Why SSR over AKL for "value"

[djohn06]

Animal Kingdom Lodge feels isolated to me and I've only stayed there once and it's my dead last choice. I'd rather stay offsite at one of the vacation clubs at Hilton, Marriott or Sheraton than Animal Kingdom. So SSR was definitely more attractive to me than Animal Kingdom Lodge. Everybody feels differently about the DVC resorts, that's for sure. I also feel the dues will continue to climb higher because of the animals.

Hilton or Marriott? Wow those are strong words. You don't even get extra magic hours.

 

[supersnoop]

For me it doesn't make sense to buy into SSR "to save" in this current environment. You can buy AKV now for the same price as SSR and get 3 more years. Plus if you ever need to sell points, not too many people are asking to buy SSR beyond the 7 month mark like AKV. Typically, you can command a premium for selling AKV points beyond 7 months. On SSR it's much harder to do that. There are times when it can be difficult to get into a certain category at AKV too. To me the fact that I can buy less points than SSR, enjoy a 11 month booking window, sell my points 7 months in advance at a place most people want to stay is huge. The difference in points between an animal kingdom value 2 bedroom vs SSR 2 bedroom is 49 points during dream season. That's a significant difference. You have to buy 49 additional points which will cost you another $3500 to $4000. I just bought a 100 point add on at AKV loaded for $73. Since both resorts are about the same in price, I felt no need to to buy 125 SSR points to get the same room class. The maint fees are lower at SSR. I get that. But, AKV has too many feature to ignore. Also to those who say it's only 3 more years, sell your points for 3 years and I'm pretty sure you can pay 6 to 8 years worth of maint fees. That alone is like throwing 4k to 5k away on a 100 point contract. Don't see how anyone leaves this out as a factor.

The maintenance fee difference is too large to ignore. $1 over 43 years is $43 per point in today's dollars.

 

[Dean]

The maintenance fee difference is too large to ignore. $1 over 43 years is $43 per point in today's dollars.

And one can routinely get Savannah and Standard view at 7 months. As with any other resort purchase, both depend on how you'll use it plus the other usual factors.

 

[djohn06]

The maintenance fee difference is too large to ignore. $1 over 43 years is $43 per point in today's dollars.

Kind of lost on this point. Everyone's situation is different. This is what works for me and why I feel AKV is the better deal financially.

Here are my facts that went into the decision making process. You can buy SSR or AKV around the same price today.

1 bedroom Value = 167 points during dream season. Guarantees me 1 week there. SSR buyer needs 200 points to get a STD room for 1 week at AKV. Value rooms are hard to get at 7 months.

Purchase price AKV 167 pts @ $75 = $12,525
SSR purchase price 200 pts @$75 = $15,000

Sell your last 3 years of AKV points to match SSR's expiration @ a $7 pp profit =$3,507.

Subtotal on AKV savings $5982 over contract life.

AKV vs SSR Maint fee difference per year (will assume AKV Maint fee is 23 percent more until 2054. But, since i purchased 19 percent less points, my Maint fees on 167 AKV should be no more than $50 per year than the Maint fees on the 200 SSR points (actually right now 200 SSR points is $982 and AK is $996 on 167 points).

Based on a fair comparison of 40 years left on contract, I have determined that there is no way that my $5,982 will ever be made up on a SSR contract vs. AKV value, unless the difference in my scenario amounts to $150 a year starting next year.

Also, with the DVC availability tool I was about to snag a value 1 bedroom at the end of my kids school year, and over labor day weekend 2015 for 6 days each. So, as long as you own at AKV you have an excellant shot at getting value 1 bedrooms. 2 bedrooms are definitely harder but still very doable.

 

[djohn06]

Oh in the earlier post about buying SSR first. Buy where you want to stay and then play around with points elsewhere. If you love SSR then buy there. You don't want to have to get stuck somewhere because it was cheaper. If you are looking for cheap, buy another resort on eBay for $200 and trade into SSR via RCI. It's almost always open.

