Why There's No WDW Customer Loyalty Program

[jcb]

While I was listening to Pete's sub-mini-rant about Disney not having a theme park visitor loyalty program (similar to the modified Castaway Club program) it struck me that the main reason might be DVC.

My thinking: DVC is making a lot of money for Disney. The bulk of DVC (I'm not one ) owners use their points to come to WDW on a fairly regular basis. In some ways it is a loyalty program (but with an sizable up front cost). Disney already gives DVC owners a "discount" on room "prices" through the points, a discount on annual pass prices (so I seem to recall) and, I suspect, other discounts.

So why would WDW (or DL) - from a business standpoint - want to create a customer loyalty program that would give non-DVC owners (like me) any incentive not to buy into DVC?

DVC may not be the only reason. I can think of others (besides just plain greed).

I'm hoping Disney proves me wrong. Soon.

 

[WaltD4Me]

I really think that up until recently the very simple answer is....Disney just didn't need to offer a loyalty program so they didn't. All bets are off now, but before the economy tanked, they didn't need to offer incentives. It's not at all customer friendly or appreciative, but there you go.

 

[fakereadhed]

In some ways it is a loyalty program (but with an sizable up front cost). Disney already gives DVC owners a "discount" on room "prices" through the points, a discount on annual pass prices (so I seem to recall) and, I suspect, other discounts.

I don't see it as a loyalty program. I see it as a time share, and they throw some niceties at the people that ponied up the big bucks for it. A loyalty program would be like the Castaway Club.

If WDW is the #1 vacation destination in the entire world why would they bother? Doubt it will happen.

 

[LilGMom]

Like a PP said, I think it is because WDW doesn't have to have a loyalty program. They pack the parks and resorts without having any sort of loyalty program.

DVC members do get a discount if on an AP but as a FL resident that DVC discount doesn't do anything for me. DVC members own part of a timeshare, which doesn't really mean a discount on resort rooms, imho. As far as other discount... they are the same, for the most part, as AP discounts. AP/DVC member do get discounts on hard-ticket events but DVC members don't get dining discounts like AP members do.

 

[Paul in CT]

I agree that there is no loyalty program for the theme parks at WDW because Disney does not need to have one to get return guests. A loyalty program would only reduce their profit margin. If "loyal" return visitor attendance were to drop off, they might reconsider. Their focus is on getting new "converts" through room discounts, free dining, etc.

My loyalty plan was to join the DVC back in 1995 because I knew that would ensure my yearly (twice yearly now) visits.

 

[Gav N Becx]

Just to add a coorection there - as a DVC member you can get roo
discounts, typically in the region of 25% off rack room rates.
It is subject to availability, just like AP room rate discounts. We've done that before where we've already used up our points in a given use year.

I agree that a loyalty programme is overdue. However as a DVC member I'd be pretty upset if a programme offered similar benefits to DVC when I've forked out $$$$$ for the privilege of DVC.
From Disney's perspective I agree it would impact on new DVC memberships. That combined with their general stubborn attitude says to me that it'd be a long time before a good loyalty programme appears.
There's still more they could do for DVC members.
There's other things they need to do first like make sure they have a working website and online reservation system.
Don't hold your breath for them to act quickly
on anything other than guest safety...

 

[wdwowner]

I think it is time to end this subject already.

When you go to a town and need a room to stay at, there are many hotels to choose from, thus a program to encourage people to stay with them and give them a little something in return.

If I remember correctly Disney has, let's see, 1, 2, two resorts in the entire US. Either you stay at an off site hotel and deal with tourist trap crap, or stay in the bubble and not worry about life and escape. It's that simple.

There are PLENTY of perks available already available. AP's, DVC, Castaway Club, Disney Visa......

I can already hear Kevin, 'An AP discount renewal is not enough'. Well any amount of discount off the normal price is a perk. Families who visit once every 10 years do not get any discounts on park passes at all. Kevin and other people who visit frequently believe they deserve 'extra perks', even above what they get already.

As a frequent visitor I would like more discounts and perks too, but the stockholder side of me also want my investment in the company to continue to grow, and every time free stuff is given away that make my stock price go down. The only thing I see that the Castaway Club changes have done is make a first time cruiser not have the ability to get seatings, excursions and cabin choices on the same playing field and everyone else. When first timers find out only the frequently cruisers can get into Palos and they never had a chance to, they will not come back.

Conclusion, if you love WDW then go as often as you can. If you can find discounts take them. If you want a loyalty program they are there, but some people just want more free stuff no matter what and they will never be happy. And if you need to complain all the time about WDW and Disney then you need to stop going and find another hobby.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

I'm an off again/ on again PAP holder. I had been planning on going down this Dec. buying a pass and the TIW card but WDW threw in free dining the first week of Dec for the first time ever and it was worth the extra $$$ to buy a package and move from the Dolphin over to BC but I cancelled a short trip in Feb and over Easter because I won't have the AP's or the TIW card.

