Whats Wrong with Disney?

[jimmysmom74]

Just left wdw and universal the week before. In response to the question....my answer is plenty! We have visited wdw 3 times this past year(nov, March, June). This was our first trip to UO. We loved UO. Amazing theming and rides. HP blows the competition away, and the new DA is going to be a game changer. The minion ride was awesome too. I love Disney, but it is not what it was 20yrs ago. Several issues on this trip.

I want to like FP+, but it is really inefficient. We waited several times over 15mins just to scan the first band. I like the MBs, but the process is ridiculous. Universal express pass is a quick handheld device that literally takes seconds. It is so easy.
The app is still a mess. My issue was that I had PP for 10-11am. We wanted splash mountain. So I attempted to change it. I picked change experience. And it showed experiences available for 10-11am. I hit SM. And it immediately changed it, no confirm, to 9pm. It said it was available for that time. I went a kiosk, where I was told yep that is what happens. Even though it said it was available for the time I wanted. I thought we can change on the fly? Dumbest app ever.
The CM, there are still great ones out there, but it is not the magic it used to be. I meet a lot of crabby ones, no smiles or magical days. And I can't blame them. I also meet a lot of annoying guests, who spent most of their time complaining. I really felt TMs at UO seemed much more pleasant and happy than CMs at wdw.
People in general don't seem to think they are at the happiest place on earth. But lines have gotten longer since FP+ and it wears on people esp kids patience.
Then to top it off. 7DMT takes 4 years to build, and avatar land is the next project that also seems to be on the slow train. They still have 2 parks in disparate need of another headliner.
In closing, I say Disney look out. Universal is coming in strong. We are returning to Orlando in fall, and for the first time ever, not including WDW in our plans. Can't wait to see DA!

 

[sonofanarchy]

Disney parks in the United States, Europe and Asia made up nine of the top 10 parks and held 11 of the top 25 spots. Universal Studios' theme parks came in a distant second with just one park in the top 10 list and four in the top 25 list. SeaWorld held two spots.


http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/04/travel/most-popular-theme-parks-world/index.html

And more people eat everyday at McDonalds than any other restaurant.

 

[carrie1626]

Harry Potter is now open for another beautiful expansion
and what is Disneys answer.... Avatar Land? HU?
I'm sorry but i dont see Avatar as having the same draw as Harry Potter

Disney has so many IPs and any of them would be better then Avatar land

Lets see a star wars land or pixar land or marvel land

i know avatar is coming out with 2 more movies but who knows if they will be successful e.g the matrix
go with something that is proven "Star Wars"

All i know is last trip we spend 7 days in disney and next trip will include Universal 100%

#1) there is nothing that could compare to Happy Potter anything.
I don't think Avatarland was meant as Disney's "answer back" to anything.




2) I agree; go with what is loved already and pure Disney: CARS or Pixar or a Beastly Kingdom for that matter.

3) I wouldn't keep assuming you have to like the movie Avatar to like this new "land". Personally, I'm really looking forward to the expansion. My 20+ kids loved the movie. They never finished the HP series. My Dd has seen all the movies with me, my Ds - not! And HP at Universal will be totally enjoyable whether you've read books or seen movies. The same can be true of Avatarland.

4) I definitely want to see the new HP, but other than that it's still WDW that draws me in wholeheartedly.

 

[JoeA]

I'll go out on a limb and say that during the first week of the full HP opening at Universal that Dis Orlando will extract more dollars from wallets then will Universal, and every week thereafter for the foreseeable future. So you could easily argue that nothing is wrong with Disney.

And a step further - isn't Universal really borrowing from Dis and moving away from a "ride centric park" to having more theming and resorts? I'd say Dis is doing something right if their model is being used across town.

Universal is still trying to catch up and this new "land" won't put them over the top. Will Universal overtake them 10 or 20 years out? None of us know but if they do then like people who navigated from stage coach, to train, to air travel...I'll adapt and not worry about progress.

Disney's universe is a whole lot bigger than Universal and right now the latter is investing their future in Orlando, while the former has more business units fighting for capital expenditure and it's going elsewhere (CA parks will probably get the most money over the next few years, I'm guessing). I am sure Orlando will get theirs in time. At least I hope. All up to ROI for both companies.

Now it's time for a drink...

 

[ampersand]

Maybe what Disney needs is an adults only princess "meet up" in a poor people's club 33.

Fastpass+ with dudes adding the note of "I want Jasmine to show me her 'world' ". Have people tipping with disney dollars.

Then watch people complain about the food.

There, I just saved WDW. You're welcome.

 

[tbia]

Just my opinion, but the balance of this argument lies with what Disney does with its now unencumbered Star Wars franchise.

