When will the liberals open their eyes?

Jon99

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NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke Thursday turned up the volume on the debate over Social Security reform - an issue that was declared dead last year but has been injected with new life in recent weeks.

In testimony to the Senate Budget Committee, Bernanke described the state of entitlement programs - which include Medicare as well as Social Security - as the "calm before the storm."


And in his introduction to the Senate Budget hearing on Thursday, Committee Chairman Kent Conrad (D-ND) said he and Senator Judd Gregg (R-NH) are "committed to facing up to ... the challenges that we confront with Medicare and Social Security."

Bernanke in his testimony noted that federal spending on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid will increase from 8.5 percent of GDP to 15 percent in 2030.

"Dealing with the resulting fiscal strains will pose difficult choices for the Congress, the Administration and the American people," said Bernanke. "However, if early and meaningful action is not taken, the U.S. economy could be seriously weakened."
5 most serious taxpayer problems

It's not yet certain that Social Security reform will be up for serious debate. For one thing, the war in Iraq may overshadow a lot of issues. Or, the Democrats and Republicans may prove unwilling to bend on critical issues.

Sticking points are likely to be the same as they were when the debate raged in 2005: The creation of individual investment accounts; increasing workers' Social Security taxes; and reducing promised benefits.

But nonpartisan observers such as the American Academy of Actuaries say a solution, if there is to be one, may well include some or all of the above.

"Every change will be painful," said Ron Gebhardtsbauer, the Academy's senior pension fellow. Because we're living longer and the ratio of workers to retirees is projected to go down during the height of the Baby Boomers' retirement, the current system will go out of sync unless something is done, he explained.
Social Security: 5 myths, half-truths and exaggerations

Social Security taxes from today's workers go toward paying today's retirees. Social Security will continue to take in more money than it has to pay out through 2017, according to the latest calculations by the Congressional Budget Office (CBO).

To pay full benefits beyond that point, the program will tap its controversial trust fund - which is a series of special U.S. Treasury bonds issued by the federal government in exchange for the Social Security surplus it spends.

The trust fund is projected to run dry after 2046. After that, Social Security will only be able to pay 79 percent of promised benefits.

While the projected long-term shortfall in Medicare is about six times that of Social Security, the latter is considered more manageable to fix in the near term because its costs are more predictable.
Where some bending points may be

One change from 2005 is that the Democrats are now in the majority in Congress.

The Democrats still adamantly oppose President Bush's proposal to create "carve out" individual investment accounts, in which workers would divert some of their Social Security taxes to fund their accounts in exchange for lower Social Security benefits in retirement.
Play the Social Security Game: Pick your fix

But there may be something for both sides to like about "add-on" investment accounts, which would not divert money from Social Security.

One such type of account is the Portable, Lifelong Universal Savings (PLUS) Account proposed recently by Senator Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.), a member of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee. Sessions proposes that the federal government contribute $1,000 into an individual account for every baby born. And when that person enters the workforce, she would invest at least 1 percent of her pay into the account and her employer would match that contribution.

Sessions also proposes that starting in 2009, every worker would have 1 percent on the first $100,000 of income automatically deducted and invested in a PLUS account along with an employer match.

Republicans may not like that the savings would be mandatory, and libertarians like Chris Edwards, tax policy director at the Cato Institute, label that kind of contribution a tax.

But it would satisfy part of President Bush's objective to create personal investment accounts, and it would satisfy Democrats' desire to increase workers' retirement savings without draining Social Security.

For those who object to mandatory contributions, a possible compromise, Gebhardtsbauer said, might be to only require that workers contribute to an add-on account if their employer does not provide them with a 401(k) or pension.

While add-on accounts don't address the shortfall issues in Social Security, they may allow for more serious consideration of some combination of fixes that are bound to rile one side of the aisle or another, but which actuaries, economists and deficit hawks say will be necessary if a long-term solution is to be reached.

These include:

* Increasing the retirement age slowly over the decades.
* Raising the payroll cap on the amount of wages subject to the Social Security tax. Currently, the first $97,500 of wage income are taxed at 12.4 percent (half paid by you, half paid by your employer).
* Progressive price indexing. Currently accrual of Social Security benefits are indexed to wage growth. Price growth is a lower measure by which to accrue benefits, and progressive price indexing would lower future benefits for middle- and high-income workers relative to what is currently promised, while leaving the promised benefits of low-income workers unchanged.
 
It's not just liberals who need to open their eyes - it's all of us. The AARP is a very formidable organization with a lot of congressional clout. No one wants to tick off the "old" ;) people. Those who do wrangle with them often find themselves short a job the next election cycle. So, what to do? Get rid of a system that never should have been there in the first place. Figure out what everyone paid in and give it back to them. Yes, it will hurt but it's like pulling off a bandaid - the quicker the better.
 
Saddest thing of all is that for what we are spending and have already spent in Iraq, the entire Social Security system could have been fully funded into the 22nd century. :confused3
 
What I didn't get about the AARP's opposition to the private accounts plan as proposed a few years back was the fact that there was going to be no change to affect any member of the AARP. The changes were only going to be for the younger folks. The AARP had no dog in the fight, yet they led the fight. Gives you some pause about their agenda.