If WDW wanted a loyalty program it would only have to add benefits to the AP instead of incentives for one trip like free dining.

 

[wdwfreeksince88]

I think it is time to end this subject already.

When you go to a town and need a room to stay at, there are many hotels to choose from, thus a program to encourage people to stay with them and give them a little something in return.

If I remember correctly Disney has, let's see, 1, 2, two resorts in the entire US. Either you stay at an off site hotel and deal with tourist trap crap, or stay in the bubble and not worry about life and escape. It's that simple.

There are PLENTY of perks available already available. AP's, DVC, Castaway Club, Disney Visa......

I can already hear Kevin, 'An AP discount renewal is not enough'. Well any amount of discount off the normal price is a perk. Families who visit once every 10 years do not get any discounts on park passes at all. Kevin and other people who visit frequently believe they deserve 'extra perks', even above what they get already.

As a frequent visitor I would like more discounts and perks too, but the stockholder side of me also want my investment in the company to continue to grow, and every time free stuff is given away that make my stock price go down. The only thing I see that the Castaway Club changes have done is make a first time cruiser not have the ability to get seatings, excursions and cabin choices on the same playing field and everyone else. When first timers find out only the frequently cruisers can get into Palos and they never had a chance to, they will not come back.

Conclusion, if you love WDW then go as often as you can. If you can find discounts take them. If you want a loyalty program they are there, but some people just want more free stuff no matter what and they will never be happy. And if you need to complain all the time about WDW and Disney then you need to stop going and find another hobby.

They actually have more than two, don't forget about Vero Beach & Hilton Head. And not sure why you singled out Kevin on that remark a lot of us have said this for a long time. I am an annual passholder at WDW and Sea World. There is no comparison in the perks, Sea World gives you 5times what Disney gives you. If they were to give more perks to the annual pass program it might make people think more about getting an annual pass and coming to the parks more often which means your spending money at WDW. But then again it might not. Plain and simple Disney is one of the very few companies that does not have a loyalty program and they should even though they make enough business without one. Disney has some of the most loyal fans on this planet and they should show a little more appreciation than just a few pitiful discounts or programs here and there that a lot of annual passholders don't use.(except maybe the room discount)

 

[wdwowner]

And not sure why you singled out Kevin on that remark a lot of us have said this for a long time.

I did that because Kevin has been very vocal in the past about how the discount on an AP renewal is not a loyalty program. It is. You get a discount when you renew your AP. If you buy regular park pass you do not get a discount when the pass days are used and you go to buy another regular park pass. Plain and simple.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

It's funny because I think WDW has an anti-loyalty program.

My parents and sister don't travel there anywhere near the number of times that I do but guess who has gotten Pin codes to lure them back and who hasn't. I got one through my Disney Visa but that opened to the public soon afterwards. I'm a loyal Disney customer and they know it.

It is kinda creepy. If you call the reservationists they know who has traveled with you in the past and can tell how often you have stayed on property. While I expect that it kept in a central computer, I didn't expect it on the screen of the reservationist.

Talk about disappointng. I used to use the Disney Visa regularly, then a friend mentioned she got a promotion of 5X more points on certain items but I did not. Stopped using the card, a few month later guess what shows up in my mail? The same promotion to lure me into using it again.

Sounds like an anti-loyalty program to me.

 

[DisneyKevin]

And if you need to complain all the time about WDW and Disney then you need to stop going and find another hobby.

Can the same be said about a podcast and website that seems to bother you as badly as this one does?

With nothing but negative posts about the same subject...well, this and D23....I'd think that you would take your own advice.

I did that because Kevin has been very vocal in the past about how the discount on an AP renewal is not a loyalty program. It is. You get a discount when you renew your AP. If you buy regular park pass you do not get a discount when the pass days are used and you go to buy another regular park pass. Plain and simple.

Just saying it is doesnt make it true.

You are more than welcome to single me out because I disagree with you and every time you post the same diatribe, I will point out it's flaws as I see them...plain and simple

This has become a one note symphony and as I have explained on more occasions than I can count....an annual pass is available to the first time guest. That in and of itself negates any possibility of being a loyalty program.

The other flaw in your post is that you do get a discount by purchasing a pass with more days on it. That means the 10 day pass is a loyalty program too? Do you think anyone believes that?

It's a way to make sure that guests return and when guests return....they spend more money. A guest with a 10 day pass will need a place to stay, meals etc.

As a shareholder, I'm surprised that you dont see that.

 

[jcb]

On the subject of whether Disney "should" adopt a customer loyalty program for frequent park visitors, it appears it is not in the stars.

