Victoria & Albert's: How Much Would You Pay?

[jrtoastyman]

Thinking of going to V&A's during our upcoming stay. Here's the dilemma: as compared to other restaurants in its class, the pricing is actually very reasonable. Unfortunately, we'll have a toddler with us and will need to add child care into the mix if we want to go, which I would estimate would add about another $100 to the evening when it's all said and done. That would knock the total cost of the meal up to about $600 in the dining room, more if we did QV or the CT.

This is obviously not V&A's problem, but it does have the practical effect of raising the price to a point where it's in some pretty elite company. Is the experience there good enough that it would be worth it even at that price, or are we better off waiting until we're back another time when we have family with us or she's at least older and we can take her to one of the child activity centers?

Thanks for any insight...

 

[JimmyV]

The Main Dining Room is not worth $600+. You are starting to get up into French Laundry and Per Se territory at that rate. While the QV might rank on a similar scale, the main dining room does not, IMHO.

 

[jrtoastyman]

You are starting to get up into French Laundry and Per Se territory at that rate.

It was exactly this thought that prompted the post, after we started pricing it out. While I've not eaten at either of those places (yet ), I was thinking about what I've paid to eat at some other culinary meccas, and the only place that I've spent that kind of coin is Alinea, and it made me wonder if it was in that same realm.

 

[JimmyV]

If you gave me a $600 gift certificate good at either V&A main dining room or Alinea, it wouldn't be close. I'd go to Aliea every time. But it is a bit of an apples and oranges concept because if you are at WDW, Alinea isn't an option, geographically. When I am at WDW and I want a really special meal, V&A is perfect. But I don't think of it as destination dining where I would drop $600 (or more) the way I have at FL, Per Se and Alinea. (To be fair, FL and Per Se are actually quite a bit more. $270 per person before wine pairings and tax, but with tip included. All in, you are looking at closer to $800). V&A is a relative bargain, but not after you factor in your child care issues if that will put you into the $600 range.

 

[Carrie in AZ]

Sort of off topic....

If you are looking for something very special, have you thought about a private dining experience at the GF? It won't be a culinary "explosion" like at V&A, but is still very special.

In 2006, I planned a special dinner for DH and myself through Private Dining. It was suppose to at the alcove by the marina but it rained so they moved us indoors. We had a table for two decorated with rose petals, our own amazing server, entrees that I selected, champagne, and a small anniversary cake with the white choc castle on top and a Cindy's Plate which is a choc slipper filled with mousse and berries. IT WAS VERY VERY SPECIAL! And, the total bill with tip was about $360 if I remember correctly. Loved that it was just the two of us, so private, so romantic and soooo special. We did have childcare for our two DDs so that added to the cost as well.

Just thought I'd mention this in case you are looking for another option. Not sure what and how Private Dining works in 2011, it may be different, but again, I thought I'd mention it.

 

[jrtoastyman]

Sort of off topic....

If you are looking for something very special, have you thought about a private dining experience at the GF? It won't be a culinary "explosion" like at V&A, but is still very special.

In 2006, I planned a special dinner for DH and myself through Private Dining. It was suppose to at the alcove by the marina but it rained so they moved us indoors. We had a table for two decorated with rose petals, our own amazing server, entrees that I selected, champagne, and a small anniversary cake with the white choc castle on top and a Cindy's Plate which is a choc slipper filled with mousse and berries. IT WAS VERY VERY SPECIAL! And, the total bill with tip was about $360 if I remember correctly. Loved that it was just the two of us, so private, so romantic and soooo special. We did have childcare for our two DDs so that added to the cost as well.

Just thought I'd mention this in case you are looking for another option. Not sure what and how Private Dining works in 2011, it may be different, but again, I thought I'd mention it.

Thanks for the tip, was not aware that that was an option. We're most interested in V&A's from just a visceral, "holy-cow-this-food-is-amazing" standpoint than because we're celebrating anything special, but definitely good to have this in our back pocket, because I'm sure we'll be celebrating something at Disney at SOME point in the future.

The only thing we're really celebrating on THIS trip is our daughter's 3rd birthday, which is somewhat ironic in the context of a discussion about a restaurant where we can't take her yet. That, and we're celebrating the fact that she'll still be free on this trip (her actual birthday is right after we get back).

 

[contemporarymom]

I have to say, while I might get flamed, that in my opinion V&A isn’t even in the same league as Per Se, Alinea, French Laundry or even Masa. Don’t get me wrong, V&A is a good restaurant. A bit precious for my liking, but a good solid restaurant. If you want a good above average dining experience in Disney V&A will fit the bill, but if you’re looking for a true world class dining experience my advice would be to look elsewhere.

 

[jrtoastyman]

I have to say, while I might get flamed, that in my opinion V&A isn’t even in the same league as Per Se, Alinea, French Laundry or even Masa.

