Update on kids in pools

[Willowwind]

I just don't know how I feel about all of this besides happy that Kate will be finished with the potty training before we cruise.

Kate's also been a movie fan since she was 2, so she would / will enjoy that as well.

For those who are concerned about the younger sibling tantrums, couldn't you schedule in an hour or two for the littlest ones so that your older kids can swim? Is it a pain, sure, will it cost more, yes, and that sucks, however it breaks my herat to think of the older siblings that won't be allowed to swim at all because the little ones can't.

 

[MelissaE1]

Originally posted by SueEllen
Just another thought here--have any of you with non-potty trained children and a cruise planned thought of emailing DCL with your concerns.

This was my thought also. I understand where everyone is coming from as my kids are both water rats, and my almost 4 year old wants to do everything her 8 year old brother does, especially if it involves water. I am so glad they are both potty trained. However, since this is being enforced because of a health issue, IMHO it is unlikely to change. So Disney obviously needs to reconsider the needs of parents with under-3 children if they want to continue to attract families with children that age. It seems to me that part of the genius of Disney is they have always tried to make people truly happy on their vacations. Let them know via email or snail mail or some way that you feel more activities are needed for the toddler set. If enough people speak out, change may very well come about. It might not help those scheduled to cruise in the near future, but you never know. It's worth a shot.

 

[indymom1]

I am one of the families that will be impacted by this change. I can understand the policy but when you are taking two children of varying age ranges both of which enjoy the water it would be difficult to explain to the smaller one why they can't get in the water. No the pools were not our only reason for picking this vacation. I planned a trip for a group of 15 people and this was a good choice for everyone. But let's also be honest. There are only two very small gift shops on board. Once you are in them for about 30 minutes you have shopped the boat. Taking a 1 year old to a movie or to hidden mickey or character drawing sessions just doesn't sound very feasible to me. In fact the other people would probably end up very annoyed that we would have brought them at all. The whole purpose of this trip was to have a "family" vacation where our older son could play and we could be close by in the Mickey ears splashing along. I do not think the idea of one of us having to push our little one around in a stroller for 7 days would be fun for him or us as parents. I don't want to spend 7 days with my husband with one child and me with the other. Or as shmoogrrl said one of us in the room and the other up at the pool.
I do believe that everyone is under the false impression that just because you get the babies out of the pool...POOF no more accidents...no more having to drain the pool. I don't mean to sound naive but I just don't think that is going to happen. Would I ever put my child in a pool at the risk of someone else's?? No but just becuase my 11.5 month old isn't in the water doesn't mean there still won't be bacteria and ecoli and other issues going on.
Once again I feel for the families who are within their 60 days and thus do not have a choice. My biggest issue all along is that Disney does not seem to be very pro-active on getting the info out to those people involved. I would bet there are people travelling with small children who will not know anything about this until they get on the boat.
Cruising is wonderful and I will do it again. But due to these new rules which are on all of the cruise lines we probably won't be able to cruise again until our son is potty trained.

 

[jellymoon]

We leave in 7 days. We cannot cancel. We have two water rats who have never had an accident in a pool and are 90% potty trained. We also have two older kids (4yo and a 7yo). The 7yo is about 80% independently able to toilet (he is developmentally disabled). My older son is more likely to have an accident than the little girls (though he too has NEVER had an accident in a pool and he has been in the pool for an hour at least once a week since he was 6 months old!), and yet he'll be allowed in and they won't. This is a SEVEN DAY CRUISE, with three sea days. What the heck are we supposed to do with our kids? We've cruised Disney before and enjoyed the pools. That was in fact the primary reason we chose to cruise. It was a trip that had something to offer for everyone. We will now spend over $10,000 on a trip we can't cancel just so that our little ones-- who wouldn't have an accident anyway--- will be miserable with nothing to do. This is crazy and I am appalled that Disney doesn't feel like they have an obligation to let people know. Can you imagine the heartbreak of all the 2 and 3 year olds that head to the pools in their swimsuits only to be told as soon as they hop in: "Get out and don't come back!" ????