Disney's CFO (Tom Stagg) was at a conference earlier this month (9/15/09) and was asked about promotions for theme parks and "how does that remain intact through the holiday period or at what point do you sort of pull those promotions?" He replied:

I think that's something that will evolve over time. With regard to holiday bookings, I can confirm that we are still taking bookings for the holiday period, but I won't say a lot more than that. You are right to point out that the consumers are making decisions closer in. We've gone through a period of time where the consumer has at least for now, an expectation of promotions. We've been through that type of period before and we are pursuing the kind of strategy that worked in the past to sort of promote as we needed to and then pull back on the promotions as the market supported the full priced approach to our marketing and to consumers. We expect that we will do that again.​

Understanding that Disney isn't going to go an investor conference and make any major announcements (especially as this conference was the week before the D23 conference), it is still disturbing that their strategy seems to be entirely reactionary. Maybe they can afford to be this way, for now. Stagg also said that based on the "volumes that we've had in the past year, the promotions have been effective."

I realize this is more along the lines of what Pete has said about WDW's business model than it does a customer loyalty program. I think Pete is right in saying there will be a day when the public will "revolt" at WDW's prices (value). It is already getting harder for me to justify going and staying onsite with the frequency I would like.

But what it also says is that the folks who responded saying that theme park attendance has been good enough that WDW doesn't need to have a customer loyalty program probably have at least as good a point as mine about DVC (I'm still not prepared to concede that DVC membership is irrelevant, however). Stagg did say, after all, "the trends that we've seen in the [theme park] bookings that we talked about when we last announced our earnings [July 30, 2009] have been relatively consistent since that point in time."

I was also going to point out that APs are not loyalty programs but Kevin just beat me to it. He said it better than I could.

I am sure glad it is Friday.

 

[Madi100]

Just to add a coorection there - as a DVC member you can get roo
discounts, typically in the region of 25% off rack room rates.
It is subject to availability, just like AP room rate discounts. We've done that before where we've already used up our points in a given use year.

I agree that a loyalty programme is overdue. However as a DVC member I'd be pretty upset if a programme offered similar benefits to DVC when I've forked out $$$$$ for the privilege of DVC.
From Disney's perspective I agree it would impact on new DVC memberships. That combined with their general stubborn attitude says to me that it'd be a long time before a good loyalty programme appears.
There's still more they could do for DVC members.
There's other things they need to do first like make sure they have a working website and online reservation system.
Don't hold your breath for them to act quickly
on anything other than guest safety...

I agree 100% with you. As a DVC member, I'm already out the free dining, which would be a better deal. However, if they offer an incentive program for guest loyalty I don't see how they can make it work for guests without making the DVC members a little upset.

 

[Madi100]

I think it is time to end this subject already.

When you go to a town and need a room to stay at, there are many hotels to choose from, thus a program to encourage people to stay with them and give them a little something in return.

If I remember correctly Disney has, let's see, 1, 2, two resorts in the entire US. Either you stay at an off site hotel and deal with tourist trap crap, or stay in the bubble and not worry about life and escape. It's that simple.

There are PLENTY of perks available already available. AP's, DVC, Castaway Club, Disney Visa......

I can already hear Kevin, 'An AP discount renewal is not enough'. Well any amount of discount off the normal price is a perk. Families who visit once every 10 years do not get any discounts on park passes at all. Kevin and other people who visit frequently believe they deserve 'extra perks', even above what they get already.

As a frequent visitor I would like more discounts and perks too, but the stockholder side of me also want my investment in the company to continue to grow, and every time free stuff is given away that make my stock price go down. The only thing I see that the Castaway Club changes have done is make a first time cruiser not have the ability to get seatings, excursions and cabin choices on the same playing field and everyone else. When first timers find out only the frequently cruisers can get into Palos and they never had a chance to, they will not come back.

Conclusion, if you love WDW then go as often as you can. If you can find discounts take them. If you want a loyalty program they are there, but some people just want more free stuff no matter what and they will never be happy. And if you need to complain all the time about WDW and Disney then you need to stop going and find another hobby.

I cringe when I see your posts. I think that you state your opinion very well. Sometimes I even agree with it. However, I rarely see a post where you don't attack some member of the podcast, and I just don't understand it. Kevin wasn't even a part of this conversation when you posted.

 

[dpuck1998]

I cringe when I see your posts. I think that you state your opinion very well. Sometimes I even agree with it. However, I rarely see a post where you don't attack some member of the podcast, and I just don't understand it. Kevin wasn't even a part of this conversation when you posted.

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

 

[shellyminnie]

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

So true.

 

[Madi100]

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

Are you telling me I have a small mind?

 

[jcb]

Are you telling me I have a small mind?

I was asking the same question about myself!

 

[katscradle]

I cringe when I see your posts. I think that you state your opinion very well. Sometimes I even agree with it. However, I rarely see a post where you don't attack some member of the podcast, and I just don't understand it. Kevin wasn't even a part of this conversation when you posted.

Nicole I couldn't have said it better, thank you.