Was there ever, in Disney's history...

[V.B.]

I am reading post after post about all the changes in the Disney Parks being less 'magical'. I know Disney is an expensive place, but I always remember the Parks being clean as a kid, the staff being nice, the parades etc and how with the price increases and the 'less is more' motto that seems to be the norm, I'm starting to hear that more people are starting to spend their money elsewhere.

With that being said... Has there ever been a time in Disney's history a time when people stayed away and Disney noticed? I seem to recall Pete saying a while back on one of shows that Disney added perks to their annual passes to woo people back, but I can't remember if it was when they first offered them, or if people had stopped going (after 9/11, people understandably didn't travel much) in general. Or, were things like 'free dining' added to increase numbers?

I'm just wondering if you think Disney will change if people STOP going (not sure that they'll drop prices, but, do you think incentives will be added in the future). From what I'm reading people are right now going, maybe because of not being allowed to travel for so long, the 50th, etc. But, that could change if people decide that the full garbage bins, getting up at 7 am and Genie plus not working is not worth the prices.

Thoughts?

 

[Robo]

Has there ever been a time in Disney's history a time when people stayed away and Disney noticed?

One comes to mind...
Quite awhile following the tragic events of September 11, 2001.

 

[StageTek]

I'm just wondering if you think Disney will change if people STOP going (not sure that they'll drop prices, but, do you think incentives will be added in the future).

There would have to be a huge drop for Disney to change any money saving perks. A 15% to even 25% drop can be attributed to many other things. Right now it's reduced travel from other countries due to the pandemic.

I think Disney might reinstate a few of the perks someday.

 

[Grasshopper2016]

I think that Disney historically adds perks and makes an effort to attract visitors whenever attendance takes a sustained downturn. But (1) those downturns tend to be the result of broad social and economic forces (like 9/11), rather that mass dissatisfaction with Disney itself or with recent changes it has made; (2) for now, anyway, demand for tourism seems to be extremely high, notwithstanding the pandemic and associated economic stress; and (3) Disney’s recent decisions to exploit that demand by raising costs and reducing value with utter disregard for the customer experience seem unprecedented. There don’t seem to be any short-term consequences to those decisions, which is why Disney keeps doubling down. But the jury is still out on whether there will be any medium- or long-term consequences. I don’t think that we can look to the past for answers because, again, this seems unprecedented.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

I remember clearly for us. 2008 financial crisis. My oldest was 10 and it was Golden until probably FF+.

People (not me) could make multiple lunch reservations and not show. Now I can’t make ONE.

I could decide depending on the weather if I wanted to go to water park that very day or not because FP was same day.

First week of December EVERYTHING was a walk on.

EMH meant low crowds.

They were very few after hours events, so park hours were much longer.

There were no cell phones so people watched where they were going.

Disney has significantly increased the number of hotel rooms via DVC in the last decade so resort perks have been watered down.

For whatever reason, the number of benches in WS has been drastically reduced. Could be elsewhere also, but walking and people watching in the world showcase is my thing.

Adding the number of FP lanes to attractions that didn’t need them, such as SE, caused SB lines to increase.

TIW saved us quite a bit and encouraged more TS restaurants.

I’m sure I’ll remember more things eventually.

 

[JZCubed]

I am reading post after post about all the changes in the Disney Parks being less 'magical'. I know Disney is an expensive place, but I always remember the Parks being clean as a kid, the staff being nice, the parades etc and how with the price increases and the 'less is more' motto that seems to be the norm, I'm starting to hear that more people are starting to spend their money elsewhere.

With that being said... Has there ever been a time in Disney's history a time when people stayed away and Disney noticed? I seem to recall Pete saying a while back on one of shows that Disney added perks to their annual passes to woo people back, but I can't remember if it was when they first offered them, or if people had stopped going (after 9/11, people understandably didn't travel much) in general. Or, were things like 'free dining' added to increase numbers?