I just can't imagine how they can enforce this rule or determine who is or isn't potty trained. If I thought my kids would poop in the pool, I wouldn't put them in. The fact is, they aren't gonna do it. If they do it by age, they aren't going to be allowed in because they are both 2 and under. Not to mention, this now becomes a totally inhospitable ship for the disabled--- they cna't go to the Clubs if they wear a pull-up even for insurance, and now they can't swim even if the liklihood of them pooping in the pool is miniscule.

Grrrrrrr. I was so looking forward to this trip, and now I find myself dreading it!!!

 

[FantasticDisFamily]

Ok, I'll start by admitting it has been many years since mine were going through the potty training stage (they are 12/15) but if my foggy memory serves at all at that same age those little ones did take naps...

Couldn't the older ones swim while the little ones nap? Just a thought.

Deb

 

[Hot4disney]

be on our third disney cruise. Our dd is just 3. She has been on two prior cruises where she was not potty trained...and me being the incredibly prepared mommy that I am (more worried about costumes and such!) left the little swimmers home on the last two trips! So we went to the pools and we went to the beach..and on NEITHER occasion was there an accident in the water. She was just so excited and so happy and so busy playing and laughing and meeting other kids...she just never went. Finally...near the afternoon on Castaway Cay..just standing there in the sand...looking at the ocean...LOL...she had a small accident with #1. This trip...she is pretty much potty trained...and she lets us know when she needs to "go to the bafroom". So I am thankful of our timing. Even when she was a baby..whenever she saw a pool...it was HELL trying to keep her away..I don't see how they can just deny a large sectionof the population one of the most sought after activities on board! JMO.

 

[SueEllen]

Sorry to offend you SueEllen, my son made me sit through the Lion King at least 100 times - including 5 times at the movies and twice while on board the Magic. He was three.

mlshields, you didn't offend me. Your son was 3, which is the age that programing is available. When I was talking about taking a toddler to a movie and having them watch and enjoy it, I was thinking along the idea of a 12-24 month old or so. 2 year olds are FAMOUS for their wonderful behavior! My point was that the activities that you listed would be great for older kids, but hey, those are the ones allowed in the pools
Seriously though, I think that letters of concern are in order here. If DCL is going to take away the ONE activity for the under 3 crowd then I think something else should be provided for them. Flounders costs, and from what I understand it fills up quickly. Can you imagine how impossible it will be to get a space in there if there is NOTHING else for a child under 3 to do?
Sue Ellen

 

[DreamsDoComeTrue]

Originally posted by indymom1
The whole purpose of this trip was to have a "family" vacation where our older son could play and we could be close by in the Mickey ears splashing along. I do not think the idea of one of us having to push our little one around in a stroller for 7 days would be fun for him or us as parents. I don't want to spend 7 days with my husband with one child and me with the other. Or as shmoogrrl said one of us in the room and the other up at the pool.

What if, on the port days, you got off the ship and let everyone, as a family swim, splash and swim some more. Then they won't feel as denied during the other days on board? Not that it won't still be a major drag.
I agree that DCL needs to come up with some free and fun toddler activities quick. Has anyone started emailing?

 

[wovenwonder]

I believe that non potty trained kiddies ARE allowed in the kids club if they are there with their parents watching them. Would that be an option for a little something extra to do with your child? I also thought the idea of bringing along a small blow up pool to use on very hot days was a cute idea -- it wouldn't take up much room in the luggage.

 

[RIDISNEYLOVERS]

WOW - we are sailing 11/3 on the Wonder and I have a 2 1/2 DD and my sister has a 2 1/2 DD too. They both LOVE the pool - it is hard to get them out of it. They are almost completely potty trained and their poop is on a schedule (if you know what I mean). We couldn't even go on that deck and deny them from going in the pool.

