Yet another teacher rant

[paigevz]

After 30 years, I'll only make about $45,000, so this truly depends on where you live.

I'm in my 12th year and make less than that..........and I work for 10 months.......I also only get paid for 10 months, though my salary is apportioned over 12. I don't "get" 2 months off in summer, I am forced to take an unpaid vacation. I usually do summer school to make up that difference.

In reading through much of this thread (though not the last page), I think there are two posts that are being responded to, and some are mixing up who is responding to whom (who?)?

The first post by the OP was about a teacher who did not treat her daughter nicely. Sorry, no way to take it, if the kid was out, she should get a chance to make up AFTER she returns. The tone didn't really matter, the teacher was wrong to even mildly rebuke the child for not having it done on the first day back.

The post about "teachers are nasty and it's all about them" is the one that I noticed most teachers responding to, and in particular our wonderful spokesperson who first mentioned pay in her post. Several people who replied after her post, seemed to think she was defending that particular teacher. I didn't get that.

I know some teachers don't do well. That's why it's harder for those of us who do. My own child has had some issues with some teachers. But just as someone pointed out that not all teachers are wonderful, well, not all are terrible either. There are supportive people here and out in the world, but the nonsupportive folks are pretty vocal. It's not fair for all of us to be judged based on what some other teachers have done. OP didn't do that, and many others didn't, but some posts definitely seem to be overgeneralizing to the effect that this teacher (and other examples given like her) represent most, if not all, of the teaching profession.

Not true for most teachers!

 

[crs7568]

Hmmm...the title of this thread is "Yet another teacher rant." How many threads do you think we would find entitled "Yet another thread in praise of the hard work done by teachers"? Sorry, but I am totally sick of the constant criticism. And yes, I am a teacher and have been teaching for eleven years. And no, I do not make anywhere near $75,000 per year with a Master's Degree in special education as well as three different teaching certifications. I can deal with the lack of money because I expected that going into the job but the lack of respect is amazing.

 

[MoniqueU]

I am totally in support of teachers as I have four of them for sisters, but I gotta tell you-you have to work in another school district. I have two sisters with masters and one who is well on her way. Now, the one is now a school psychologist, so I don't know how their pay rate compares, but my other sister makes well over $75K a year. And I know you all work hard, but let's keep in mind that she still has several weeks off throughout the year and all summer off. I know about all the extra hours--mom was a teacher too--and I know the day doesn't even end when you finally walk out the door, but $75 K for 9 months a year is not bad.

My MIL retired with a 72k a year pension for the rest of her life. If someone is not happy with their pay maybe they should do like others would and seek out different employment or move districts. You always have the choice of moving on if you feel you are worth more on the open market. It seems to me silly for someone to invest a minimum of 4 years in school for a job they are going to cry about being underpaid for the rest of their lives. If you aren't going to be happy with your salary don't take the job.

That being said back to the original post, my son is in 7th grade. He just had the stomach flu about a month ago and missed 3 days of school. He had some late work he had to make up also. If on going back to school a teacher said the same thing to him while I don't think I would necessarily be pleased I would tell him to laugh it off. It's hardly the end of the world or an earth shattering life event. Far worse things are going to be said to him in the future from potential bosses or co workers.

My oldest daughter has the same "mean" teacher this year that my son did. My neighbors son who is very nice, polite, well mannered and smart lasted less then a week in this particular teachers class due to her teaching style. I know her reputation among other parents and I am sure her teaching style is not as cozy as other teachers. You know what? That's life. Life is not always full of warm fuzzies. I was shocked when I heard my neighbors pulled their son from her class. I want my kids to learn how to deal with all sorts of personalities and teaching styles. My son never complained about this particular teacher and neither has my daughter. It would not get them far in our house.

 

[paigevz]

Sorry that teacher is such an inconsiderate person.

