Unfathomable: Church Massacre

[usnuzuloose]

I must be one of the few people that think evil is real without needing justification of mentally ill or poor parenting raising. It is easier for a lot of people to swallow
such things thinking that mental illness dominates someone instead of evil though. Just like you can't teach morality, you can't always put a bow on evil person and situation.

When we have American on American violence, we want to resort to feel better labels. When it is non American on American violence, we want to kick their *** and give them the needle and show America doesn't take this. Think Bin Laden. Now a days it seems more likely an American is going to die at the hands of another American than a terrorist attack.

I agree with you. To much blaming with all the illness. People use it in court to try and get off with the damage they do.

 

[lovemygoofy]

I disagree, people should see what is out there. If the mods feel its inappropriate then they can delete it, but lets get real, that poster isn't sharing hate to spread the message, she's sharing information for those who don't believe its out there.

Everyone knows that there is these kind of people and these kinds of sites. Bringing them publicity of people clicking on their sites just gives them more justification that the numbers believe the same. It is still unknowingly advertising for their message.

 

[usnuzuloose]

Everyone knows that there is these kind of people and these kinds of sites. Bringing them publicity of people clicking on their sites just gives them more justification that the numbers believe the same. It is still unknowingly advertising for their message.

It was the same thing in Furgeson. The more people that were streaming there and stirring up trouble keep going because they see the number of people watching them. Which is so sad. They need to stop doing that stuff, and the media needs to stop reporting things before they know all the facts.

 

[Dizlvr]

Everyone knows that there is these kind of people and these kinds of sites. Bringing them publicity of people clicking on their sites just gives them more justification that the numbers believe the same. It is still unknowingly advertising for their message.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

In fairness, there was a "challenge" issued, and the poster was responding to it.

If we know these people exist, then there's probably no need to issue challenges.

ETA

Never ever will you hear of an Black man killing someone and then having a "mental illness" excuse. EVER.

I totally agree with every thing else but in the media, mental illness is only ever use to describe a caucasian perpertrator.

Show me an example of a black man killing a white man where the media said as a primary excuse: He was mentally ill. Hasn't happened to my recollection. It's always about "his parenting" "absent father" "his community" etc etc etc.

Just saying that I think the posts were as a response these posts.

(Admittedly better sites would've been preferable.)

 

[delyrium]

I want to be clear. I did not issue any sort of challenge wherein I wanted that poster to display more of her information literacy. I wanted to warn people away from clicking on garbage, and make her aware of who she was aligning herself with.

These are the people that welcomed that individual into their place of worship.

 

[cabanafrau]

I want to be clear. I did not issue any sort of challenge wherein I wanted that poster to display more of her information literacy. I wanted to warn people away from clicking on garbage, and make her aware of who she was aligning herself with.

These are the people that welcomed that individual into their place of worship.

Makes it even more painfully tragic when you look at their smiling faces. I cannot imagine the pain of their families.

 

[Mkrop]

Makes it even more painfully tragic when you look at their smiling faces. I cannot imagine the pain of their families.

Or even hearing the killer admit they were so nice to me and that he almost could not go through with it...these were nice people, welcoming people, NOT the people he IMAGINED were "harming his race"

 

[lauradis]

Yep Im a racist and a hater, because I refuse to ignore the whole problem.... not just small parts or large horrible tragic events.

 

[lauradis]

Stop advertising hate sites! You aren't justifying your argument so much as you going to be sharing the hate message!

ok so cnn and local tv channel are now hate sites???? well you got me there I agree with you.

 

[gwynne]

These are the people that welcomed that individual into their place of worship.

We grieve their loss, and pray for their families.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I don't pretend to have answers. At all. But in my gut I feel like we need some better leaders in this country who can bring all the different factions of people we have here together, as a nation. Problem is, once people start trying, they're either called names or shot down, etc.

I know in my job, as a nurse, I see people at their most human, vulnerable level. It doesn't matter what color skin is, or how much money is in the bank, whose father or mother someone is or what type of career someone had, it all boils down to this when facing illness or death: We are all the same when it comes to human-ness. That's where we need to start.

I always imagine that (in the farthest stretch of the imagination) if we somehow got invaded by otherworldly aliens, we'd find a way really quickly to band together for our common good. What is holding us back from doing that now? (I know the answer, but just putting it out there for thought.)

 

[amg35]

Probably the reason mental illness is brought up so often in these types of shootings is because let's face it, it's usually a while male who does mass shootings. And I would think, to be able to pull off such a horrible crime, you need to be mentally unstable?


In this case, the guy was a racist. Not sure how that can even be argued. Or why it would be argued.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I don't think, as others have already said, that anyone is arguing he is not a racist.

I think people are saying, though, that it's not as black and white (pardon the pun) as it seems; that there are probably a lot of factors that would make someone do something like this.

I don't know if killing is considered a normal human trait. I don't think it is.