My first purchase was BLT because I wanted to walk to Magic Kingdom. Imagine my disappointment if I bought 200 SSR points, spending $15,000 and couldn't go the week after Christmas because BLT was full at 7 months. Don't get me wrong. SSR points are generally good at 7 months if you are flexible. I just wouldn't settle out of the gate.

 

[MountainMouse]

The maintenance fee difference is too large to ignore. $1 over 43 years is $43 per point in today's dollars.

I don't have excel handy and I'm not a finance guy, but is this math right? Just looks a little to simple. I would think that $1 over 43 years would be less than $43 in today's value.

 

[Dean]

Kind of lost on this point. Everyone's situation is different. This is what works for me and why I feel AKV is the better deal financially.

Here are my facts that went into the decision making process. You can buy SSR or AKV around the same price today.

1 bedroom Value = 167 points during dream season. Guarantees me 1 week there. SSR buyer needs 200 points to get a STD room for 1 week at AKV. Value rooms are hard to get at 7 months.

Purchase price AKV 167 pts @ $75 = $12,525
SSR purchase price 200 pts @$75 = $15,000

Sell your last 3 years of AKV points to match SSR's expiration @ a $7 pp profit =$3,507.

Subtotal on AKV savings $5982 over contract life.

AKV vs SSR Maint fee difference per year (will assume AKV Maint fee is 23 percent more until 2054. But, since i purchased 19 percent less points, my Maint fees on 167 AKV should be no more than $50 per year than the Maint fees on the 200 SSR points (actually right now 200 SSR points is $982 and AK is $996 on 167 points).

Based on a fair comparison of 40 years left on contract, I have determined that there is no way that my $5,982 will ever be made up on a SSR contract vs. AKV value, unless the difference in my scenario amounts to $150 a year starting next year.

Also, with the DVC availability tool I was about to snag a value 1 bedroom at the end of my kids school year, and over labor day weekend 2015 for 6 days each. So, as long as you own at AKV you have an excellant shot at getting value 1 bedrooms. 2 bedrooms are definitely harder but still very doable.

We can nit pick the numbers in a number of ways with no one being particularly right or wrong, we simply don't know. Personally I think it's unrealistic to think AKV will be the same as SSR long term (likely a long term spread around $5) but it should be fairly close so I'm OK with ignoring any price difference there. I have no idea the value of 3 yrs of points in 40 yrs, so I'm inclined not to count it either way. It's just as likely, if not more so, that it'll add to the cost rather than reduce it therefore I'd personally simply ignore it. Assuming long term fees remain constant between the 2, also optimistic I believe, AKV would be roughly $1400 more in fees over 40 yrs. I'd therefore put the difference at more like $1000 in favor of AKV with the other assumptions but I'd also add the TMV to the $1000.

The big kicker is that those numbers, no matter which other assumings we make, assume every AKV point is used for value every year. They also assume one could never get value using SSR. Thus the argument only makes sense comparing cost to SSR this way if one buys solely for AKV value AND that plan stays in place for the full time. Obviously there are other factors besides cost, maybe one wants concierge or just not to have to worry about the 7 month window, but that's another discussion.

 

[Dean]

I don't have excel handy and I'm not a finance guy, but is this math right? Just looks a little to simple. I would think that $1 over 43 years would be less than $43 in today's value.

On a per point basis over 40 yrs the aggregate dues would be $466.57 vs $567.30 between the 2 assuming compounded interest at 4%.

 

[MountainMouse]

