Whats up with paying Peak prices in March but not getting peak hours?...a vent thread

[The Sybah Shelstah]

I'm more of a night person (so EE is really a pain for me... but I'll probably do it. LOL) so ofcourse I would prefer later hours on my trips and totally got spoiled by the hours at my first visit this past holiday season......
However, on my upcoming trip if the crowds are way less than they were during the holidays- which it is SUPPOSED to be since it's value season... right?- then it will be okay with me. I'll just use the evenings/late nights for DTD and PI -PI is open later right?!? I sure hope they don't force me into bed before 9pm-10pm.
LOL

In any case, I sure wish there was atleast the OPTION of E-nights in Jan. But alas, it doesn't appear there is. I know there are E-nights in Feb and March (so far) and I think that is great to have the option to pay a little more and get to go to later hours on some days. I wish I had that option- because I would for sure be paying for it! (being a night person that I am)

My feelings on this are all because it's value season and the parks aren't supposed to be as crowded and I got value season rates at the resort. If I were paying peak season rates, to me that would mean it's peak season in the parks and would be crowded- so I would be nontoo pleased that the parks weren't open later also. I think that's a normal reaction. Everyone wants to get the most out of their stay- that's what they are paying for! And if it's busy... yet the same earlier hours (even if it's their "normal" hours) then you are going to feel you got shortchanged because you can't see/do all that you want to do in that timeframe.

 

[Eeyore2U]

I think you will also see that "name your category" resort seasons are not always "name you category" park seasons. There were a number of posts that made reference to October having a shifted to another category due to higher demand as a result of conventions. The resort seasons are based on supply and demand for space.

 

[The Sybah Shelstah]

Okay... so how do we find out the park's seasons? I'm serious.. so it's value season at the resorts for my upcoming trip, that means it might or might NOT be "less busy season" at the parks, right? Where can I find this info out? I only see seasons listed- not seperately for resorts vs. parks. Thanks!

 

[Eeyore2U]

If I confused you I'm sorry. Based on previous posts on these boards the resort "season" may be higher then the crowds. My guess is "value" is "value"

 

[skiwee1]

Originally posted by eeyore0062
We aren't putting up with anything. Official MK and MGM park hours are, and always have been 9am-7pm... those are the hours for which we pay. AK hours are 9 am-5 pm, and Epcot is 9 am until 9 pm. Yes, hours may be extended in the summer, Christmas, spring break and at the discretion of the park officials, according to crowds, and need. Anytime they extend the hours, that is a bonus. I think because they have extended the hours in the past, we seem to loose sight of that. I don't see where we can get by with complaining. At least WDW is open Nov through March, unlike those theme parks further north. Also, if you look at the competition in Orlando, you will find that the admissions are at least as high, if not higher, and there isn't a whole lot of difference in the hours, either.

As I said before, instead of insiting everyone on this board, put pen to paper, or fingers to keyboard, as it were, and let Disney know how you feel. Nothing may change, but you may feel better!

I agree! If those hours are not good for someone then they need to plan their trip during a time that WDW offers extended hours. The cost of a ticket is only for those hours WDW considers normal. If anything I'm surprised they don't raise the price for tickets during those extended hour times since that is more then their normal hours. We always go during the offseason and really enjoy it more. The hours are less but you don't need as many with no lines. We also make sure we are there at least one weekend night to see MK at night. We did Universal along with WDW last October and they too closed at 7pm and some nights 6pm! WDW is not the only theme park that does this. Also around my way, all the parks completely close up in the winter!

 

[skiwee1]

Originally posted by raidermatt
According to Birnbaum's...

End of Feb through 2nd week of March is "Average".

3rd week of March through 3rd week of April is "Most Crowded".

I think it really depends on when Easter falls. Last year, the week before and after Easter had closings as late as Midnight. I would expect something similar this year.

That said, I'm not really defending what Disney is doing with regard to cutting hours from year to year. In fact, I think I said its not in-tune with what the "Disney philosophy" is supposed to be. I'm just explaining why they are doing what they are doing.


True, that could happen. But from a planning point of view, this makes it difficult to make PS's. Also, some like to schedule there day at MK, for example, when it has a later (or earlier) closing.

Further, there is no guarantee the hours will be extended, so its better to speak up (to Disney) now.

