Yes, crowds getting worse, quality going down, prices going up, and schedule your entire trip months in advance. We have gone every year since 02, and never thought I would not want to anymore, but it has finally happened . We also had a wonderful time at universal. We had planned 2 of our 11 days at universal, and ended up the kids asked if we could use the free third day on our universal tix and go back our last day instead of MK!! So....universal is getting my money next year.
I'm sorry that Disney vets can get so jaded. In researching this year compared to other years, it seems that all theme parks are making a resurgence after being DOWN for a few years. The MK and the other parks have not gotten smaller, but have increased every year the usable space and added rides, restaurants, shops, etc. Toon Town gone, replaced with more Fantasyland. Old rides refurbished, etc. WDW wants as many SATISFIED, HAPPY customers as possible. And they do a GREAT job, or they wouldn't be busy! Great entertaining means popularity and crowds. Not the other way around. The less competition for good family entertainment, the more they can charge and the more crowded it may seem. Who is to blame for that? Disney? All 48.5 million guests to WDW parks? The evil Mouse? By the way, attendance figues seem to say that attendance has skyrocketed, by about a whopping
2.3%. Hmmm...
OP, I am so sorry you had such a bad experience, but I have to wonder if you did any research at all prior to your trip?
I went to the Halloween party on 9/29/13 and it was amazing. Barely any crowds, a ton of candy and we had an absolute blast!
I would never go to Paris without finding out about the Eiffel Tower or what restaurants are recommended. I wouldn't go camping in Banff/Jasper without coordinating the Calgary Stampede. I agree that the op showed little initiative in researching a family vacation, probably less than complaining here. A simple Google search would have brought a ton of info, even the official WDW site. All the info on FP+ is on their site as well. And, incidentally, with a Key to the World card you could have used paper FP still instead of FP+. But many rides would have FP distributed by noon anyway.
And as for
MNSSHP, I can't understand not knowing it would be crowded! Mardi Gras, Festival, heck even Times Square at NY, you have to know some events in life will be crowded! And according to some crowd calendars, the day of )ct 31, 2013 at the MK was LESS CROWDED than expected. TP website said it expected a 2 (out of 10) but was only a 1! This was for normal touring, not the MNSSHP. But only 3 rides?
I'm not sure you can blame Disney for you not doing your research about your trip. If you haven't been since 2006 you have to expect some things may have changed since then
The MB and FP+ system are still being tested as far as I know, so you could have opted out and just used your key card to access regular FP. I don't know what time you arrived in the parks, but if you arrive late on high crowd days some FPs are going to be gone regardless of whether or not guests are using regular FP or have pre-booked.
Exactly. Once I was there I think I would have done some research as to my options. If you had a smart phone you could have done quite a bit of research while waiting in the lines you hated - wifi is free there, isn't it?
It sounds to me like you are either exaggerating, you are extraordinarily averse to lines, or your definition of what constitutes a ride is different than most.
Would be interested in knowing which of these is the case, and which rides you were able to ride.
I messaged several guests. On the same day, a friend with 4 kids rode more than a dozen rides at MK and hopped and rode more at another park instead of going to MNSSHP. Very interesting
I'm totally serious. We went on 3 rides during the Halloween party (Pirates, Thunder Mountain and Haunted Mansion) and waited over an hour to get on Soarin
But yes, in all fairness, I'm adverse to spending over an over waiting for a 2 minute ride in an over conditioned building when we're spending thousands of dollars to get
out of the cold
In all fairness? To who? Some rides are very short, but did you really wait 2 hours for Thunder Mountain? And what over (air?) conditioned building did you wait for - you listed BTMR, HM, POC, and Soarin'. Soarin' is the only one I have ever seen with a very long wait and air conditioning, but I just wouldn't
have ridden it that late in the day. At rope drop or early morning it most certainly wasn't anywhere near that long of wait - probably less than 30-45 min. WDW is NOT a park for casual touring in peak times, and that should have been known by you if you have come before.
