Troubled economy casts shadow over Disney union talks

[CR Resort Fan 4 Life]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-disney-world-union-negotiations-20100725,0,3916267.story

 

[eliza61]

This is going to be extremely interesting especially with the company wanting to get rid of employee pensions. Yikes.

Question? can some one really only make $7.45 at Disney?

 

[skiingfast]

The union talk is pretty complaining as expected.

In the cycle of business unions wins when business is good, the company wins when business is bad.

As far as moving to a 401k the union rep is full of crap to complain about it. Pensions outside of the government are almost phased out.

They ommited the fact that pension benefits in the economic downturn have been reduced for many, including the people who have retired and that pension was thier income. All they cared to mention was stock market losses in 401Ks.

 

[tgropp]

As far as moving to a 401k the union rep is full of crap to complain about it. Pensions outside of the government are almost phased out.



I know in Canada, it is goverment and city, and minicipal workers. Our taxes are KILLING us.

 

[eliza61]

The union talk is pretty complaining as expected.

In the cycle of business unions wins when business is good, the company wins when business is bad.

As far as moving to a 401k the union rep is full of crap to complain about it. Pensions outside of the government are almost phased out.

They ommited the fact that pension benefits in the economic downturn have been reduced for many, including the people who have retired and that pension was thier income. All they cared to mention was stock market losses in 401Ks.

There are concerns with both sides of the argument. I wouldn't call the unions stance fully crap.

Many companies have really crappy 401K plans so if you've got one and the only choice they offer you is heavy on the Disney stock. I wouldn't go for that either. My Dh works for one of the largest oil companies around (think right up there with BP) and they had to fight tooth and nail to get decent funds in their 401K.

401K's were never designed to be the sole avenue for pension funding. If you work for disney and make $11 bucks an hour, do you really have the money to slap into a 401K fund. In today's economy? So the reality of the situation you're quickly going to have a workforce of people who make barely enough money to live on with nothing in their retirements. Now while this is not going to be a concern for Disney, it dang sure should be a concern for the rest of us because who do you think is going to pay for these people to survive when they retire?

We just had a thread on the community board quoting figures of some thing like 27% of Americans have less than $1000 bucks saved for retirement. Once again these people aren't thinking about picking up and moving to the Ukraine so they're going to be around in say 15 years needing some type of assistance.

Aren't the elderly the fastest growing segment of the population? I thought I read that some where. If this is true whats going to happen if that turns into the "fastest growing segment of the population is elderly and poverty stricken"

You can union bash all you want but as I said before, these people will grow old and retire, that's guaranteed.

 

[skiingfast]

There are concerns with both sides of the argument. I wouldn't call the unions stance fully crap.

Many companies have really crappy 401K plans so if you've got one and the only choice they offer you is heavy on the Disney stock. I wouldn't go for that either. My Dh works for one of the largest oil companies around (think right up there with BP) and they had to fight tooth and nail to get decent funds in their 401K.


You can union bash all you want but as I said before, these people will grow old and retire, that's guaranteed.

All I noted is how the unions complaint about moving to a 401K is unfounded because this is the current trend and in the private sector what is working the best. Also that the currently slow down in the economy hurt Pensions and 401Ks.

I haven't and won't bash unions here, but you should realize they were founded for worker safety not to get higher wages.

 

[Donut23]

There are concerns with both sides of the argument. I wouldn't call the unions stance fully crap.

Many companies have really crappy 401K plans so if you've got one and the only choice they offer you is heavy on the Disney stock. I wouldn't go for that either. My Dh works for one of the largest oil companies around (think right up there with BP) and they had to fight tooth and nail to get decent funds in their 401K.

401K's were never designed to be the sole avenue for pension funding. If you work for disney and make $11 bucks an hour, do you really have the money to slap into a 401K fund. In today's economy? So the reality of the situation you're quickly going to have a workforce of people who make barely enough money to live on with nothing in their retirements. Now while this is not going to be a concern for Disney, it dang sure should be a concern for the rest of us because who do you think is going to pay for these people to survive when they retire?

We just had a thread on the community board quoting figures of some thing like 27% of Americans have less than $1000 bucks saved for retirement. Once again these people aren't thinking about picking up and moving to the Ukraine so they're going to be around in say 15 years needing some type of assistance.

Aren't the elderly the fastest growing segment of the population? I thought I read that some where. If this is true whats going to happen if that turns into the "fastest growing segment of the population is elderly and poverty stricken"

You can union bash all you want but as I said before, these people will grow old and retire, that's guaranteed.

