Torn between economics and convenience

[CastAStone]

Food for thought
When you plan a vacation anywhere do you always choose the cheapest destination over the destination you would prefer?
If you do you will miss out a lot in life.

Buying a vacation timeshare is much the same do you buy the cheaper one knowing you will get less of an experience?
Or do you buy to have the best vacations and experiences you could imagine.

Most here put cheapness over their happiness if you ask me but each to his own flavor.
I have family that are park commandos bringing their own food, water, etc but that takes time in planning that has to be calculated as well. My time and effort are worth something to me so I vacation like a tourist I plan nothing live for the moment in the best surroundings I can afford and you know waht that gets me in the end?

That gets my family and I some of the best vaactions we can enjoy. Lots of ways to save money in life vacations have never been one of them.

I don't begrudge anyone for making any resort choice they would like. I have had some life circumstances come up that is postponing my planned DVC purchase until early next year, but I am planning a split purchase of SSR and BCV - the best and worst "deals" for points of all the WDW resorts. I think it's important to separate people purchasing specifically to have Sleep Around Points from people purchasing to own a specific resort (we're doing both).

If you want to always stay in a studio at Grand Floridian or Copper Creek or Riviera or Beach Club the data seems to say you should buy the resort you want to stay at, even though it's not as cheap as Saratoga Springs.

If you want to try all the different resorts and are willing to take whatever at 7 months and have lots of flexibility in dates and want to sometimes use points at Aulani and Hilton Head, you'd be wasting money to buy anywhere but Saratoga Springs.

If you're somewhere in between, that's when "buy where you wouldn't mind staying" comes in. And I think most people are somewhere in between.

 

[Wedgeout]

In a maybe strange way, Disney is smart on the resale restrictions and new resort rules. I think it will spur more direct buying. We talk about all the sleep around 7 month stuff. Will be interesting when the stats come in on how many Riviera owners are in SAP mode and snagging availability from the SSR SAPers. All the new direct buyers liking Riviera can SAP there all they want without current resale buyer competition.

 

[sethschroeder]

PVB rents out for more

I see this posted but personally have not come across any evidence for this. I guess I never see it in the rental area but I never really looked that closely.

That being said if you like PVB it being a little more expensive than SSR isn't a big deal because honestly you are getting a better 11 month booking window then.

Poly will have studios available at 7 months. It's a surprising

Not really surprising to me those are expensive studios and the lack of 1BR/2BR I think moves a good amount of points outside the resort.

Those billion kiosks and the ice cream machine were there for a reason. Plenty of people buy without even knowing about resale.

Except its all in the math that people do on the spot if deciding to buy. Saying ticket discounts are part of the benefits is a big thing.

Again tickets have ALWAYS been part of the membership benefits and I think there is a 0.1% chance its not part of it for the next 50 years. There is really zero factual information backing up a claim they are removing ticket discounts in the future completely from DVC. I suspect you will try to claim the current time frame yet again which has been explained this is not DVC specific but all APs that are temporarily on hold from being sold new (some reports of renewals being allowed).

 

[sethschroeder]

All the new direct buyers liking Riviera can SAP there all they want without current resale buyer competition.

So it really will not matter for about 20 years. 99.9% of points right now are grandfathered in to be able to book anywhere at the moment and over time that will come down some but as new resorts come on line that will start to skew numbers and as resorts expire that will also be a larger shift.

Riviera owners are in SAP mode

Brought this up before that RIV is not a terrible SAP contract if you are buying enough points all at the same time. I bought my 300 points for $155/point and as I outlined it sits right behind AKV on the chart that was posted earlier in the thread. It could even pass AKV in the next 2 years as I would suspect RIV has one more "free pass" before it starts getting average MFs increases. That is also Direct RIV vs AKV pure costs not accounting for anything else and the math comes out similar.

All that is why I just decided to make the jump in to RIV, had sold 2 of my 3 BWV contracts back in April. I plan on using RIV at RIV though no SAP.

 

[Duckbug.Ducktales]

all APs that are temporarily on hold from being sold new (some reports of renewals being allowed).

I would add that it's not useful to even say they've gone away, they are still listed as one of the direct perks. They just happen to not be selling any AP because of the extremely unusual circumstances we are in. APs are on hold, not gone. When the hold is lifted DVC members can buy again at the discount.
And yeah, one can renew. My parents renewed theirs online to get the 15% discount.

 

[CastAStone]

I see this posted but personally have not come across any evidence for this. I guess I never see it in the rental area but I never really looked that closely.

