Will Disney Tokyo Keep Splash Mountain?

Will Disney Tokyo Keep Splash Mountain?

  • Yes

    Votes: 14 82.4%
  • No

    Votes: 3 17.6%

  • Total voters
    17


BMB777

Mouseketeer
Joined
Mar 17, 2020
I would imagine they'll keep the original version. Different ownership group. And I would imagine Tiana isn't a favorite character out there.
 
  • MKTokyo

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 24, 2018
    Wow... so many infrequent posters that are suddenly quite devoted to posting about one particular theme park ride. You don’t see that every day!

    Are any of you planning a trip to Japan?

    I would imagine they'll keep the original version. Different ownership group. And I would imagine Tiana isn't a favorite character out there.
    Why don’t you think Tiana is popular?
     

    IamBrerBear

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Jun 25, 2020
    Wow... so many infrequent posters that are suddenly quite devoted to posting about one particular theme park ride. You don’t see that every day!

    Are any of you planning a trip to Japan?


    Why don’t you think Tiana is popular?
    I've already been to Disney Tokyo several times. Have you ever been?
     
  • gelatoni fan

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Mar 18, 2018
    I highly doubt Tokyo will do a retheme. The rides in the US are constantly being changed to shove more IP in but Nemo Searider is the only case I can think of in recent years of that happening in Tokyo. Space Mountain in Tokyo was never rethemed to Hyperspace unlike Disneyland, Paris and Hong Kong.

    I'm strongly against Disney making this change to Splash Mountain because I don't agree with them censoring everything related to Song of the South instead of helping to educate people about the historical context. I thought the movie was empowering because a black man teaches life lessons to a white boy through stories. I'm curious how many people actually watched the movie and think Splash Mountain should be changed due to featuring Brer rabbit rather than get stirred up by the media constantly exaggerating claims of racism. Given that Japanese people don't see any problems with the characters in the ride and have a stronger attitude of "don't fix what's not broken", I can't imagine Splash Mountain in Tokyo going away in the near future.
     

    Alan1972

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Mar 16, 2019
    Good news looks like post above is wrong and Oriental Land Co is considering changing the theme.maybe not a princess and frog but something else.
     

    WorldOfPooh

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jun 3, 2020
    I highly doubt Tokyo will do a retheme. The rides in the US are constantly being changed to shove more IP in but Nemo Searider is the only case I can think of in recent years of that happening in Tokyo. Space Mountain in Tokyo was never rethemed to Hyperspace unlike Disneyland, Paris and Hong Kong.

    I'm strongly against Disney making this change to Splash Mountain because I don't agree with them censoring everything related to Song of the South instead of helping to educate people about the historical context. I thought the movie was empowering because a black man teaches life lessons to a white boy through stories. I'm curious how many people actually watched the movie and think Splash Mountain should be changed due to featuring Brer rabbit rather than get stirred up by the media constantly exaggerating claims of racism. Given that Japanese people don't see any problems with the characters in the ride and have a stronger attitude of "don't fix what's not broken", I can't imagine Splash Mountain in Tokyo going away in the near future.
    Exactly, Br'er Rabbit, Fox and Bear come from African American and West African Culture long before White Guy Joel Chandler Harris created Uncle Remus and the racist Uncle Remus stories.
     

    BMB777

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Mar 17, 2020
    Good news looks like post above is wrong and Oriental Land Co is considering changing the theme.maybe not a princess and frog but something else.
    Why is that good news?

    Here is a great article explaining why it's highly unlikely a change is coming, even though OLC said they're considering a change.

     
    Last edited:
  • Karin1984

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 5, 2012
    Why is that good news?
    Because even though the racist undertones aren't known in Japan, or maybe not relevant, it is what the movie is based on. Updating it is an improvement for equality.
    If I, as a Dutch person, may throw in a Dutch related issue. Look up 'Black Pete' and 'Sinterklaas', in origin, Black Pete is a racist character, however 200 years later for a lot of people (white & black) it is not anymore what it once was. That only doesn't change the origins and what it means in a negative way to also a lot of people (white & black).

    Yes, it would be ideal if we could keep the ride and explain the history at the same time. But as themeparks are a way to escape the real world, that will not happen, within the ride. It would be an option to have a museum on site with the history of rides and movies to explain the backgrounds of decisions made years ago, but as that would be an optional, it doesn't justify keeping the ride.

    I think it is a perfect opportunity for OLC to create an original ride, unique to Tokyo, based on Duffy & his friends. If there is one thing that is popular, it's Duffy, Shelliemay, Gelatoni and all the others. As it is a ride with many creatures and many scenes, they could make it work to give each character it's own little scene, and then a big finale together.
     

