Ugh, dh has a court date while we are at Disney

[racetrack18kb]

I was just thinking about this very thing today. I replied to this thread earlier, and at the time I wasn't even thinking about the rules for receiving unemployment benefits. I was just answering the question with regards to the ADR and what I would do about it. But after other posters mentioned what they did about the stipulations (actively looking for work, being available), I wondered if it were possible to take a week off of receiving the benefits. It seems that it is. I was in no way trying to help encourage anything wrong. I still wish the best to the OP and her family.

But you see, what M&N posted and what the OP posted are totally different things. M&N's friend is going on a planned vacation and pretty much admits that he shouldn't be getting unemployment compensation at the time. No harm, no foul. He told unemployment and it sounds like he won't getting unemployment for that week.

But the OP has planned a vacation (from it looks like to me) after her husband got laid off. As far as I know, no vacation with it's cancellation fees will put you more in a hole than taking the actual vacation. There are all kinds of added expenses even after paying off the balance on your package.

And as far as not just answering the OP question, well too bad. She put it out there with enough info for everyone to draw their own conclusions. You know what? I love Disney as much as the rest of you. I would love to get down there this year. We chose to take our vacation to Universal because they offer a better deal for my family.

But DH is employed. He isn't at home wondering if his unemployment compensation is going to be denied and he is going to have to pay all the money that he has received back after a "vacation". Right now, my DH is working 11 hours away because that is where the work is. He'll be gone for the next 3 weeks at least. He could stay home and collect because his contract doesn't say he has to travel. Home every night and all that jazz. But he knows he can work even if it's out of town. There are people more deserving of unemployment than him. I just don't thing the OP is one of them.

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

So being a "Dis Veteran" means you're allowed to be rude or judgmental? I may be new to disboards, but not new to message boards. I'm a manager on a 3500 member message board, we follow rule #1 "respect your fellow member". If you can't follow that rule, you can't play. Even if it's a joke. Maybe it's a newbie that doesn't realize putting it all out there will get you flamed. Again I say,

I'm pretty sure there's no rule about being judgemental on the disboards. You put your situation out there, people will comment about it. If you don't want the comments, don't write about them.

Yes, I'm a dis veteran, and I can't tell you how many times people have posted wanting support for a point of view and are *shocked* that the rest of the world simply thinks they are off their rocker.

Then they get mad, or they change their story, or they poof off the thread. I think it's an excellent tool for discovering that outside one's "real" life small circle, that the rest of the world doesn't always think that way. I find other people's points of view enlightening, not offensive.

Usually people who get all twisted up about opposing viewpoints have some unidentified personal issues that cause them to react irrationally to honest feedback.

Or, to put it simply, if you can't take the heat, don't post. If you get all upset about the posts, don't read them!

This is by far one of the kindest, gentlest boards I've ever seen, this characteristic, however, does not preclude people from saying "you're way off base".

 

[Crisgw]

I have to agree with some pp's. What the OP and her husband are doing is fraud. Lying to the unemployment office and the likes is fraud. I hope that things go smoothly for you and your DH doesn't get caught because he will have to pay everything back.

 

[surfgirl]

OP, what did you decide to do ?

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

OP, what did you decide to do ?

OMG that's funny!

 

[tartemis]

I'm actually going to take the minority view on here and say that I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. If he is a serial unemployment taker, that is one thing -- but if he has otherwise being gainfully employed his adult life and is now laid off, he should take advantage of the situation and take his time to find his next job and defnitely enjoy his vacation (that he had planned prior to being laid off.) After all, it is HIS money that he paid into unemployment and what he is getting back. Unlike all the welfare cheats out there who have never paid into the system (or haven't paid much) and are just living off the backs of those of us that do work.

