why $10 per point?

[cindyfan]

I think EROS hit it on the head with "SUPPLY AND DEMAND".
That is what will determine the price more than anything.
Which also determines the cash rates available by calling CRO. Just look at what has happened since Sept. We have seen rates dive so low!!

Cash reservations may not differ completely on weekends, but there are other factors involved. Mainly availability of rooms.
So the weekend thing does come into play.

And Knowing that the cash rates aren't available til 60 days before.....we are taking chances. Which makes "renting" points so desirable to those of us wanting to stay at a particular DVC resort.

Doc, I completely agree with your "bottom line" comment.

This all makes the planning of a WDW vacation FUN!!!
Some may not agree with me on that point......but I LOVE the planning !!! and looking for "deals"

Thanks!!

 

[Disney On The Bayou]

I understand supply and demand and everything else, but I wouldn't even consider renting my points to strangers for anything less then $12-$15. In some cases, I may not have a renter, but I would rather give my points to family and friends then to charge just $6-8 points. However, I would certainly consider renting points to a trusting DVC member for a much lower cost, (dues) if that member would return the favor.

 

[cindyfan]

It may be time for me to bow out of this thread......since I am not a DVC member. Even though a potential "renter"

Disney on the Bayou......isn't that discriminatory!!
Who's to say a member can be trusted any more or less than a non-DVC member?
Do you not trust your fellow DIS board members?

Sorry just had to say it.

Now bowing out.....

Thanks for letting me share my thoughts

 

[fkj2]

I don't know that Disney on the Bayou meant to imply anything about his statement; I think that he just feels a sense of camaderie with fellow DVCers.

As Doc as said many times, the rent/trade thing is about trust and being fair to BOTH parties.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Sorry, Renters, you won't be getting any of my 400 points. I'll give them to family and friends before I sell them to people I don't know. We bought our points for our vacations. Why don't you just go out and buy some of your own instead of leeching off of us? [I know I am gonna get flamed for that, but that's my opinion of non-DVC owners renting points. It burns my butt to see people suggesting renting points from DVC owners to bring down the cost of their one time vacation. They don't feel its any kind of problem to add a few extra people to the room, just bring in a few cots or aerobeds.] DVC is family to me. You don't belong to my family. And that includes you, cindyfan, and call it discriminatory if you like. Tough.

 

[ncligs]

Deb and Bill, very well said. I agree with you 100%. I would give them to family or sell them to friends at a very reasonable cost, before I would sell them to strangers and non-DVC members.

 

[Regina]

Okay everyone, let's take a deep breath and try to calm down.

Obviously, this is a hot topic. Let's remember the board rules, and not engage in personal attacks.

Your cooperation is appreciated.

 

[cindyfan]

Quite possibly my intent is to try out the DVC experience or resort before I choose to buy into it.
Did you not do the same????

I am not a "leech" and don't appreciate the attack.
In order to rent points there has to a member "of your family" that is willing to rent them out!

Thanks dvcreg!!
This thread started out civil, and some very good points were brought up!
But, now feeling very unwelcome.......so

NOW, I'm out of here

 

[Dean]

Renters and non members are fine. We should all show respect, both ways. Don't let a few people with strong feelings push you away.

 

[Richyams]

Again, what Dean said.....

 

[mic_KY_mouses]

This is my opinion added into the mix. I think it's to be commended that someone does their homework when deciding whether to rent points or not, or rent out their points or not, or buy into DVC or not..... etc...

We bought into DVC Thanksgiving week while visiting Disney. While in Orlando we stayed in a very, very nice 2 bedroom condo (0ffsite, a mile from the park) for just $300 for a whole week. We did our homework and got a last-minute deal through the TUG board. If I ever feel the need to rent my points I will do my homework once again and do whatever I feel gets ME the best value.

I think all posters on this board should be commended (me included
for doing our homework.......OH, and I gotta go now and call my lawyer to see how I can get adopted by Deb and Bill....since their going to give their points away to family!!!!

 

[TrudyZ]

Whoa, Deb and Bill--- where did that come from??

I am one of those "leeches" you so elequently referred to. I rented points to check out DVC (only packed 3 people in our studio!); and ended up buying a resale (you can thank me now for propping up the value of your DVC membership by increasing the market demand for resales).

Aren't you glad to know I am now one of the "family" (kinda like the red-headed stepchild (no offense to redheads meant here)). How on earth did you let one of us renters in??? Boy, don't you just hate when the family tree goes to hell??

Trudy

PS I had a few extra points and rented some of my points out--and converted two renters to owners. You know, once you let in a bad seed Better sell soon--DVC is being overtaken by former renters!!

 

[PKS44]

First- I am a recent DVC member...I have never rented points or rented out my points, but I might do either in the future if it works for me...Not everyone wants to committ to 40 years with DVC (their loss) but if a member wants the money more than he or she wants the points, this is what markets were created for...I don't think this makes the renter a leech any more than you or I leech off any entrepreneur...it is a simple business transaction...sure I would prefer to rent from/to family or friends, but mostly because with a stranger, I am not sure how comfortable I would be....

It is the insecurity of the whole thing scares me, but just knowing someone is a DVC member is not assurance enough for me...it's true that with another DVC member at least you can sort of know where they are for the next 40 years ... we have non-member friends (oh my goodness!) whom we could not accommodate (we only have a small contract for our own use). They are renting points from a member to go later this year...they found him on the Rent/Trade board...I encouraged them to check the guy out thoroughly and even contact him personally as I believe you can learn a little more from a voice than a post...they did not call him, and have exchanged some of the money already...I hope it all works out but I am nervous. My friends are legit- I don't know about this DVC member. I will be glad when it all works out...