DS knows how I feel about his teacher. He did say she's a "new" teacher as in fresh out of school. Guess that must be it. But from time to time he comes home with a "demerit" which I have to sign. Not just this teacher but sometimes another. What the heck is with demerits????? Does it matter to me if he had two occasions of not handing in a test that I've signed? A demerit slip because he forgot his planner? Geez! That's ridiculous. I haven't once seen anything GOOD come home! I'm disgusted with teachers.

Thanks for reminding me. It's been a bit since I sent the "good notes" home, too. I try to do a few a week and touch all the kids who are being responsible and respectful, but I've been busy since coming back from break. I do only have a homeroom class, though, being in second grade. Can't imagine how intermediate/middle/jr. high/senior high teachers can do it. Gotta get back to it!

 

[N.Bailey]

When my son was in 6th grade, his teacher wrote in his student notebook something to the extend of, you've got a darling son. It's such a pleasure to work with him.

In 2nd grade, my daughter's teacher would just say, we love your daughter, every time I'd see her.

Both comments always made me and my children feel good.

I've never been one who needs a pat on the back, but it was nice to hear and read.

EDIT: Oh and on report cards and mid marking papers, the teachers in our district have always said glowing things about the kids. I do think, at least in our experience, they're as quick if not quicker to point out the good.

 

[torinsmom]

Yep, it definintely depends on the school system and state. I have been a teacher for 6 years and I make $33,000. And lets get real. That "time off" is often partially spent in workshops, taking continuing ed classes to keep your license current and preparing for class. I have all of 5 weeks of summer this year before I have to go back for a teacher work week. During my summer, I have to call each of my new students' parents, and talk to them as long as necessary to make them comfortable. This is usually 30-45 min per student x 25 students. I also have to come up with a curriculum for the year, have meetings with special ed students' teams and parents, and coordinate with my co-teacher over the forementioned items.

During the school year, my hours are officially M-F 8-4. Of course, I don't WORK those hours. I usually get to school between 7 and 7:30 and I work until 5 or later, cleaning the classroom and getting things ready, copying, etc. I am often in on weekends, doing the same thing. It is a non-stop job, if you are a good teacher.

So, why do I continue to do this often thankless job? Because its all I ever wanted to do! I love kids and I love seeing their faces light up when they "get" a concept. I love that I can make a child who doesn't get enough encouragement at home feel like they can do anything they put their mind to. And I love that some of these children will remember me for the rest of their lives, like I remember my good teachers. Teaching is a noble profession, as someone once says. Maybe one day, we will be paid enough,across the board, to be able to support our families.

Now, back to the question at hand. Noone should ever humiliate a child in private or public. Teachers that do that to my child would be confronted in a private conference and if that did not produce results, I would speak to administration. Make sure you let the teacher give his perception of what happened, and be calm in your confrontation. I hope you can get some sort of resolution to this.

Marsha

I am totally in support of teachers as I have four of them for sisters, but I gotta tell you-you have to work in another school district. I have two sisters with masters and one who is well on her way. Now, the one is now a school psychologist, so I don't know how their pay rate compares, but my other sister makes well over $75K a year. And I know you all work hard, but let's keep in mind that she still has several weeks off throughout the year and all summer off. I know about all the extra hours--mom was a teacher too--and I know the day doesn't even end when you finally walk out the door, but $75 K for 9 months a year is not bad.

 

[torinsmom]

I'm sorry you feel this way. I get this from parents when I have to write an incident report. I try not to, but when a child says "I am going to kill the teacher!" over and over or hurts another child, I have no choice but to document it. I don't know about demerits for not turning in assignments? I know I do my best to mention the positive as well to parents. Of course, I work with younger kids and see the parents on a daily basis. I imagine it is harder to develop a relationship when you have to only send notes, etc.

Marsha

Sorry that teacher is such an inconsiderate person.