I read recently on a thread that MBs are not shipped to those that don't live in the US, and you have to pick up your bands at check in. That would explain why you didn't have them before your arrival.
Also, you say you booked through Disney, not a third party, so did you not receive any info via snail mail, or email about your upcoming trip? Did you not have access to the website and use
MDE?
But it appears op booked through CAA, not WDW TRavel. BIG difference!
AAA/CAA TAs are not exactly in the business to facilitate a magical experience. Only really savvy travelers that are just looking for that AAA discount deal should use them. A real TA at one of several (E.G DU from this board) sites would have provided much better service. But remember, TAs don't get thousands of dollars to do research for a boutique, concierge trip to WDW. Disney sets the rates, and if you aren't paying for a Travel Consultant to help you with the details, all you are getting is a booking anyway. This is not a NEW thing. By the way, when I traveled to Hawaii this year (not Aulani) I emailed, called and faxed the hotel for room requests. This is just smart travel to make sure each vacation goes as planned.
I think she personally wrote this type of review because she did not do the necessary research before going and just wanted some sympathy lol...Plus when did they move Soarin from Epcot to Magic Kingdom lol..Totally over reacting in my opinion.
As the OP said, she didn't do that in MK, but just to illustrate a point. But curiously, the op said they did 4 rides over 7 days. 3 on MNSSHP day on 10/31 and onlty 1 other - Soarin'. What about the other days????? I really find this difficult to take as seriously as I would with less apparent questionable complaints. Sorry, that is how it appears. And I have had my complaints over the years as well.
She was simply complaining that she spent top dollar for a Royal Room which she said looked nothing like was advertised. I'd too be annoyed if I booked their most expensive room and was facing the parking lot and had no pillows or blankets. I also agree that if you're spending $$$ to go to an exclusive event, it shouldn't be overbooked and have the amount of guests as a normal business day. It defeats the purpose, if the park is filled to capacity. Many of you say, "oh she should've researched", but not everyone has the time or desire to research every aspect of their vacations. Just my opinion.
Think about what you are saying. An exclusive event? MNSSHP is an event, but it sells out precisely because it is limited in attendance. It is busy to capacity MANY times of year, particularly holidays. Wouldn't YOU have tried to figure this out before spending $$$$? And if you don't have the DESIRE to research, then why complain? If the OP has seen what she thought was much nicer Royal Rooms, she must have done SOME RESEARCH. You can see the view from every Royal Standard Room at Port Orleans. Here is the worst I could find.
http://assets1.touringplans.com/assets/room_views/ORL015/9612.JPG
Not the Ocean View I had in Maui, but the standard Royal Rooms are only in Bldg 95 and 90, and are about the twinkle lights and wall designs. And are not that much more ($221 RR vs $182 RR) and a "garden view" Royal Room is only $6 more. Sounds like caveat emptor. And a low-budget TA is not responsible for what the rooms look like, and neither is Disney. I can't see the Holiday Inn room's view, can you?
We were there Halloween week as well, in Magic Kingdom on Tuesday 10/29 and found the lines all to be extremely short, with the paper Fastpass system plentiful. I thought Hollywood Studios on Weds 10/30 was a bit crowded but all in all I found the crowd levels very low until we went to Magic Kingdom on Sunday, 11/3 - that was busy but I figured it would be that way on a weekend.
Exactly
Also, yes we can blame Disney for the crowds. They control how many people can get into the parks on regular days and special event days. They can decide that they don't have to fill the place to fire capacity limits and can set their own limits based on customer enjoyment levels. I know I've said it before but they can still maximize profits by having less people in the parks. The law of supply and demand clearly supports price increases for the parks, which would push attendance down and in my opinion a more enjoyable experience would result. There is something to be said for maintaining quality in product and the parks are selling an experience. The quality of the experience is all within Disney's direct control.
