Why the Middle class is not being out priced, the Washington Post article is one sided at best.

[Tonka's Skipper]

Parks
Disney is Available to the Middle Class – A Rebuttal to the Washington Post
June 14, 2015 dadfordisney Leave a comment


On Saturday, Drew Harwell of the Washington Post wrote an article discussing how theme parks, using Walt Disney World as the prime example, have left the middle class behind. My article, today, is a rebuttal to his arguments. I found his article and arguments flawed in a number of areas and will flesh out those flaws in the rebuttal.

1) Stop Sticker Shocking People

Mr. Harwell did this on a number of occasions in this article. He mentioned “dine on a $115 steak, enjoy a $53-per-person dessert party and sleep in a bungalow overlooking the Seven Seas Lagoon starting at $2100 a night.” I love when people mention the $2100/night bungalows at the Polynesian Village Resort. Those bungalows are part of the Disney Vacation Club which, yes, you need to be a member to join and, yes, it costs a lot of money to join the Disney Vacation Club (trust me as a member, I know). But as part of the Disney Vacation Club, these villas are rarely, if ever, available to the general public. But journalists like to trot out how much they cost per night like any member of the general public can book those rooms. They can’t but the writer mentions the cost per night of the bungalows twice: “starting at $2100 a night…..stilted Bora Bora Bungalow that can cost up to $3400 a night.” Which is it? Do they cost $2100 a night or $3400 a night? Like I mentioned earlier, they cost a Disney Vacation Club member anywhere from 115 to 227 points per night. How many people can afford these? Very, very, very few. But please don’t talk about these rooms like they are available to everyone with just a phone call to Walt Disney World.

Mr. Harwell also brings up the “$195 pampering for little girls that includes a makeover, hair-styling, a costume, and a princess sash,” which one can get at Bibbidi Bobbidi Boutique. The writer fails to mention that packages start at a more affordable $55 and that girls AND boys (there is a Knight package for $19), as old as 12, go the Bibbidi Bobbidi Boutique for these events. Ask any 12-year old and they will emphatically tell you they are NOT a little girl or boy.

2) No mention of budgeting for Disney or how affordable Disney can be

As an independent travel agent, I work with people who have a variety of budgets. Walt Disney World is able to accommodate people with a wide variety of budgets. Rooms can start as low as $95 per night during the off-peak seasons at Walt Disney World’s value resorts. Where was this mentioned in the article? Nowhere. Walt Disney World can be done on a budget that a “middle class” family can afford. Steaks can be had, at some restaurants, for as low as $26. Will that $26 steak be off the same quality and the restaurant of the same ambiance as the $115 steak? No. Will the guest, at Walt Disney World, enjoy the experience any less at the more affordable restaurant? No, they could have a similar if not better experience. Walt Disney World Imagineers put as much thought into the themeing of the more value resorts and restaurants as they do in the deluxe resorts and restaurants. That part of the Magic of Disney. Guests from many classes and income backgrounds can have a wonderful experience. But this article is so focused on the 1%, that they lose the 99% who go to Disney on a budget and have a wonderful time. Would everybody love to be able to go to Walt Disney World without a budget and not worry about the costs? Of course. But most people do have budgets and Disney is able accommodate a variety of budgets.

This brings to the $53-per-night dessert party. Most of these dessert parties have a few desserts and guests have an “up-close view of the night-time fireworks shows.” Some of these dessert parties have character interactions but most do not. But like the cost of the rooms and the cost of steak, there is no mention that there are plenty of places where guests can watch the fireworks for free especially the Magic Kingdom and Hollywood Studios fireworks. The Wishes fireworks show at Magic Kingdom has great free viewing areas just outside The Contemporary Resort and along the beach at The Polynesian Village Resort. The Hollywood Studios fireworks show can easily be seen just outside Hollywood Studios. Guests can take the boat to the theme park, not enter, and get a great view (if not better view) than those guests inside Hollywood Studios and it does not cost them anything. This strategy works well for guests who have not bought theme park tickets for the day or park hoppers for their tickets and have already visited another park earlier in the day.

3) Is Tiered Pricing Expected or Just Survey?

At the beginning of the article, the writer mentions, “the theme-park giant’s prices are expected to climb even more through a surge-pricing system that could value a summer’s day of rides and lines $125.” The writer back-pedals from this (probably after most people have stopped reading) to, “Disney surveys sent last month to guests suggested the giant was considering a tiered pricing structure that clock peak-time “Gold” tickets, during summer and winter holidays, at $125.” Which is it, Mr. Harwell? Is the surge-ticket pricing expected or just a trial balloon survey? Mentioning that the ticket price increase is expected in the beginning of the article and then back-pedaling to considering later in the article is shock-value journalism at its finest. Don’t scare people into thinking another ticket increase is expected.