With the word of AIdol and IJones closing, it is obvious that big changes are in store for DHS.

Again, just my opinion, but the next 9-12 months will tell a lot about how much of a real threat they feel Potter is.

 

[JimmyV]

Disney's universe is a whole lot bigger than Universal and right now the latter is investing their future in Orlando, while the former has more business units fighting for capital expenditure and it's going elsewhere...

Good post. As to the quoted potion, this is easy to swallow if you are a shareholder. But if you are a visitor who lives in Georgia who has no plans to travel to Singapore or Tokyo any time soon, doesn't that person have good reason to question the arms race in Central Florida lately? While DIS owes that person nothing, it can't be said that a certain level of frustration or angst isn't understandable. What that person is perceiving from their 500 ft view is real, even if it doesn't capture the full picture from 50,000 ft.

 

[Cogswel_Cogs]

Whenever I try to think of what is wrong with Disney I always think of the book "I know it When I see It."
The company in it is number one till suddenly they start losing there grip. Bottom line is they start listening to themselves tell them how they are doing and what they should be doing. Those are not the people you are supposed to listen to.

 

[ampersand]

Just my opinion, but the balance of this argument lies with what Disney does with its now unencumbered Star Wars franchise.

With the word of AIdol and IJones closing, it is obvious that big changes are in store for DHS.

Again, just my opinion, but the next 9-12 months will tell a lot about how much of a real threat they feel Potter is.

Indiana Jones has not been confirmed by anybody worth listening to as far as I know. AI, on the other hand, has.

 

[mefordis]

It's difficult to see things any other way. But looking back at history...

• Union Pacific didn't need a response to TWA and American Airlines
• Converse didn't need a response to Nike
• Compaq and IBM didn't need a response to Apple
• The "Big Three" didn't need a response to Japanese and Korean auto makers

...or did they? It was once inconceivable that the insignificant "little brother" could ever surpass the established giant. And yet.....
Let's not lose sight of the fact that Universal isn't run by a bunch of wannabees. Most of their most important and creative people joined the company from Disney. If these same people were "innovative geniuses" while at Disney, why would we think that they are no longer the best minds in the theme park business simply because they moved 10 miles north? If 75% of Microsoft's senior leadership, creative teams and R&D people left to work at NewCorp, would you bet on or against that company's success?

This explains a LOT of why we aren't seeing good decisions coming from Disney, nor good implementation or creative. They lost their talent to Universal.

 

[JoeA]

Good post. As to the quoted potion, this is easy to swallow if you are a shareholder. But if you are a visitor who lives in Georgia who has no plans to travel to Singapore or Tokyo any time soon, doesn't that person have good reason to question the arms race in Central Florida lately? While DIS owes that person nothing, it can't be said that a certain level of frustration or angst isn't understandable. What that person is perceiving from their 500 ft view is real, even if it doesn't capture the full picture from 50,000 ft.

Agree 100% with this. One common theme on this thread is, "I've been to WDW 100 times and..." - well, we're all bored and want/expect more! I've walked out of the "world" the last few years saying I'm done for a few years and I really (think) I mean it this time, darn it!

We have a big family vacation in HI next year (DVC!) and don't have any plans to visit Orlando at least until 2016, or maybe 2017, and we'll spend a day or two at Universal during that trip.

What's wrong with Dis is wrong for us, but not necessarily wrong for them. And if Universal wins the race in Orlando then I'll switch flags

 

[Travelgrrl]

Personally, the movie Avatar and the thought of a land devoted to it, shoehorned into Animal Kingdom, leaves me cold. What if they spend a bajillion dollars building it and the supposed sequels tank at the box office?

I agree that Disney has so many terrific 'intellectual properties' in their arsenal that they could have made a far better choice.

When AK was first announced, Disney indicated they planned a future 'mythical creatures' land. How cool! Griffins, unicorns, centaurs, perhaps some gargoyles or some gorgans, a scattering of other creatures - the possibilities are limitless!

Instead, a whole land devoted to blue people?

 

[basas]

Perhaps you missed the announcement about the New Fantasyland?

Pretty, but little substance. Reviews are coming from Diagon Alley and we're hearing "astounding", "most immersive land ever", "mind-blowing", "stunning". How many times have you heard New Fantasyland described like that? It adds capacity to Magic Kingdom which was needed, but it could have been so much more.

2) I agree; go with what is loved already and pure Disney: CARS or Pixar or a Beastly Kingdom for that matter.

I agree. With the success of Cars Land in California, I just cannot understand why it was killed for DHS. That park is a complete mess...

