract at DVC that provides for a comparable stay in a studio. (not to mention that while OKW is typically the best value as DVC resorts go, some people aren't fans of the theming or location, and as a result, shouldn't compare its numbers to those of their favorite moderate...if you'd only want to stay at the BWV or VWL, the numbers for owning at those resorts would be slightly different.)

 

[Luv2trav]

Also, that was based on $91 per point. That price is now up to $104 per point. Also doesn't include finance charges.

You can buy resale a lot cheaper than $104 and actually Disney is selling less than $104 if you don't take the free vacation option. As for the financing that is true but how many people finance their Disney trips through CRO?

You keep making comparing Value to DVC and it's not an equal value. Run you numbers for Beach Club Standard room and DVC Beach Club Studio or WL standard and WL Studio and you will see the cost savings.

 

[riggins]

Hi guys-
I’ve been reading through this thread quite a bit over the past few days and I thought it might be helpful to share some actual numbers. We bought 200 BWV points in late 2003. We financed the purchase, but paid it off in 18 months. I have been tracking our costs and savings every month to assess when I “break even.” Every time we use our DVC points for a trip, I calculate what I’m saving based on what I would have spent had I been paying cash. I base that amount on discounts available at the time, NOT the rack rate, and include tax. All our DVC stays have been in 1 or 2 bedroom units. Our cash nights would have been standard view rooms in deluxe resorts. So, while I don’t consider a standard deluxe room comparable to a DVC 1 or 2 bedroom villa, it is an actual comparison of what I would have spent. Here are my numbers:

2003:
Principal/Interest/Dues: $5,785.81
Savings: $0

2004:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $9,343.72
Savings: $4,478.68

2005:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $2,486.12
Savings: $2,902.50

2006:
Dues: $938.04
Savings: $2,475.16

2007:
Dues: $976.88
Savings: $3,635.38

Total to Date:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $19,503.57
Savings: $13,491.72

So, after 4 years, I am behind $6,011.85. I expect I will break-even and start to be ahead in 3-4 more years.

Like I said, I’m sharing this info because it’s an accurate reflection of how the financial aspect of DVC has played out for my family and may help paint a picture for how it may or may not work for your family.

All this said, we bought DVC because we no longer wanted to stay in a “regular” hotel room. We wanted the space of a 1 or 2 bedroom villa and DVC is clearly the most affordable way to do that. So, while there certainly was a financial factor in our decision, it was based much more on the type of accommodations we wanted, rather than the costs. For us, we are thrilled with our DVC purchase and it’s been great for my family. But, as others have articulated very well, it’s not for everyone.

Good Luck!
Leslie

 

[boomhauer]

You keep making comparing Value to DVC and it's not an equal value. Run you numbers for Beach Club Standard room and DVC Beach Club Studio or WL standard and WL Studio and you will see the cost savings.

I know that. No denying that, and I've said that in agreement. The more I run the numbers, you can actually compare a moderate to DVC and save money too.

I don't think anyone would deny, DVC is less expensive than the same amount of nights in a deluxe. And honestly, that's just who DVC was designed for.

 

[Luv2trav]

Hi guys-
I’ve been reading through this thread quite a bit over the past few days and I thought it might be helpful to share some actual numbers. We bought 200 BWV points in late 2003. We financed the purchase, but paid it off in 18 months. I have been tracking our costs and savings every month to assess when I “break even.” Every time we use our DVC points for a trip, I calculate what I’m saving based on what I would have spent had I been paying cash. I base that amount on discounts available at the time, NOT the rack rate, and include tax. All our DVC stays have been in 1 or 2 bedroom units. Our cash nights would have been standard view rooms in deluxe resorts. So, while I don’t consider a standard deluxe room comparable to a DVC 1 or 2 bedroom villa, it is an actual comparison of what I would have spent. Here are my numbers:

2003:
Principal/Interest/Dues: $5,785.81
Savings: $0

2004:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $9,343.72
Savings: $4,478.68

2005:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $2,486.12
Savings: $2,902.50

2006:
Dues: $938.04
Savings: $2,475.16

2007:
Dues: $976.88
Savings: $3,635.38

Total to Date:
Principle/Interest/Dues: $19,503.57
Savings: $13,491.72

So, after 4 years, I am behind $6,011.85. I expect I will break-even and start to be ahead in 3-4 more years.