A survey sent to guests does not mean that another ticket price increase is coming. Disney has been sending out similar surveys for years. With the advent of social media and the ability to take a screen shot of the survey with a cell phone which can be posted for everyone to see. This has caused rumors like this to fly around the internet. Will Disney implement surge/tiered pricing? It’s difficult to say. A trip to Walt Disney World is more than a one-day event for most people which is where tiered pricing is easiest to implement. A multi-day vacation to Walt Disney World will have a lot of people crossing over into different tiers and how does the cost of the ticket get calculated over multiple tiers? Disney has a lot of questions that they need to answer before they roll out a tiered/surge pricing scale. That will take years not months or days to answer.

4) Pulling On Heart Strings Using Walt Disney’s Name

“If Walt [Disney] were alive today, he would probably be uncomfortable with the prices they’re charging right now.” Statements, like this one, made by Scott Smith, assistant professor of hospitality at the University of South Carolina, have always bothered me. How do we know what Walt Disney would think of Walt Disney World today? Walt Disney had dreams for Disneyland and for Walt Disney World. He got to see and experience his dreams for Disneyland. He never got to experience those dreams at Walt Disney World. Walt Disney liked to make money. He did not like making money for the sake of making money. He liked making money because it allowed funding for bigger dreams. Making money made him less dependent on outside funding for his dreams. Some could argue that he would be comfortable with the current ticket prices. Why? Because he could now fund bigger dreams. This is no different from the Walt Disney Corporation using the profits from theme park ticket prices and resort stays to fund new movies and new theme park attractions to drive people into the parks and keeping the cycle going with “bigger dreams.”

Walt Disney believed that everyone was a VIP. Disney cast members are expected to treat everyone like a VIP whether they are staying at the Pop Century Resort or staying at the Four Seasons Orlando (not a Walt Disney World property) with, “rooms starting at $449 a night.” For the most part, cast members, in the parks and resorts, treat everyone like a VIP. Like any large industry, there will be exceptions to the rule. Whether you spend $2000 or $20,000 on your Disney vacations, Disney cast members will treat you like a VIP.

A short story to close: A friend of mine was staying at one of Disney’s Moderate Level resorts. One of her sons lost his autograph book during their day in the theme parks. She went to the front desk of the resort and told them what had happened, which characters had signed the book and what could be done to find the lost autograph book. When they returned from dinner, there was a brand new autograph book with signatures from all the characters they had seen during the day plus a few extra. Did the cast member have to go to that length to make the customer happy? No, but Disney treats everyone like a VIP no matter who you are or how big you pocket book may be.

BY:
Mr Tim Brooks

 

[rteetz]

I'd just like to add Tiered pricing or something along the lines of it is expected.

 

[Confederate Scott]

I have not read the article you refer to but would agree that Disney is affordable for a typical middle class family. Here is link to an article from the DIS in April that dispels many of the myths that a Disney trip is not affordable. http://www.wdwinfo.com/planning/disney-myth-buster-a-disney-vacation-is-too-expensive/

 

[rteetz]

I have not read the article you refer to but would agree that Disney is affordable for a typical middle class family. Here is link to an article from the DIS in April that dispels many of the myths that a Disney trip is not affordable. http://www.wdwinfo.com/planning/disney-myth-buster-a-disney-vacation-is-too-expensive/

The dis article compares vacations that can be done on the cheap or expensive. Compared to other popular vacations disney is expensive. A beach vacation for example to let's say Destin, FL can be done much cheaper. It's all dependent on the family too. A family of five is going to have to spend usually a good amount more than a family of four at disney. Also airfare needs to be accounted for a lot of people fly to disney rather than drive, flying isn't cheap. Most middle class salaries aren't getting bigger while Disney vacations have, I think that's the biggest part of this.

 

[patsal]

I found fault with much of the article. I also thought what an odd time to put it out there considering the price increases were months ago. It also fails to mention that the $115 steak is a steak for two. There was much to find not quite right about the article. Sadly as an independent travel agent myself, I will now have to deal with the aftermath of this article that was skewed at best.

 

[Planogirl]

The article was over the top but a trip to WDW is expensive and getting more so. Transportation is outrageous now and from the Disney side of it so are passes and food. Middle class wages have budged very little in quite some time while the cost of virtually everything has gone up and up. Other things do take priority over trips to WDW.

