Will SSR make VWL impossible to book without the 11 month advantage?

[utahkennedys]

I own at OKW and will be doing an add-on soon at BCV or BWV. I know for sure I will not be staying at VWL, ever. I don't like the theme at all, the decor is totally unappealing, I have heard horror stories about the pool and all of the campground users, etc. I think owners at the smaller resorts get nervous without reason sometimes. I bought at OKW because I love it. I am staying there on our first trip as owners in September, and we may never stay anywhere else. I am sure a lot of SSR owners love it too and will usually stay there.

 

[sssteele]

My wife love VWL, especially at Xmas. (We stayed there last June and December) We own 300 points at BCV, and called our guide last Wednesday to wait-list for VWL, since our first contract there will be paid in September. Guide says "no wait list - I have three contracts available." We jumped at the opportunity to own 200 points at VWL, but not everyone likes the resort. Since we wanted VWL available particularly at Xmas time, we are thrilled to be owners there. Can't wait to take my grandchildren!

 

[lllovell]

I am not technically savvy to link to the poll that polled SSR members about their planned usage of DVC resorts, but it was dated 4/26/05 and approximately 13% of the SSR purchasers stated that they would almost always choose to stay at other resorts (30 out of 216). The particular resorts and the reasons why were listed. In my mind, that is a fair number. Another 134, I beleive said they wanted to try all the resorts. I think around 42 said they would choose to stay at SSR. Another poster on another thread indicated that approximately 80% of SSR members would choose to try all the resorts while for other DVC locations that number was around 40%. Perhaps that can be attributed to a higher number of SSR purchasers being new to the system. This was my source for concluding that a fair number of people who purchased at SSR do not intend on staying there on a regular basis.

As for breaking it into 3 resorts, the posted about the additional expense showing up in member dues is probably correct, however, HH is a smaller resort with no hotel attached to it and traditionally they have been able to keep their dues down.

I am not sure how to get back to those polls or I would link them all (so neither of us is technically savy enough lol). Maybe someone else can do it.

You also need to look at the polls for the other resorts. There are a certain percentage of people that will not stay at their "home" resort at EVERY DVC location. Its a natural thing. You buy in because its what Disney is selling and you didn't know about resales or your tastes change or you discover that you really miss one particular resort, etc. Many peope won't toss good money away doing a sale and buy back at a different resort (with closing costs and transfer fees, etc).

SSR needs to be finished and then the effects will finally show. Many people will try it and like it, many others wont. I am sure it happens at every resort.

We have discussed many times here that strictly from the numbers, there is no doubt that if 10% of current owners want to stay elsewhere, then the number of rooms available at the smaller resorts will be proportionately smaller than 10% of SSR owners empty rooms. What I am not sure of is that there is ANY way of knowing how many owners actually stay in their home resorts to begin with (lets face it - DIS is a skewed view of DVC membership - we are the fanatics). We can poll to death here, but only Disney really know those numbers.

As I said before, if you are a peak traveler, you need to buy where you want to stay. If not, then you will often get which ever resort you want. DVC will forever be changing (I hope!) and adding more resorts, etc. What effects bookings at any one resort today could change dramatically in the next few years, so we are all just speculating anyway.

 

[bobbiwoz]

Is this the poll?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=765834&highlight=SSR+owners+poll

Bobbi

 

[chrissyk]

I've been wondering about this topic myself. If we add on, it will most likely be at VWL for the 11-month window.

 

[lllovell]

Is this the poll?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=765834&highlight=SSR+owners+poll

Bobbi

Thats it Bobbi - thanks.

If you read down through the comments, you will notice that a good number of people that said they wanted to stay at all resorts said that they want to TRY them all because they are newbies. Didn't you try them all at some point? (I bet most do when they first buy in - but a good many find themselves missing their "home" quickly)

Give SSR time to build up a loyal following. Some will say it won't happen because the resort wont appeal. No way! Every resort appeals to some rather than others - thank goodness! There are people that would NEVER stay at BWV (is this the long hall one? haven't stayed there personally being a newbie) or VWL (too dark) or OKW (old folks home) or SSR (take your pick) or BC (heck - I don't even remember the gripes about this one - but you know they are out there!).

 

[tjkraz]

I am not technically savvy to link to the poll that polled SSR members about their planned usage of DVC resorts, but it was dated 4/26/05 and approximately 13% of the SSR purchasers stated that they would almost always choose to stay at other resorts (30 out of 216).