But the OP was already complaining of the price! Lowering attendance by putting a lower limit woukld mean that thousands of parents who for some reason HAD to take their kids on Halloween would have been turned away. Probably MORE disgrunteld than if they had to crowd in. It would only have helped those who have planeed better and earlier, something the op obviously didn't do.
An expansion would help a lot; all I saw them building was the dwarf ride though. Another good idea would be to keep the parks open later than they are (except for Animal Kingdom, because of the animals well being)
That is why there are 4 theme parks, 2 water parks, golf courses, Disney Quest, a new area called Disney Springs for shopping and entertainment. It costs billions of dollars for any added area and attraction. I wish it has bigger, too, but I know who would have to pay. And later hasn't been always effective. If they could do that and still profit, they would - and they do. The hours change based on season and expected crowds. MNSSHP is just a holiday event, and we can't do anything about the crowds except not go on the busiest days.
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opps, sorry for daring to blame a multi-billion dollar corporation for not informing their customers of crucial changes and wanting them to send the necessary bands we required on time, it's clearly our fault for not doing THEIR job for them...
Sounds like an entitlement problem to me. Try buying a house, a car, plan a trip to Europe, or horrors, by a DVC from someone. It takes due diligence. I treat my money as a tool that needs looking after. We all should do the same and not expect someone else to look out for our lack of effort. The MBs are a work in progress. I don't like them yet, but it is what it is, and we all will learn the system. I DO feel for the op that they traveled unprepared to WDW during this transition time. But again, a SMALL amount of research would have revealed all this.
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My mom booked the vacation through Disney travel directly, DisneyParks
Not if she used CAA/AAA. Not possible. This is a common problem, a minimal-service agency is NOT WDW Travel. WDW Travel is not DisneyParks. Directly means, well, directly. And by phone or online to one of several hundred Disney employees that arrange your travel, but do not usually help with decisions or suggestions. That is why most of us use an experienced Disney
travel agency SPECIALIZING in Disney - not an auto club. It seems in reality you don't know exactly what your mom booked. Or how.
I'm so sorry that happened to you. Things like this is exactly why they need to have staff regulating these things, because there are too many people like this that are shamelessly out for themselves. And cast members who can't deal with needed confrontation should not apply
I am not a Disney "honk", but for minimum wage, with WDW having the most employees of any single site in the world, they do an incredible job of dealing with all our whining, finagling, and belligerence with only a minimal incidence of poor customer service. And they DO have staff regulating and overseeing these issues. I have dealt with them in the past, and at least for me, they have taken my complaints seriously and though they didn't always bow down to my wishes, treated me better than other mid-priced hotels (this is what Port Orleans is, you know).
This is exactly what I meant by them being poorly organized. I strongly dislike that they're using paying costumers as guinea pigs in their new experiment
As I said, you could have used a KTTW card instead of the MB. It isn't an experiment, it is testing what WILL be the new system. All of use wish that it wouldn't happen to us, but they aren't going to close the parks down for a few weeks and hire guinea pigs. It's like closing one lane of the highway instead of the whole thing. It ticks travelers off, but imagine if they had to take a detour?
We're waiting to see if they'll respond back to the survey my mom did for them, so we'll see how that goes, but right now, we are pretty livid with them
Unfortunately, a little late if you have left the park. Hopefully you lodged the complaint before you left at the hotel and the parks? Guest services? I didn't see that in your post.
I just don't think it's unreasonable to expect a cast member to use their authority to ensure kids can view the parade. In Toronto, they do the national Santa Clause parade annually, and the staff ensures the front row is for kids, because...the parade is *for* kids, just like Disney is.