DS knows how I feel about his teacher. He did say she's a "new" teacher as in fresh out of school. Guess that must be it. But from time to time he comes home with a "demerit" which I have to sign. Not just this teacher but sometimes another. What the heck is with demerits????? Does it matter to me if he had two occasions of not handing in a test that I've signed? A demerit slip because he forgot his planner? Geez! That's ridiculous. I haven't once seen anything GOOD come home! I'm disgusted with teachers.

 

[punkin]

I'm shocked at some of the responses. I am outraged at what one particular teacher did in one particular situation and all of a sudden I am accused of bashing all teachers and my "little angel" is a liar and has me "whipped."

I think maybe some of you should not be teaching if you have so little respect for your students and their parents.

 

[golfgal]

I'm shocked at some of the responses. I am outraged at what one particular teacher did in one particular situation and all of a sudden I am accused of bashing all teachers and my "little angel" is a liar and has me "whipped."

I think maybe some of you should not be teaching if you have so little respect for your students and their parents.

You have completly missed the point of all these posts then. They are saying that kids often exaggerate or don't tell the whole story. Maybe the teacher was making a comment in general to the entire class about kids not turning in homework and it being difficult to get into college without good grades and your DD took it personally. To me, that is a good thing for a teacher to remind 8th graders since they are going to high school and their grades start to count. The point is, you don't have the whole story yet you are willing to jump down this teacher's throat when maybe nothing happened. I am sure your DD felt like the teacher was making a rude comment about her being sick but what if she misunderstood him? If a child came to me and said that they had been vomiting non-stop for 4 days I would wonder why they were not in the hospital. Your comment about the dr saying it was ok because she didn't have diarrhea makes me wonder how often "non-stop" was too because 4 days with no fluids is enough to hospitalize anyone. People tend to embellish things to suit their own needs, plain and simple.

 

[hmp2z]

My MIL retired with a 72k a year pension for the rest of her life. If someone is not happy with their pay maybe they should do like others would and seek out different employment or move districts. You always have the choice of moving on if you feel you are worth more on the open market. It seems to me silly for someone to invest a minimum of 4 years in school for a job they are going to cry about being underpaid for the rest of their lives. If you aren't going to be happy with your salary don't take the job.

Saying that teachers who are unhappy with their pay should move districts is ridiculous. I'm in one of the top paying counties in NC, and I make $34K after 5 years of teaching & a Master's degree. To get pay anywhere near that, I'd have to move to New York, New Jersey, California, etc. (One of the states that actually seems to fund their children's education, as opposed to the vast majority of states in the US). That is a far cry from changing districts, to say that all teachers in the US should move to one of the few states that almost pays them what they're worth. Unfortunately, inadequate funding for schools is a liability of living in the South, where, much as people proclaim their love for children and respect for families, no one puts their money where their mouths are.

And I can absolutely believe that you think it's silly for someone to invest 4-6 years in school for an underpaid job. Many, many other people also believe that someone is only worth what they're paid. Hence the lack of respect for the teaching profession.

Here is my confusion: I read all the time on here about parents professing undying love and devotion to their children. Why, then, is it that these same parents don't stand up and DEMAND that either their state or federal government fund the schools adequately? It's not just the teacher pay: it's abysmally large class sizes, not enough supplies, overcrowding, and all that results from that. Those of you too busy complaining about the teachers and wondering why they can't fix every problem and kiss every boo boo need to think again. We can only kiss a certain number of boo boos every day. When the number of kids we have to keep track of grows into the triple figures, every child will not get the time, attention, care, and love that they need. Do the teachers like brushing off their students? Heck no, we hate it, and it makes us feel horrible. But does it happen? Yes, more often that we care to think about. Would I ever deliberately humiliate a child? Not ever - I'm a teacher because I LOVE children. Would I ever accidentally brush off or rush to judgment because that's all I have time for, and thus inadvertently hurt of humiliate a child? I'm sure. I would feel horrible about it afterwards, but it could definitely happen, even to the best of us. Can you hear my frustration, as someone who knows she's not doing the job the way she wants to be able to do it?