DH, 32 veteran, sits next to his Union rep at work daily. Luckily, his small little Union's pension is currently funded 123% (low of 112% last year). His pension safe because it is not physically administered by the Disney suits and is supported by conservative investment policy by people who hold disney to their contract promises.

Sad for most disney castmembers -many other disney pensions are currently grossly underfunded by disney already. No wonder they want to eliminate them.

 

[eliza61]

All I noted is how the unions complaint about moving to a 401K is unfounded because this is the current trend and in the private sector what is working the best. Also that the currently slow down in the economy hurt Pensions and 401Ks.

I haven't and won't bash unions here, but you should realize they were founded for worker safety not to get higher wages.

My bad and my apologies.

I think I'm more spooked than most because I volunteer 3 days a week with the elderly and the poor. All of them pretty much worked most of their lives but saved nothing (for various reason). Talk about drain on a communities resources?

I work for a large fortune 500 company in Wilmington DE and our pension was slashed 3 years ago to 1/3 of the initial value. My first 17 years is grandfathered in but from 2005 on the emphasis is on our 401K. We have a pretty good 401K, they match dollar for dollar for the first 6% and lots of choices for funds but even with all that in my lab of 18 I think 3 of us contribute. That's scary to me and I do ask them what will they live on in their retirement? Some actually don't plan on retiring, they literally say they plan on working until they die and most of these are what would be considered high earners (average salary is ~70K).

 

[eliza61]

As far as moving to a 401k the union rep is full of crap to complain about it. Pensions outside of the government are almost phased out.



I know in Canada, it is goverment and city, and minicipal workers. Our taxes are KILLING us.

What happens to the people who don't have pensions and don't contribute to their 401K? who pays for their existence? Serious question. how does Canada handle that?

 

[tgropp]

What happens to the people who don't have pensions and don't contribute to their 401K? who pays for their existence? Serious question. how does Canada handle that?

Good question. If you work, you are entitled to Canada Pension at 60 years of age and old age pension at 65 years of age. Not quite sure how much it works out to but I would estimate approx close to $900.00 $1000.00/month/person. Now remember, I paid approx $2,500.00/year in Canada Pension payments yearly in my income tax. $1000.00 a month sounds good but if you have no money saved up, you are in trouble trying to make ends meet, especially if you own a house with outrageous property taxes, heat and hydro payments. Lots of seniors live in poverty and rely on food banks, friendship meals etc.. But as I always say, if my great grandparents were around to hear me complain about how hard we have it, they would kick my
Rear end all over the place.

 

[disneydreamgirl]

Good question. If you work, you are entitled to Canada Pension at 60 years of age and old age pension at 65 years of age. Not quite sure how much it works out to but I would estimate approx close to $900.00 $1000.00/month/person. Now remember, I paid approx $2,500.00/year in Canada Pension payments yearly in my income tax. $1000.00 a month sounds good but if you have no money saved up, you are in trouble trying to make ends meet, especially if you own a house with outrageous property taxes, heat and hydro payments. Lots of seniors live in poverty and rely on food banks, friendship meals etc.. But as I always say, if my great grandparents were around to hear me complain about how hard we have it, they would kick my
Rear end all over the place.

Old Age Security is available for those who have lower income as well as the Guaranteed Income Supplement for those who qualify. There is no doubt that people have to save if they want to do more than just exist in retirement. Those over age 65 also receive Drug benefits in many of our provinces and they qualify for other tax benefits. Recently income splitting has allowed many retirees to reduce their individual taxes paid by splitting their income with their spouse, so that both are earning the same amount and ideally paying less tax collectively than one would claiming the entire amount.

 

[nytimez]

As far as moving to a 401k the union rep is full of crap to complain about it. Pensions outside of the government are almost phased out. [/B]

Just because companies are trying to kill pensions -- and succeeding -- doesn't mean companies SHOULD kill pensions. In fact, it's an absolute outrage what companies have been allowed to do to pension funds.

Also, just because unions began to protect workers safety a century ago doesn't mean that's the only thing they should be involved in today. By law, they are allowed to represent workers in all phases of their negotiations once they've voted to organize.

I've never been a part of a union myself, and overall they've certainly done some things to hurt their cause over the years. But it's important to appreciate and respect their role in the process when they legitimately represent the interests of their workers.

 

[tgropp]

Just because companies are trying to kill pensions -- and succeeding -- doesn't mean companies SHOULD kill pensions. In fact, it's an absolute outrage what companies have been allowed to do to pension funds.

Also, just because unions began to protect workers safety a century ago doesn't mean that's the only thing they should be involved in today. By law, they are allowed to represent workers in all phases of their negotiations once they've voted to organize.