    BMB777

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Mar 17, 2020
    Because even though the racist undertones aren't known in Japan, or maybe not relevant, it is what the movie is based on. Updating it is an improvement for equality.
    If I, as a Dutch person, may throw in a Dutch related issue. Look up 'Black Pete' and 'Sinterklaas', in origin, Black Pete is a racist character, however 200 years later for a lot of people (white & black) it is not anymore what it once was. That only doesn't change the origins and what it means in a negative way to also a lot of people (white & black).

    Yes, it would be ideal if we could keep the ride and explain the history at the same time. But as themeparks are a way to escape the real world, that will not happen, within the ride. It would be an option to have a museum on site with the history of rides and movies to explain the backgrounds of decisions made years ago, but as that would be an optional, it doesn't justify keeping the ride.

    I think it is a perfect opportunity for OLC to create an original ride, unique to Tokyo, based on Duffy & his friends. If there is one thing that is popular, it's Duffy, Shelliemay, Gelatoni and all the others. As it is a ride with many creatures and many scenes, they could make it work to give each character it's own little scene, and then a big finale together.
    Fair enough but as the article I linked explains, it's very very unlikely that OLC will be changing it anytime soon.
     

    gelatoni fan

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Mar 18, 2018
    Because even though the racist undertones aren't known in Japan, or maybe not relevant, it is what the movie is based on. Updating it is an improvement for equality.

    I think it is a perfect opportunity for OLC to create an original ride, unique to Tokyo, based on Duffy & his friends. If there is one thing that is popular, it's Duffy, Shelliemay, Gelatoni and all the others. As it is a ride with many creatures and many scenes, they could make it work to give each character it's own little scene, and then a big finale together.
    Duffy and friends are at Disneysea not Disneyland. I am all for creating unique rides though.

    I also think that claims of racism are over-exaggerated and mostly by people who haven't bothered to view the source material. For people who have watched the movie, whether it's racist or not is debatable. The original movie actually did a lot for equality such as Baskett being the first African American to win an honorary Oscar. I don't see this is an improvement for equality but rather promoting censorship rather than discussion as the correct way to deal with criticism.
     

    Karin1984

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 5, 2012
    Fair enough but as the article I linked explains, it's very very unlikely that OLC will be changing it anytime soon.
    So, the main explanation of the author on why the change will not happen (soon) is Japanese culture's attitude towards change vs. tradition? Can I summarize it like this?
     

    gelatoni fan

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Mar 18, 2018
    So, the main explanation of the author on why the change will not happen (soon) is Japanese culture's attitude towards change vs. tradition? Can I summarize it like this?
    I think the author emphasizes more that OLC wants things to be tested for several years before improving on it to put in TDR. There's also the cultural difference of listening to Disney's proposals which in American culture implies interest but in Japanese culture is mainly to show respect.

    One thing the article doesn't mention is that Splashdown Photos in Tokyo Disneyland is sponsored by Fujifilm. OLC takes what their Japanese partners think very seriously so Fujifilm also needs to approve any changes to Splash Mountain.
     

    IamBrerBear

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Jun 25, 2020
    So, the main explanation of the author on why the change will not happen (soon) is Japanese culture's attitude towards change vs. tradition? Can I summarize it like this?
    I'll summarize it but the first point that really needs to be emphasized is that OLC doesn't care if Splash Mountain is based on a movie that offends a small number of Americans. Tokyo Disney is built for the Japanese, I've been there several times so I know precisely what I'm talking about. Japan doesn't have the same type of PC culture that the U.S. does. Now let's get to some of the main points in the article:

    1) The area with Splash Mountain is basically themed entirely around Splash Mountain. All the nearby restaurants and attractions are related to Splash Mountain. So the expense to change all of that would be substantial. They can't just remove the bunnies from Splash, stick some frogs and Tiana in there, and call it a day. That's not at all how that process would work.

    2) Have you heard of Kawaii culture? It's the culture of cuteness. Everything cute cute cute to the max. A fun loving attraction with singing animals fits that culture perfectly.

    3) As Gelatoni referenced in his post, OLC likes sure things. Princess and the Frog is about as far from a sure thing as you can possibly get. Rides don't make their way to Tokyo Disney until years and years after they've demonstrated their popularity in the states. Heck, look at how popular Soarin has been in the states since its debut in 2001. Now, finally, almost 20 years later it finally made its way to DisneySea. Soaring was about as sure a thing as you can possibly get.

    Factoring in all of the above, I just can't believe that OLC would make this change anytime soon. And by soon I'm talking probably the next 5-10 years at the absolute earliest, if ever.
     

