WWYD- Selling House

[LuLuO]

I think it depends on what the cosmetic problems are. New carpet? Nope. Wall color? Nope. If something is not up to code, it should be fixed. But code issues are not the same as cosmetic issues, IMO.

We are buying a house. The inspector pointed out a few things we didn't notice- one being a couple holes in the siding, probably from rocks thrown by the mower, and there's a ripple where they put a grill too close to the house. Another was some side pieces (i dont know what its called) missing up by roof. Neither things will cause any damage structurally, but are things we did not notice.

To a PP that mentioned GFIs by sink- that's not up to code and should be fixed by seller.

Yes. Of course you are right. It's been a long time. I wanted specific GFI outlets and my brother is an electrician so I preferred that he put them in.

 

[tvguy]

You mean you did agree to pay for the last modifications to the garage that the buyer/contractor wanted?

No we did not. We did the legally required repairs to dry rot in one bathroom and told him no on the addition changes, because the code violations are not visible. Only someone who saw, or did the additional would know they were there, and HE was the one who built the addition. But it was a Probate sale, and Probate sale disclosure rules are different. DW hadn't lived in the house in close to 20 years, and never owned it prior to inheriting it. She had no idea what was done with the garage conversion, she was 14 when it was done.

 

[TheRustyScupper]

. . . Its tough to separate the emotion from the business of selling your home, but it is critical. You can not take it personally that someone is criticizing something you haven't noticed or didn't care to deal with while you lived there . . .

1) THE BEST ADVICE.
2) Wish I had remembered to say that!
3) Remember, this is business, not personal.
4) Plus, a house is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.
5) Not what you, neighbors, realtors, or appraisers think it is worth. *

* We have sold houses for less than the appraised or comp value. But,
on the other hand, we have sold houses for far more than the appraisal.

 

[Bob NC]

88

 

[rbork]

I thought inspection was for safety, malfunctions and building codes not cosmetic?

We always plan a couple grand for items on the inspection to allocate to repairs. We have even started to just offer the buyers a flat rate and they fix it themselves.

Do u walk away or not? Well, why did you go through he process to begin with? Once I list a house, I'm done and checked out. Just get me to the closing table.


Good Luck and do what's right for you.

 

[MrsPete]

What does your realtor say about their counter offer? My first inclination would be to fix the radon - and the buyer can fix the rest at their expense.

I agree. Radon's a reasonable request. Cosmetics are in the eye of the beholder, and if they didn't see it as they toured the house earlier, it must not've been too important to them.

I thought inspection was for safety, malfunctions and building codes not cosmetic?

And you're right. The inspection is to check out things that the average person couldn't accurately inspect. If the buyer doesn't like the ceiling fan in the bedroom or the tile in the bathroom, that's cosmetic and he should note it himself as he tours the house. On the other hand, if the electrical wires are shoddy old aluminum and might catch fire or if the tiles look good but are hiding water damage, that's the kind of thing the inspector should disclose to the potential buyer.

One note of importance: IF the inspector finds something actually wrong (as in, your roof has a leak, not as in I don't like blue carpet), and the sale falls through, you -- the seller -- once informed of this actual problem -- are legally required to either fix it or make it known to the next buyer.

 

[tvguy]

I will add, some code violations are either not going to be visable to an inspector, or they miss them.

I've been in my house 30 years (next month), it seems everytime we undertake any project we uncover some other violation that should have been caught during construction, that weren't, and weren't by our inspector.
Things that only turn up when you tear something up.

 

[richmond282]

I agree that it depends on what the "cosmetic" requests were as to how I would handle it. When we sold our last house, there were some things the buyers requested that we fixed (changing out some wiring, for example). There were some things we didn't fix (they wanted us the elevate the water heater 6 inches off the floor which would have required cutting the pipes etc. It was located in an unfinished portion of the house and we just flat out told them "no".) When we purchased our house, we made some requests too (GFI outlets in the kitchen, new bathroom fan) but nothing too outrageous.