I've taught in schools before with 36 kids in my class, and only 31 desks. I've taught in a trailer with no heat or air conditioning. I've watched my kids shivering and trying to write in a trailer whose thermometer reads 37 degrees (we all wore gloves and hats and coats during the winters). I wonder to myself why, why, why do parents waste so much energy blaming the teachers, for ridiculous, petty things, or for things that are inherent to the kind of crowding that our fellow taxpayers impose upon us. But if everyone had the attitude that underpaid teachers should quit, then who would teach these children?

There is so much research out there that shows that the ideal class size is 8-12 children. Small enough to allow the teacher to know and love them all. Small enough to give the teacher time to breathe before the next crisis begins. Small enough for the kids to form bonds and a community with each other, and to cut down on bullying, teasing, etc. that result from seeing others, not as people, but as just another dorky-looking body. How many of you with children have them in schools with classes this size?

And no, I'm not defending cruel teachers. But I am asking two things: one, that you find out the truth of the matter, before jumping all over the teacher or going behind her back to complain to the principal, because even YOUR child is capable of lying. Two, that you separate the deliberate cruelty of the teacher from the casualties of overcrowded, underfunded schools.

Cheers!
Heather W

 

[Alicnwondrln]

----------------------

My granddaughter is in the second grade right now and she has always had wonderful teachers who clearly go above and beyond.. She's out of school right now for a week because she just had her tonsils and adenoids taken out on Friday and her teacher made a point of sending the work home a week ahead of time so she could work on it a little each night while she was still feeling fine and not in pain recovering from surgery..

All 3 of her teachers have been young and I think that makes a big difference.. The longer teachers teach, the greater the odds of them "burning out" (and probably due to a lot of the guff they have to put up with from parents who think their children do absolutely no wrong).. However, the remark from this teacher was totally uncalled for.. Teachers are not there to embarrass their students and I believe I would speak to her privately about it to be sure that it didn't happen again.. The child was sick - not in Disney World on vacation!

YES YE SYES I aso agree. LAst year ds 6 was in K and had a woman who is set to retires next year she spent the whole year saying he wont sit still, he sucks his thumb sometimes, but xmas she said he would need to stya back. Well we worked with him all year and sent him to first grade anyway. There have been no issues. The first grade teacher is MUCH MUCH younger not much older than me and she is sooo great. I am so grateful to her and how she has helped him. He was alittle gunshy after the way the teacher treated him last year. So I totally agree with Cann about the younger teacher , funny the teachers have such a huge impact on the way kids see school as fun or a chore.

 

[CheshireVal]

Yep, we're the most selfish people around. I only keep teaching so I can keep drawing my big, fat paychecks.
My brother makes more money bartending 5 nights than I make in a month, with my Master's degree. And yet, I wouldn't trade my job for the world, and neither would any of the other teachers I know. Maybe it's because it's all about us, and we enjoy all the glory that comes along with being a teacher. Maybe we enjoy the elevated societal rank or the fact that, with Masters degrees, the taxpayers still see fit to give us a lower salary then the average grocery store assistant manager. Maybe we enjoy the fact that the whiniest, dumbest, trashiest parent in the world, can march into the school demanding a conference and complaining because little Jimmy, who turned in 2 of his 27 assignments this quarter, got an F. Maybe we like the fact that everyone and his brother feels like he's our boss and knows our business best and can tell us what to do and how to do it.
Or maybe, just maybe, we're actually dedicated PROFESSIONALS who take all of this trash and file it in the "not worth our time" category, because we know that we're darn good at what we do, and we love the kids, and even parents like these aren't going to stand in the way of the education that we know these kids can get. Does that mean we don't have bad days, or days when we're feeling poorly ourselves, or days when we wish we had smaller classes so we could get to know each child the way we want to know them? Heck no, but most of us do our best, and if we didn't, we'd go into another, more lucrative field - take your pick - stripper? factory worker? subway driver?
Grrrr... I don't know you or your daughter's deal or how often she calls in sick or whether she does her makeup work when she's out or whether she's got a meanspirited warlock for a teacher or whether she's got a teacher who has to deal with 80-100 children each day (standard fare for a middle school) and doesn't know or have time to know exactly what was wrong with her.
All I know is that I don't believe comments like the one I quoted above are appropriate, and I absolutely believe that such comments are the reason this country is facing a critical teaching shortage. We have difficult enough working situations as it is, and I invite anyone who thinks otherwise to walk into their nearest school with 50% or greater numbers of kids on free & reduced lunch, and spend a week in a classroom.
And, to answer the OP's question about explaining this attitude, how many of you know 80-100 of your coworkers on such a personal basis that you care deeply about each and every one of them and wonder what is happening when they don't show up to work for a day or two? Unfortunately, crowded schools mean that middle/high school teachers don't have time to develop the relationship with children that elementary school teachers can afford. Sad, believe me, it saddens us, too, but until the taxpayers are willing to fund the school system adequately, it's something we're all having to live with.
Cheers!
Heather W