Correct. But here are the other numbers by resort for the "always want to stay at XXX resort":

VWL: 24.39%
BCV: 14.28%
SSR: 13.9%
OKW: 10.86%
BWV: 9.04%

Another 134, I beleive said they wanted to try all the resorts. I think around 42 said they would choose to stay at SSR. Another poster on another thread indicated that approximately 80% of SSR members would choose to try all the resorts while for other DVC locations that number was around 40%. Perhaps that can be attributed to a higher number of SSR purchasers being new to the system.

The exact question was "plan to use at ALL DVC locations." The results can absolutely be attributed to SSR members being so new to the system. The beauty of DVC is that we CAN use our points elsewhere. We aren't all locked into a single resort.

I would fully expect most OKW owners to want to stay at their Home resort because when they bought there was ONE resort. They made a purchase decision based upon the reality (at that time) that they would be spending 50 years at that single property. And apparently they are still happy with that decision as a group.

Take a look at this poll:

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=830132

In post 49 I summarized the results to the best of my abilities. Based upon those posting, SSR is right on target for the number of rooms in the system as of the date of the poll.

Sorry if it seems like I'm beating up on you over this issue (which is NOT my intention) but I think this projection of SSR member visit habits has turned into a self-perpetuating myth.

Will it get harder to book at the smaller resorts? Certainly! More people + same number of rooms means the resort will certainly fill up sooner than pre-SSR. But let's wait a few years before we try to project the long-term likes and dislikes of a group of people, many of whom have yet to stay at their Home resort much less sample the others on-site.

(BTW, here are links to the resort polls for anyone interested

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=765834
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=767106
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=767104
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=767103
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=767099

 

[KLEONARD]

DW and I toured SSR in Jan 05. Bought 225 points in Feb O5. I liked the theme, but the real clincher was the layout. I ran the disney half marathon and have done the full marathon in the past. Running is an important part of my life, and will be as long as I am able. With the size of SSR, the wonderful health club and spa (after run messages) and location, I can run for miles without setting foot on any busy streets. SSR is the resort for me. I have run at WL. The path to FW and the sidewalks through the campground were nice. I just felt that one wrong step and I would end up in someones tent or camper. IMO, running DVC members might make SSR a hot property. The bigger, the better. A mile jog to DTD is just a warmup to the people in my social circle (lol). Spa, size and location will keep me at SSR, no need to worry about 7 months out at other resorts.

 

[Beca]

I think there are some "language" issues going on here. While many SSR owners might have clarified their usage plans in the posts following the poll, the poll itself did not have a "we would like to try them all once, then mainly stay at SSR" option. The good Lord knows...if I asked my dh if he planned on using a pool if we shelled out the money for one and his reply was "Yes". I would be a little ticked off, if after "trying" the pool once...he considered that "usage". I would certainly expect his "usage" to be more than "trying" it once.

The poll DID actually say "plan to use all resorts". Now, to everyone's credit...there was NOT an option for "trying". But, I think the difference that is concerning many BWV/BCV/VWL owners (especially new ones) is that many of these people researched DVC (and some even came close to buying SSR before deciding to go resale) before buying, and chose "resort X" instead of SSR because they plan on staying there. These are new owners as well...but, they (in large part) are not planning on "trying" all resorts...they want their home resort.

I think, in reality....most everyone is going to have the "opportunity" to try all resorts...(i.e. your home is not available on a last minute trip, so you take what you can get). I have had 3 trips "home", and have had rooms at 4 of the 5 resorts....not by choice, but by "reality".

But, I think tjkraz is correct....who knows what the majority of SSR owners are going to do? Maybe they will LOVE SSR in mass numbers and very few SSR owners will ever want to stay anywhere else. Maybe they will all hate it and everyone who owns at any other DVC resort is "out of luck" because they will be leaving SSR in droves and "invading" the other resorts. Or, maybe their statistics will look much like the stats of the other resorts....some "die hard" fans, some "take it or leave it" folks, and some who wish they owned another resort. The latter is probably the reality.

Statistically, that would still be a lot of owners from a larger resort trying to trade into smaller ones. In my mind...that still means that getting a room at a smaller resort will become more difficult...especially at popular times. Remember....there are a LOT more owners than there are rooms. DVC has increased in membership nearly 20,000 members since I bought a little more than a year ago. So, if a lot of these new people are hoping to get early December....that's a lot more people trying for a few more rooms. Now, if NONE of these new people want early December....then that time of year just opened up for old members because there are now exactly the same number of members trying for more rooms. So, by my VERY "over the top" examples....it seems to me that with every added member, the popular times at all resorts may become more difficult to get, and the less popular times at all resorts may become easier to get. And, obviously the smaller resorts will be the first to fill.