 

[bumbershoot]

I'll first say that I'm not in the market for a house yet, I never have been. I feel that I've learned a lot from friends (and watching their struggles and bad decisions is what has helped keep us from jumping into home-mortgage-ship). I've been checking out redfin for our area for about a year, seeing how fast things go, etc.

From this total amateur point of view, if I see a house that's for sale for more than 3 months in my area, I'm seriously wondering what is wrong with it.

So I'm really wondering what these cosmetic issues are. If a house isn't attractive to buyers, it's not attractive to buyers. And you might end up lowering the cost even more, or making the decision to fix them, to make the house more attractive.

This was our first ever offer, but there are no houses in the area we are interested in for sale. ... We aren't in a rush since there aren't any houses available that we are interested in

...and if they pull out of the deal, that's ok because there aren't any other houses that have our eye to move in to yet. I just don't want to lose them- what if no one else gives us an offer??

And those things make me wonder "why are YOU selling?" You are staying in the area, you don't have a house in mind to move to. What's the matter with the house that YOU want to leave? Is it the same set of issues that maybe others are seeing?

I'm probably totally and completely off (maybe it's just the wrong size for your family), but it's worth asking. "If I were wanting to move into this house, what do I see wrong with it?"

 

[Jenny3]

I also would like to know what cosmetics they are asking for. In my area, the home inspection is for structural, safety or defective items, nothing cosmetic, so that Reply to Inspections wouldn't fly around here.

I would definitely remediate the radon; any Buyer would ask you to do so. Other than that, I would offer a small credit in lieu of the repairs - less than half of the estimate cost - and this is just to keep the peace. If the Buyer is being this picky on small cosmetic items, I'm sure they will be particular on analyzing the work and reviewing the receipts. Best to just give them a credit at closing so they can hire their own contractor, choose their own fixtures, etc.

 

[ktlm]

Honestly, I think it is pretty impossible for any of us here to give you any valid advice without knowing all of the specifics of your situation. There are so many things that can affect a home sale. If there is a high level of radon, then you need to get that remediated right away, both in terms of selling the home and in terms of you living in the home. As far as the rest, there are just so many variables that could make a difference. Maybe you need to fix the issues or maybe these people are just being ridiculous. How much money are you talking about for these repairs they are demanding?

One question is why your home has been on the market for so long without another offer. There are so many specific reasons that could be. 1. Is the market where you are just in really bad shape right now where nothing is selling; 2. Did you over price the house to begin with (even if other houses in the neighborhood are selling at those prices are the details of your house comparable- i.e. did those other houses have updated interiors; granite counters; better yards etc while yours doen't); 3. Is there some issue with your house that has led to a lack of offers-- i.e. poor curb appeal; no yard; issues with lay out; not updated or doesn't have the type of interior perks that other houses in the neighborhood have.; 4. Could the items the inspector found be what is keeping you from getting offers or keeping you from getting offers in the range you want?

I live in a part of town that is very desirable because of the schools. A lot of people want their kids in one of 3 specific grade schools. As a result, houses of all sizes (smallish to large) in the area can often sell in less than a week. In fact, I have a friend, who is trying to move into the area who has already lost 2 houses he wanted because he didn't get his offers in fast enough. Even so, there are houses here that are on the market for 6 months to a year or more and there is usually a reason. Some of the reasons are things that can't be changed. There was an absolutely gorgeous house- but the entire backyard was pool and concrete- no grass at all- not great for kids or dogs. That house sat on the market for a year and a half; Some are just priced wrong- I can think of another beautiful house that sat on the market for over a year- the reason was it was a big house that had an absolutely tiny back yard, and was totally overpriced and the owners didn't want to bring the price down. Some is is stuff that the owners didn't want to put the money into fixing- yet they still priced their house the same as others in the area that did not have those issues and didn't want to make concessions - For, example there was a house where you walked in and it smelled hugely like cat (the carpets I'm pretty sure) and all the doors were beat up/scratched up. They didn't want to do a carpet allowance. I can think of another one that still had all of its original appliances, laminate counters, and even vinyl floors and they wanted the same price as ones in the neighborhood were selling for that had been updated with new appliances, granite counters, and wood or tile floors. The house just didn't have the appeal of others in the neighborhood which were selling for the same price they were asking.