Kind of lost on this point. Everyone's situation is different. This is what works for me and why I feel AKV is the better deal financially. Here are my facts that went into the decision making process. You can buy SSR or AKV around the same price today. 1 bedroom Value = 167 points during dream season. Guarantees me 1 week there. SSR buyer needs 200 points to get a STD room for 1 week at AKV. Value rooms are hard to get at 7 months. Purchase price AKV 167 pts @ $75 = $12,525 SSR purchase price 200 pts @$75 = $15,000 Sell your last 3 years of AKV points to match SSR's expiration @ a $7 pp profit =$3,507. Subtotal on AKV savings $5982 over contract life. AKV vs SSR Maint fee difference per year (will assume AKV Maint fee is 23 percent more until 2054. But, since i purchased 19 percent less points, my Maint fees on 167 AKV should be no more than $50 per year than the Maint fees on the 200 SSR points (actually right now 200 SSR points is $982 and AK is $996 on 167 points). Based on a fair comparison of 40 years left on contract, I have determined that there is no way that my $5,982 will ever be made up on a SSR contract vs. AKV value, unless the difference in my scenario amounts to $150 a year starting next year. Also, with the DVC availability tool I was about to snag a value 1 bedroom at the end of my kids school year, and over labor day weekend 2015 for 6 days each. So, as long as you own at AKV you have an excellant shot at getting value 1 bedrooms. 2 bedrooms are definitely harder but still very doable.

Just like the earlier post I'm not sure on the math here but regardless I think this makes a good point. You are locked into a value accommodation to get the savings, but personally the values sound like a nice value (for lack of a better word). If the maintenance fees for AKL increase at a higher rate then it's a different story.

 

[Syndrome]

There has to be something said for the differences in the "value" accommodations at AKV . Unlike standard category at BWV or BLT which the rooms are physically the same as the other rooms, just differing views , AKV "value" rooms ARE different, so you are getting LESS . The AKV value rooms are smaller, dont have the extra sleeper chair and there is no "true" 2 bdrm value villa (only lock-offs) Etc.
Personally, we dont prefer the value rooms at AKV , even at the points savings.
For us ..........the value of AKV , is the savanna view villas . Its unique .....where else can you have that ??? At a price thats VERY close to SSR. Thats good value to us. Again .......value is not solely tied to cost.

On a side note ........
I personally think that the points required to stay at SSR are a little on the high side to be honest.

 

[littlestar]

Hilton or Marriott? Wow those are strong words. You don't even get extra magic hours.

Marriott Lakeshore Reserve, Hilton Parc Soleil, or Sheraton Vistana Villages - love those resorts. We always rent a car and I am not a park commando so I never use the extra magic hours. We pop in the parks (annual pass) and back out after a few hours. We typically stay at either SSR or Old Key West and then tack on days offsite with the other major brands.

 

[Dean]

Marriott Lakeshore Reserve, Hilton Parc Soleil, or Sheraton Vistana Villages - love those resorts. We always rent a car and I am not a park commando so I never use the extra magic hours. We pop in the parks (annual pass) and back out after a few hours.

I'd add several to that group to get it to around 10 or so. Our fav has been The Fountains in the 3 BR Presidential's for $79 a night. Overall we still prefer on site including for AKV, SSR & OKW but I strongly agree that the difference is not nearly as much as many think it is.

 

[djohn06]

Marriott Lakeshore Reserve, Hilton Parc Soleil, or Sheraton Vistana Villages - love those resorts. We always rent a car and I am not a park commando so I never use the extra magic hours. We pop in the parks (annual pass) and back out after a few hours. We typically stay at either SSR or Old Key West and then tack on days offsite with the other major brands.

Ok tack on makes sense to me. I did a VGF add on to parc soliel in June. I thought you were saying in lieu of.

 

[djohn06]

The big kicker is that those numbers, no matter which other assumings we make, assume every AKV point is used for value every year. They also assume one could never get value using SSR. Thus the argument only makes sense comparing cost to SSR this way if one buys solely for AKV value AND that plan stays in place for the full time. Obviously there are other factors besides cost, maybe one wants concierge or just not to have to worry about the 7 month window, but that's another discussion.

I agree the numbers are subjective. A person just needs to make them work for themselves. I just cant give SSR the clear cut nod. Again, for my family we have BLT and HHI points as well. So I have no problem banking or selling AKV points in years I can't get a value room.

I agree on the assumption about SSR and never getting Value. You could probably wait list and snag a couple value 1 bedrooms.

Honestly, I didnt buy AKV for value rooms. I bought for versatility. I can go value route or concierge. It has a lot of depth that other resorts lack when it comes staying there.