As far as this "battle" that has been going on with SSR owners and non-SSR owners....I just wish it would stop. There is nothing any of us can do about it. DVC controls the properties and markets them as they see fit.

No one knows for sure how SSR owners are going to act in the future, just like no one knows for sure how any other resort owners are going to act. We can make "educated guesses" based on past behavior...but, they are just guesses.

I think this issue is too "emotionally tied" to all of us via our pocket books and our pride for many to see it witout bias. So, here's my opinion....if you own at SSR and are offended by these comments....well, that is your right. Personally, I think as more owners actually get to stay at SSR and become more comfortable in their choice, they will be less and less offended by comments and "laugh them off" as easily as owners of other resorts do. All resorts get bashed...it is a part of "dis-life". It's kind of like cheering on your favorite sports team (go BCV!!! Sorry, I just "had" to throw that in. Somewhere, Richyams is at me, right now.). In reality....it's your money and your vacation...who cares what someone you have never met says about your resort??!!

And, if you are an owner at one of the other 4 WDW resorts and are worried that the size of SSR is going to negatively impact your "DVC experience"....I am NOT going to tell you not to worry. It is your money, your vacation, and your home resort. If you own at a tiny resort and are very loyal to it....I think you have reason to worry. Who knows what the future may bring.

Bottom line....people have the right to think and feel what they want, and no one has the right to ask them not to. People who feel that their resort is getting trashed have every right to feel that way, and people who feel their ability to book their home resort without panic is being taken away by the choices DVC is making are right as well.

Can't we all just agree to disagree...and stop trying to convince people they are "wrong"? Each new resort/member brings ramifications to DVC ownership. Think about things....figure out what makes you "comfortable", and work within the confines of the DVC rules to make DVC the most enjoyable for you. If that means you need to book your home resort day by day at the 11 month window to make yourself feel comfortable...then, do it. If you think nothing is going to change...keep calling 5-6 months out and "go with the flow".

In reality, only time will tell...just enjoy the fact that you own DVC and are healthy and wealthy enough to visit!!!



Beca

 

[BEACHCLUBVILLAS]

Today I snagged a WLV studio from 8/20/05 to 8/24/05. I initially booked SSR because one day was not available at WL during my stay. Then no sooner did we hang up, the phone rang and the WLV wait list came through.

 

[lllovell]

Beca,

I agree with your post. My only comment is that those who own at the smaller resorts currently have that 4 month window as "protection" of space at your own resort. I am willing to bet (and again - we have had polls to prove it at least among DISers) that most people that are truly loyal tend to plan far enough in advance to assure they get the resort they want when they want it. If you are trying to get into a resort during a busy time after the 7 month window opens and it really matters to, then people should add-on at that resort or sell and buy points there. During non-peak times it probably won't matter.

I think this conversation has been going well and without any of the "bashing" that commonly goes on in the great resort wars (which we all grow tired of I think). Its nice to see people talking nicely, without getting nasty for no reason about this topic, which has in the past become quite heated for no reasons.

We are all playing by the rules DVC established. Thank goodness for the 11 month booking window. I hope everyone gets to stay where they wish!

Laura

 

[Muushka]

I own at OKW and will be doing an add-on soon at BCV or BWV. I know for sure I will not be staying at VWL, ever. I don't like the theme at all, the decor is totally unappealing, I have heard horror stories about the pool and all of the campground users, etc. I think owners at the smaller resorts get nervous without reason sometimes. I bought at OKW because I love it. I am staying there on our first trip as owners in September, and we may never stay anywhere else. I am sure a lot of SSR owners love it too and will usually stay there.

Hmmm. The owners at smaller resorts probably get nervous when they read a post like this!

 

[skelooch]

I'd like to see the the 11 month window extended by at least a couple of months, but with DVC using the 7 month window as a major selling point I'm sure it would never happen.

You can probably guess my favorite DVC resort

 

[cruise-o-matic]

I suspect, considering BWV, BCV and VWL collectively, it will be getting harder and harder to book rooms at the 7 month point. It will perhaps never be "impossible" except during certain times of the year, but to some extent we have to assume that the average BWV, BCV and VWL member will prefer to stay at their home resort than at SSR or OKW. After the procrastinators get blocked from their home resort a few years running, because SSR, OKW, HH, and VB members have reserved those rooms at the 7 month point, they'll learn that to get what they bargained for from DVC they're going to have to book early. As more BWV, BCV and VWL members book early, the less chance there will be anything left available at those resorts at the 7 month point.