Any buyer, is going to figure up what the cost is to fix any issues they see in the house- whether that be updates, carpets, cosmetic issues, etc. - and if it is going to cost them more to fix the issues than it would to buy another comparable house for that price in the same neighborhood, unless they absolutely are in love with your house, they won't buy it. So I think you need to really analyze what the issues might be with your house, that might be turning buyers off, if any. Your buyers possibly are just being unreasonable, but you may actually have issues that need to be taken care of, or accounted for before you are going to get a good sale. It is really hard to say whether your buyers are being unreasonable without knowing the specifics of what they are asking you to do.

 

[Bob NC]

when we listed our other house we got some crazy offers but the one that I wouldnt even think about was the one that wanted to pick out new paint colors and have us hire someone to do it . The house was painted the week we moved out into our new house , so it didnt need it at all . They also asked for us to have the pool painted blue and for us to leave ALL the patio furniture and lighting including some torches I bought to match the furniture that I paid 100 bucks each for !By the time I got half way through the paper I called and told our agent to tell them we were not even going to look at the offer any further.

They wanted about 15 -20 things that were crazy . Leave our freezer in the garage ?? on top of that it was not even a full price offer .


They put in another offer and I never saw it because I told our agent I didnt care if they offered full price they were nuts . LOL They were first time home buyers and thought they could get everything

You took their offer personally rather than as the business decision it should have been.

I imagine we have all walked into a car dealership and made a really low offer to start with, and maybe throw in an alarm system, floor mats and a year of XM too, (I have). I couldn't imagine the dealership saying they want no more offers from me because they were insulted with my first offer.

 

[StitchesGr8Fan]

You said there are no houses you would be interested in buying TODAY. What if you turned down the offer and TOMORROW your dream house comes on the market? You may not get another offer for months and your dream home could slip away. In other words, you have to consider the opportunity costs of declining the offer.

 

[badiggio]

Typically ,up here in canada,the hot season to sell is april to july/august,reason being people with young families want to be settled and have their kids registered in school for september, and of course nobody really wants to move in the winter.I think you originally listed at the wrong time,and did get an offer in april.Unless you're in a hurry to get rid of the house,I'd refuse all the extras .

 

[Belle & Ariel]

Ten years ago realtors required a 3 month listing, then went to 6 months when the market suffered. Now they want a year listing because many homes will not sell in 6 months. Your home was listed in the slower time of a slump, so I do not think your home is stale. There are homes in our area that have been on the market over a year.
The inspection contingency allows negotiation on repairs the inspector notes are needed. If you do those, the buyer is obligated to close or forfeit his earnest money. Cosmetic issues do not and should not figure in--they should have been addressed during the original purchase contract.
If they have paid loan fees, appraisal, building inspection, and lose earnest money, they might not easily walk. Your realtor can rightfully demand THEY (not you)pay the commission if they fail to close on issues not related to the building inspection.
It is also common for the buying and selling realtor to kick in money to close.

I would not do more than the radon. That is all you are required to do. Sadly many try to take advantage.

Let us know what you do. This happens too often.