I'm not going to bother to read any of the other posts in this thread, because I don't think I can find one that tops this.

 

[momo3hods]

Ok...let me start my saying....imo you are right to feel this way with this situation. Now, we all know how ridiculous it is for this teacher to say without completing this homework your child will not get into college. But unfortunately there are many, many children who do not complete their homework, and who's parent's do not encourage make-up work. And at the risk of being yelled at, I am gonna say that there are very few people outside of the teaching profession that truly understand what it is like to be a "teacher" in a clasroom setting. It just seems to me, it is extremely hard for a teacher in this day and age to EVER do the RIGHT THING!

I was a teacher before being a parent, you are right on, teachers are rarely supported by parents, even if it means the child was wrong. Now as a parent, my DD knows we stand behind the teacher whenever she has done something wrong.

 

[Alicnwondrln]

us to we totally stand behind mrs B and ds6 knows that
shes the boss at school and we belive in her
ds6 knows this and loves MRs.B next year is gonna be tough

 

[crs7568]

There is a reason for the quote, "There are three sides to every story. Your side, the other person's side, and the truth." Perspective colors everything.

 

[Disney Doll]

Heather, your posts are insightful and amazing, but in this day and age, you are wasting your time trying to convince most parents that their little "darlings" may have an imperfection or two.

In this land of entitlement, everybody wants to know what oyu can do for them. Period. They don't care about the other things you have to deal with (class size, cold classrooms, lack of supplies etc.). Their little angels deserve a superior education, regardless of the pitfalls you face. And their little angels can't possibly have misiniterpretd what the mean old teacher said. And their little angel can't possibly be ::gasp!"" wrong or, even worse, lying. Their little angel doesn't lie.

To the person who knows a teacher who retired with a $72K pension....where did she work????

I live in the Northeast,, an hour or so north of NYC, so a fairly "affluent" area of the country, and I don't know of many teachers around here who make that kind of money.

And BTW, the answer isn't to tell the teacher to "find another job". If every teacher "found another job" because the kids or parents aggravated him/her, then there'd be no teachers, because I have to assume that dealing with 35 kids plus their associated parents, step-parents, legal guardians etc. and all their associated problems has to be a freakin' nightmare.

To the OP...OK, the teacher was cranky and embarassed her. It's not the first time she's been embarassed in her life and it won't be the last. Tell her to chalk it up to a bad day and move on, unless the teacher is constantly behaving this way. Then do something about, but make sure you're ready to hear things that you may not know about your kid.

I like the line "If you don't believe eveything they tell you about me, I won't believe everything they tell me about you". Classic!

 

[declansdad]

I don't think this is a fair statement at all.


Till this time however, I have absolutely nothing but the highest of praises to offer every single teacher my children have had to this point. I have been astounded thru the years at how remarkable teachers in our district are. I could never commend them enough for their efforts and the effects they've had on both of my children. This teacher however does not deserve to stand beside the rest of them!