Well, you won't get flamed by me, you'll get thanked for your frank assessment of the place. As I mentioned above, that's really the question that prompted the post, although it might not be entirely fair to compare it to those places (although it might be, since some of them are also AAA 5D restaurants). The places you mentioned are in rarefied air, although, as a PP pointed out, they are also quite a bit more expensive.

If you step outside of those the truly elite places, though, how does it compare to comparably priced big name/celebrity chef restaurants? Does it hold its own?

 

[contemporarymom]

Well, you won't get flamed by me, you'll get thanked for your frank assessment of the place. As I mentioned above, that's really the question that prompted the post, although it might not be entirely fair to compare it to those places (although it might be, since some of them are also AAA 5D restaurants). The places you mentioned are in rarefied air, although, as a PP pointed out, they are also quite a bit more expensive.

If you step outside of those the truly elite places, though, how does it compare to comparably priced big name/celebrity chef restaurants? Does it hold its own?

Ok, lets compare it with two rather well known "celebrity" restaurants, Daniel and Jean Georges (New York). The price range for their tasting menus are fairly similar so they should be fair comparisons. Unfortunately IMO V&A still falls short. As I stated before, V&A's is a good above average restaurant but in no way, shape or form does it compare to the top tier of restaurants in that price range.

I have had the privilege to eat at all of the restaurants I've mentioned including V&A and while I did enjoy V&A each time I've dined there I wouldn't put it in the same category as the others.

 

[yenlee]

It's a tricky question, because only the OP can know what is "worth the money" to him. The best answer one can give is to explain where V&A lies on the spectrum of great restaurants (which in any case is hugely subjective). The most useful answers were the ones that said that V&A is just not as good as Per Se, Jean Georges, etc, but I'm pretty sure most people already assume this. And of course, the comparison is sort of meaningless if OP has not eaten at these sorts of places.

Also, instead of bundling the childcare cost into the "value" of the meal, I would think of it this way: The meal cost pays for actual food and drink that you consume. The childcare costs pay for the experience of being able to dine in peace without your children (or any other children) bothering you. It sounds to me that you are more concerned that the second cost is not a good value rather than the first cost. In particular, if you actually prefer NOT to ditch your kid for a night at WDW, then I think you should skip V&A.

Btw, it seems irrelevant to me that for the same cost of a meal at V&A, you can have a meal at Famous Restaurant X in NYC. (Possibly relevant if you actually *live* in NYC area or visit frequently.)

 

[BriarRosie]

Alinea is close enough to me, but I haven't been there. I need to round up some foodie friends and try it. I do think it will be a few notches above V&A, even though the total experience at V&A is worth more than the food alone.

For the food and the value, the tasting menu at Tchoup Chop at Universal Royal Pacific was far less expensive, but blew me away in terms of quality for the value. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it. Or maybe I would...no need to give away a hidden gem.

 

[jrtoastyman]

It's a tricky question, because only the OP can know what is "worth the money" to him. The best answer one can give is to explain where V&A lies on the spectrum of great restaurants (which in any case is hugely subjective). The most useful answers were the ones that said that V&A is just not as good as Per Se, Jean Georges, etc, but I'm pretty sure most people already assume this. And of course, the comparison is sort of meaningless if OP has not eaten at these sorts of places.

For what it's worth, while I've not yet eaten at Per Se or Jean Georges in particular, I travel quite a bit for work and do tasting menus at similar places pretty regularly -- recent places would include Fleur de Lys, Alinea, Topalabampo, moto, wd-50, Morimoto, etc., and I'm actually going on a dining trip to NYC in a couple of days -- so I'm not averse to dropping a couple bills for a great meal or more (as in the case of Alinea) for something truly exceptional. I guess the question is where on the spectrum a V&A's experience lies. Sounds like it's below a place like Alinea, but probably on par with those others?

 

[jrtoastyman]

For the food and the value, the tasting menu at Tchoup Chop at Universal Royal Pacific was far less expensive, but blew me away in terms of quality for the value. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it. Or maybe I would...no need to give away a hidden gem.

I actually did this, too, about a month ago. Loved it, was our best meal in Orlando by a wide margin!

 

[JimmyV]

Ok, lets compare it with two rather well known "celebrity" restaurants, Daniel and Jean Georges (New York). The price range for their tasting menus are fairly similar so they should be fair comparisons. Unfortunately IMO V&A still falls short.

Main Dining Room, yes. Queen Victoria room, no. I would put QV on par with Daniel and Jean Georges.

As I stated before, V&A's is a good above average restaurant but in no way, shape or form does it compare to the top tier of restaurants in that price range.