I'm just wondering if you think Disney will change if people STOP going (not sure that they'll drop prices, but, do you think incentives will be added in the future). From what I'm reading people are right now going, maybe because of not being allowed to travel for so long, the 50th, etc. But, that could change if people decide that the full garbage bins, getting up at 7 am and Genie plus not working is not worth the prices.

Thoughts?

"Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded." -- Yogi Berra

For us, thankfully, it is not the financial cost that will cause the greatest change to our behavior.

My family has likely reached a tipping-point by the expected daily interaction with Genie @ 7am.

Disney IT is bad enough; daily @ 7am is not vacation for us.

It's one thing to pay more and get more, and it's even expected that we pay for inflation by paying more and getting the same, but it appears that Disney is expecting folks to simply pay more for less.

Genie seems to mean working harder to plan on a daily basis while paying more for that privilege.

Seems a bit distasteful.

My family is not sure we want to contribute to that in 2022.

 

[soniam]

I think Disneyland in the 80s had issues with attendance. I thought that’s why they added Splash Mountain and that teen dance club thing at night.

 

[goofy4prez]

I remember back sometime around 2008-2010 at the height of the housing market crash and a tanking economy, Disney like so many other places was struggling to attract crowds. They offered a promotion I believe was a 4/3 deal where you booked four nights and received 3 nights free and also received a $200 gift card as well (Or something like this). It was the best promotion I have ever taken advantage of at WDW.

 

[Jonfw2]

I'd recommend watching the entire Imagineering series on D+. Yes, it's a bit whitewashed, as it is made by Disney, but there are some very candid "warts and all" moments discussing some leaner times and poor decision making.

 

[Moms]

We are going soon and are anxious to see what the changes bring to the experience. I have to (to some extent, not unequivocally), take Disney's side in some of what has transpired in the last several months. First and foremost Disney is a business, a publicly held company and they have shareholders looking for profits. It has always been a "magical" place but it has always been expensive too. My husband always said if you want to see the real "Disney Magic", open your wallet and watch your money disappear. And that was years ago ... even before the good old days before fast pass plus!

People keep coming despite the changes so why would (or should) they go back to what some think were the "glory days". Looking at attendance levels ... especially this time of year, it is hard to really believe that Disney is really ruining the experience ... at least not across the board. We have no problem with being up at 7:00 AM ... in fact we are generally on our way to the parks at that time! The busses are full so we are not alone. If you like to sleep in, more power to you, but it is not something that everyone does at WDW. We will give Genie a try but will wait in long lines if we opt out at some of the parks. Frankly I prefer being able to purchase a chance to ride Rise of the Resistance rather than that awful, anxiety ridden boarding pass system that was in place in 2020 when we had to cancel our last trip. If you didn't get a pass you didn't ride ... at least now you can wait in line! It's a choice and it's nice to have one!

I know we are paying more and in theory getting less, but have you been to the grocery store lately? Everything is more expensive and many, many things are in short supply ... why would we imagine that Disney isn't having the same issues on their end?

 

[lampshadehead]

I remember back sometime around 2008-2010 at the height of the housing market crash and a tanking economy, Disney like so many other places was struggling to attract crowds. They offered a promotion I believe was a 4/3 deal where you booked four nights and received 3 nights free and also received a $200 gift card as well (Or something like this). It was the best promotion I have ever taken advantage of at WDW.

The 4/3 deal is when I got hooked! It's weird though, because I remember it being very crowded the year I went on the 4/3 deal (it was also July). So when I visit now, at other times of the year, it still doesn't feel as crowded as my first introduction to summertime WDW.

 

[SteveH]

I'm just wondering if you think Disney will change if people STOP going (not sure that they'll drop prices, but, do you think incentives will be added in the future). From what I'm reading people are right now going, maybe because of not being allowed to travel for so long, the 50th, etc. But, that could change if people decide that the full garbage bins, getting up at 7 am and Genie plus not working is not worth the prices.

I do believe that after a while of this madhouse they have created it will begin to bite them in the backside, but not right now. There is to pent up demand to vacation and Disney is seen as 'safe' but as these guests go and get the lack of royal treatment I think they will begin to turn on Disney and won't see the value in it. The question will be if Disney adapts quickly or not. I think this could be when Universal takes a bigger bit out Disney parks then Disney wants to admit.

