Why are Maintenance fee's different?

[MaryPA]

Can anyone explain to me Why the Maintenance Fee's are different?

I can understand why the Resorts out of the World would be different. What I can't understand is why the oldest DVC Resort and the newest DVC Resort have fee's under $4 a point and the others are over.

 

[paulh]

each resort is set up differantly okw and ssr dont have carpets in the hallway outside of room so no cost there to fit and maintain and clean and replace also no nead for aircon in corridor as its oppen to ellements
Paulh

 

[JimC]

Each resort is its own timeshare operation. The two with the lowest fees on property are separate DVC resorts and are quite large -- you can spread the operating costs and reserves over the greater number of points for that resort.

The other resorts are combined with WDW resorts -- so some services are shared across the timeshare and the WDW resorts division. Those DVC resorts are smaller and have fewer points to spread the costs.

 

[PeterPanFanWDW]

I would think it has something to do with number of DVC rooms and amenites offered (inside corridors vs outside).

IMHO

PPF

 

[Chuck S]

Other amenities could include the recreation falilities. BCV has Stormalong Bay which would incur higher maintenance, as well as more carpeted hallway areas. BWV has the boardwalk area, and more restaurants. Probably higher fire insurance rates because of those restaurants. BCV, BWV and VWL have valet parking, so a slight increase in labor costs. Also all of those resorts have fewer DVC rooms, so the cost is spread among fewer points.

SSR & OKW are the two largest DVC resorts, so more points to spread the costs, no carpeted a/c hallways, and no valet parking services. SSR & OKW probably also have lower fire insurance rates because the restaurants are not in the same buildings as any guest rooms.

 

[CarolMN]

Other amenities could include the recreation falilities. BCV has Stormalong Bay which would incur higher maintenance, as well as more carpeted hallway areas. BWV has the boardwalk area, and more restaurants. Probably higher fire insurance rates because of those restaurants. BCV, BWV and VWL have valet parking, so a slight increase in labor costs. Also all of those resorts have fewer DVC rooms, so the cost is spread among fewer points.

SSR & OKW are the two largest DVC resorts, so more points to spread the costs, no carpeted a/c hallways, and no valet parking services. SSR & OKW probably also have lower fire insurance rates because the restaurants are not in the same buildings as any guest rooms.

I doubt very much that BWV owners are paying any of the operating costs of the Boardwalk area or the restaurants. If we are, then we should also be getting a share of the revenue generated by those venues!

The BWI shares the operating expenses of the common areas with the BWV just like the YC & BC shares with the BCV and the WL shares with the VWL.

I do think it costs more to operate the hotel-like DVC resorts than it does to operate the condo-like resorts.

Best wishes -

 

[dianeschlicht]

I do think it costs more to operate the hotel-like DVC resorts than it does to operate the condo-like resorts.

I agree, to a point Carol. I suspect the hallway maintenance etc isn't really thre reason though. OKW and SSR have far more landscape maintenance than the hotel style DVC resorts, while the hotel style DVC's have airconditioning of the larger buildings (including hallways) that make their operating expenses greater. On the other hand, bus fees for SSR and OKW are greater, so who knows why.

 

[tjkraz]

Here are the major differences in 2005 budget between OKW and BCV:

(Dollars are OKW / BCV, expressed as a dollar amount per point)

Admin and Front Desk: $.3868 / $.5335
Housekeeping: $.6839 / $.8170
Maintenance: $.4022 / $.5233
Management: $.2814 / $.3563
Member Activities: $.1035 / $.2221
Transportation: $.3851 / $.1075

I would guess that BCV is higher in most of these areas for two primary reasons:

1. The infrastructure associated with the hotel-style accommodations (as opposed to the condo-style buildings at OKW)

2. Fixed costs being spread over a smaller number of owners.

OKW's transportation budget is quite a bit higher, which is not unexpected. No busses to two of the theme parks at BCV, and it's not uncommon for bus service to be shared between multiple resorts in the Epcot area. OKW has dedicated bus service to all theme parks plus the boat to DTD, thus the higher cost.

 

[CarolMN]

Here are the major differences in 2005 budget between OKW and BCV:

(Dollars are OKW / BCV, expressed as a dollar amount per point)

Admin and Front Desk: $.3868 / $.5335
Housekeeping: $.6839 / $.8170
Maintenance: $.4022 / $.5233
Management: $.2814 / $.3563
Member Activities: $.1035 / $.2221
Transportation: $.3851 / $.1075

I would guess that BCV is higher in most of these areas for two primary reasons:

1. The infrastructure associated with the hotel-style accommodations (as opposed to the condo-style buildings at OKW)

2. Fixed costs being spread over a smaller number of owners.

OKW's transportation budget is quite a bit higher, which is not unexpected. No busses to two of the theme parks at BCV, and it's not uncommon for bus service to be shared between multiple resorts in the Epcot area. OKW has dedicated bus service to all theme parks plus the boat to DTD, thus the higher cost.