I agree there is NOTHING else for a child under the age of 3 to do. We as parents are going to have to become very creative and that could be very challenging when it is not your own environment rather than a vacation. We are talking about children that lose interest in things very fast and don't have a big attention span. My DD would like to look around at things, but she would get board with that quickly.

I think I am going to e-mail DCL and tell them my concerns and ask that they do impliment something for the under 3 crowd to do or they shouldn't consider this a family vacation.

This is just my opinion and I am frustrated by it as well.

Lisa

 

[4nana]

OMG
Trying to visualize dragging around a portable swimming pool for the grands to use! Even more hilarious, if 'depends' aren't allowed I may have to bring it for myself !! Don't get grossed out, I'm only joking.....too much time of my hands here!!
ROTFL

 

[akasleepingbeauty]

While I do find it disappointing to think that little ones won't be able to swim on DCL ships, I don't think it should have to spell an end to cruising for those families. We cruised in May of 2001 with our then 13-month old dd and never used the pools even once. We found the pools to be crowded and somewhat yucky and just decided to forego the whole area. Granted, we were traveling with only the little one and a 15-year old so it was easier than it would be with many families with children closer in age.

Remember, in 7 days, you have embarkation day which goes pretty quickly with safety drill, dinner etc. - not too hard to miss out on swimming that day. You also have 3 or 4 port days depending on your itinerary. We went into St. Maarten (although we did not swim there either but you could) and looked around etc. - dd loved seeing the people and sights. We went to St. John on our other port stop. We swam in Trunk Bay and enjoyed a nice beach day with dd there. We also swam at CC and enjoyed the sun and sand. That left only 3 days (2 on the Western itinerary) of time to entertain dd without swimming. We strolled the decks with dd either in the stroller or backpack, had meals at the restaurants and by the pools (luckily she was young enough that she enjoyed watching the others swimming while she ate but didn't get upset about not swimming herself), she went to Flounder's a couple of times during the day over the course of a week, she took good afternoon naps in our stateroom, she visited the kid's club during "family time", she went with me to play bingo etc. I really never had a difficult let alone impossible time entertaining her without using the pool. Once again, I am sure this would be different with somewhat older but still non-potty-trained kids or for those with closer in age siblings who can swim but it can be done and you can still have fun.

I do feel especially bad for those families who will not have the benefit of knowing long enough in advance to modify their travel plans. This really should be looked at as a major change, IMO, and those guests traveling soon with little ones should at least be notified by mail.

I do hope they add some activities for younger kids as parents currently need to be creative and flexible with young children as there are few "official" activities for this age group. We are planning another cruise in 2004 and will likely have a non-potty-trained child with us. I am sure we can do as before but having other actiivities available would also be nice.

 

[jel0511]

I justs sent an e-mail to DCL (thanks Sue Ellen!!) about my concerns for the under 3 crowd. I suggest everyone who has an issue with the new policy to do as well, hopefully DCL will listen to us!!!! Here is the e-mail I just sent:

I was very dismayed this morning to learn that DCL is no longer allowing non-potty trained children in any of the pools on board. I know that DCL is following US regulations in implementing this new policy, but what upsets me is the lack of programming for the under 3 age group. Now that the pool is off limits to most of this age group, since most of them aren't potty trained yet, what is being planned for them? They aren't allowed in the children's programming and the only other option is paying $6 per hour for our young children to have some sort of activities. I chose Disney Cruise Line for my family's cruise due to it's nature of advertising itself as a true family cruise. Now with the implementation of this new policy, DCL unless something else is done, will be basically ignoring the under 3 age group. I wanted both of my children to enjoy themselves on the boat and the only thing my 18 month old was going to be able to do was swim in the Mickey pool and that has now been taken away from him. I would be happy if some alternate programs would be made available to keep the toddlers on board a little busy and give them something that would make them feel special and involved. My cruise is booked for 11/3/02 and if I had known about this policy, I don't know if I would have booked it and if I was outside the cancellation window, I definately would consider cancelling the cruise. I was planning on booking another cruise for 2003, but those plans are on hold until I can see what types of accomdations DCL can do for the under 3 age group. If some type of plan isn't implemented I would definately not consider a 2003 cruise and possibly not another one for the near future, until my little one would be able to participate in the children's programming and swim in the pools. I'd appreciate any attention you can give to this matter.

