TSA mess and the police

[Trixieplus2]

I am sorry to hear this the world is full of people for whom any intimate touching is just out of the question. This is why I won't shut up.

I hope they will at least attempt to find a better method soon.

 

[DMRick]

I do hope that the TSA starts taking into account that some people just can't be touched (although they do have the same sex doing the pat down, and you can ask for privacy, I'm not sure what else they can offer). Most people do not have to go through the pat downs, because nothing throws off the scan, but you can never be sure. There are lots of airports where business is as usual, such as our airport, but then it depends on where you are coming back from.

I know my sister won't fly either, although for her it's fear of the plane, not the TSA. She did say this weekend she would not fly because of the TSA, but I know she wouldn't have flown no matter what..she has always been afraid to fly. Because we live so far from Disney, she has missed some nice family trips, but for her the fear of flying is worse than the fear of missing the family gatherings.

I had planned to at one point and would still like to if something changes but for now I am to afraid of TSA to even attempt it.

I wont argue about it and it is not about "punishing" the airline for me personally. It is just simple fear. It worries me enough to make me swear off flying unless they make some changes. Until then

 

[olwyngdh]

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/2010-11-23-airport-security-tsa-poll_N.htm

Poll: Most fliers bothered or angered by TSA pat-downs

By Gary Stoller, USA TODAY
Most air travelers are bothered or angry about thorough pat-downs at airport security checkpoints and many dislike the alternative at many airports, a full-body scan, a new USA TODAY/Gallup Poll finds.

I think this is a very skewed poll. There is a huge difference between "bothered" and "angry." For example, I am bothered by the kids playing football across the front yards on the block leaving their empty Gatorade bottles on my lawn. I am not angered by it. The fact that the poll jams those two things into one pool for the numbers bothers me, but it doesn't make me angry. It does, however, make me distrust the numbers.

 

[OceanAnnie]

TSA Looks to Expand Use of Full-Body Scanners at U.S. Airports

Published December 29, 2009 | FOXNews.com

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/12/29/tsa-looks-expand-use-body-scanners-airports

What did the TSA keep quiet about in 2010?

Didn't see any mention of "enhanced pat downs".

 

[DMRick]

What did the TSA keep quiet about?

Didn't see any mention of "enhanced pat downs".

It was known in August:

http://motherjones.com/blue-marble/2010/08/tsas-new-gropey-pat-downs

 

[OceanAnnie]

It was known in August:

http://motherjones.com/blue-marble/2010/08/tsas-new-gropey-pat-downs

Mother Jones??

 

[OceanAnnie]

"Pistole, (head of the Transportation Security Administration) who spent 26 years with the FBI, told reporters he rejected the advice of media aides who advised him to publicize the revised security measures before they took effect."

http://thehill.com/homenews/administ...-to-terrorists
__________________

Call me crazy, but if the head of TSA said he didn't publicize the revised security measures, I'm going with his version.

 

[DMRick]

Mother Jones??

Yes, does it matter which magazine it was in? It was a quote from the Boston Globe.
The point I was making was that it's not like we just knew about this on November 1st. Or did just a few people know about this? I knew, although I didn't know just how enhanced it would be. I took the article to mean they didn't go in depth, because they didn't want to play out all their cards.

They also said it will remain like this in the short term..which to me means they are looking at it and perhaps there will be changes.

 

[OceanAnnie]

Yes, does it matter which magazine it was in? It was a quote from the Boston Globe.
The point I was making was that it's not like we just knew about this on November 1st.

According to the head of the TSA, that's just not the case.

 

[DMRick]

According to the head of the TSA, that's just not the case.

Well, since that article I posted (and the comments from all the people, which sound much like some of the comments on this board) was in August, it was known. They may not have sung it from the ceilings, or highly advertised it, but it was known. I knew before Nov 1. He said it was not publicized, he didn't say it wasn't known.

 

[LuvOrlando]

I can only speak for myself but I did not fully understand the procedures ahead of the date I started this thread. I was happily oblivious and perusing airline websites for good fares to our 2 intended vacation spots when this mess slapped me awake within the week I was willing to buy our tickets. I don't consider myself uninformed but I do have 2 kids so I don't really hunt for stuff to get worked up over either. I don't do talk radio and the nightly news is horrific to me so I generally stick to on-line news papers ect. where I can opt in or out of a story and minimize the painful bias. Truth be told I'm a fairly standard issue middle class Mom.

It seems to me that what we were told in dribs and drabs is starkly different from what we actually saw when we all got an eyeful courtesy of You Tube. In fact, I bet most Americans had no idea we couldn't walk out of the TSA Security without risking thousands of dollars in fines until it was on video, personally, I had zero idea .

 

[OceanAnnie]

I have read a number of articles that speak to the enhanced security measures being rolled out without informing the public, with quotes confirming it from the head of TSA. I'm going with his version.

We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

 

[DMRick]

If you do a search on the Dis, a lot of this was discussed back in March or so. Most of the threads then (and a lot started recently) are now closed, because of politics and debating, but they are still up. So you may have a lot of ariticles sayign it was a secret, but it was much discussed months ago, right here.

