What would you do? Renter wants to cancel.

[CarolinaMike]

I’d just remind them of what you all agreed on, but you are willing to move it forward for them even though you are not required.

I would also give them a deadline for moving it. Holding penalties are going back in place May 1st so you want to try and avoid that as that will make any request from them more difficult to achieve.

If they fail to move by that date, then just leave as is. Rentals come with risks and honestly, if a renter wants to be able to cancel or change, they should either not rent or find an owner who offers those options as some do.

When I rent, I am pretty strict and do not offer refunds, name changes, or date changes. I charge less for it and realize it will not meet needs of everyone but the few times, the people were willing to agree.

Good luck

Thanks your reply Sandi!
What forms of Payment do you take? This reservation was paid via PayPal invoice.
I explained her option to rebook as a gesture of goodwill and that the contract stated no refunds and no 3rd party and did not provide for rebooking (there are no terms of changing dates in contract). I also provided her with the cancellation date for the current reservation. The 31 day window to avoid holding. I will get this in writing if I cancel the Current date for them though. I go above and beyond for my rentors. It took 17 phone calls to get through to member services and a 20 minute call just to Add a "birthday" to this reservation. I think it actually a month or so later but wanted it added.
And her statement to me this morning was "what are my options bc I don't think this is right".
Really?? So I just reiterated everything once again.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Ok are you saying that PayPal doesn't cover Timeshare contract?? Or they would honour the contract.

I am saying PayPal provide zero buyer protection where timeshare rental is concerned. They cannot dispute the transaction under TOS and win.

 

[GoingSince1990]

I would offer to rebook within the life of the returned points. And if the renter did not want to reschedule, I might (and defintely would, if they had what I thought was a good reason) offer to re-rent the returned points to a new renter and pay the new rental fee over to the original renter so that they would get at least a partial refund (“partial” because the points now have a shorter life and would probably rent for a lower price compared to the original rental). This is going “above and beyond”, and involves some work, but would not leave you a single cent out of pocket. What I would not do is simply agree to cancel the reservation and refund the original price paid.

 

[CarolinaMike]

I am saying PayPal provide zero buyer protection where timeshare rental is concerned. They cannot dispute the transaction under TOS and win.

Thank you for your reply. So the PayPal Invoice is the correct way to collect rental fees? I should not let them pay via friends/family. Correct?

 

[CarolMN]

One additional reason to not allow them to re-rent:
They just booked this, presumably paying with a credit card on paypal. If you allow them to re-rent, they could pretend to be you while renting to a third party and collecting money for the rental. When you change the names on the contract, it triggers the email to the third party with the booking information, thereby making the third party "sure" they are dealing with you. You'll all be happy, until the original renter issues a chargeback on the card, or the card used on paypal by the original renter turns out to be stolen, in which case you're out the money for the rental, have a third party who will claim to have paid you, and good luck finding the original renter!

Offering to let them book another trip in their names until January 2022 is a very generous, and safe, offer.

It was not all that long ago that there was a scammer out there doing pretty much what you have described. He/She may still be doing so. Renting is not without risk - for either party to the transaction.

 

[vicarrieous]

Thanks your reply Sandi!
What forms of Payment do you take? This reservation was paid via PayPal invoice.
I explained her option to rebook as a gesture of goodwill and that the contract stated no refunds and no 3rd party and did not provide for rebooking (there are no terms of changing dates in contract). I also provided her with the cancellation date for the current reservation. The 31 day window to avoid holding. I will get this in writing if I cancel the Current date for them though. I go above and beyond for my rentors. It took 17 phone calls to get through to member services and a 20 minute call just to Add a "birthday" to this reservation. I think it actually a month or so later but wanted it added.
And her statement to me this morning was "what are my options bc I don't think this is right".
Really?? So I just reiterated everything once again.

Exactly. I would just state terms are clear in the contract that was signed.

Although, like another poster, if its been only a couple days, my hubby said he would just refund and cut ties with this person as they may be problems down the road. That does irritate me a bit as they ultimately get what they want and go off again to rent and not read or value the terms of a contract.

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

The statement I then got was I will check with hubby to see if we can cancel flights and car rental. Yeah I think they are playing me.

As others mentioned, that statement is a red flag. This seemingly unintentional slip indicates to me that they were cancelling with you, but not cancelling the trip. Otherwise, why would they need to see IF they could cancel their flights and car rental.

If they need to cancel the trip for a valid reason, they would already be cancelling their flight and rental car. Why would you keep those reservations if you need to cancel your trip?

 

[Evita_W]

Hi - I was paid via PayPal invoice I sent. I don't t know how that works within Paypa. But my contract stated in more than one place Non-Refundable and no 3rd party transfer.