 

[my3kids]

Right now DCL charges just a nominal fee for children under 3, right? What if they expand the Flounders Reef concept so there are options for the tiny ones, just as the 3-12 ones, and charge them the same fee?

I do feel badly for the people with non trained children. I understand the reasoning though. Guess I'm wishy washy since my children are past that stage. There probably ought to be full coverage for children of all ages, not just 3+. I want everyone to be happy

 

[SueEllen]

I just recently sent one also expressing the same concerns. I don't know how much good it will do, but it certainly cannot hurt.

Sue Ellen

 

[taswira]

akasleepingbeauty - It is good to see <I>someone</I> here who is not <I>totally negative</I> about this and who does think there is more to the ship and the cruise, even for babies, than the Mickey Pool! I'm sorry, folks, but has it occurred to anyone that this whole thing must be stressful for DCL also? They appear to have had short notice on the requirement to ban the non-potty trained. They are doing what they legally and ethically should. Do you think the CM's will <I>enjoy</I> the evil looks and remarks they'll face from disgruntled guests who blame THEM? Do you think DCL <I>wanted</I> to suddenly snatch the Mickey Pool from the tots and suffer the barrage of irate mail from guests about to cruise? The people who run DCL are not stupid. They KNOW the uproar this will cause. But they are human and can only develop solutions and implement changes with time. I think they have two choices: 1. (Preferable) They start figuring out how to entertain the non-potty trained enough to satisfy the parents who were counting 100% on the Mickey Pool. <I>or</I> 2. They will lose the infant/toddler market and have to focus their marketing on people of the age they show in their big 2002-2003 brochure, who all look old enough to be potty trained.LOL Give them a chance! They KNOW this has upset everyone with non-potty trained kids. They just haven't had time to figure out exactly what they're going to do to pacify everyone.

 

[mrsltg]

As the parent of a 21-month-old, I am really offended by Disney. This is, quite frankly, a bait and switch issue. We all entered into a contract with Disney when we paid our deposit. We did so in good faith having chosen a product with certain benefits to it. I can fully understand the concerns of the parents on this board who are cruising shortly and wondering what in the world they are going to do. Disney needs to make good on this. Obviously it is their ship and they can feed you bread and water all week and close all the pools and activities if they'd like, but they will lose business.

What I am especially baffled by is the problem in general with the pools. Hello? Shock the pool. Make it reek of chlorine. Chlorine will kill most anything which is why it is the chemical of choice. And as far as the people that have suggested that parents of young children should put the safety of others first, are you unaware that even if you, a potty-trained (let's hope!) adult has an upset stomach and you go swimming and pass gas in the pool, you can be passing on e-coli in the small amount of fecal matter that escapes you? Are you putting the safety of others behind your enjoyment... I don't think so!

My daughter will (heaven willing) be trained by our cruise in 12/03... but if it's looking unlikely by the time the 60 day mark is in view, I'll be keeping my $3000+. I can't see going on a vacation where I'll be trapped in my room a good portion because, eventually, either my husband or myself will end up in jail after we toss the little darling overboard!

 

[Wishing on a star]

Quote:

I'll be keeping my $3000+. I can't see going on a vacation where I'll be trapped in my room a good portion because, eventually, either my husband or myself will end up in jail after we toss the little darling overboard!


Love your comments!! We are really looking forward to our cruise, now that ds IS fully potty trained. When I mentioned this whole problem to DH, he just said, Why would anybody want to cruise with a baby anyhow!! We purposefully held off on any plans like this cruise until DS was older. Though I know that with many folks, this just isn't the case.