Like I said, I’m sharing this info because it’s an accurate reflection of how the financial aspect of DVC has played out for my family and may help paint a picture for how it may or may not work for your family.

All this said, we bought DVC because we no longer wanted to stay in a “regular” hotel room. We wanted the space of a 1 or 2 bedroom villa and DVC is clearly the most affordable way to do that. So, while there certainly was a financial factor in our decision, it was based much more on the type of accommodations we wanted, rather than the costs. For us, we are thrilled with our DVC purchase and it’s been great for my family. But, as others have articulated very well, it’s not for everyone.

Good Luck!
Leslie

You are close to breaking even however if you were to sell right now you would more than break even.

When I look at buying DVC I would hope to keep it forever but realistically we are looking to keep it around 10-15 years and possibly selling... Therefore getting some of our initial money back.

 

[salmoneous]

But again, we'd be talking about low season, no weekends. If you wanna make the same comaprison with Values, it'd be far less than $36,000, since low season rates are currently $74 per night.

Also, that was based on $91 per point. That price is now up to $104 per point. Also doesn't include finance charges.

Actually, no, that's not based on low season, no weekends. Including a weekend, Dream Season - the third priciest - gets you 12 days in an OKW studio for 148 points. Magic Season - the second most expensive, costs 164 points for those 12 days (again, including two weekend nights.) You are using $99/night for the value, which is the rate for Regular, the second cheapest.

Look, as I said, I agree with your main point - one of the many groups for whom DVC isn't appropriate are folks who are happy in Values. But I'm too much of a numbers geek to not comment on mismatched examples. 8 days in a Value at Regular Season isn't a fair comparison to 160 DVC points.

 

[G8RFAN]

I don't think throwing in financing charges for DVC would be a good comparison to determine value as that is an option to obtain the "capital" to acquire DVC and not a function of DVC value itself. It's just like saying anyone buying a Deluxe accomodation thru CRO using their credit card may or may not have interest on the purchase depending on their fiscal discipline. It has to be emphasized that DVC is not an investment. Vacation expenses are discretionary and in numbers alone can never be justified over sticking the same amount of money in a mutual fund. Those that try to overthink a DVC purchase and throw in opportunity cost, etc. are not thinking of the true spirit of vacation and why we spend our hard earned money on them.

 

[pilferk]

Those were our big questions before we took the plunge. Sure, there are those that will tell you you might do better keeping all of that $$ in stocks and earning the interest, and they might be right.

Mousesavers has a great breakout of opportunity costs (investing vs using the money for DVC), though it's a couple years old:

http://www.mousesavers.com/dvc.html

You can fiddle with the numbers used in the spreadhseet here:
http://www.mousesavers.com/DVCvsCash.xls

But the break even point on opportunity cost ($1200 vs 150 DVC points, for example), when looking at the points you'd need for similar rooms, is pretty low, depending on how you stay and use your points.

 

[mprewitt]

FYI. Someone posted an Excel spreadsheet where you can key in how much you spend per year on your hotel fees, and then a certain number of points, the purchase price, and maintenance fees. It then shows you how many years it takes to break even, and how much you'll save with DVC over the long haul.

It's posted on the DVC board on the PassPorter boards.

 

[pilferk]

FYI. Someone posted an Excel spreadsheet where you can key in how much you spend per year on your hotel fees, and then a certain number of points, the purchase price, and maintenance fees. It then shows you how many years it takes to break even, and how much you'll save with DVC over the long haul.

It's posted on the DVC board on the PassPorter boards.

Heh heh...great minds think alike!

There's a link to just such a spreadsheet in my post above.

 

[ducklite]

In all honestly, I've never seen this. I think DVC owners, as a general rule, are very quick to point out reasons why DVC isn't for everyone.

Agreed. IMHO anyone who normally stays at a value resort, and is content there is not going to see the point of buying DVC. I've always given both sides to the equasion. It's not an "investment" (although we did make a tidy sum when we sold our BCV points 18 months after we bought them, but there's more to that story) and it's definitely not a solid financial decision for a good number of people.

Anne