I'm not saying that all middle class people can't go to WDW but simple logic would say that as prices go up and salaries (in theory) don't then many people won't be able to afford it at some point. When that occurs will of course depend on each family's circumstances.

 

[rteetz]

I found fault with much of the article. I also thought what an odd time to put it out there considering the price increases were months ago. It also fails to mention that the $115 steak is a steak for two. There was much to find not quite right about the article. Sadly as an independent travel agent myself, I will now have to deal with the aftermath of this article that was skewed at best.

It was put out there because of the frenzy or panic that this survey from disney has caused.

 

[smidgy]

and the tickets costing over $100? that is for a one day ticket to MK. says nothing about days 5 through 10 costing $10 each.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

I'd just like to add Tiered pricing or something along the lines of it is expected.

We will see what happens. My complaint about the tiers pricing right now, is it makes a visit just that much more complicated!

AKK

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

It not just Disney getting more expensive........Uni is slowly and quietly matching a lot of WDW pricing..........been to a concert?,...hundreds for 2 or 3 hours of show???.......Ball game????....last I saw was $110 per person, not including transportation.....movies....with snacks, parking etc...$25.00 +, for 2 .5 hours.

AKK

 

[Lewisc]

DIS members aren't typical visitors. Years ago I read the average family visiting WDW was going to have one, maybe 2, trips in their lifetime. They don't care how much credit card debt they incur.

Budget conscious people rarely go to a movie theater. They either "steal" new movies on the internet or watch movies via Netflix, Redbox, etc. You can get tickets to most baseball stadiums, less popular games, for under $20. Check travelzoo promotions. Get on the email list for your favorite team. Check places like stubhub.

Disney is expensive. People think its worth it. Disney is able to raise prices.

JMO but tier prices is nothing more then a money grab. People going during peak times face crowds. They face lines. They may not get to do everything they want. They'll be paying more and getting less. Peak pricing for hotel rooms is a little different. Disney has a finite number of rooms.

Concerts The very top tier concerts are $$$. I constantly get emails and travelzoo promotions for many concerts.

 

[Castle2Castle]

JMO but tier prices is nothing more then a money grab. People going during peak times face crowds. They face lines. They may not get to do everything they want. They'll be paying more and getting less. Peak pricing for hotel rooms is a little different. Disney has a finite number of rooms.

They have a finite amount of park space and ride capacity too. If anything, there would seem to be less park and ride capacity than there are hotel rooms since off-site hotels provide additional options.

Under the tiered price proposal people going during peak times would pay more and still face crowds and lines, but they would be smaller crowds and lines than they otherwise would be at the lower price point.

 

[oddman]

Parks
Disney is Available to the Middle Class – A Rebuttal to the Washington Post
June 14, 2015 dadfordisney Leave a comment

Sorry mate but the Post writer is correct , and I can say that without having read a single word...



Here is how it goes.


over the last 15 years Disney World has increased prices beyond inflation to the point that a 1 day ticket costs twice as much as it did 15 years ago (averaged out over 20 odd years )

Now I have to be clear because disfans don't like this fact as it does not make Disney look friendly.. so.

If we take the cost of a ticket from 1995, 1999, 2002, etc and adjust it to todays dollars they work out at about 50% of todays price to enter.

as we take the average family income 1995 , 1999, 2002 etc and adjust into todays dollars we do not see a real increase in incomes for working and middle class they have DECLINED in adjusted dollars. That has been offset somewhat by increased purchasing power of the dollar for some goods. but overall it is a loss or at best a wash.


so tickets cost twice as much.

middle class is the same or lower


Disney is now less affordable for the middle classes than is has been over the last 20 odd years.


It is important not to turn this into a fight over the exact percentages because they don't matter, what matters is that families have less ability to purchase a family vacation to Disneyworld than they did when we were kids....


can any family save up and go, of course, but that does not mean it compares favorably with other goods and services and thus can be viewed as comparatively unaffordable .


In real terms it costs more to visit Disney than it has over the last decade or so and looks set to see a whole new bunch of increases. Disney knows they don't need the middle class and that there is more money in having a crowd made up of wealthy folk who are more likely to drop a wallet load of cash on a stuffed toy and a fancy dinner.