3) I wouldn't keep assuming you have to like the movie Avatar to like this new "land". Personally, I'm really looking forward to the expansion. My 20+ kids loved the movie. They never finished the HP series. My Dd has seen all the movies with me, my Ds - not! And HP at Universal will be totally enjoyable

Although Avatar wouldn’t have been my choice at all, and I still find the choice puzzling to be honest, I would agree that if an attraction (or “land”) is well done I believe it can be enjoyed immensely even without being a fan of the IP (see Splash Mountain)...which is why all fans of theme parks, and not just Harry Potter fans, owe it to themselves to go see an area like Universal’s Diagon Alley.

Disney's universe is a whole lot bigger than Universal and right now the latter is investing their future in Orlando, while the former has more business units fighting for capital expenditure and it's going elsewhere (CA parks will probably get the most money over the next few years, I'm guessing). I am sure Orlando will get theirs in time. At least I hope. All up to ROI for both companies.

Now it's time for a drink...

Is it really? Disney has parks in Orlando, Anaheim, Paris, Tokyo, Hong Kong and soon Shanghai. Universal has parks in Orlando, Hollywood, Japan, Singapore and possibly soon in South Korea, Beijing and Moscow.

 

[JoeA]

Pretty, but little substance. Reviews are coming from Diagon Alley and we're hearing "astounding", "most immersive land ever", "mind-blowing". How many times have you heard New Fantasyland described like that? It adds capacity to Magic Kingdom which was needed, but it could have been so much more. I agree. With the success of Cars Land in California, I just cannot understand why it was killed for DHS. Although Avatar wouldn’t have been my choice at all, and I still find the choice puzzling to be honest, I would agree that if an attraction (or “land”) is well done I believe it can be enjoyed immensely even without being a fan of the IP (see Splash Mountain)...which is why all fans of theme parks, and not just Harry Potter fans, owe it to themselves to go see an area like Universal’s Diagon Alley. Is it really? Disney has parks in Orlando, Anaheim, Paris, Tokyo, Hong Kong and soon Shanghai. Universal has parks in Orlando, Hollywood, Japan, Singapore and possibly soon in South Korea, Beijing and Moscow.

Possibly soon? Lol!

Disney has more parks, and more non-park business units who all want capital. This isn't even debatable. That's the answer to why it was killed for DHS. ROI. CA had it. DHS didn't. At least for that budget cycle.

And with all those great reviews you posted, Universal will still account for fewer guests and a fewer spend then lil' ol' Disney World. Go figure.

 

[Planogirl]

I remember when Japanese cars were trying hard to get decent sales in the US. I'm personally glad that both American and Japanese (and Korean and German and so on) offer models now. I prefer more choice and competition.

The same could be said of themeparks.

 

[sonofanarchy]

Personally, the movie Avatar and the thought of a land devoted to it, shoehorned into Animal Kingdom, leaves me cold. What if they spend a bajillion dollars building it and the supposed sequels tank at the box office?

I agree that Disney has so many terrific 'intellectual properties' in their arsenal that they could have made a far better choice.

When AK was first announced, Disney indicated they planned a future 'mythical creatures' land. How cool! Griffins, unicorns, centaurs, perhaps some gargoyles or some gorgans, a scattering of other creatures - the possibilities are limitless!

Instead, a whole land devoted to blue people?

This.

People are clamoring for more Harry Potter. I don't know a single person who is interested in any more Avatar. I think Disney has made a HUGE mistake. If the sequels fail, this will become an embarrassment to the company.

 

[basas]

Possibly soon? Lol!

Disney has more parks, and more non-park business units who all want capital. This isn't even debatable. That's the answer to why it was killed for DHS. ROI. CA had it. DHS didn't. At least for that budget cycle.

And with all those great reviews you posted, Universal will still account for fewer guests and a fewer spend then lil' ol' Disney World. Go figure.

I don’t see what is so hard to understand? The argument was made that Disney isn’t focused on Orlando because it has to focus on its other resorts and for Universal that this wasn’t an issue. As I said, Universal has, or is in the process, of completing major expansions to its parks in Hollywood, Orlando and Japan in addition to new parks in Singapore and elsewhere around the world. Not really a whole lot different from Disney. Quite frankly, it’s a lousy excuse for WDW's staleness. Universal parks and resorts is a small piece of the Comcast empire. You don't think they have a lot of business units who all want capital?

TDO doesn’t want to spend money...on anything...they’re cheap as can be. It might deliver short-term results but I’m pretty sure history has shown that “lower quality, higher prices” - WDW's current business model - is a poor one in the long term. The reason Cars Land was canceled probably has more to do with the debacle that is MyMagic+.

And with all those great reviews you posted, Universal will still account for fewer guests and a fewer spend then lil' ol' Disney World. Go figure.

