wwyd-will

[happywanderer2]

ok, here is backstory: my mom passed away recently and I am 1st executor of will and then older brother, who lives nearby. Have 2 other brothers that live out of state. Mom had minimal insurance and a few accts. that almost paid for funeral and other debts. Only other assets are a car and some collectibles.

Problem is car. A few hours before she died she clearly told me she wanted older brother to have car. First problem is I need money from sale of car to clear up the rest of mom's debts. This problem can be solved as older brother is willing to pay amount that would cover rest of mom's debts (but is still a little less than I prob.could get selling car). Second problem is other 2 brothers don't want to do that.

Would you insist that other 2 brothers sign off on title to car and let other brother buy it, or would you sell car (knowing one of mom's last directives to you was to let brother have car-but nothing written down).

Everything has been left to me to do with minimal help from anyone else and frankly I'm getting angry at everyone for their nitpicking. WWYD?

 

[msmayor]

I'm not sure the other brothers have any say in what happens to the car, or need to sign the title. You, as executor, are charged with dispersing the assets and are most likely the only signature required on that title.

Have you spoken to an attorney about this?

 

[Hannathy]

I would sell the car and pay off the debts. Then distribute anything left over from the sale and clearing up the debts equally. Are the collectibles valuable? or just "collectibles" If in the latter category I'd divide them up equally as close to cost as I could or if all about the same offer everyone a pick going in order of age. If very valuable have them appraised and then offer them the choice sell and divide money or take one.

A car is not like a family heirloom, you need the money, sell it

Also if it was hours before her death are you sure she was thinking clearly? and did she know she didn't have enough cash to pay her debts? because I doubt she would want to give him the car and then have you have to pay her expenses. Sometimes people aren't aware how much things cost and she may have thought she had it covered and he always liked the car and the other 3 of you never said anything, or are out of state etc.

Sell the car use the money and divide what is left and valuables equally.

 

[tinatark]

Your mom made you executor because she expected you to honor her wishes - if she wanted your older brother to have the car, and he is willing to pay the deficiency amount for her bills, then I think you should honor her wishes.

Not sure why the other brothers would need to sign off on the car title - is it titled in her name only? Joint with you or another? In her name only and an estate asset?

Have you opened probate? It's not totally necessary, in fact not at all if all of her assets have other people's names attached as joint... saves SO much headache when you don't have to, especially with minimal assets.

I would do what she wanted with the car, then if the house is sold, subtract the additional car value (over what your brother paid towards the estate bills) from his share of the proceeds.

If no proceeds from that, then maybe make it fairer for the other brothers by letting them (and you) choose the collectibles they will receive first.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I would tell brother he needs to buy the car for "market value" if he wants the car.

Just because it was your mother's wish to have him get the car does not translate into him getting the car for free.

Your brother is free to turn down the offer and then you are free to sell it private party sale.

 

[tlbwriter]

As executor, your job is to carry out the wishes written in the will. So I think you should sell the car and pay the bills. However, why can't your brother buy the car? It sounds like he wants to get a deal by paying the bills (which are less than the value of the car) instead of paying the value of the car, and I can see why your other brothers would disagree with this. So sell him the car at its true value, use that money to pay the bills, and everyone wins.

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

Everything has been left to me to do with minimal help from anyone else and frankly I'm getting angry at everyone for their nitpicking. WWYD?

I sympathize, trust me.

I would sell the car and pay off the debts.

I agree. Did your mother realize when she said that about the car that there would be a problem with debts? My mother told me a few months ago, in a moment of intense gratitude (for being the only one that did ANYTHING for her), that she wanted me to take everything but her will says "equally 5 ways". Yeah, let me try the "mom SAID..." line on my sibs.

 

[Carly_Roach]

This is sentiment (mother's last wishes) vs. real world facts (not enough money to pay the leftover debts). It is also a no-win situation for you as an executrix. If you follow your mother's wishes by allowing one sibling to pay the debts in return for a car that's valued higher, your other two siblings will squawk. If you follow the best business practice of having your older brother buy the car at blue-book value, he'll squawk.

If I were faced with this dilemma, I'd find a totally impartial third party (most likely someone at Cooley Law School downtown or an estate officer at a bank), get their opinion in writing, and present that opinion to my family stating that this is the way I'm going to handle it. No arguments, no whining, no changing my mind.

It sounds like you're not going to have a solution where everyone is going to be agree and hard feelings are going to occur. Accept that and get on with closing the estate. You're better off following the guidelines written out for your state and protecting your own personal assets.

Or, you could turn over probate to the courts who will likely take a larger bite out with taxes and fees, and let them decide.

I'm very sorry. I wish I had better advice for you.

 

[Hannathy]

Who was there when she said about the car? Did your brother hear it or did you tell him?

AND you may not want to hear this but I have seen it in families if your brother told you he knows Mom said that did he groom her to say that? assets, death and wills do odd things to normally sane people.

I also emphasis that people do not always think clearly as they die in contrast to what they show in the movies. unless it was unexpected and fast like a sudden heart attack or stroke the body is shutting down and the brain often isn't getting enough oxygen and she may not have been thinking I have more debts than money, I need the money from the car to pay for things.
I would tell him I would like to give him the car but it is needed to pay for bills and if he wants to buy it for what I can sell it for or close to it he can but otherwise I need the money. And that you want to be fair for all and do the right thing for everyone.