 

[djohn06]

There has to be something said for the differences in the "value" accommodations at AKV . Unlike standard category at BWV or BLT which the rooms are physically the same as the other rooms, just differing views , AKV "value" rooms ARE different, so you are getting LESS . The AKV value rooms are smaller, dont have the extra sleeper chair and there is no "true" 2 bdrm value villa (only lock-offs) Etc.
Personally, we dont prefer the value rooms at AKV , even at the points savings.
For us ..........the value of AKV , is the savanna view villas . Its unique .....where else can you have that ??? At a price thats VERY close to SSR. Thats good value to us. Again .......value is not solely tied to cost.

On a side note ........
I personally think that the points required to stay at SSR are a little on the high side to be honest.

Less is subjective.

Yes I get less space if I compare to another unit with the same bedroom count, but I may get a pool or Savannah view too which means I upgraded since STD AKV rooms are less likely to include Savannah views vs Values.

I honestly put value in its own category and do not compare it to bedroom sizes. Since we primarily do 1 or 2 bedrooms, the AKV 1 bedroom actually compares to an "upgraded studio with kitchen". Here is my thought process when looking for a unit for a dream season week. These are the resorts where I normally stay.

BLT studio 141 for lake, 250 for 1 bedroom STD
BWV studio 125 (non STD), 255 for 1 bedroom (non STD)
VGF studio lake 183, 308 STD 1 bedroom.
AKV 1 bedroom value 167

STUDIO Comparison
Notice, the 1 bedroom value room is only 26 more points than a BLT lake view studio and 16 points less than a VGF studio. It is 42 points more than BWV studio, which is a significant amount.

1 Bedroom Comparison
83 points less than BLT, 88 less than than BWV, 141 less than VGF.

So from a point comparison, it's best to not even compare it to 1 bedrooms at the other resorts. The point differential is too huge.

It is a stretch studio with kitchen and washer and dryer. Some studio rooms even cost more (VGF and BLT theme view rooms). In my mind, I'm getting a 1 bedroom for a studio price. But, it's all in the eye of the beholder.

 

[supersnoop]

I don't have excel handy and I'm not a finance guy, but is this math right? Just looks a little to simple. I would think that $1 over 43 years would be less than $43 in today's value.

Assuming the rate of inflation, or expected rate of return, is equal to the rate at which maintenance fees increase, it will take one of today's dollars to pay the equivalent amount of maintenance fees in the future. If maintenance fees increase faster than your rate of return, then you'd actually need more than $1 today to pay the equivalent fee in the future.

 

[Dean]

I agree the numbers are subjective. A person just needs to make them work for themselves. I just cant give SSR the clear cut nod. Again, for my family we have BLT and HHI points as well. So I have no problem banking or selling AKV points in years I can't get a value room.

I agree on the assumption about SSR and never getting Value. You could probably wait list and snag a couple value 1 bedrooms.

Honestly, I didnt buy AKV for value rooms. I bought for versatility. I can go value route or concierge. It has a lot of depth that other resorts lack when it comes staying there.

AKV is likely our preferred resort right now and we do own a smaller contract there but this wasn't about your or my preferences, the OP was related to value more in a $$$ sense. For that situation just to get into the system and use all around, SSR is roughly 25% less long term making the assumption that the fees flow from here and I think that's best case scenario. There are 3 resorts that scare me related to long term ownership costs. They are VB, OKW & AKV. One could put HH there are well I suppose but while I think it's not a good choice to buy simply for WDW, I do believe it's more of a known quantity. For VB it's dues and natural disasters. For AKV it's long term dues and/or loss of amenities related to animals. OKW is the intriguing one but it's related to dues late in the course for the 2042 owners and after the drop out date for the 2057 owners.

 

[littlestar]

Ok tack on makes sense to me. I did a VGF add on to parc soliel in June. I thought you were saying in lieu of.

I was. It is the same way many people feel about SSR. Only they are flipped for me. Good thing Disney has so many different resorts to appeal to everyone.

If I were buying resale between SSR and AKV it would come down to which one I preferred and whether I would book the value rooms at AKV.