Is it a race? I suppose for the companies involved it is, but I don’t treat it like a sports game where I’m cheering for one team or the other. I don't know why people post stats like this as if it's a personal accomplishment. I want them both to be successful and I want both of them to keep delivering great new experiences.

I remember when Japanese cars were trying hard to get decent sales in the US. I'm personally glad that both American and Japanese (and Korean and German and so on) offer models now. I prefer more choice and competition.

The same could be said of themeparks.

Why limit yourself to one when you can have both? Seems silly...

 

[kpal2490]

After reading through this thread, it seems a lot of the responses are focused on Avatarland not being "as popular" as HP; and that may be accurate for your worldview, but a quick search shows that their fanbase is expansive, diverse, and dedicated to the world James Cameron created. So, I think what everyone needs to realize is that just because you don't like something, doesn't mean that there isn't an audience for it . There is a reason that it's the highest grossing movie of all time, ya know?

Another thing, I've been to WDW and Universal 24 times. I've gone once a year since 1990, so I've been able to experience the changes each park has gone through as they were going through them. One thing I have noticed is that while WDW is usually pretty crowded no matter what time of year I'm there, Universal is almost always empty. The only time I noticed an increase in guests in Universal was the first year after Hogsmeade was opened, but that quickly dropped soon after. I think that though there are a lot of thrill rides catered to an older audience at Universal, it doesn't have the same ability to keep guests on the property for more than a day, maybe two if they have the money to spend.

I don't know, after reading through these responses I felt like I needed to create an account and share my opinion.

 

[basas]

Another thing, I've been to WDW and Universal 24 times. I've gone once a year since 1990, so I've been able to experience the changes each park has gone through as they were going through them. One thing I have noticed is that while WDW is usually pretty crowded no matter what time of year I'm there, Universal is almost always empty. The only time I noticed an increase in guests in Universal was the first year after Hogsmeade was opened, but that quickly dropped soon after.

I'm pretty sure that's a bit of a stretch, although I would probably agree that the Universal parks tend to have more of an 'off-season' (which I would argue WDW had too until relatively recently). If you look at unofficial (but the best we have) attendance statistics, Universal’s parks have lower attendance than DHS and AK, but it’s not an enormous difference.

I think that though there are a lot of thrill rides catered to an older audience at Universal, it doesn't have the same ability to keep guests on the property for more than a day, maybe two if they have the money to spend.

I think that has been true in the past, but I think Comcast is trying to change that.

I don't know, after reading through these responses I felt like I needed to create an account and share my opinion.

Welcome to the boards

 

[sonofanarchy]

After reading through this thread, it seems a lot of the responses are focused on Avatarland not being "as popular" as HP; and that may be accurate for your worldview, but a quick search shows that their fanbase is expansive, diverse, and dedicated to the world James Cameron created. So, I think what everyone needs to realize is that just because you don't like something, doesn't mean that there isn't an audience for it . There is a reason that it's the highest grossing movie of all time, ya know?

Another thing, I've been to WDW and Universal 24 times. I've gone once a year since 1990, so I've been able to experience the changes each park has gone through as they were going through them. One thing I have noticed is that while WDW is usually pretty crowded no matter what time of year I'm there, Universal is almost always empty. The only time I noticed an increase in guests in Universal was the first year after Hogsmeade was opened, but that quickly dropped soon after. I think that though there are a lot of thrill rides catered to an older audience at Universal, it doesn't have the same ability to keep guests on the property for more than a day, maybe two if they have the money to spend.

I don't know, after reading through these responses I felt like I needed to create an account and share my opinion.

This is a classic example of using WDW as a whole instead of what the real example is, which is the Magic Kingdom. The other 3 parks are more on pace with Universal's attendance than the Magic Kingdom. Saying Universal is almost always empty is just crazy. By comparison to the MK, the crowds are certainly more manageable, but empty? Hardly.

As for Avatar, it's about longevity. Being the highest grossing movie of all time is impressive, but what did that take, maybe 3 months? That doesn't mean it has the longevity to maintain an entire theme park land. Harry Potter was a proven entity. Not sure where you're getting your numbers from, but Islands of Adventure's attendance has remained steady since the opening of Hogsmeade. And with Diagon Alley set to open next door, that park's attendance is going to rise, especially given that all reviews are excellent. Gringott's is already being called the most incredible theme park experience anywhere. Nothing at WDW can lay claim to that. Back to Avatar, it's one thing to have a built in audience based on 7 books of source material. It's another to take a possible one off hit and expand beyond it. It's completely conceivable to say that the Avatar sequels will not be nearly as big as the original. I've said it before - I don't know one person who could possibly care about a sequel, let alone 3 or 4. As for the theme park area, I'd be shocked if people make a special trip to Orlando just to see it, like people do with Harry Potter.