 

[LuvOrlando]

If you do a search on the Dis, a lot of this was discussed back in March or so. Most of the threads then (and a lot started recently) are now closed, because of politics and debating, but they are still up.

But you would have had to know what you are looking for in order to find it. I really had only the slightest spark of knowledge and even then I thought they might all just be rumors.

Once the videos began surfacing I knew to look and when I knew to look, well I was able to see KWIM

 

[DMRick]

But you would have had to know what you are looking for in order to find it. I really had only the slightest spark of knowledge and even then I thought they might all just be rumors.

Once the videos began surfacing I knew to look and when I knew to look, well I was able to see KWIM

Just put in TSA scans or enhanced pat downs, etc in the Dis search. Here is one to show that it really was discussed last March. There are several threads on it..most closed:
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=35706665#post35706665

Obviously people knew about the changes. Maybe not to the extent, but they were known.

 

[OceanAnnie]

Just put in TSA scans or enhanced pat downs, etc in the Dis search. Here is one to show that it really was discussed last March. There are several threads on it..most closed:
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=35706665#post35706665

Obviously people knew about the changes. Maybe not to the extent, but they were known.

It seems we were both right. The changes were known (to what extent is debatable), but kept quiet by the TSA.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Yes, does it matter which magazine it was in? It was a quote from the Boston Globe.
The point I was making was that it's not like we just knew about this on November 1st. Or did just a few people know about this? I knew, although I didn't know just how enhanced it would be. I took the article to mean they didn't go in depth, because they didn't want to play out all their cards.

They also said it will remain like this in the short term..which to me means they are looking at it and perhaps there will be changes.

I know I was aware pat-downs were being changed from back-of-the-hand to front-of-the-hand long before the change went into effect. It matters to me because I have about a 40% chance of being patted down, based on experience.

I DON'T CARE. I've been, as stated above, patted down in the past. I've been aware what 'enhanced' pat-down entails since it was first determined, well before October 29. Would I rather have it the old way? Sure. Will I undergo whatever security procedures are required so I can board my flights? Sure.

 

[Geoff_M]

Just put in TSA scans or enhanced pat downs, etc in the Dis search. Here is one to show that it really was discussed last March. There are several threads on it..most closed:
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=35706665#post35706665

Obviously people knew about the changes. Maybe not to the extent, but they were known.

While "pat downs" were discussed back then as the "opt out" Plan B, it's worth noting that a "pat down" is a pretty general term with varying degrees of intrusiveness. Everyone that goes to a Detroit Lions game at Ford Field is given a same-sex "pat down" too, but it's VERY minimal. They check around your waist for something tucked in your belt, and then quickly run the back side of their hands down each of your arms and legs... and you're in. You don't feel like you should be kissing the guy during the check, if you know what I mean.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I can only speak for myself but I did not fully understand the procedures ahead of the date I started this thread. I was happily oblivious and perusing airline websites for good fares to our 2 intended vacation spots when this mess slapped me awake within the week I was willing to buy our tickets. I don't consider myself uninformed but I do have 2 kids so I don't really hunt for stuff to get worked up over either. I don't do talk radio and the nightly news is horrific to me so I generally stick to on-line news papers ect. where I can opt in or out of a story and minimize the painful bias. Truth be told I'm a fairly standard issue middle class Mom.

It seems to me that what we were told in dribs and drabs is starkly different from what we actually saw when we all got an eyeful courtesy of You Tube. In fact, I bet most Americans had no idea we couldn't walk out of the TSA Security without risking thousands of dollars in fines until it was on video, personally, I had zero idea .

But, respectfully, you effectively hide your head in the sand with regards to news because it's biased, but then put complete faith in a few YouTube videos? Keep in mind, some of those are from persons with some type of agenda: John Tyner puts his cell phone on 'record' and puts in on top of his luggage before it goes through the normal carry-on screening - for what purpose? That other San Diego passenger (name eludes me) planned to strip down to his underwear. The boy who was supposedly "strip" searched? His own father removed his shirt, not at the behest of the TSA.

But again, it's interesting that you don't consider any of that biased or one-sided, but the news is? If you pick and choose what news you read, it's disingenuous to claim you weren't informed. Chances are, this WAS 'in the news' available to you long before October 29.

 

[kaytieeldr]

While "pat downs" were discussed back then as the "opt out" Plan B, it's worth noting that a "pat down" is a pretty general term with varying degrees of intrusiveness. Everyone that goes to a Detroit Lions game at Ford Field is given a same-sex "pat down" too, but it's VERY minimal. They check around your waist for something tucked in your belt, and then quickly run the back side of their hands down each of your arms and legs... and you're in. You don't feel like you should be kissing the guy during the check, if you know what I mean.

Patdowns at stadiums are checking for alcohol. When you can get to a distant destination by entering a sports stadium or arena, maybe the security procedures at airports can be changed to mirror what they use at Ford Field.