I have always made my PSs without knowing what the hours are going to be. I know when we are going to eat so I make a PS for it. Getting the hours won't change what time we like to eat. If MK closes at 7pm I have possibly already made a PS for the Crystal Palace at 6pm so there is no need to know the hours ahead. Seriously, why do you need to know the hours in order to make a PS? I'm not being nasty, just uninformed! LOL

 

[skiwee1]

Originally posted by Eeyore2U
I think you will also see that "name your category" resort seasons are not always "name you category" park seasons. There were a number of posts that made reference to October having a shifted to another category due to higher demand as a result of conventions. The resort seasons are based on supply and demand for space.

That's right. October used to be Value season for resort prices and the crowds were always low. Now October is considered Regular season for resort prices but I've still found the crowds to be non-existent.

 

[raidermatt]

Seriously, why do you need to know the hours in order to make a PS? I'm not being nasty, just uninformed! LOL

No problem. You're not uninformed, it just doesn't matter for the type of planning you do.

Certainly not knowing the hours does not prohibit you (generic you) from making a PS. But lets say you plan for MK to close at 6pm (the base), and want to make a PS at Downtown Disney after you leave MK. So you make the PS for 7:00.

Then, MK's hours are changed to 7:00. Sure, you can still leave MK at 6:00, but what if you really want to take advantage of the later hours, ride a few more rides, and see Main Street at night? Now, you will need to change your PS to 8:00. Maybe it will be available, maybe not. Certainly it would have been nice to know in the first place that MK would close at 7:00, right?

It just makes it more of a guessing game when your plans aren't as simple as "eat at 6:00 no matter what".

Honestly, we plan our PS's more like you do, but there are some that base it on more information.

It all just depends on how detailed your planning is. We try to plan out which parks we will visit on each day, and the closing times have an impact on what that decision will be. So we have to guess at what the hours will be, then plan the parks so we can make our PS's. So far its worked ok, no major problems, but we are pretty flexible too.

 

[raidermatt]

The cost of a ticket is only for those hours WDW considers normal.

Legally, this is correct. But that doesn't mean its a good idea for Disney to use this as their only basis for deciding on operating hours.

When you gradually reduce hours vs. what they were before, you also gradually reduce the value you are offering. You can't expect guests not to notice and react to the reduced value.

 

[skiwee1]

Originally posted by raidermatt
No problem. You're not uninformed, it just doesn't matter for the type of planning you do.

Certainly not knowing the hours does not prohibit you (generic you) from making a PS. But lets say you plan for MK to close at 6pm (the base), and want to make a PS at Downtown Disney after you leave MK. So you make the PS for 7:00.

Then, MK's hours are changed to 7:00. Sure, you can still leave MK at 6:00, but what if you really want to take advantage of the later hours, ride a few more rides, and see Main Street at night? Now, you will need to change your PS to 8:00. Maybe it will be available, maybe not. Certainly it would have been nice to know in the first place that MK would close at 7:00, right?

It just makes it more of a guessing game when your plans aren't as simple as "eat at 6:00 no matter what".

Honestly, we plan our PS's more like you do, but there are some that base it on more information.

It all just depends on how detailed your planning is. We try to plan out which parks we will visit on each day, and the closing times have an impact on what that decision will be. So we have to guess at what the hours will be, then plan the parks so we can make our PS's. So far its worked ok, no major problems, but we are pretty flexible too.

OIC! I do plan every day what park we are going to and make at least one PS for each day. The big difference is that since we travel with a 3 y/o we pretty much don't have a life after 7pm anyway! So if we don't go to Epcot that night then we just hang out at the pool at the resort. We only do DTD in the afternoon as a major shopping outing. Yes, I can see wanting to know hours for that. We are also more relaxed in that knowing from the start that we are on slow mode with the kid and my 65 y/o mother. If we do 4 rides a day then that is a commando day for us.

 

[eeyore0062]

"When you gradually reduce hours vs. what they were before, you also gradually reduce the value you are offering. You can't expect guests not to notice and react to the reduced value"posted by Raidermatt

Then not only is Disney guilty of this, but Anheiser Busch and Universal is as well. The ticket prices are the same regardless of the hours or time of the year.

If those hours are not good for someone then they need to plan their trip during a time that WDW offers extended hours.
posted by skiwee1


I totally agree!

 

[raidermatt]

Then not only is Disney guilty of this, but Anheiser Busch and Universal is as well.

Disney did not become Disney by doing things like everybody else. They focused on the long term guest relationship, and valued this over the short term profit. Consequently, they made more profits than anyone ever dreamed they would. Why they should look to Busch and Universal for a model of how to run a resort vacation destination instead of their own past is truly perplexing.

The ticket prices are the same regardless of the hours or time of the year.