 

[maxiesmom]

I'm actually going to take the minority view on here and say that I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. If he is a serial unemployment taker, that is one thing -- but if he has otherwise being gainfully employed his adult life and is now laid off, he should take advantage of the situation and take his time to find his next job and defnitely enjoy his vacation (that he had planned prior to being laid off.) After all, it is HIS money that he paid into unemployment and what he is getting back. Unlike all the welfare cheats out there who have never paid into the system (or haven't paid much) and are just living off the backs of those of us that do work.

I dare say it is not all his money. And if he is not looking for unemployment that week he should not be taking the benefit. It is not ok to cheat just one time. I think they should tell the unemployment office they will not be taking benefits that week, as he will not be looking for work. Though I do think taking an expensive trip while drawing unemployment benefits is not the smartest thing to do anyway.

 

[a1tinkfans]

My friend was laid off and is collecting unemployment. His planned vacation came up. It's not a DW one-just a drive through NC and VA. He went to the unemployment office and told them he would be away and he's not getting his compensation during that time. No problems--no lies.

Not available to work, NO unemployment, its a matter of
LEGAL issues and common decency and conscience! Thanks for posting this............

 

[tartemis]

I dare say it is not all his money. And if he is not looking for unemployment that week he should not be taking the benefit. It is not ok to cheat just one time. I think they should tell the unemployment office they will not be taking benefits that week, as he will not be looking for work. Though I do think taking an expensive trip while drawing unemployment benefits is not the smartest thing to do anyway.

How do you know it is not all his money? I know that I have paid into the system more than I could ever get back given the cap on benefits.

Also -- being on unemployement does not mean that every minute of every work week you are looking for work.

 

[a1tinkfans]

I'm actually going to take the minority view on here and say that I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. If he is a serial unemployment taker, that is one thing -- but if he has otherwise being gainfully employed his adult life and is now laid off, he should take advantage of the situation and take his time to find his next job and defnitely enjoy his vacation (that he had planned prior to being laid off.) After all, it is HIS money that he paid into unemployment and what he is getting back. Unlike all the welfare cheats out there who have never paid into the system (or haven't paid much) and are just living off the backs of those of us that do work.

As a business owner
Unemployment is paid by the employee AND the employer. If one works contractually, then the employee pays BOTH halves...
SO the rationale that one should
"take advantage", since he already paid in is really disturbing and inaccurate. Goodness, its like saying, I paid my car insurance and did not use it, so I'm due the money back.....????

Maybe if MORE people did what was RIGHT rather than what was EASIER this great country of ours would be in better shape!
maybe not sucking our systems dry (not saying that about op by the way)

I am not one to say skip your vacation to the OP, BUT they should notifiy Unemployment that he is NOT available to work, they will then hold that pay for that time period....

It is FRAUD plain and simple to do it any other way. Some people choose to cheat thru their lives, some don't ...to me it is a matter of Knowing the facts and making a decision you are willing to live with!
Plain and simple.....FRAUD....play with fire, eventually get burned.....

 

[maxiesmom]

But you are supposed to be looking for work during that time, not on vacation at Disney World. Where he will most likely not spend any time looking for work.

 

[tartemis]

But he was laid off -- its not like he is scamming the system. The only question is he abiding by the rules -- and there is a gray-area there. Especially if he is a white collar worker, he isn't required to take any job that comes along -- and more likely than not, any job that is going to become available isn't going to require him to start the same day that he is hired. Thus, he would have plenty of time to get back to an acceptable job if he were hired.

Look -- I'm with you on the personal responsibility front. But, this is not the type of situation that is running the country into the ground.

 

[dawnball]

After all, it is HIS money that he paid into unemployment and what he is getting back. Unlike all the welfare cheats out there who have never paid into the system (or haven't paid much) and are just living off the backs of those of us that do work.

Actually, the OP is in Michigan, where it appears (as in my state of NC) that unemployment taxes are paid solely by the employer. And in that case, every dollar of unemployment paid out, is more money that the employer has to pay in insurance. In addition, the maximum unemployment tax rate is about $250/year, and the average check is $300/week. So having been unemployed for 4.5 months, they're looking at about 20 years worth of unemployment taxes to break even on what they've collected so far. In the case of employers like mine, who are reimbursement employers - we pay 125% of the claim value every time there's a claim.