I think it is far better than "above average". And while accolades are not the best or true measure, it has had a AAA Five Diamond for many years, and those are hard to come by. In attaining that status, it is not measured against Ohana and Chef Mickey's. It is measured against The Inn at Little Washington, Charlie Trotter's, Daniel and the like. Also, Forbes (formerly Mobil) just came out with its Five Star List of hotels and restauarants. No Florida restaurants got five stars. V&A (along with Norman's) were the only 4 star restaurants in the Orlando area. Recognition along these lines suggests a restaurant that is better than "above average."

 

[contemporarymom]

Main Dining Room, yes. Queen Victoria room, no. I would put QV on par with Daniel and Jean Georges.



I think it is far better than "above average". And while accolades are not the best or true measure, it has had a AAA Five Diamond for many years, and those are hard to come by. In attaining that status, it is not measured against Ohana and Chef Mickey's. It is measured against The Inn at Little Washington, Charlie Trotter's, Daniel and the like. Also, Forbes (formerly Mobil) just came out with its Five Star List of hotels and restauarants. No Florida restaurants got five stars. V&A (along with Norman's) were the only 4 star restaurants in the Orlando area. Recognition along these lines suggests a restaurant that is better than "above average."

That's why it's an opinion. We have eaten in the main dining room, the Queen Victoria Room and at the Chef's Table. While we have enjoyed each of our meals at V&A I wouldn't rank any of our experiences there in our top ten. Honestly I wouldn't even measure it up against places such as The Inn at Little Washington or Charlie Trotter's. It just doesn't fall into the "elite" category for us.

The best restaurant ranking out there is the S.Pellegrino awards by Restaurant Magazine. It is a yearly list compiled by over 800 members of the restaurant industry. Basically it's a list of where these people want to eat. All of the restaurants that have been mentioned here have appeared on the list at least once. V&A's has never appeared.

I'm not saying that V&A's is not a good restaurant or that we haven't enjoyed our meals there, we have and will continue to do so but IMO it does not rank up there with the other restaurants in their price range that they have been compared to.

 

[JimmyV]

The best restaurant ranking out there is the S.Pellegrino awards by Restaurant Magazine. It is a yearly list compiled by over 800 members of the restaurant industry. Basically it's a list of where these people want to eat. All of the restaurants that have been mentioned here have appeared on the list at least once. V&A's has never appeared.

To be fair, the S.Pellegrino rankings list only 100 restaurants...worldwide. There are only 15 from the United States, the vast majority of which are in New York with a few in California. I have always found the list to be regionally biased, with restaurants appearing more for their gastonomic envelope pushing than for their actual performance. Still, not making such a list hardly qualifies one for "above average" status. To me, Gramercy Tavern and Commander's Palace are "above average". V&A is a full level above that.

 

[ElizabethB]

Well, we have not dined at all of the restaurants listed in this thread, but we have dined at Daniel, Eleven Madison Park, La Bernardin and Jean-Georges. Quite frankly, in our opinion, V&A compares extremely favorably with all of them. We have not done the QV room, but we have dined in the dining room and at the Chef's Table on numerous occasions. I can honestly say that I have enjoyed my V&A meals more than some of the meals at the other restaurants I have listed.

We have always been delighted by the creative, thoughtful and multi-layered flavors and textures of Chef Hunnell's cuisine. Add to this the wine pairings, and the night is special, indeed. We have often been surprised and delighted by the wines chosen by Israel and his staff.

We are not alone. Writing in the Wall Street Journal, the wine writers, Dorothy Gaiter and John Brecher, reported on the V&A Chef's Table:

"Our chef-host introduced herself, waiters poured a pink cava from Spain -- Cordorniu Pinot Noir Brute -- and for the next three hours, we had one of the most satisfying meals of our lives. We asked for the optional wine pairing menu. We have had wine-food pairings at some of America's best restaurants, but we've never had more thoughtful combinations. The wine and food spoke to each other in a way that was quite special."

Sometimes I think V&A gets "dissed" because it is at Disneyworld, rather than in New York City. From our perspective, it stands up wonderfully to other top tier restaurants at which we have dined.

Ditto what JimmyV said regarding places such as Gramercy Tavern (to which I would add Union Square Cafe as well) -- very good, but certainly V&A is in a different league altogether.

 

[contemporarymom]

I completely agree that V&A's is far and above both Gramercy Tavern (completely overated IMO) and Union Square Cafe. It's all a matter of opinion and in my opinion, I have yet to have an "Oh my G-d, this is one of the most incredible meals of my life.", moments at V&A's. After dining at Alinea and Per Se, I could have honestly said I had experienced one of the very best restaurant experiences in the world. The again I've dined at Le Bernardin numerous times and have yet to have that OMG feeling either.

 

[JimmyV]

The again I've dined at Le Bernardin numerous times and have yet to have that OMG feeling either.

+1 on that.

 

[ElizabethB]

I would agree, too. But, Le Bernardin is a 5-star Forbes restaurant! That's why one can only give so much credence to lists.