I've never been a part of a union myself, and overall they've certainly done some things to hurt their cause over the years. But it's important to appreciate and respect their role in the process when they legitimately represent the interests of their workers.

I agree 110%. I was fortunate to retire at the age of 52 with a very good pension (automotive sector) so I am thankful for my union representation. But in the 35 years of working I saw some abuse by the union, and now you see abuse by corporations. It seems nobody knows how to act responsible when they hold the hammer.

DisneyDreamGirl. Thank You for clarifying our pension entitlements in Canada. I will need to do some investigating on what I should be doing when I reach the age of 60.

 

[disneydreamgirl]

DisneyDreamGirl. Thank You for clarifying our pension entitlements in Canada. I will need to do some investigating on what I should be doing when I reach the age of 60.

Definitely read up - there are lots of publications provided by the government that explain what's available. A visit to their website will allow you to order information and print forms necessary to register. I'm impressed that you retired at age 52...you must have planned well! Congrats!

 

[eliza61]

Just because companies are trying to kill pensions -- and succeeding -- doesn't mean companies SHOULD kill pensions. In fact, it's an absolute outrage what companies have been allowed to do to pension funds.
Also, just because unions began to protect workers safety a century ago doesn't mean that's the only thing they should be involved in today. By law, they are allowed to represent workers in all phases of their negotiations once they've voted to organize.

I've never been a part of a union myself, and overall they've certainly done some things to hurt their cause over the years. But it's important to appreciate and respect their role in the process when they legitimately represent the interests of their workers.

Indeed. The other issue I'm facing is that even with a company offering 401K's how many people automatically become financial gurus in an instant. Seriously, I've made it a priority over the last 6 years to read up on IRA's, CD's, stock markets etc etc and I mean talk about confusing. Throw this at the average Joe or Jane working in an office and suddenly they are supposed to know what investment vehicles are good for them?

Gimme a break, most people in the states can't even figure out their credit card statements. 10 years go by and then you find out you've invested most of your contribution in the wrong fund, you're screwed.

 

[TheRustyScupper]

1) I am lucky, in that I am in my second retirement.
. . . retired at 55, when I took a CEO buyout
. . . after one year, went back to work to help start a company as CEO
. . . then retird as CEO after 4-1/2 yrs
2) I am glad I did not have to survive on the monies from 1-yr at Disney.
3) They pay their people tradiditonal tourist-area wages.
4) So, you knew the retirement wasn't going to be that great.

NOTE: People who work for Disney know the wages are low. However, they do have really good insurances. So, the employee has to make a choice - take the better fringes or go elsewhere for higher base pay. Just today's realities.

 

[Donut23]

1) I am lucky, in that I am in my second retirement.
. . . retired at 55, when I took a CEO buyout
. . . after one year, went back to work to help start a company as CEO
. . . then retird as CEO after 4-1/2 yrs
2) I am glad I did not have to survive on the monies from 1-yr at Disney.
3) They pay their people tradiditonal tourist-area wages.
4) So, you knew the retirement wasn't going to be that great.

NOTE: People who work for Disney know the wages are low. However, they do have really good insurances. So, the employee has to make a choice - take the better fringes or go elsewhere for higher base pay. Just today's realities.

The funny thing DH and I discovered about Disney insurance when we married.....

Disney insurance is the deal of a lifetime for the castmember....it's really good for castmember and partner/spouse.....and it becomes terribly - terribly expensive for castmember/spouse and children. Most of DH's co-workers have children on thier spouse's policy. It just seems so odd for a company based on family entertainment.

 

[Tekneek]

This is going to be extremely interesting especially with the company wanting to get rid of employee pensions. Yikes.

Question? can some one really only make $7.45 at Disney?

$7.50. In fact, many that you will interface with directly at Disney are going to be paid that or close to it.

 

[Tekneek]

Disney insurance is the deal of a lifetime for the castmember....it's really good for castmember and partner/spouse.....and it becomes terribly - terribly expensive for castmember/spouse and children. Most of DH's co-workers have children on thier spouse's policy. It just seems so odd for a company based on family entertainment.

Maybe this is why most of the stories are about broken families...

 

[TheRustyScupper]

Disney insurance is the deal of a lifetime for the castmember....it's really good for castmember and partner/spouse.....and it becomes terribly - terribly expensive for castmember/spouse and children.

1) Unfortunately, insurance is expensive, today.
2) My old company paid all the employee's insurance and 80% of dependents.
3) But, that is a rareity.
4) Yes, Disney insurance for a full family is high, but still lower than most.
5) Besides, it is pretty comprehensive coverage.

NOTE: There are cheaper insurance options at WDW, just like at other places. But, if you want the ultimate family plan, it will cost you.