I was paid via the PayPal Invoice I sent them. I'm not sure if they can dispute.??The contract states in more than 1 place NonRefundable and no 3rd party rental.

They absolutely can dispute with PayPal and you may end up loosing the dispute at bare minimum if they dispute it, you are looking at the money being tied up for 6 to 12 months in my experience. The contract will likely not assist you with PayPal.

Can you tell I have been the victim of this? Not only did I offer to rebook for the renter that had this issue, they did so and still filed a dispute. As soon as I finally resolved this issue, I closed the PayPal account and won't use them.

The one saving grace you have right now is you can cancel without any major penalty since points go back to the use year they came from if borrowed. In my case, I was at least far enough out they I was ok and I hadn't borrowed points.

 

[CarolinaMike]

They absolutely can dispute with PayPal and you may end up loosing the dispute at bare minimum if they dispute it, you are looking at the money being tied up for 6 to 12 months in my experience. The contract will likely not assist you with PayPal.

Can you tell I have been the victim of this? Not only did I offer to rebook for the renter that had this issue, they did so and still filed a dispute. As soon as I finally resolved this issue, I closed the PayPal account and won't use them.

The one saving grace you have right now is you can cancel without any major penalty since points go back to the use year they came from if borrowed. In my case, I was at least far enough out they I was ok and I hadn't borrowed points.

Thank you for your reply and information. What forms of payment do you take for your rental s to avoid issues??

 

[5th gate dreamers]

I only take check or sometimes disney gift cards. I prefer a check. We mail a signed contract back and forth, so I just have them throw it in the envelope. If a renter has a problem with me or my contract, they can take me to court. I'm not letting you have credit companies fight your fight with me.

 

[Sandisw]

Thanks your reply Sandi!
What forms of Payment do you take? This reservation was paid via PayPal invoice.
I explained her option to rebook as a gesture of goodwill and that the contract stated no refunds and no 3rd party and did not provide for rebooking (there are no terms of changing dates in contract). I also provided her with the cancellation date for the current reservation. The 31 day window to avoid holding. I will get this in writing if I cancel the Current date for them though. I go above and beyond for my rentors. It took 17 phone calls to get through to member services and a 20 minute call just to Add a "birthday" to this reservation. I think it actually a month or so later but wanted it added.
And her statement to me this morning was "what are my options bc I don't think this is right".
Really?? So I just reiterated everything once again.

I have used PayPal and the invoice option too. And, I would ask her if she responds again to help point out from the contract she agreed to that she believes you are not adhering to.

Other than that, do as you did...give her the options of rescheduling or keeping as is with the date to modify.

 

[AZMermaid]

Ugh! I’m so sorry! I think I’d reply “your options are to travel as planned or rebook by 1/31/22 as generously offered and next time strongly consider if renting non refundable points works for your travel plans. Hotels can be flexible, timeshares are not.”

Because your points have a long shelf life still... I might offer a refund less a transaction fee of 10%, 20%? 25? Enough to make it worth your while- at least $250! But ONLY because you still have 10.5 months to rerent them. But there’s the point that now you’ve missed the 11 month window too, which is worth a premium even if this renter didn’t use it. I only say this because a PayPal dispute might be a hassle! Transfer the funds to your bank ASAP!

 

[Ronaldo17]

When we rent out our points, we charge less and don't offer refunds unless Disney closes the DVC resorts due to COVID.
We ask for payment in full by PayPal, direct to our PayPal account(not PayPal invoice) and as soon as the funds are in my PayPal account I transfer them to my bank account. This leaves the PayPal account balance at zero, so neither the renter or PayPal can access the funds.
You have been more than fair, it's their problem, but I think they are at it.

 

[CarolinaMike]

When we rent out our points, we charge less and don't offer refunds unless Disney closes the DVC resorts due to COVID.
We ask for payment in full by PayPal, direct to our PayPal account(not PayPal invoice) and as soon as the funds are in my PayPal account I transfer them to my bank account. This leaves the PayPal account balance at zero, so neither the renter or PayPal can access the funds.
You have been more than fair, it's their problem, but I think they are at it.

 

[CarolinaMike]

When we rent out our points, we charge less and don't offer refunds unless Disney closes the DVC resorts due to COVID.
We ask for payment in full by PayPal, direct to our PayPal account(not PayPal invoice) and as soon as the funds are in my PayPal account I transfer them to my bank account. This leaves the PayPal account balance at zero, so neither the renter or PayPal can access the funds.
You have been more than fair, it's their problem, but I think they are at it.

currently

Can you explain what is meant by PayPal direct? Is this the friends and family tab? I know by using the Paypal Invoice option, fees are charged but no fees are charged with the Friends and Family tab. What is the best was to have them send money under Paypal.