/agreeing with Erin yet again
 

Saddest thing of all is that for what we are spending and have already spent in Iraq, the entire Social Security system could have been fully funded into the 22nd century. :confused3

Why does everything need to be tied back to Iraq? Whether there is a war or not, SS is a disaster and needs to be scrapped..
 
Why does everything need to be tied back to Iraq? Whether there is a war or not, SS is a disaster and needs to be scrapped..

Because billions (not millions) of dollars are being spent on a monthly basis and the reprucussions have yet to be felt.
 
Saddest thing of all is that for what we are spending and have already spent in Iraq, the entire Social Security system could have been fully funded into the 22nd century.

That may be a valid point, but it still does not solve the fundamental problem. There's a leak in the bucket. You can either be responsible and fix the leak now, or you can just keep pouring more water into it and leave the problem for later generations to fix.
 
The Republicans have controlled both the executive and legislative branches for quite some time. Whereas they used to represent at least some nod to fiscal responsibility, they have plunged us into a deeper debt than has been seen in decades. Don't know why there is the notion that this is somehow a "liberal" fault. Liberals can be fiscal conservatives and many are. Liberals have not held the purse strings in quite some time. Sounds like there needs to be a mirror handed out for where fault is lying.
 
The Republicans have controlled both the executive and legislative branches for quite some time. Whereas they used to represent at least some nod to fiscal responsibility, they have plunged us into a deeper debt than has been seen in decades. Don't know why there is the notion that this is somehow a "liberal" fault. Liberals can be fiscal conservatives and many are. Liberals have not held the purse strings in quite some time. Sounds like there needs to be a mirror handed out for where fault is lying.

OK. How does that solve the problem?
 
We've had some really good threads on Social Security lately, none of them involved partisan politics, so I hate to see it turn to that now. The original aritcle I posted on this "Entitled Selfishness" from Newsweek mag, laid a large amount of the blame on *both* Bill Clinton and George Bush...each president for eight years, and neither did anything (to this point anyway) about Social Security or Medicare. Shame on both of them.

And for what it's worth, the amount of money that Congress has promised in Social Security and Medicare to all current working and retired Americans is 72 *trillion* dollars.....10 trillion for SS and 62 trillion in Medicare. That's what we'd need in the bank today, earning interest, to cover all future liabilities. I'm fairly certain that what we've spent in Iraq wouldn't cover the bill....
 
OK. How does that solve the problem?

It doesn't solve the problem, but it does illustrate that there is plenty of blame to pass around. Call out "liberals" as the "problem" only drives a further wedge into what is an extremely complex issue with a multiplicity of valid viewpoints and no easy solution. If we would spend less time passing blame and more time looking in the mirror for both responsibility for the problem *and* responsibility for being part of the solution a lot more progress would be made. As a country our politics have become so much more about "I'm right so you must be wrong" that very little is getting done other than having a polarized nation of ideologues who look for wedges to divide rather than bridges to bring people together.

I miss the days when politics was more like the Warner Bros cartoon with the sheep dog and wolf -- "morning Sam" and other pleasantries as they clocked in and out each day.
 
I don't think labels accomplish anything.

Exactly! Why make this about partisan politics? No one's hands are clean in the SS mess.

We already had a lengthy, sensisible discussion about this courtesy of the article dvcgirl provided.

Sounds like the OP is just trying to :stir:

:sad2:
 
It was the current White House that pushed for an overhauled system, was it not? Washington needs to step up and do the right thing, not whatevers popular with the folks that vote in November..
 
I don't think the AARP (and it's members) will ever allow the SS system to be revamped or change no matter who is in power, be it democrats or republicans.
 
Liberals -- you're kidding, right?

The lack of accountability on social security is not a partisan issue. Both parties have done what they needed to do to be elected, which means they've not made the heard decisions that have to be made.
 
I don't think the AARP (and it's members) will ever allow the SS system to be revamped or change no matter who is in power, be it democrats or republicans.

AARP doesn't have a say in the matter, they are nothing but a lobby group.. Washington needs to do whats right for this country, not continue to try to fund an entitlement program thats horrible..
 
Although we tend to be pretty "liberal" about the topics allowed on the Budget Board, I am drawing the line at political debate. I am moving this thread to the Community Board where this topic is much more appropriate...

Thanks.
 
I don't think the AARP (and it's members) will ever allow the SS system to be revamped or change no matter who is in power, be it democrats or republicans.

I don't think the members care, unless scare tactics are used against them to make them think they would see a reduction in their benefits. Under the proposed plan, none of the changes would have affected anyone old enough to be in the AARP. (I believe you can join at 50?)

It's the institution that simply appears to be power hungry. There was no legitimate reason for them to oppose the proposal. I'm not saying that the proposal was good or bad, just that it was of no concern to the membership of the AARP.
 
Note the tricky wording in the testimony. Medicaid and Medicare are in serious financial trouble. Social Security IS NOT. When people lump them together, they are confusing the issue. And when people use the troubles of Medicaid and Medicare as an excuse to gut Social Security, they are flat out being dishonest.
 






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