 

[amg35]

Well, to me those terms are not related to the race, but to the crime.
thug = street level criminal
terrorist = someone with a political agenda
mentally ill - someone who should be getting medical treatment because their reality is skewed

Exactly - thug is any gang-banger - black, latino, white, asian, whatever - who commits crime.
Terrorist - IRA, Isis, Timothy McVeigh, etc. - has an agenda, often political. This kid had an agenda, I can see the argument for a charge of terrorism.

 

[MarcW]

Everyone knows that there is these kind of people and these kinds of sites. Bringing them publicity of people clicking on their sites just gives them more justification that the numbers believe the same. It is still unknowingly advertising for their message.

I don't think she knew what the sites represented. It is just that the information she was trying to share is deliberately hidden by the media and their ilk and not considered polite conversation by most conservative sites and so not really talked about.

This is one reason black people feel separated from the rest of us. They are told by people who want to manipulate them that "only this type of bad thing happens to black people, only white people do these types of horrible crimes" etc.. These are lies. All people have the capacity for evil as well as good. We need to acknowledge that fact or we will never advance as the human race.

According to DNA there are really no different "races". We are all the same. Humans.

 

[amg35]

I understand, I was just more questioning the bigger discussion, not just this board.

 

[dinolounger]

Two words: Gun control.

Chicago has some of the most stringent gun control laws in the nation.

But there have been 15 gun murders in Chicago just this week. 197 so far this year.

So gun "control" laws alone -- which are regularly circumvented and ignored -- are not going to stop the carnage.

What we need is a sea change in values and attitudes. And places to start? Here are two to ponder:

• Why has the marriage rate dropped nearly 60% since 1970?
• Why do one out of every three children in this country live in a household with no father?

I raise those questions because if you go to the link below, scroll down towards the bottom and read the profiles of the fourteen mass killers who used firearms, you will see the dynamic of broken homes and fatherless families again and again.

http://www.news.com.au/world/guns-i...e-shocking-facts/story-fndir2ev-1226539874646

 

[cabanafrau]

I don't pretend to have answers. At all. But in my gut I feel like we need some better leaders in this country who can bring all the different factions of people we have here together, as a nation. Problem is, once people start trying, they're either called names or shot down, etc.

I know in my job, as a nurse, I see people at their most human, vulnerable level. It doesn't matter what color skin is, or how much money is in the bank, whose father or mother someone is or what type of career someone had, it all boils down to this when facing illness or death: We are all the same when it comes to human-ness. That's where we need to start.

I always imagine that (in the farthest stretch of the imagination) if we somehow got invaded by otherworldly aliens, we'd find a way really quickly to band together for our common good. What is holding us back from doing that now? (I know the answer, but just putting it out there for thought.)

In the healthcare arena it must be particularly obvious. It does boil down to seeing one another as people. I think if each of us sat down and had a conversation with most any other person we'd find out we have something in common -- and a lot of the same basic goals in life.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I am always interested in what this guy has to say.

Jack Levin is a professor of Criminology at Northeastern University and an expert and authority on criminal behavior:

"Experts: Mass murderers usually flash warning signs

Dylann Storm Roof likely showed early warning signs of his deadly intent — possibly fueled by his own distorted views of current events — long before he was arrested and accused of massacring nine black people inside a historic church, according to experts.

“It doesn’t just develop from a year ago,” said Mary Ellen O’Toole, an ex-senior FBI profiler. “The warning signs would have been there years ago. He probably talked about this before and people thought he was kidding. He probably has a fascination with other cases of mass murder.”

O’Toole said mass murderers also tend to do surveillance, donning a particular outfit and visiting potential targets in a sort of dress rehearsal. “There would have been a lot of planning for this,” she said.

Jack Levin, a Northeastern University criminologist, said hate crimes are committed by people who feel threatened by those they consider outsiders. These crimes are often driven by current events, he said, pointing to an increase in crimes against Muslims and Arabs after the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, against gays in the wake of gay rights decisions, and against blacks after President Obama’s election. “We have seen an incredible increase in tension between blacks and whites in the United States, from Ferguson to Baltimore and everything in between, so the massacre at this historic black church in Charleston, I believe, was inspired by deteriorating black-white relations. In his distorted view,” Levin speculated about Roof, “he saw blacks as gaining power and control and perhaps robbing him of his privileged position as a white person in society.”

O’Toole said Roof’s demeanor before the shooting was telling.

“He walked into the church and seemed to be pretty cool, calm and collected and sat for an hour,” she said. “It was a risk because someone could have seen the gun hanging out of his pocket and called police. It’s that kind of stealth predatory behavior that I call ‘mission-orientated.’ They’re the most dangerous ones because they’re not going to be deterred.”

It doesn’t appear that Roof was associated with an organized hate group, but only 4 percent of all hate crimes are, Levin said.

“But at the same time a lot of these groups have websites where a lot of these teenagers and people in their early 20s who are not doing well in life can log on, visit message boards and receive propaganda,” Levin said. “They may have felt isolated at home, but online they have plenty of like-minded company and that inspires them to commit these acts of hate.”

http://www.bostonherald.com/news_op...ts_mass_murderers_usually_flash_warning_signs