Just posting to add:
BCV (and BWV) also pay a portion of the cost of the boat service to MGM and EPCOT.

Both also bear a portion of the cost of valet parking services and room service (neither available at OKW or SSR)

 

[dianeschlicht]

I have a hard time figuring why the BCV administrative/front desk costs should be so much higher. It would seem they should be less fewer rooms and sharing with the BC resort.

 

[Chuck S]

I didn't say BWV was paying "operating" costs for the restaurants and boardwalk...but because there are restaurants located underneath the villas, the insurance is higher. Also, the boardwalk itself would be considered "common area" and/or recreational facilities whose upkeep would be included.

Any building that is located in the same building as a restaurant pays higher fire insurance fees. My former employer built his own building to house a video store. He also built some additional rental space. A restaurant was interested in the space...the fire insurance for ALL the tenants increased because of the "hazard" of a restaurant.

 

[paulh]

its still worth it to me
Paulh

 

[Doctor P]

SSR's dues and current budget are subsidized according to the reports from the end of last year. I expect the dues there to increase significantly but still be less than some of the hotel-based resorts.

 

[KAMLEM]

I would love to know what the basis is for allocating costs for things such as the front desk, valet, transportation, etc., between DVC and Disney for places like BCV where DVC and non-DVC share things such as these. For that matter, I wonder how they account for the fact that all DVC resorts have some percentage of cash customers so we shouldn't have to pay 100% of these types of expenses. I must really sound like a geek but I have always wondered about these kinds of things. Wish I knew someone who worked in Disney Finance.

 

[icydog]

Can anyone explain to me Why the Maintenance Fee's are different?

I can understand why the Resorts out of the World would be different. What I can't understand is why the oldest DVC Resort and the newest DVC Resort have fee's under $4 a point and the others are over.

Depends on the location, the upkeep and the needs of each resort. We own at Vero and the MFs are high due to constant repairs by the ocean. OKW and SSR are both stand alone resorts and are therefore less expensive to keep up. The location of the three hotel based resorts makes them so expensive-=- the land is more valuable.
Marylyn

 

[Dean]

From the standpoint of fees, each resort is different. The only commonalities should be the management costs which should be proportional to the number of units or points at each given resort. Otherwise each resort pays for themselves. VB will likely have higher direct maint costs over time but will not have transportation. BWV will have higher transportation costs but it will be spread over more members. The other thing that will hurt HH and to a degree VB is that the breakage income will be very low. Same will be true to a lessor degree for SSR and OKW.

During the hurricane talk last year someone suggested that other resort members subsidize any increased costs there, a ludicrous idea IMO. But given that DVC THEMSELVES would have had to absorb any overages for the year (under FL law) the long term fees should cover the costs with little affect of what the fees would have been otherwise. FL law says that a resort can avoid paying maint fees on units it owns as long as it agrees to absorb any uncovered costs for any given year. DVC has taken that option.

 

[crisi]

Depends on the location, the upkeep and the needs of each resort. We own at Vero and the MFs are high due to constant repairs by the ocean. OKW and SSR are both stand alone resorts and are therefore less expensive to keep up. The location of the three hotel based resorts makes them so expensive-=- the land is more valuable.
Marylyn

Land is more valuable isn't an operating expense, as the land doesn't depreciate and therefore there is no associated depreciation expense. We suspect BCVs has SAB adding costs - its an expensive resource for upkeep. The constant maintanence of a Boardwalk isnt' cheap either.

Traditionally, as each resort has opened and its fees have been subsidized (I've watched VWL and BCVs and now SSR - BWVs and OKW was before I paid attention) the fees are underestimated the first year and take a larger than usual jump the second and perhaps third years as Disney discovers how much the resort actually costs to run.

 

[JimC]

... FL law says that a resort can avoid paying maint fees on units it owns as long as it agrees to absorb any uncovered costs for any given year. DVC has taken that option.

Dean,

Should members care which way DVC elects to handle this? I suspect that the law was designed to be neutral as to the members/owners. But if operating expenses and/or reserve estimates were less than expected then DVC would benefit because it would cover less than it would have if it simply paid the fees. Is that correct or am I missing something?

 

[disneynutt1225]

"No busses to two of the theme parks at BCV, and it's not uncommon for bus service to be shared between multiple resorts in the Epcot area."

Not to be obnoxious, because I'm new here , but what two theme parks don't have bus transpo from BCV? I was just there in April and was able to get to all theme parks from there (except the water parks, which I don't believe have any direct buses from resorts at all).

 

[Doctor P]

See next post (computer glitch misedited post).