I never said that they should adjust ticket prices for the time of year. I only said that if they only open the MK for 9 hours this year on a given day, after having it open for 10 last year, and 10.5 the two years before that, they are offering less to their guests/customers. And for those customers that are not quite as devoted to WDW as you or I, these types of decisions can reduce the value of their vacation to the point that they decide to take the family somewhere else next time.

If those hours are not good for someone then they need to plan their trip during a time that WDW offers extended hours.

I totally agree!

Sure, for those of us who are going to WDW no matter what, that's what we do. But for those on the fence, they don't "need" to do anything. They can just decide not to go.

You may think that's an acceptable trade-off in the long-run, and maybe it is. Neither of us have a crystal ball to know what will happen for sure. But ignoring the potential for this to cause more harm than good would be an un-wise move on Disney's part.

 

[The Sybah Shelstah]

We also make sure we are there at least one weekend night to see MK at night.

That would be great too- except even though I'm staying long enough to also get a weekend in- they aren't open any later. Well.. 30min I think? I think MGM is open till 7:30 on the weekend. IN FACT, I was looking at the calendar and noticed that MK and MGM (I think I'm remembering those right) are open 9-9pm on ALL weekends in Jan EXCEPT THE VERY WEEKEND I'll be there!
Imagine that.
I'm not surprised... it's how my luck goes. Nightowl goes to WDW on a solo trip and it's the one weekend they don't close later. Hmpph
LOL

The big difference is that since we travel with a 3 y/o we pretty much don't have a life after 7pm anyway!

I was just thinking about this awhile ago and how it would make more sense for solo trips (atleast nightowls like myself) to go during the times of years when the hours are later and to go during shorter hour times of the years WITH the children. Because honestly my kids limit the time spent in the evenings at the parks also! I think that would be the case for almost all parents with children there. However, the problem with that is school. The hours were longer during the holiday vacation when the kids were out of school and are now shorter now that I couldn't take the kids because they are in school!
*sigh*
Ohwell!!!
(but I still say an E-night or two or being open later on Sat atleast would have been nice... for this nightowl who really is NOT a morning person. LOL)

 

[eeyore0062]

For the most part, if you look at it, the value is the same. The times of the year when the hours are extended, they need to be that way, so a guest can get their money's worth. When the hours are standard 9 am -7 pm, the parks aren't as crowded, so you still see as much. If the question is whether or not you prefer night hours, well, then you just go when you know they will be offered. Why should a park stay open late, if the demand isn't there.

As for Busch and Universal... Disney didn't write the book about extended hours... we have just been spoiled because the economy was so good for so long, so more people were there, hence the need for extended hours. This is no longer the case.. hours are back to normal, and of course, the complaining begins. Disney wants to exceed its guests' expectations, but not to the detriment of the company.

I know that most don't agree with me, but Disney is a company, and has to put the bottom line first at times. No, you don't have to go, if you don't like the practices, so let Disney know how you feel... as I have said before, it could help, and then again it might not, but at least you will have had your say... and only they can control their business practices. All of the complaining here isn't going to accomplish much.

BTW, at the top of this section is a whole thread about Cutbacks, Complaints, etc. I think this whole subject has been hashed out there many times.

 

[Gillian]

Originally posted by eeyore0062
For the most part, if you look at it, the value is the same. The times of the year when the hours are extended, they need to be that way, so a guest can get their money's worth.

In general, this is true, BUT the original poster is talking about paying PEAK resort rates and getting short hours. Maybe the parks won't be that crowded, but if this is the case, why are they charging such high hotels rates? They're saying the demand is high for the hotels, so we're charging more, but the demand is low for the parks, so we're not extending hours. Full hotels but empty parks? Doesn't make sense.

Summer is not Peak season (some parts, at deluxe resorts, are even Value!!!) but the hours are very long. Explain the logic of this, please!

And yes, there are codes, but compare october AKL rates of $109 or $119 to March rates of $189 (std room).

 

[angey77]

Originally posted by Gillian
In general, this is true, BUT the original poster is talking about paying PEAK resort rates and getting short hours. Maybe the parks won't be that crowded, but if this is the case, why are they charging such high hotels rates? They're saying the demand is high for the hotels, so we're charging more, but the demand is low for the parks, so we're not extending hours. Full hotels but empty parks? Doesn't make sense.

Summer is not Peak season (some parts, at deluxe resorts, are even Value!!!) but the hours are very long. Explain the logic of this, please!