That said, I collected unemployment when I was eligible and it was pretty easy to indicate days I wasn't available to work for whatever reason - just like it was easy to report what earnings I did have - both extended the total time I could collect unemployment while job-searching. So I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt that her DH is going to be honest with MI-UIA.

 

[tartemis]

I'll confess that I probably shouldn't have opined since it appears that I don't truly understand how the system works -- I've been lucky enough to not have to apply for them.

I'm on a general anti-tax rant rant now, so please forgive me.

 

[Chancedabowsa]

Heres an idea...cancel the trip. Use the THOUSANDS of dollars its costing you to go on this trip instead of sponging off unemployment...It sucks that he lost his job but that money could go to much better use than a WDW trip. Everyone loves vacations but they shouldn't be taken when one doesn't know what the future holds job wise to FEED their family and one shouldn't rely on unemployment insurance to pay for that! There will always been time to go to WDW when a new job is found and money is saved back up again!

WRONG! No one "sponges" off of unemployment insurance. This is a benefit paid out after premiums have been paid into it. When there is a loss of a job, a benefit gets paid out. Just like health insurance or car insurance. No one hopes for a loss, but , it happens. Who is to say that the OP's husband isn't looking for work on the INTERNET a few hours per day ? Or maybe the OP's husband is working 80 hours job searching the week before in order to have some time off ? I think that we should not be so hasty to judge others. Sometimes a vacation is what someone needs to jumpstart them after the trauma of a job loss. We do not know the circumstances and shouldn't judge. JMO.

 

[maxiesmom]

WRONG! No one "sponges" off of unemployment insurance. This is a benefit paid out after premiums have been paid into it. When there is a loss of a job, a benefit gets paid out. Just like health insurance or car insurance. No one hopes for a loss, but , it happens. Who is to say that the OP's husband isn't looking for work on the INTERNET a few hours per day ? Or maybe the OP's husband is working 80 hours job searching the week before in order to have some time off ? I think that we should not be so hasty to judge others. Sometimes a vacation is what someone needs to jumpstart them after the trauma of a job loss. We do not know the circumstances and shouldn't judge. JMO.

I don't have a problem with him taking a vacation. I do have a huge problem with him collecting unemployment while he is on vacation. If the OP's husband wants to go on vacation, then he should contact the unemployment office and tell them that is what he is doing.

 

[surfgirl]

I see a few different issues here.

1) He is unemployed and taking vacation. Some posters have an issue with this because:
a) It is hard to justify taking a vacation while being unemployed. However, the OP stated that it was pre-paid before he lost his job, so we can give her the benefit of the doubt (although there have been valid questions about timing of planning trip vs. losing his job, but that is neither here nor there).
b) He is receiving unemployment benefits right now. Maybe he has (or is planning on) reporting to Meeeee-chigan (thanks to ? announcer!) Again, she can receive the benefit of the doubt that she will do the right thing.

2) He is going to court because his former employer is fighting the unemployment. We don't know the details, but maybe they are claiming he quit vs. being fired or whatever. Not our business, but the employer is fighting it.

=> If he loses (and this is the really important part), he will be forced to pay back 4 1/2 months of unemployment benefits that he has already received and probably will not be (don't know the law in MI) eligible for future benefits. This is what could be some big big bucks.

My point is that I would want to be in court for that hearing. Maybe it is only a fact finding thing with attorneys and he is not required to be present, but for the relatively small amount of money to change flights and fly down Monday night instead, he is risking a lot of money to do a conference call. Maybe I'm all wet here, but he should be prepared to answer the question why he is calling in versus being at the hearing in person. Even if he has reported that he is away that week and not claiming unemployment for that week he is on vacation, I think it still looks bad. I would want to do everything possible to be on the good side of the court and taking a vacation while unemployed can put someone in a negative light.