David’s charges a $1 premium for all WDW resorts that are not OKW or SSR. The other large rental broker charges as much as $25/point (maybe more, I haven’t look at all of them) for fixed reservations at high demand resorts.

 

[RoseGold]

I would add that it's not useful to even say they've gone away, they are still listed as one of the direct perks.

So is TOTW, also closed with no date to open.

And any of these benefits can be taken away at any moment (like now). Historically, perks have shrunk, not expanded.

 

[Sandisw]

So is TOTW, also closed with no date to open.

And any of these benefits can be taken away at any moment (like now). Historically, perks have shrunk, not expanded.

I think the point is that DVC did not take away the AP discount and phrasing it that way is wrong,

WDPR has suspended the selling of APs to everyone which has nothing to do with DVC.

So, once the decision is made to sell again, this is a perk you will be eligible for as a direct buyer. Now, if they go on sale and no DVC tickets are there, then you can say the perk is gone.

 

[Yinn]

I see this posted but personally have not come across any evidence for this. I guess I never see it in the rental area but I never really looked that closely.

I'm basing it on this:

One example:
https://dvcrequest.com/dvc-owners/information
PVB is considered a premium resort (among others) whereas SSR is considered a standard resort. $1/pt more in terms of rental.

Less relevant thanks to COVID. But pre-covid it was also one of the ones that would routinely be in demand with brokers seeking PVB points to rent out.

 

[sethschroeder]

I'm basing it on this:

One example:
https://dvcrequest.com/dvc-owners/information
PVB is considered a premium resort (among others) whereas SSR is considered a standard resort. $1/pt more in terms of rental.

Less relevant thanks to COVID. But pre-covid it was also one of the ones that would routinely be in demand with brokers seeking PVB points to rent out.

Ya I guess I would always rent my points myself likely so wouldn't really look at a rental company but had heard about the incentive for renting 11 months out.

 

[poofyo101]

PVB does rent higher. PVB is the easiest resort to rent IMO as well.

 

[Ruttangel]

The value to me in DVC is beating the house.
House says $195 a point and 132pts for a week in Aug in a studio at RIV
I can get a 2BR value at AKV for 206 for a week at same time for $105 a point.
I’m still saving money after 20 years of 2BR!!!

 

[sethschroeder]

The value to me in DVC is beating the house.
House says $195 a point and 132pts for a week in Aug in a studio at RIV
I can get a 2BR value at AKV for 206 for a week at same time for $105 a point.
I’m still saving money after 20 years of 2BR!!!

Value rooms make up like 0.01% of all rooms in DVC, are very hard to book, and there is not even enough capacity for each AKV member to book even a single stay in the next 50 years. It also is not the same room/location when comparing to RIV, BLT, VGF, CCV. I could book at Value resorts and likely save money, book offsite save money, or not go to Disney and save money.

It took me a while but you need to balance "savings" with what you want in a vacation as well. There is a reason why AKV has been considered to be a half tier below other deluxe resorts. Love the resort the location is atrocious though and don't even start talking about "but skyliner will come".

Its fine to buy AKV though because its a low point of entry although resale seems to not be around $100-$105 anymore and is up closer to $115?

 

[Ruttangel]

Value rooms make up like 0.01% of all rooms in DVC, are very hard to book, and there is not even enough capacity for each AKV member to book even a single stay in the next 50 years. It also is not the same room/location when comparing to RIV, BLT, VGF, CCV. I could book at Value resorts and likely save money, book offsite save money, or not go to Disney and save money.

It took me a while but you need to balance "savings" with what you want in a vacation as well. There is a reason why AKV has been considered to be a half tier below other deluxe resorts. Love the resort the location is atrocious though and don't even start talking about "but skyliner will come".

Its fine to buy AKV though because its a low point of entry although resale seems to not be around $100-$105 anymore and is up closer to $115?

It’s all personal preference, you say remote I say it’s an escape from the madness.
I’m not sure why you said atrocious...you can’t have a savannah full of animals near fireworks!!

I know what is atrocious, RIV resale restrictions. I just couldn’t buy knowing there’s a risk it could be $80 a point in 10 years.
A final point on location, RIV looks like a gran destino of CBR.

 

[RoseGold]

The value to me in DVC is beating the house.

Yes, to many of us, this is a game. I get that to most normal humans trying to go on vacations, this is overwhelming, but you're right. I am GOOD at this game.

 

[sethschroeder]

I see you make no argument around the severe lack of availability in Value Rooms or around you "beating the house" while ignoring you can actually save more by "giving up" other benefits if you want to take it further.

I’m not sure why you said atrocious...you can’t have a savannah full of animals near fireworks!!