I think you are missing the point of my statement.

There are some people on these threads that do what you just did. Talk about a particular teacher that you have had a problem with but on the other hand you make sure that you praise those teachers that deserve the praise. Then there are the other people who trash teachers because of their experiences with one or two. The "all teachers are losers" comment for example.

Show me any other profession in North Ameraica that takes the abuse that teachers take. I dont think there is anyone in here that defends teachers that will say all teachers are great but yet there are people who post in here that lump them in together. Should we discuss all professions that way. If we do then all doctors, lawyers, engineers, stay at home parents, clergy, mail carriers etc must be bad.

 

[Nancy]

Unfortunately, inadequate funding for schools is a liability of living in the South, where, much as people proclaim their love for children and respect for families, no one puts their money where their mouths are.



Here is my confusion: I read all the time on here about parents professing undying love and devotion to their children. Why, then, is it that these same parents don't stand up and DEMAND that either their state or federal government fund the schools adequately? It's not just the teacher pay: it's abysmally large class sizes, not enough supplies, overcrowding, and all that results from that.


There is so much research out there that shows that the ideal class size is 8-12 children. Small enough to allow the teacher to know and love them all. Small enough to give the teacher time to breathe before the next crisis begins. Small enough for the kids to form bonds and a community with each other, and to cut down on bullying, teasing, etc. that result from seeing others, not as people, but as just another dorky-looking body. How many of you with children have them in schools with classes this size?


Heather W

Heather, I took some things out of your post becuase I just wanted to address just those topics

I had to jump in here on this one. I think the some of the parents that complain about schools and teachers and want better are all fine and dandy until it effects their pocketbooks. To fund a school properly takes a raise in both state and school taxes and listening to the complaints I hear around my area...no one wants to pay more taxes for education. I have no complaints with my district, most teachers my kids have had have been awesome. (except for the second grade teacher that told me my DD needed to be locked away because she, my daughter, had serious mental problems!)

I'm not sure what people pay in other areas for taxes for school so I don't know what is considered high or low. I know what I pay and I think it is high, but I will pay it so my kids continue to get a decent education, have small class sizes and all the supplies they need. While we don't have as small as sizes as mentioned, most are less than 20 per class.

Now granted, I am in a suburban school district. I know the Buffalo City schools have serious problems, they deal with issues that the suburbs don't, the funding is horrible for the city, but again...the people in New York State are taxed to death...most do not want and can't afford to pay more taxes. So I don't know where the answers are on the funding issues. Wouldn't it be nice if schools could get sponsers, like a big business says we are going be the sponser for XXXX district, name a building after us and we will give you lots of money...just like they do for the sports teams.

 

[Regina]

The second I read your post, I knew that the teacher did this in front of the class instead of speaking to your child privately. That's a shame that your child was embarassed in this manner.

The local paper recently published a sampling of current teacher salaries in my district:

$106,663 - HS Math
$96,543 - Grade 1
$93,425 - HS Science
$92,945 - Special Ed
$92,703 - Special Ed Elementary
$92,703 - Library Media Specialist
$92,383 - Special Ed Elementary

We have 878 teachers. The total salary budget is $53,984,495 which averages to $61,485. There are two internet listings for a Physics and French teacher. The starting salary is $43,000 - $65,000 depending on experience.

If you feel that you're underpaid, move to my district.

 

[Wishing on a star]

It is not necessarily a complete lack of funding.

Per child spending is MORE today than it ever has been.


And, to Punkin, you mentioned that you brought up a specific incident with a specific teacher, and now you have all these blown up and untrue accusations thrown against you.... Welcome to the club!!!! Never incur the wrath of the teachers!!!

They are all perfect you know... and you can never question them.


To the person who says, "can you imagine a thread about any other group that is titled "Yet another ______ rant". I would ask, just why is it that there are so many complaints??? We entrust our children to teachers everyday, but they don't want to be held accountable???? We have no right to question anything????