 

[sbell111]

As I understand the OP's issue, the will divides all assets equally among the four children. The only real asset is the car and there are debts to be paid. The mother verbally stated that she would like the car to go to one brother. The brother would be willing to buy the car for the amount of the debt.

Imagine that the car was worth $1200 dollars and there was $800 debt. Selling the car for market value would result in each of the children inheriting $100. However, if the car is sold to the brother for $800 (the amount of the debt), then he would have increased his assets by $400 and the other chilkdren would receive nothing.

The OP cannot sell the car to the brother for anything less than market value because doing so would increase his share in the estate and decrease the share of the other three individuals. This would be unfair on it's face and violate the terms of the will.

 

[MushyMushy]

I'm so sorry for your loss and the difficult decision you have to face. I'll be facing a similar pickle. My parents have a sum of money being left to an uncle of mine in their will, but my father has told me many many times that he doesn't want me to give it to him. He won't change the will himself because he's afraid my mother will be mad at him when he sees her after he dies. Hey, I don't mind being the bad guy. My mom was always mad at me in life anyway.

Don't you have to do what's legally written in the will vs what was told to you verbally? That's what I assume.

 

[Motherofboys]

Usually it goes something like "follow the terms of the will, which is a signed legal document or risk being sued by the other heirs", under the laws of most states.

And siblings do sue each other, sometimes even over piddly amounts or items. I don't think I would risk it. Sorry you were put in this situation.

 

[happywanderer2]

to clarify--her death was very, very sudden. she had heart problems but thought things were under control-they weren't. she literally died two hours after we had that converstion, on the kitchen floor. I'll never forget this.

but, thank you for your responses to this. I guess I needed to hear some clear thinking. unless I can get my other 2 brothers to agree to my older brother buying the car at the lesser value I will have to insist, if he wants the car, he has to pay list value. The problem is he doesn't have the money, but that will be his problem. Right now I kind of hate my family for putting me through this.

 

[Motherofboys]

to clarify--her death was very, very sudden. she had heart problems but thought things were under control-they weren't. she literally died two hours after we had that converstion, on the kitchen floor. I'll never forget this.

but, thank you for your responses to this. I guess I needed to hear some clear thinking. unless I can get my other 2 brothers to agree to my older brother buying the car at the lesser value I will have to insist, if he wants the car, he has to pay list value. The problem is he doesn't have the money, but that will be his problem. Right now I kind of hate my family for putting me through this.

It's highly likely that your mom put you in charge b/c she knew you would be the most fair and the most honest She had faith in you that you would do a good job, she trusted you. You are trying to do right by all of your brothers and by your mom's wishes -- you can remind your brothers of that fact and that this is a lot of work and stress for you and that they should be grateful that you are doing it.

 

[msmayor]

to clarify--her death was very, very sudden. she had heart problems but thought things were under control-they weren't. she literally died two hours after we had that converstion, on the kitchen floor. I'll never forget this.

but, thank you for your responses to this. I guess I needed to hear some clear thinking. unless I can get my other 2 brothers to agree to my older brother buying the car at the lesser value I will have to insist, if he wants the car, he has to pay list value. The problem is he doesn't have the money, but that will be his problem. Right now I kind of hate my family for putting me through this.

Again, this should be run by someone with knowledge of estate law in your state, but selling that car at less than market value may not even be an option, regardless of what you want to do.

If there are debts to be paid, those must be satisfied first before anything remaining is distributed. If you sell that car at less than market value and it results in debts going unpaid, then those debtors can probably sue the estate and come to you for mis-managing the settlement by selling that car for less than its worth.

The debts need to be satisfied first and foremost with any assets remaining, and as executor you have a duty to ensure that those debts are paid as completely as possible with the assets available.

As badly as you may feel for the brother that cannot afford to pay market value, I don't think you have a choice here. Seek legal advice before making that decision.

 

[ginna74]

Again, this should be run by someone with knowledge of estate law in your state, but selling that car at less than market value may not even be an option, regardless of what you want to do.

If there are debts to be paid, those must be satisfied first before anything remaining is distributed. If you sell that car at less than market value and it results in debts going unpaid, then those debtors can probably sue the estate and come to you for mis-managing the settlement by selling that car for less than its worth.

The debts need to be satisfied first and foremost with any assets remaining, and as executor you have a duty to ensure that those debts are paid as completely as possible with the assets available.

As badly as you may feel for the brother that cannot afford to pay market value, I don't think you have a choice here. Seek legal advice before making that decision.

agree agree!!!

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Legally you will be ripping off the estate by not selling the car at market value.

If your brother is not able to pay for the car then he can't have it.

 

[happywanderer2]

the amount I asked older brother to pay is about $800 less than blue book value, but is the amount that would satisfy all mom's debt and close the book-so to speak. whatever monies are left would be divided by all 4 of us, plus the collectibles-which are not that valuable, mostly sentimental. I thought it was an equitable compromise.

 

[hambirg]

Speak to somebody that knows. It still may be possible to allow the brother the car, say if everyone agrees that the remaining items are then split 3 ways. But get the advice of a professional, that way everything can be fair, legal and above board.

 

[tlbwriter]

the amount I asked older brother to pay is about $800 less than blue book value, but is the amount that would satisfy all mom's debt and close the book-so to speak. whatever monies are left would be divided by all 4 of us, plus the collectibles-which are not that valuable, mostly sentimental. I thought it was an equitable compromise.

It's not exactly equitable - it's giving older brother a gift of $800 that wasn't specified in the will. How much money will be left? Is it possible he could pay the $800 out of that amount?