The location is by far the biggest strike against the resort that otherwise only really has positives (except no real quick service at Kidani). I mean you can say its worth it but thats rationalization of the whole resort not specific to location comparisons. AKV is in the bottom 1/4th of DVC resorts when it comes to location.

Tier 1 - BWV/BCV/BLT
Tier 2 - VGF/POLY
Tier 3 - CCV/BRV/RIV
Tier 4a - AKV
Tier 4b - SSR/OKW

Based on attendance numbers for benefit of proximity to park:
MK - 36% of trip, AK - 24% of trip, Epcot/HS - 60% of trip (and only location of festivals)

I know what is atrocious, RIV resale restrictions. I just couldn’t buy knowing there’s a risk it could be $80 a point in 10 years.
A final point on location, RIV looks like a gran destino of CBR.

Well since most people consider Gran Destino one of the best hotels on property I guess thats a good thing?

In the end you can guess that it will be $80/point but in reality its very unlikely to be the case I could go over a bunch of factual information but its more likely you made this comment because you are upset over AKV being called out on its location. In the end my direct RIV purchase is barely any more expensive long term than AKV resale so I am happy with it especially since I expect for the next 2 years MFs to come together between RIV/AKV although possibly delayed slightly because of 2020 weirdness.

 

[Ruttangel]

I see you make no argument around the severe lack of availability in Value Rooms or around you "beating the house" while ignoring you can actually save more by "giving up" other benefits if you want to take it further.



The location is by far the biggest strike against the resort that otherwise only really has positives (except no real quick service at Kidani). I mean you can say its worth it but thats rationalization of the whole resort not specific to location comparisons. AKV is in the bottom 1/4th of DVC resorts when it comes to location.

Tier 1 - BWV/BCV/BLT
Tier 2 - VGF/POLY
Tier 3 - CCV/BRV/RIV
Tier 4a - AKV
Tier 4b - SSR/OKW

Based on attendance numbers for benefit of proximity to park:
MK - 36% of trip, AK - 24% of trip, Epcot/HS - 60% of trip (and only location of festivals)



Well since most people consider Gran Destino one of the best hotels on property I guess thats a good thing?

In the end you can guess that it will be $80/point but in reality its very unlikely to be the case I could go over a bunch of factual information but its more likely you made this comment because you are upset over AKV being called out on its location. In the end my direct RIV purchase is barely any more expensive long term than AKV resale so I am happy with it especially since I expect for the next 2 years MFs to come together between RIV/AKV although possibly delayed slightly because of 2020 weirdness.

1. If location is based on access to parks then AKV is quicker to get to all parks than WL resorts (bar MK).

2.I’ve just booked the 2BR value for those dates, hence the comparison

3. RIV has many beautiful attributes but it’s location, restrictions, point chart and cost are not part of them

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

It’s all personal preference, you say remote I say it’s an escape from the madness.

Count me among those who love AKL/AKV for the resort itself AND for the location. I get that lots of people want to walk to MK or EP, but that's not the be-all end-all for us. We like being a little off the beaten path.

Maybe that's a little weird, but at least we're not as crazy as those people who like to stay at a remote campground!

 

[sethschroeder]

1. If location is based on access to parks then AKV is quicker to get to all parks than WL resorts (bar MK).

Except again this is the primary park getting roughly 2x the amount of visits compared to AK.

2.I’ve just booked the 2BR value for those dates, hence the comparison

Just because you have done something doesn't mean you can make a declaration of how you beat the system when that is 1 year out of 30-40 years owning a resort. Did you also just book it or plan and walk the reservation for months? There is a pretty common thread on threads by people getting info and thats don't rely on getting Club or Value rooms at AKV so I think its a little disingenuous to act like its a given.

3. RIV has many beautiful attributes but it’s location, restrictions, point chart and cost are not part of them

Except its location is superior to AKV. Its a 6 min ride to Epcot, 15 mins to HS on the skyliner which gets you to two parks. On top of that stand alone busing to MK without multiple stops at the same resort.

AND for the location

I would have less issue if the buses came more often and were on time. Really like the resort itself as I have said on other threads will for sure stay there again.

 

[Ruttangel]

Except again this is the primary park getting roughly 2x the amount of visits.

Except its location is superior to AKV.

1. So, we agreed it’s quicker to all parks except MK. Also don’t forget Blizzard Beach round the corner too.

2.I was referring to it being adjacent to a moderate resort, plus I travel in August the skyliner will be closed for storms every afternoon.

3. Regarding the value rooms, Ok, so this was a real life extreme example but a studio at RIV will still be 30% more points.

The positives for RIV for me are the artwork, rooms and Topolinos are all excellent