I think that's what we're seeing now, especially with BCV. Those contracts are getting scarfed up at well above the ROFR price and there is a long waitlist at DVC. Why else would you want to spend top dollar and not use the 11 month booking advantage? At 7 months, my HH points are worth the same and cost me a lot less.

 

[bicker]

Diane did several not all that long ago and basically, they showed similar things. There was a high percentage of people that are SSR owners that said they wanted to try other resorts, but they want to TRY them, not ALWAYS book them.

So we still have no idea what is the relative percentage of owners of each resort who are trying to book at non-home resorts.

The "new kids on the block" SHOULD want to try them all.

Of course. My guess is that eventually SSR and OKW will track the same. So the question reduces down to whether there are a greater percentage of OKW owners trying to get rooms at BWV, BCV and VWL than the percentage of BWV, BCV and VWL owners trying to get rooms at OKW and SSR. Again, I think it is a relatively safe assumption that the answer is going to be "yes".

Its what DVC is selling is a 7 resort package.

And that's really the reason why what I suspect is true is true: BWV members were sold BWV, the BoardWalk, and easy access to Epcot.

Most everyone that responded did say that they do plan on staying at SSR as well. A certain percentage at EVERY resort said they would NEVER stay at their resort.

Of course, and so again, it comes back down to relative percentages, something which it is very difficult for vBulletin polls to gather. Even if they could, they're in no way representative samples, so the data isn't valid anyway. Time will tell, and only time will tell. The question is whether folks want to bank on things breaking their way. I don't put generally my money into investments that will "possibly" pay off, unless the potential pay off is a rather substantial return on investment.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Okay, I am the skeptic. The OP came in with only a few posts, posted a "hot" question, and did not come back to the thread. I think you guys are having your chain yanked.

Of course it will be more difficult to get any of the smaller on-site resorts as teh system expands, and that means in ANY way, not just with SSR.

 

[bicker]

The OP came in with only a few posts, posted a "hot" question, and did not come back to the thread.

So? We don't need no stinkin' OP to bicker about things!

 

[dianeschlicht]

LOL!

 

[wtpclc]

So? We don't need no stinkin' OP to bicker about things!

Good thing I was out of coffee. Glad to see we're still being mature in our discussion.
Thanks for putting this all in prespective. Best laugh I've gotten in a LONG time.

 

[WelcomeHome]

I read all the posts when I got home last night and I must say you gave me a lot to think about and "sleep on." I sincerely appreciated all the different opinions and I was certainly amazed by some of the different directions my simple question took.

After waking this morning, every thing seems much clearer and I've made a decision to go with VWL as my 2nd home. After re-reading all the posts this morning, I realized that the smaller PERCENTAGE of VWL units will PROBABLY make it more difficult to book than the other DVC sites. And as much as I love BWV also, I already have the advantages of the close proxcimity to Epcot, MGM, and many restaurants with my first home at BCV. Since BWV is so close to my first home at BCV, I will always have access. And since VWL is in a very different "neck of the woods" and has the smallest percentage of units available, VWL gets my vote for my second home. Hopefully, I will add on a different resort as my 3rd home some day.

I would also like to make one more comment regading SSR. While I have not yet had the HONOR to vacation at the newest DVC resort, I'm POSITIVE I will find it to be every bit as great as all the other resorts. Once, the resort is completed, and the landscaping fills in, and all the facilities are running, and all the "finishing touches" are added, I KNOW I'm going to love it every bit as much as all the other DVC resorts!

Let's face it, we all bought DVC because we love Disney and we love DVC. While the Magic Kingdom is very different from Epcot which is very different from MGM & AK, they're all Disney parks - and there all GREAT parks. And of course everyone has their favorites, but that's because everyone is as different as the different parks and resorts are. So to all you SSR people, please accept my sincerest congratulations and "WELCOME HOME"!

I look at it this way:
Some people find VWL too dark, but I find it is soothing and secluded.
Some people find BWV is too noisy, but I find it exciting.
Some people find OKW like a retirement home, but I find it charming.
Some people find SSR like an 800 unit hotel complex, but I KNOW I'm going to find it to be a chic, cosmopolitian city within a city!

Best wishes to all my fellow DVC members,
Dave