Truth be told, we have one of those 'active' kids who loves water, and no way is going to sit still for things like movies for any extended period of time! Anyone who does NOT understand the feelings of the distraught parents must simply have not been in their shoes! If we were planning on this cruise, and DS was younger, like two or three.... I would be majorly upset!! Like you, I would have to cancel or risk tossing our little one overboard! Being confined with a very active child, well that is exhaustion and frustration beyond description!!

I am just confused.... I think of the millions of toddlers splashing their hearts out in millions of pools everywhere.... And then I think, Hey Disney, anybody who has ever had a kid knows that young children who ARE potty trained, and older children too, in no way means squeaky clean and germ free!!

And, like some of you have said, what angers me the most is how this goes completely against everything 'Disney', especially in how they have promoted their cruises!!! Such as "Activities for ALL ages..." and their much touted "Kids clubs, so parents can have a little time together of their own...." etc.... etc.... etc....

Bottom line, with the Pool restrictions, and the Kids Club restrictions.... Disney is truly a "No Pooping Aloud" cruise line!!!!

Anybody else think that DCL needs one huge wake up call!!!

 

[Wishing on a star]

Quote:

I'll be keeping my $3000+. I can't see going on a vacation where I'll be trapped in my room a good portion because, eventually, either my husband or myself will end up in jail after we toss the little darling overboard!


Love your comments!! We are really looking forward to our cruise, now that ds IS fully potty trained. When I mentioned this whole problem to DH, he just said, Why would anybody want to cruise with a baby anyhow!! We purposefully held off on any plans like this cruise until DS was older. Though I know that with many folks, this just isn't the case.

Truth be told, we have one of those 'active' kids who loves water, and no way is going to sit still for things like movies for any extended period of time! Anyone who does NOT understand the feelings of the distraught parents must simply have not been in their shoes! If we were planning on this cruise, and DS was younger, like two or three.... I would be majorly upset!! Like you, I would have to cancel or risk tossing our little one overboard! Being confined with a very active child, well that is exhaustion and frustration beyond description!!

I am just confused.... I think of the millions of toddlers splashing their hearts out in millions of pools everywhere.... And then I think, Hey Disney, anybody who has ever had a kid knows that young children who ARE potty trained, and older children too, in no way means squeaky clean and germ free!!

And, like some of you have said, what angers me the most is how this goes completely against everything 'Disney', especially in how they have promoted their cruises!!! Such as "Activities for ALL ages..." and their much touted "Kids clubs, so parents can have a little time together of their own...." etc.... etc.... etc....

Bottom line, with the Pool restrictions, and the Kids Club restrictions.... Disney is truly a "No Pooping Aloud" cruise line!

Anybody else think that DCL needs one huge wake up call?

 

[DISNEYGATOR]

I know a lot of people are upset about this issue, and granted it doesn't effect me at a personal level, but still...

Doesn't it show something that Disney would make such a tough decision to protect it's guests, even if it meant loosing money and customers?

I know a lot of people are upset too because of the lack of activities for children under 3, and think that since now that non-pottytrained (the infant - 3 year old age group) can't go in the pool DCL should have come up with some sort of an activity plan. But I don't think we are considering how much that would involve. I mean it isn't like DCL could close the pool to tots one day and the next day have this magical, wonderful activity program for them.

Keep in mind, kids ages 3 and under cruise fair is significantly lower, mainly because this age group doesn't eat much of the food, or do any of the major activities or programs, like a lot of you said, mainly it was just splashing around in the pool.

But now with this new policy DCL first has to find out, how much of an effect will this have on our passagers? Will enough of this younger child market be effected to warrent special activities? And since we have to create new facilities, develop a new program, hire a new staff trained to deal with infants and toddlers, does that mean the fair for passengers this age should go up to? If so, how will raising fair rates for young passagers effect business? I know a lot of people were upset because of the cost of Flounders, would you be willing to pay more for these additional programs?

Let's say they do develop these new programs, it will take time. You have to decide how large it needs to be, how to staff it, where to put it, how to train the people, find these cast members, develop programs, etc. Give DCL time. It takes a little time fielding what the market really needs.