WDW Wants to develop more wetlands than planned - Orlando Sentinel Article

[lockedoutlogic]

With DHS you'll get that mix of both. Two major E tickets in Star Wars and the family attractions to keep people occupied in toy story. Then of course whatever comes with phase 3.

Well...it's been awhile...so I have to say:

T.O.T.S.

Do not count on what you typed...
The toy story land is pretty safe money...the Star Wars is just smoke and mirrors now.

Need an example? the underwhelming back section of magic kingdom...just not more than an average effort on the whole.

 

[rteetz]

I think a fifth gate is a fantasy...

Not because they couldn't eventually fill it...because they lack the will to spend for it.

Gates require massive amounts of infrastructure before they are even close to going vertical...then a locked in guarantee of longterm labor and support costs that escalate over time.

They are also longterm financed debt...which Disney now has big time in two spots that aren't the slam dunks Orlando is: Paris and the overpopulated toxic dump known as mainland China.

Just don't see it.

Back to the pricing...we all seem to agree that their recent policies is to create almost a new "Disney class" of wage earners that are insulated and will always have a discretional cash...

To take the "50 mil" attendance and get it to 75+ to justify another gate you have to have a legion of "middle income" patrons. That is the foundation of Disney parks.

That pool is not going to be replaced...they are positioning the consumer to be forced to one of the poles:

The very wealthy who frankly have little use for Disney's "not quite excellent service"...and the lower tier that will never be able to beg, borrow, or steal enough cash to get there.

The "victory of capitalism"

I think 5th gate is fantasy any time soon but I don't see think it is unreasonable 30 years from now. I see a second gate in Hong Kong as the next park to be built. Then possibly Shanghai.

 

[rteetz]

Well...it's been awhile...so I have to say:

T.O.T.S.

Do not count on what you typed...
The toy story land is pretty safe money...the Star Wars is just smoke and mirrors now.

Need an example? the underwhelming back section of magic kingdom...just not more than an average effort on the whole.

New fantasyland was over hyped but it's not like they said it would be all major e ticket attractions or anything. Disney never doesn't over hype anything these days.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I think 5th gate is fantasy any time soon but I don't see think it is unreasonable 30 years from now. I see a second gate in Hong Kong as the next park to be built. Then possibly Shanghai.

Disney will never build another domestic park unless there's a fundamental shift in how economics works in relation to compensation and expenses...this ain't the 80's...and the fact that the last two generations will decline in wealth from the boomers isn't a myth and frankly likely isn't fixable.

You have to have consumers to sell things too...Disney's arc on parks will leave the chart far sooner than people think. Just my take.

 

[Planogirl]

Disney might be taking precautions in the event of a turndown. Pushing DVC so hard could lead to more people being locked into vacations at WDW if the economy goes south.

I don't expect a fifth park either. I did at one time but it does appear that Disney's priorities have shifted from what it once was. I'm not saying it's a good or bad thing, just different.

 

[circus4u]

Even if they wanted to build a 5th gate now, are there enough people in the Orlando area that Disney could tap into to staff the park? I have no idea how many employees would be required, but seems it would be pretty darn high.

 

[rteetz]

Even if they wanted to build a 5th gate now, are there enough people in the Orlando area that Disney could tap into to staff the park? I have no idea how many employees would be required, but seems it would be pretty darn high.

Well there is a lot of projects coming into Orlando area. You have universal opening a new water park and resort in the next two years, I-Drive has new things popping up all the time, Disney Springs shops and restaurants, and the flamingo crossings hotels. You'd have to think that requires a lot of employees too so these companies must feel the people are there to do it.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Even if they wanted to build a 5th gate now, are there enough people in the Orlando area that Disney could tap into to staff the park? I have no idea how many employees would be required, but seems it would be pretty darn high.

Absolutely not...

Labor has been a problem in Orlando since ak opened.