Don't get me wrong, I'm an adult and love a lot of kids stuff too, but I will not ruin a child's day for my own benefit
Unfortunately, it sounds as if you should have gone to
Legoland. You enjoyed Universal, and that is much less a *for* kids park than the MK. And it is not a parade. Parades are 1 thing in a whole slew of activities, that if you had arrived early enough, you would have had a front row seat. Disney does provide areas for disadvantaged guests, but they figure able-bodied adults should be supervising their children, and get them to the viewing areas in time to see. I like to see the parades without screaming, unsupervised children right in front of me, or tripods of a video camera, or blankets spread out for 1/4 and acre saving a spot all day. But I know I can move to another spot, and show up earlier enough if I want an unobstructed view. I feel it is more rude when a mom pushes her toddler in front of my and my kids when she just showed up. I would gladly let a small child I see have a better view, but I have seen over the years more cheap positioning and using their small children for advantage, than small children genuinely stood in front of by adults.
Honestly, I wasn't even complaining about the regular crowd increase, just the over-selling of the party tickets.
However, I do think Disney can do A LOT more to cater to the growing crowds, like expanding attractions and keeping the parks (outside of Animal Kingdom) open a few hours longer.
They're a mega rich company, they can afford it
And they want to continue making money, which is their right. We have a right to not go, not buy their merchandise, and spend our vacation dollars elsewhere. Unfortunately they still produce one of the best and most expensive vacation destination in the world, and most of us will just go at lower crowd times and expect to see others who do the same thing.
But I do think one of the biggest reasons their line rides are so long is because they simply don't have many rides to accommodate the number of people that come to their parks
We go because of school in July. Hot, crowded. But we arrive early, ride all the rides we want, and go back to the hotel for a swim or rest, and do it again in the evening after some crowds have pooped out. Those days are more crowded than October by far. But again, we plan. And I have never ridden just 4 rides in a day, and can't imagine it. Single rider lines, FP, going when parades are going, doing a line swap, there are so many strategies for getting the rides done. The only one that never seems to work is showing up about noon expecting to ride what you want.
We're not complaining about outside incidents, this is about totally preventable problems that Disney could have prevented. We're mad at their lack of communication, the disorganization, the over selling, the reduction in quality (but not prices!) and the general cheapness of the corporation that makes BILLIONS.
I don't hate Disney, I hate what they've become and I can't say I'd want to continue lining the pockets of their big wigs while they continue to treat their costumers as if they're disposable
Disney is NOT a few cigar-smoking mogul. I am a shareholder. 1 share per family member. WDW employs more than 66,000 people, spending more than $1.2 billion on payroll and $474 million on benefits each year. They run an amazing College internship program, and an international program. 5000 cast members just do maintenance and engineering, with 600 painters and 750 horticulturists. Disney spends $100 million on maintenance at the MK alone every year. They run a tree farm to supply all the trees on the property. They paint the carousel horses with gold leaf paint. Cheapness? Not exactly. 66,000 people think differently, and 10s of thousands apply for the job openings that wish they too could be part of this big wig, cheap company.
I was at the party on Halloween night. I had my issues with typical "rude people" syndrome, but we really enjoyed our night. Got on lots of rides without waiting longer then 10 minutes, saw the parade from a nice spot and got tons of candy.
Hmmm...
My mom spoke with the travel agent on the phone multiple times, even up to, basically, when we left. The package was picked-up at CAA (which is the Canadian AAA) and the travel agent there didn't say anything about the bands either (but I'm guessing it's because Disney did not inform them as well).
Since we neither were informed about them, nor received them with the package, we had no way of even pre-booking any fast-passes to begin with. And if this is common for residents outside of the USA, than that's completely unfair
Once again, blame your CAA "Travel agent." They are the only ones that could have told you about the bands and any changes to FP. They are the TA - they get PAID a commission from the travel supplier to sell these to you or your mom. They should have done so, but they are the least likely TAs to actually have been to the parks or have spent any time doing the research. Some auto club TAs may be very knowledgeable. but really, if you had spent "multiple times", was there already some confusion. Talking about what? The seller of the travel should be the one to tell you anything, not the destination. I cannot see the reason you blame Disney instead of who sold you the package and did not tell you what almost everyone here on this board knew for many months. Every
Disney travel agent I know spends time on these forums, and does so to help them be better at what your travel agent was not.