Paul

 

[Regina]

As I said before, I've never been involved in a rental.

From what I've observed, the problem seems to be the expectation that the owners should price the points at a rate that's so low that it's undervaluing the property.

Part of this logic is based on the "great deals" that Disney has for cash stays. If this is the case, why on earth would anyone want to rent? It would remove the element of risk, and the restrictions are far less severe.

We all know the answer. It's because some points are being offered at a bargain basement rate.

While it's free choice, it can be unsettling to see this from an investment perspective.

 

[fkj2]

See, that's my point too....that there's this EXPECTATION that owners should rent the points for such a low price......as though renters are doing us this huge favor by taking those points off our hands.

If potential renters can get such a great deal through Dis (daily housekeeping and 11% room tax), to quote Dis, "Be my guest".

 

[Dean]

Don't be fooled into thinking it's just certain renters who think you should rent too low. I can remember many discussions over the past 2 or 3 years about those with $13-18 per point listings and ebay sales in that range where the member bandwagon was that the member shouldn't charge so much, it wasn't fair to the other members. I've also seen lots of posts from members saying one should only rent for a low amount to other members, somthing in the price range of dues only or $5 per point.

That's not to say these members are trying to deflate the market, I don't think they were. They were just looking at this as a big family and saying you should only rent to family (members and direct family) at a price so as to be careful and not make any profit. I disagree in principal with these people but they are welcome to their opinion and to rent me their points at that price if they want to.

 

[Deb & Bill]

It's always been my understanding that anyone can stay at a DVC property as long as they have either the cash or the points. So to say that you need to rent points to check out DVC is a crock.

 

[PamOKW]

Renting points out to people beyond one's personal circle of friends and family is a grey area with DVC as far as I'm concerned. It moves more into the realm of being a business and I think steps into being a commercial use of the property. The proliferation of the Internet and boards such as these had made renting points much easier for everyone than if people were using classified newspaper ads. I wish the practice had been stopped by DVC but it seems like it is here to stay. In the grand scheme, it is still a very small amount of points that are being rented out this way.

That said, nobody owes anything to anyone in terms of how they price those points. There are no rules, pricing guidelines, cancellation policies....everything is set by the DVC owner and whoever they are dealing with. Also, people should remember this is the Internet, not a family. DVC is a company owned by Disney. It is not a fraternal club or a family. I enjoy sharing information and chatting with people here. I feel I have an idea of what type of person many of you are. But, in reality, I have no way of knowing if you are as represented here. I also have no obligation to price things differently for members vs. non-members. Some members break just as many rules as non-members so that's not necessarily protecting our investment.

I think people read on other boards or the Mousesavers site how they can get deals by renting from members. There are actually only a small amount of people offering those rentals so the prices can fluctuate up and down. People get annoyed when they are asked to pay more than they expected and the member is annoyed that someone is not going to pay what they expect. But, that's business. I hear Macy's is having a big one day sale. I go to see what they are charging for the dress I've been wanting for months. It had been priced at $700. The one day sale has just about everything in the store priced at 50% off. Except that dress...still full price. Can I go and tell the salesperson who badly I want the dress and how good it will look on me and how I'll probably buy more at Macy's if they let me wear it? Oh, and can she also use her employee discount to get me an additional 20% off since I come in all the time and chat with her so I'm like family? I don't think so.

I don't plan on selling my DVC anytime soon and unless the price falls dramatically I can still recoup most of my expenses. Anyone who rents points and then purchases is not doing anything for me. You are giving Disney a profit and paying the salespeople but it has no benefit to me.

 

[John.Disney]

There is nothing going on here that can't be explained by supply and demand as others have pointed out. On paper, renting points from a member at current rates is a great deal if you can find the accomodations you need. If there were more publicity I'm sure the rates would stay above $10 a point.

If you go over to the resorts board you see lots of questions about postcards and when are the new AP specials coming out. It seems like most people aren'y even aware that renting points can get you an even better deal than the postcards in many cases. Or maybe I'm underestimating peoples willingness to take on the risk of dealing independently with a stranger on the net, I don't know.

What I do know is that not every DVC member is affluent enough to be giving away the points they can't use. Also, there is a lot more cost to a WDW vacation than the accomodations, and even once every other year can be a lot for some members (not to mention short or long term drastic changes in people's financial situations). This along with the fact that Disney is not slowing down its sales of new memberships leads me to believe that there will always be a steady supply of points being rented out. Still, the supply will always have its limits.

OTOH, if the word is spread that this is a viable means of getting a great deal on accomodations, demand would be theoretically unlimited. Outside of the risk and *uncomfortableness* of dealing with strangers and not Disney, the price should probably settle somewhere around the AP discounts then available.

I'm not sure what the best way to go about doing that would be (spreading the word), but my guess is it would be something other than the 'us vs. them' attitude taken by some of the posters on this thread. The fact is, the DVC family is a small part of the Disney familiy, which has been around a lot longer. Some renters may be Disney newcomers, but others may have been around a lot longer than you.

John

 

[Disney On The Bayou]

Cindy,

What I was trying to state briefly was: I may rent some unused points to another DVC member for say just the dues on those points, in return, that member would rent me some points in the future for the cost of the dues. Really, borrowing except that you pay the dues in case they increase. Example: I rent from Bob this year when the dues are 3 dollars and somthing, then Bob rents points from me in 2004, but now the dues are 4 dollars and somrthing.