 

[Brian Noble]

9/11 was the big one that I remember. WDW ran a "Buy 4, get 3" promotion in the year or two after that---pay rack for four nights, stay for seven.

The Great Recession had an impact, but not nearly so large. I do remember a lot of fire-sale DVC rentals then, but I don't recall WDW discounts being completely out of line.

Edited to add: reading back through the responses, I might have my dates crossed. The 4/3 deal might have been Great Recession.

 

[parasail_of_congress]

I am reading post after post about all the changes in the Disney Parks being less 'magical'.

The audience of this board is a tiny fraction of people who actually go to Disney Parks. There are always going to be some people dissatisfied with a product, and they are usual the vocal minority. Message boards are inherently a place to complain about things.

 

[Newbie500]

I remember one year, staying on property, pre-C, when we could not get back into MK on NYE. Shortly before midnight we did get in. We were told it was because locals had gone home to ring in the new year.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

Keep in mind that to a certain degree, Disney wants a limited umber of people to stop coming. I.E. some of this is planned.

Also, it is very, very difficult to determine who much is attributable to COVID, the economy, inflation, household budgets, etc...

Eventually, they will bring back incentives. But they are no where near that, since again they are purposely artificially raising prices to lower attendance.

 

[disneyseniors]

There have always been things that people don't like or changes by disney. Then these things are usually griped about and forgotten, and everyone goes back to disney and accepts these changes.
Now? It just feels different. My husband and I are "the disney couple" who all the family goes to for help with disney. Now, we are telling them it is not worth it anymore for us, we wont' be back, and will try other destinations from now on. And , even though I will miss the "old" disney, we will move on to other things. We are the hooked couple that always went to disney every year from out of state and loved all things disney.
For us to change about disney, alot of negative things have to happen.
So that is one reason why I think this time it is different.
It is difficult for a business to recover when their brand name has been tarnished. Sears, anyone?

 

[DavidNYC]

I remember clearly for us. 2008 financial crisis. My oldest was 10 and it was Golden until probably FF+.

People (not me) could make multiple lunch reservations and not show. Now I can’t make ONE.

I could decide depending on the weather if I wanted to go to water park that very day or not because FP was same day.

First week of December EVERYTHING was a walk on.

EMH meant low crowds.

They were very few after hours events, so park hours were much longer.

There were no cell phones so people watched where they were going.

Disney has significantly increased the number of hotel rooms via DVC in the last decade so resort perks have been watered down.

For whatever reason, the number of benches in WS has been drastically reduced. Could be elsewhere also, but walking and people watching in the world showcase is my thing.

Adding the number of FP lanes to attractions that didn’t need them, such as SE, caused SB lines to increase.

TIW saved us quite a bit and encouraged more TS restaurants.

I’m sure I’ll remember more things eventually.

I remember going a couple times during that crisis. It was almost eerie. It was beyond walk ons - I remember mid-day heading to Body Wars and there being only 4-5 people in the entire ride vehicle. It was actually too quiet - attractions like Honey I Shrunk the Audience had maybe 50 people in a 500+ seat theater so all of the fake screaming and fake audience reaction that was part of the soundtrack just sounded weird. I've been on this board for decades and I've never seen such disappointment on such a large scale as now. Nothing was even remotely close to this. And what is Chapek focused on? Getting Disney into internet gambling . . . I'm sure that's exactly what Walt would have wanted for his company . . .

 

[prestoncaldwell]

Every time Disney makes a change, some people get their backs up and vow never to return. Many of them probably don't ever return.

Yet crowds get larger and larger and larger.

 

[Moms]

Every time Disney makes a change, some people get their backs up and vow never to return. Many of them probably don't ever return.

Yet crowds get larger and larger and larger.

Heartily agree! I especially like the posts boo-hoo-ing about how things are ruined at Disney while they are packing their bags and checking their ADR’s! That said, I do think judgement should wait until one has experienced a trip with the changes in place.