    Karin1984

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 5, 2012
    I'll summarize it but the first point that really needs to be emphasized is that OLC doesn't care if Splash Mountain is based on a movie that offends a small number of Americans. Tokyo Disney is built for the Japanese, I've been there several times so I know precisely what I'm talking about. Japan doesn't have the same type of PC culture that the U.S. does. Now let's get to some of the main points in the article:

    1) The area with Splash Mountain is basically themed entirely around Splash Mountain. All the nearby restaurants and attractions are related to Splash Mountain. So the expense to change all of that would be substantial. They can't just remove the bunnies from Splash, stick some frogs and Tiana in there, and call it a day. That's not at all how that process would work.

    2) Have you heard of Kawaii culture? It's the culture of cuteness. Everything cute cute cute to the max. A fun loving attraction with singing animals fits that culture perfectly.

    3) As Gelatoni referenced in his post, OLC likes sure things. Princess and the Frog is about as far from a sure thing as you can possibly get. Rides don't make their way to Tokyo Disney until years and years after they've demonstrated their popularity in the states. Heck, look at how popular Soarin has been in the states since its debut in 2001. Now, finally, almost 20 years later it finally made its way to DisneySea. Soaring was about as sure a thing as you can possibly get.

    Factoring in all of the above, I just can't believe that OLC would make this change anytime soon. And by soon I'm talking probably the next 5-10 years at the absolute earliest, if ever.
    Seriously, the amount of 'who can piss the furthest' in this thread... Bragging if you have been to Disneyland Tokyo, often or not and if you live there is really not relevant. Even if we both live there and go to the park daily, we can still have a discussion about what we THINK will happen. And it is possible to agree or disagree. (I've visited all the Disney parks in the world, if it matters to you).

    Yes, I get that Tokyo Disney is build for the Japanese and I know about Kawaii culture. However, that doesn't mean that Japan doesn't have a problem with racism, it's not about the Americans visiting the park in this case. What I have been reading is that there are BLM protests in Japan and the conversation about racism in Japan is starting. More and more is written about racism, maybe not specifically against black people, but also Koreans in Japan etc.
    And that conversation in the long run can influence a decision to change Splash Mountain, so I agree with you and the offer it will take time and it will not happen tomorrow. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's the main driver to change the ride in the future. And maybe not into Princess and the Frog, but there are other options.
     

    WorldOfPooh

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jun 3, 2020
    Because even though the racist undertones aren't known in Japan, or maybe not relevant, it is what the movie is based on. Updating it is an improvement for equality.
    If I, as a Dutch person, may throw in a Dutch related issue. Look up 'Black Pete' and 'Sinterklaas', in origin, Black Pete is a racist character, however 200 years later for a lot of people (white & black) it is not anymore what it once was. That only doesn't change the origins and what it means in a negative way to also a lot of people (white & black).

    Yes, it would be ideal if we could keep the ride and explain the history at the same time. But as themeparks are a way to escape the real world, that will not happen, within the ride. It would be an option to have a museum on site with the history of rides and movies to explain the backgrounds of decisions made years ago, but as that would be an optional, it doesn't justify keeping the ride.

    I think it is a perfect opportunity for OLC to create an original ride, unique to Tokyo, based on Duffy & his friends. If there is one thing that is popular, it's Duffy, Shelliemay, Gelatoni and all the others. As it is a ride with many creatures and many scenes, they could make it work to give each character it's own little scene, and then a big finale together.
    Goede Morgen,

    It's bad news because you are getting rid of Bre'r Rabbit which are historical fables from African American and West African folklore. By putting the cloud of Racism on Spalsh and getting rid of it, by implication Bre'r Rabbit is associated with Racism which hurts the Bre'r Rabbit Brand.

    Uncle Remus, a creation of White Man, Joel Chandler Harris is more analogous to Black Pete and Sinterklaas. And that has rightfully been purged about 30 years ago. Now if you want to get rid of SoS,'s Zipadeedoo dah then by all means get rid of that.
     

    WorldOfPooh

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jun 3, 2020
    I think the author emphasizes more that OLC wants things to be tested for several years before improving on it to put in TDR. There's also the cultural difference of listening to Disney's proposals which in American culture implies interest but in Japanese culture is mainly to show respect.

    One thing the article doesn't mention is that Splashdown Photos in Tokyo Disneyland is sponsored by Fujifilm. OLC takes what their Japanese partners think very seriously so Fujifilm also needs to approve any changes to Splash Mountain.
    Yes, respect must be show to African American and West African folklore and the Br'er Rabbit brand.
     





    Connect

    Disney News and Updates





    SUBSCRIBE TO OUR DAILY EMAIL
    Subscribe and never miss out on Disney News, Deals and Updates.






    Top