Which is why then likely have to outsource many things to ever staff another park area.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Well there is a lot of projects coming into Orlando area. You have universal opening a new water park and resort in the next two years, I-Drive has new things popping up all the time, Disney Springs shops and restaurants, and the flamingo crossings hotels. You'd have to think that requires a lot of employees too so these companies must feel the people are there to do it.

You have to want to pay more than $0.10 an hour over minimum wage...and Disney abandoned that concept as too expensive long ago.

In the past...universal and sea world have at times drawn people away for "better pay"...which still amounts to chump change.

Disney labor - buy and large - is pretty low to start and has a low "top out" number that basically locks you in after about 7 years...their labor numbers are somewhat guaranteed. With some cost of living variations.

 

[ParrotBill]

Here's another article on this subject, with some speculation built in on what Disney might be doing with it!

http://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/...s-so-they-can-destroy-wetlands-closer-to-park

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Good read...thanks for posting

 

[TheRustyScupper]

Someone might come to the conclusion that the development of "more wetlands" is to release other wetlands for park development and/or expansion.

 

[circus4u]

Someone might come to the conclusion that the development of "more wetlands" is to release other wetlands for park development and/or expansion.

Hmmm, Pandora at 47 acres??????????????????????

 

[rteetz]

Hmmm, Pandora at 47 acres??????????????????????

Pandora just can't be 47 acres tho. All Aerial images show around 11 acres. Star Wars is being constructed at 14 and is being promoted as the biggest land Disney has built or whatever. 47 acres is close to the size of typhoon lagoon.

 

[Lee Matthews]

It's all well and good opening a 5th gate but it depends on what your going to put in it. Star Wars Land and Toy story land at DHS will probably bring as many people as a 5th gate. Its just going to make DHS full in no time

 

[lockedoutlogic]

It's all well and good opening a 5th gate but it depends on what your going to put in it. Star Wars Land and Toy story land at DHS will probably bring as many people as a 5th gate. Its just going to make DHS full in no time

They need to massively rework that park to put new significant areas in there... That IS like a whole new park.

I think that some of the wheels are turning as I would expect a massive transportation rework over this winter when it's slower and conditions are favorable.

 

[rteetz]

I think that some of the wheels are turning as I would expect a massive transportation rework over this winter when it's slower and conditions are favorable.

We can already see that in the permit that was just filed. You have the parking changes, road changes, and the one entrance becoming buses only.

 

[TheRustyScupper]

They need to massively rework that park to put new significant areas in there

.
1) Or, convert/consume existing areas into the "new" areas.
2) Example:
. . . there could be a river
. . . . . . the river might be considered part of a new "land"
. . . . . . thus, without adding new land area, the new land gets big, right away
. . . there could be a roadway or pathway
. . . . . . the roadway or pathway might be considered part of the new "land"
. . . . . . thus, without adding new land area, the new land gets big, right away
. . . there could be an existing ride or attraction
. . . . . . the ride or attraction could be considered or converted to be part of the new "land"
. . . thus, without adding rises, the new land gets big, right away
3) Let us not assume that when new lands are built, it automatically means an area expansion.

 

[jetdoctor]

A NEW PARK MUST BE BUILT. NO MORE ROOM FOR GUEST. PARKS VERY OVER CROWED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FOOD AND WINE IS STARTING ON SOME DAYS RIVAL CHRISTMAS TIME CROWDS. DO CHILDREN GO TO SCHOOL ANYMORE?. No but really I am a once a week visiter and have really noticed over the last 2 years that crowd levels have increase significantly. We all know that more hotels and what seems to be a ton of restaurants @ Disney Springs aren't going to keep long time visitors happy for ever. For me the value is ever shrinking. Now that being said I have always waited in lines since 1981. But those lines are getting longer and longer. There is only maybe 3 full weeks all year that are truly slow. I do believe Disney will answer that 5 gate question some day but i think we are now going to have to wait till DHS is done with its expansion.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I said "rework"...not add. And that's what I meant.

As in they have to get rid of the "studios"...it been mothballed or badly repurpose for 20 years