And yes, there are codes, but compare october AKL rates of $109 or $119 to March rates of $189 (std room).

Thank you Gillian!!!!

 

[yesdisneyfool]

Originally posted by The Sybah Shelstah
Okay... so how do we find out the park's seasons? I'm serious.. so it's value season at the resorts for my upcoming trip, that means it might or might NOT be "less busy season" at the parks, right? Where can I find this info out? I only see seasons listed- not seperately for resorts vs. parks. Thanks!

I don't remember where I got this from but I've had it a few years.

Q: What are the busiest and least busy times of the year?
A: Although special events and promotions may influence our Theme Park attendance levels, the following list highlights historic attendance trends throughout the year:

Lowest Attendance:
January (except New Year’s Day) until just prior to Presidents’ week in February
The week following Labor Day until just prior to Thanksgiving week
The week following Thanksgiving until the week prior to Christmas

Moderate Attendance:
After Presidents’ week in February through early March
Late April through early June (except Memorial Day weekend)
The first part of Thanksgiving week

Highest Attendance:
Presidents’ week in February
Mid-March through Late April (“Spring Break”)
Memorial Day weekend
Mid-June through Labor Day
Thanksgiving Day and weekend
Christmas week through New Year’s Day

Also, during regular attendance periods, our Parks tend to be the busiest on the following days:
Busiest Least
Magic Kingdom Park: M, TH, S T, W, F, SU
Epcot: T, F M, W, TH, S, SU
MGM Studios: SU, W M, T, TH, F, S
Animal Kingdom: M, T, W TH, F, S, SU


Sunday is slow at all four parks as it is a MAJOR travel day.
Sunday is historically the slowest day at MK, with Wednesday a close second.
Epcot is slow on Mondays, as most guests arrive on Monday and want to spend their first day at MK.
Tuesday is Epcot's first heavy day of the week.
Tuesday and Wednesday are heavy at MGM, but Sunday and Monday are slower.
AK is still hard to judge as it is still a baby and still defies most attempts to identify patterns (just like a two to three year old human)
Fridays and Saturdays are heavy at MK, but not as heavy as Mondays.
Generally, Saturdays are heavier at all four, and all of these generalities are to be totally ignored during peak days and holidays (New Year's Eve was on a Sunday... we closed the gates before 10am) Good luck! As I remember, March is usually fine unless the final week leads into Easter (Fastpass, EE, E-ride, and extended hours... that's all I can tell you for those peak seasons)

 

[yesdisneyfool]

Originally posted by yesdisneyfool
I don't remember where I got this from but I've had it a few years.

Also, during regular attendance periods, our Parks tend to be the busiest on the following days:
Busiest Least
Magic Kingdom Park: M, TH, S T, W, F, SU
Epcot: T, F M, W, TH, S, SU
MGM Studios: SU, W M, T, TH, F, S
Animal Kingdom: M, T, W TH, F, S, SU

Sorry let me fix this section
Magic Kingdom Park:Busiest M, TH, S Least T, W, F, SU
Epcot:Busiest T, F Least M, W, TH, S, SU
MGM Studios:Busiest SU, W Least M, T, TH, F, S
Animal Kingdom: M, T, W TH, F, S, SU

 

[yesdisneyfool]

Originally posted by yesdisneyfool
I don't remember where I got this from but I've had it a few years.

Also, during regular attendance periods, our Parks tend to be the busiest on the following days:
Magic Kingdom Park:
Busiest M, TH, S
Least T, W, F, SU

Epcot:
Busiest T, F
Least M, W, TH, S, SU

MGM Studios:
BusiestSU, W
Least M, T, TH, F, S

Animal Kingdom:
BusiestM, T, W
Least TH, F, S, SU

Sorry let me fix this section. See above

 

[raidermatt]

For the most part, if you look at it, the value is the same.

Yes, when you compare January of this year to June of this year, its probably comparable. But the op was discussing the hours for March, and how they perceived them to be short. Part of that is due to seasonality, but part of it is also do to reduced hours over the same seasons from past years.

Why should a park stay open late, if the demand isn't there.

You assume Disney is accurately guaging the demand and long term impact of these reduced hours. Given their gross error in evaluating the demand for EE, I can't make that assumption.

I know that most don't agree with me, but Disney is a company, and has to put the bottom line first at times.

I DO agree with you. I just think the long term impact needs to be accounted for, as it will decide your bottom line for years to come, not just this quarter.

All of the complaining here isn't going to accomplish much.

No, but explaining what is going on and why does help people understand the situation.