 

[lovepurple]

Ten years ago realtors required a 3 month listing, then went to 6 months when the market suffered. Now they want a year listing because many homes will not sell in 6 months. Your home was listed in the slower time of a slump, so I do not think your home is stale. There are homes in our area that have been on the market over a year.
The inspection contingency allows negotiation on repairs the inspector notes are needed. If you do those, the buyer is obligated to close or forfeit his earnest money. Cosmetic issues do not and should not figure in--they should have been addressed during the original purchase contract.
If they have paid loan fees, appraisal, building inspection, and lose earnest money, they might not easily walk. Your realtor can rightfully demand THEY (not you)pay the commission if they fail to close on issues not related to the building inspection.
It is also common for the buying and selling realtor to kick in money to close.

I would not do more than the radon. That is all you are required to do. Sadly many try to take advantage.

Let us know what you do. This happens too often.

Real estate laws vary from state to state. In NC there is something known as the due diligence period in which the buyer can walk away for any reason, including cosmetic issues.

 

[Jenny3]

Ten years ago realtors required a 3 month listing, then went to 6 months when the market suffered. Now they want a year listing because many homes will not sell in 6 months. Your home was listed in the slower time of a slump, so I do not think your home is stale. There are homes in our area that have been on the market over a year.
The inspection contingency allows negotiation on repairs the inspector notes are needed. If you do those, the buyer is obligated to close or forfeit his earnest money. Cosmetic issues do not and should not figure in--they should have been addressed during the original purchase contract.
If they have paid loan fees, appraisal, building inspection, and lose earnest money, they might not easily walk. Your realtor can rightfully demand THEY (not you)pay the commission if they fail to close on issues not related to the building inspection.
It is also common for the buying and selling realtor to kick in money to close.

I would not do more than the radon. That is all you are required to do. Sadly many try to take advantage.

Let us know what you do. This happens too often.

That is definitely not common in my area! Or at least in my business as a Realtor. My salary is not a negotiation tool.

OP - I think the majority of us need more information, especially the state you reside in as laws vary.

 

[Arielle22]

You took their offer personally rather than as the business decision it should have been.

I imagine we have all walked into a car dealership and made a really low offer to start with, and maybe throw in an alarm system, floor mats and a year of XM too, (I have). I couldn't imagine the dealership saying they want no more offers from me because they were insulted with my first offer.

Off topic but I had to answer this. I used to work at a car dealership as HR/Payroll. I was walking through the showroom one day when I heard the sales manager tell a customer that he could leave as the manager would be better off than selling the car to him after cost. The manager felt this customer would be too difficult to work with after such a low offer and so invited him to leave.

Customer didn't believe it at first but eventually got the message. First and only time in 7 years of working there that I saw that.

 

[tvguy]

Off topic but I had to answer this. I used to work at a car dealership as HR/Payroll. I was walking through the showroom one day when I heard the sales manager tell a customer that he could leave as the manager would be better off than selling the car to him after cost. The manager felt this customer would be too difficult to work with after such a low offer and so invited him to leave.

Customer didn't believe it at first but eventually got the message. First and only time in 7 years of working there that I saw that.

That whole industry is a mystery to me. We have a friend who was Business manager of a European dealership. She said that a competing dealer was losing money on every car they sold. That competing dealership also sold a domestic brand, and we took an ad for $7,000 off sticker from that dealership to another dealership that sold the same brand. They looked at the ad, said they would match it, but said the same thing, "that price is below both wholesale and dealer cost".
But as our friend put explained it, you never know what kickbacks the dealer is getting from the auto maker. They got like $30,000 in money for advertising if they sold 30 cars of a particular model in a month. The lost money on the original sale of each of those cars. She also said, even if they make a profit, it's not uncommon for them to make only $25 on a $50,000 new car sale, and $5,000 on a $10,000 used car sale. But service is where they make their money.

 

[rbork]

patiently waiting for more info or update from OP

FWIW, I too had realtors kick in $ in the past to close a deal. Not alot but enough. When your talking 35+ in commission, it wasn't worth them losing it for a couple grand difference.
I do note however that the market has changed and realtors work harder and longer to market and sell a property than during the bubble. Therefore making them kick in $ to settle a difference hightly unlikely during these economical times.