So... I'm assuming the OP has checked out here since no one ever comes back if we don't all agree 100% with them. I'd love to hear what they've decided to do. And why this is a good idea.

 

[surfgirl]

WRONG! No one "sponges" off of unemployment insurance. This is a benefit paid out after premiums have been paid into it. When there is a loss of a job, a benefit gets paid out. Just like health insurance or car insurance.

Not exactly paid out like you infer.

You get a car, pay car insurance. On day #2, you get into an accident and total your car. They still pay out the premium even though you've only paid 1 day into it. Its all about risk. Your insurance goes up in the future, yes.

I don't know the details of unemployment, but you aren't paid what you've paid into it. I believe you are paid a certain percentage of your salary before you lost your job. Even if you were employed for only a short time. The employer's premiums rise because a claim was placed against them.

I'm no expert on unemployment and how the payments work, but your example of health insurance and car insurance makes no sense... there isn't another party paying a portion of it.

 

[Chancedabowsa]

Not exactly paid out like you infer.

You get a car, pay car insurance. On day #2, you get into an accident and total your car. They still pay out the premium even though you've only paid 1 day into it. Its all about risk. Your insurance goes up in the future, yes.

I don't know the details of unemployment, but you aren't paid what you've paid into it. I believe you are paid a certain percentage of your salary before you lost your job. Even if you were employed for only a short time. The employer's premiums rise because a claim was placed against them.

I'm no expert on unemployment and how the payments work, but your example of health insurance and car insurance makes no sense... there isn't another party paying a portion of it.

Of course you are not an expert. No one expects you to be. Your a surfer girl I'd rather be on the beach too.

The OP's husband is collecting a benefit that he and his employer paid into. Nothing wrong with it. Who is to really say that he isn't working 80 hours the prior week looking for work so that he can take this vacation. Or that he isn't working a few hours each day while there making calls networking, reviewing online job sites, searching for career fairs to attend etc. Lots can be done remote. I'd assume that someone who wants to look for work will make this a priority and find time to vacation too. In so far as being available for work goes, it is not likely that he will be offered a job that says, we want you to come in tomorrow. There is a negotiation process an offer letter , background check, drug testing etc. that all needs to get completed before one reports to work. We do not have any indication that the OP's husband is a slacker and I think folks have been to quick to judge. He's not the first unemployed person to take a vacation. I think it's a good idea myself for the family to get away. When he lands a new job it will at least six months to a year before he can comfortably take a vacation.

 

[1sttimemickeymom]

WOW! Hot topic!

I am a former workforce development professional. First -- states do have different rules & although some of the PP's have pointed this out, there are still many posters making assumptions based on their own state! (Disclaimer: I did not work in Michigan in this field, so I am not intimately familiar with their rules)

I, too, am suspicious of the OP and wonder if this is a joke. But, as another PP stated -- some people have been VERY aggressive with their answers. It's one thing to have a strong opinion (along with some personal knowledge) but don't you think we could all use a little more kindness in this world?! Even (maybe especially) for those who use a hot button issue like this as a joke (if that's what the OP did).

Also - for those of you who are questioning "phoning in" versus being there in person -- some states are sooooo backlogged & shorthanded that they are going to a more "automated" approach. When someone is told to phone in, there is less chance that a hearing will drag on -- meaning more cases can be determined. It's all about efficiency, I guess.

I will say I too am upset about people who abuse ANY system. There are many many people who are really looking for work but can't find any that pay a living wage and are sucking up their pride and taking the UI benefits that they deserve. Yes, employers AND employees pay for this benefit -- and that what it is. Consider that the cost of paying UI might mean that someone's salary is less (or other "optional" benefits -- like paid sick leave, health care, etc-- are cut or minimized) so that IN CASE they need to use this benefit it is there. IMHO, in a legitimate situation, that is NOT taking advantage -- it is using all of your resources.

Just my $0.02 worth from someone who used to be "in the trenches"....

whew....I'll get off the soapbox now so someone else can climb on!!