I have already transferred the money into my bank account and it has cleared into my account.

 

[DVC Doctor]

As a good will gesture I did offer them they could rebook until January 31, 2022 that is end of my use year. Again this not allowed for in contract but I am trying to allow them use of points. The statement I then got was I will check with hubby to see if we can cancel flights and car rental. Yeah I think they are playing me.

First of all, how many points are we talking about, as a 50 point rental vs 300 point rental is a huge sum and I would be much more accommodating to a large point renter

Second, DVC owners need to STOP being so rigid in their policies or they will kill it for everyone that needs or wants to rent points as negative renters will create negative online buzz.

If someone pays for points rental then it is my OPINION that we really need to provide service for this renter, especially in covid times and be helpful and accommodating. Sure, if you want to be a Grinch, then stick to your guns or lame contract and be warned that if your renter decides to fight back, you may not like it.

If they want to cancel and lose their 50% deposit, then that is their choice to lose that money
If they paid in full, and want to cancel, then you should allow them to rebook up until the points expire.
If they want to resell the points or transfer to another person, then that is fine, but you can charge a $1pp or so fee for the effort.

Look, I get it that you may have a contract or some worthless agreement, but in reality, DVC point rental is based on a TWO-WAY system of trust and if too many people lose money due to rigid policies, then that will only make it harder for everyone that wants to rent points.

This topic comes up often on this bbs and in the past people here have been very rigid about making changes and modifications and I think that is the wrong approach.

I understand that changes require effort and generally, in non-covid times, that is rare, but these days DVC members need to be more flexible in their policy or simply STOP renting points.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

I understand that changes require effort and generally, in non-covid times, that is rare, but these days DVC members need to be more flexible in their policy or simply STOP renting points.

I think your point is fine, but in this case it's someone who was making a booking within 60 days who seems to be having buyer's remorse after paying and accepting the presented terms. Playing Twister on the terms also creates unrealistic expectations for any future owners these people may deal with.

 

[Sandisw]

First of all, how many points are we talking about, as a 50 point rental vs 300 point rental is a huge sum and I would be much more accommodating to a large point renter

Second, DVC owners need to STOP being so rigid in their policies or they will kill it for everyone that needs or wants to rent points as negative renters will create negative online buzz.

If someone pays for points rental then it is my OPINION that we really need to provide service for this renter, especially in covid times and be helpful and accommodating. Sure, if you want to be a Grinch, then stick to your guns or lame contract and be warned that if your renter decides to fight back, you may not like it.

If they want to cancel and lose their 50% deposit, then that is their choice to lose that money
If they paid in full, and want to cancel, then you should allow them to rebook up until the points expire.
If they want to resell the points or transfer to another person, then that is fine, but you can charge a $1pp or so fee for the effort.

Look, I get it that you may have a contract or some worthless agreement, but in reality, DVC point rental is based on a TWO-WAY system of trust and if too many people lose money due to rigid policies, then that will only make it harder for everyone that wants to rent points.

This topic comes up often on this bbs and in the past people here have been very rigid about making changes and modifications and I think that is the wrong approach.

I understand that changes require effort and generally, in non-covid times, that is rare, but these days DVC members need to be more flexible in their policy or simply STOP renting points.

As owners, we all should get to decide how and when we do it and if some of us want to be rigid, it’s a valid way as long as we are upfront with the renter.

Of course, as I said my rigid policies come with a well below market value charge. In 2019, my renter was more than happy to pay $11/point for an 11 month booking for Food and Wine at BWV vs the $15/$16 others were charging

In this case, the renter did not have to go with an owner who didn’t have terms they liked. But they did and now should not be upset when an owner doesn’t want to change them.

Plenty of owners out there who are willing, as you say, to be flexible, so no reason any renter or owner has to be in a contract that doesn’t meet their needs.

 

[AZMermaid]

But he did offer them the ability to use the contract for the life of the points and they just want a full refund. Renting involves risks on both sides, yes, but owners shouldn‘t have to bend over backwards and give full refunds less than 60 days just because the renters changed their minds on a whim.

 

[DVC Doctor]

But he did offer them the ability to use the contract for the life of the points and they just want a full refund. Renting involves risks on both sides, yes, but owners shouldn‘t have to bend over backwards and give full refunds less than 60 days just because the renters changed their minds on a whim.

I never stated to give anyone a monetary refund, especially in this case of <60 days before checkin

I agree that this OP did the right thing by agreeing to change the reservation to any open date up until points expiration, but should not have to refund any money.

I am merely stating that we as owners should do the right thing and assist renters in the event of a change, and if you have an iron clad contract stating that no changes or modifications, then that is up to you, but will probably not result in a repeat renter or referral of their friends.