We did, and I just re-checked the site and they still don't list "parking lot" as a possible view for a Royal Room, unless "Landscaping" is a euphemism for it.
Every resort hotel I have been to lists the view. Standard almost always means a parking lot, Royal Room or no. There ARE parking lots at Port Orleans, and some rooms have to view them - just like at the Holiday In or a Sheraton. The Standard Rooms fit this description.
I find all this blatant defending, here, of a multi-billion dollar companies shady policies to be nauseating
And I find your accusations of "shady" policies to border on criminal. It doesn't matter their portfolio, you were hurt and are mad. And it appears you got on this board not for advice or solutions, but to air your dirty laundry.
It was both done through Disney directly, and through their affiliates at a CAA (Canadian AAA) travel office near us. None of it was done online but directly through agents
Do you not get this? Canadian Auto Association is not an "Affiliate" of Walt Disney Company. You would have done better going online.
Disney doesn't have to contact you, but if you're booking THROUGH them they should at least bring it up, I mean they have no problem pitching things to people to buy but suddenly get quite when it comes to something that you need to know about, prior, to enjoy your vacation?...
Oh right, because they don't profit off of your enjoyment, once the checks are signed and sent their job is done
Please read this to yourself. You didn't book anything through them. They didn't pitch anything to you - CAA did. And yes, they would not be so successful if they didn't care about your enjoyment, even if their motives include making even more money.
The multi-billion dollar company can afford to send people on pre-paid vacations to test their new systems and provide feedback, only than, when all the kinks are sorted out, should it be made available to paying guests
Where can I sign up for Beta-testing? Free vacations for all!
I get that some people are shorter, some people are even literal dwarfs, but there's got to be a time when you acknowledge that you're an adult, which means you don't try to compete with children because it's...pathetic
Actually it would really mean competing with adults like...you! Parents of small children are by rule supposed to be with their small children.
Of course, but no need to ruin a kids dreams because you want to have fun
Of course, I have never met a child whose dream for life was to see Mickey's Jammin' Jungle Parade. Pretty sad actually if true.
And as far as the parade comment goes: you need to go back and reread what you said to that lady that is 5'1" and can't see over many people. You basically told her she's "competing with CHILDREN to view a children's parade". If she got there an hour before the parade starts to make sure she has a nice view than what's wrong with that? Should my 69 year old mother who is about 5'2" allow kids who tower over her to go to the front? She's shorter than them just like the PP so obviously they are going to be able to see.
WAIT...I just saw your comment about "competing with children" and being "pathetic". How do you know adults aren't there for their first time? How do you know they aren't ill and it was their dream to go to WDW one last time? I LOVE kids but there are other circumstances that you aren't thinking about.
Very true. We are never the only ones affected by these things.
I might be misreading, so if you could clarify for me that would be great. You said you went directly through Disney but you also mention CAA and a travel agent. But if you used a travel agent, that wouldn't be directly through with Disney? Right? I'm slightly confused.
So we have tried to tell you nicely, at first. But this isn'yt the evil Mouse's fault. Disney is a big corporation, which happens to make a lot of children's dreams (and adults) come true. But there will always be mishaps and confusion when you deal with money, crowds, logistics. But to blame the wrong entity, and never see that YOU are mostly to blame for your lack of due diligence, and your so-called travel agent who you think works for Walt Disney, is ludicrous. You don't want help or advice, just to complain and exaggerate or mis-state the issues. Everyone here knows that there are things Disney could do better. But we also want to enjoy our future vacations, and giving helpful advice is mostly what this board is for. I am sorry I have been so caustic, but your approach rubs me the wrong way. I would not suggest trying Disney again, but go back to Universal as you suggested. What makes Disney unbearable at times is the guests, not the Cast Members or the attractions.
As Pogo said, "We have met the enemy and he is us."
And Pogo also said, "Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent."
) I started getting these things around October 27th.