 

[sheetz]

To me it's a Captain Obvious story--Disney's target audience is clearly the upper-middle class and higher income group (although by scrimping and saving most people can still afford to go to WDW). The more interesting thing to see is how so many people are outraged by it. Nobody would care if the story was about Ritz Carlton pricing their hotels higher than what middle class people can afford, but if Disney does it then watch out for the torches and pitchforks.

 

[oddman]

To me it's a Captain Obvious story--Disney's target audience is clearly the upper-middle class and higher income group (although by scrimping and saving most people can still afford to go to WDW). The more interesting thing to see is how so many people are outraged by it. Nobody would care if the story was about Ritz Carlton pricing their hotels higher than what middle class people can afford, but if Disney does it then watch out for the torches and pitchforks.

I just read the story and the guy is mostly correct. He should have included middle class income figures along side so it would be clearer to objectors that incomes (in the usa) have not kept pace with Disney cost increases .

The target market has in fact shrunk in the USA over the last twenty years. I believe it is the loss of a true middle class that has is being exposed more than anything else.


But the important part is that the percentage of Americans who can afford to visit Disney continues to decline as Disney continues to increase prices and real wages fail to keep up. But the expanding size of the total market has more than offset this as Disney continues to cast a wider net and as a larger percentage of the GLOBAL population finds international flights and Disney more affordable than ever.


so less Americans can afford to go , but many more earthlings can afford to go , even if they only go once or twice in their lives the pool of potential consumers has grown and will continue to grow for a long time.

 

[Castle2Castle]

Disney knows they don't need the middle class and that there is more money in having a crowd made up of wealthy folk who are more likely to drop a wallet load of cash on a stuffed toy and a fancy dinner.

It is not necessarily the case that there is more money in a smaller crowd of wealthier customers than there is in a larger crowd of the average populace. Even if there were, the increases as such would be in revenue rather than attendance, but attendance has continued increasing.

 

[skier_pete]

Disney vacations have gotten much less affordable over time relative to income, the rate of ticket price increases in the last 8 years is beyond outrageous. However the article is pretty much a sensationalist hack-job of what I would expect from most main-stream media. It talks about 1-day ticket prices like someone going on a "once in a lifetime vacation" is going to pay that for the day. There are still ways to make a Disney trip affordable, and certainly affordable for a middle class income family. The article makes it look like the high end is the norm. We've been to Disney 10 times and have never budgeted more than $4000, and often under $3000, which is not extravagant for a week-long vacation, and that is staying on-property with airline tickets. A family of 4 staying off-property could certainly best $3000 depending on where they are coming from. (Airfare can be a massive factor in any vacation plans.)

Edit: I did a little research, and "middle class" is now defined pretty broadly, with incomes between $32K and $150K. That's a pretty huge difference. I was thinking of "middle class" as being around $100K annual income. I would agree a family making <$50K a year would have a hard time affording a trip to WDW.

 

[oddman]

It is not necessarily the case that there is more money in a smaller crowd of wealthier customers than there is in a larger crowd of the average populace. Even if there were, the increases as such would be in revenue rather than attendance, but attendance has continued increasing.

cool, but of course I did not suggest the crowd would be smaller, I think it will remain close to capacity.

the % of global consumers who can afford 1 or more trips to Disneyworld in their lives has increased hugely over the last couple of decades. It is true too that the % of Americans who can afford to visit has declined in the same time frame.


As such I expect Disney to increase profits by ensuring they stay focused on higher income visitors. I don't like it at all, and feel it sucks for so so many Americans, but this is the result of 40 years of winner takes all America..

 

[Castle2Castle]

cool, but of course I did not suggest the crowd would be smaller, I think it will remain close to capacity.

Unless you think the "wealthy folk" outnumber the middle class, your suggestion that Disney would rather have a crowd of such folk implies a smaller group of customers. And if the middle class is being priced out, they need to not only increase their visits to continue driving attendance year-over-year, but they'd need to increase visits even more to also offset the much larger drop in attendance by the middle class.

the % of global consumers who can afford 1 or more trips to Disneyworld in their lives has increased hugely over the last couple of decades. It is true too that the % of Americans who can afford to visit has declined in the same time frame.

People in other countries may be doing better over the past couple of decades, but they still generally have fewer "wealthy folk" than they do middle class, so you're still talking about smaller target markets. Even among those wealthier international guests, travel costs to the U.S. are higher and the USD has made Disney World even more expensive for them over the past couple of years.

 

[gmboy95]

I have been to Disney over 30 times....and will continue to go....that being said I agree with the Post article 100%!!!!!.....the Disney of today is not the one of just 15 years ago when it comes to affordability...anyone saying differently is denying simple math