To the DISer whose husband was looking for a teaching job

[fac]

That would be nice, but the students are the most important part. Parental support is a fantastic bonus that I can't count on! I work with 8-12 year olds that every morning get themselves ready, walk to school by themselves, and arrive at school early for tutoring- despite zero parental support. It is a sad situation. I saw 1 parent at parent-teacher conferences. I can't help the parents, but I can help their children! I'm not going to make excuses and say these students can't succeed because they have lousy parents. My students have to work harder and have more things to overcome, but they can do it!

It isn't easy, but it can be done. You have to be 100% committed, and can't have a negative attitude. You need strong administrative leadership and a very dedicated staff!

THANKS. In particular to hear from a teacher confirming it.

As I pointed out earlier, I am a parent of a special ed kid and found out the sped ed teacher wasn't doing her job right, when I tried to work with other parents, I found out a parent was not able to commit the time. (She has 2 jobs and her husband lost a job), I asked myself how much is the parents' fault, I can only conclude that it would be nice if she can spend more time, but it does not excuse the bad attitude from the teacher. Again, the sped ed kids in DD's class just need different teaching strategies.

This year, her sped ed teacher offered DD morning (and some afternoons) one-on-one teaching. I sent DD to school early, I could see she was tired, I asked her time and again whether she wanted to go to school early, every time she response was yes because it helps her to understand better. If I did not send her she would have to walk to school early and she would.

I really appreciate the help from her current sped ed teacher, at the same time I also felt bad for her, because if the previous teacher had done a half decent job, the kids would not be as behind as they are. (Again some people take the job as going to a classroom to spend the 40 minutes with the kids and no more).I am not even going to discuss the negative attitude of the administrator and teachers.

Sometimes I read (from newspaper or other media) about teachers complaining kids in 5th and 6th grade and do not know how to read, then the teachers ask how they can teach, I would ask myself what happened to the same kids when they were in k or 1st grade.

I have to agree on the "nice bonus" that bridget used, note that teachers are paid to teach (again, depends on what we meant by teaching)

 

[fac]

I can't help the parents, but I can help their children! I'm not going to make excuses and say these students can't succeed because they have lousy parents. My students have to work harder and have more things to overcome, but they can do it!

very well said. Sometimes I asked myself whether the kids be given a life sentence when their parents cannot spend enough time with them.

 

[chobie]

very well said. Sometimes I asked myself whether the kids be given a life sentence when their parents cannot spend enough time with them.

Some kids can be motivated by teachers to overcome a lousy home-life and every teacher should strive for that. However, you cannot quantify that and demand teachers get every kid to graduate and pass the state test, which is what NCLB wants to do.

But if we as nation are so concerned about kids like this, why are teachers left to shoulder the whole responsibility? Maybe if parents in these low-income neighborhoods had living wage jobs and health benefits, they could be home more for their kids to help them achieve well in school.

 

[gojoe]

Please read this story before making up your mind

http://www.projo.com/news/content/central_falls_turmoil_02-28-10_TQHGS9N_v292.38b0e26.html

 

[HsvTeacher]

Don't think it is a relevant comparision. Most people know how much they paid before getting into a profession. On the other hand, most of us know we have to get a decent good job, and if it means working overtime without pay, to keep the job. If people think they were not paid fairly, they should move to another job. It is particularly important for a teaching job because it impacts our future generation.


As an aside, with only the exception of a few posts, when the teachers brought up the pay rate, they forgot to mention about the pension they are getting.

My retirement benefits will come from money that I have earned, not money that is just being given to me. A set percentage of my income is taken out of my paycheck every month when I get paid. It is held in a retirement account for me.

 

[hanutedmansionmomma]

As an aside, with only the exception of a few posts, when the teachers brought up the pay rate, they forgot to mention about the pension they are getting.

My pension consists of money that comes out of my check automatically, and another part is contributed...errr...I mean...borrowed against and spent already....by the state of KS.

Look, we could go around and around about teacher salaries forever.

No matter what career you choose, we should all support each other getting fair compensation and having input into time and workload issues. Fill in the blank with any other career and say the same things, it's not right on any level. Even if I worked at McDonald's I would expect to get paid more if I worked more. It wouldn't be a news story.

 

[MrsPete]

My retirement benefits will come from money that I have earned, not money that is just being given to me. A set percentage of my income is taken out of my paycheck every month when I get paid. It is held in a retirement account for me.

Yep, a portion of my check goes into my pension fund every month. It's MY money, not something that was gifted to me.

 

[allison443]

Please read this story before making up your mind

http://www.projo.com/news/content/central_falls_turmoil_02-28-10_TQHGS9N_v292.38b0e26.html

Thanks for posting the article! It was very informative and gave a lot of facts about the situation!
Now let's see how many posters read it...

 

[fac]

My pension consists of money that comes out of my check automatically, and another part is contributed...errr...I mean...borrowed against and spent already....by the state of KS.

Look, we could go around and around about teacher salaries forever.

No matter what career you choose, we should all support each other getting fair compensation and having input into time and workload issues. Fill in the blank with any other career and say the same things, it's not right on any level. Even if I worked at McDonald's I would expect to get paid more if I worked more. It wouldn't be a news story.

please read all my posts, I don't envy a teacher's salary or time. There was an article in CNN about an auto ex-CEO was paid as a consultant, the per hour wage is like $3000 per hour (forget the exact figure). I also don't envy him. My belief has always been if anyone doesn't think he/she gets paid fairly, gets a job that pays you well and stop whinning. But don't change the subject on my discussion of your salary.

I brought up the pension as an example on people only put one side of the problem and not on the benefit. On the other hand, as someone posted that the time is listed in the contract and he/she were to get the administrator to walk over him/her, where does she draw the line, the argument gets more of my respect.
I totally agree that without a union, the employees are in a disadvantage, therefore enjoy while you can.

BTW, can you explain to me the formula on the pension? how much is taken out each month and what pension will a teacher get when he/she retires? so that we, non-teachers, can set aside the money and create our own pension plan.

 

[fac]

Thanks for posting the article! It was very informative and gave a lot of facts about the situation!
Now let's see how many posters read it...

Thanks. From the link http://www.projo.com/news/content/central_falls_turmoil_02-28-10_TQHGS9N_v292.38b0e26.html

Gallo said she could pay teachers for some of the additional duties — but not all. Gallo said she offered to pay the teachers $30 per hour to attend two weeks of professional development in the summer, and said she would try to find grant money to cover 90 minutes of weekly “common planning time” after school. All told, Gallo said the 74 classroom teachers — 56 of whom earn the district’s top step of $72,000 a year — would likely earn $3,400 more.

But Gallo said she didn’t have enough money to pay teachers for the other duties, including adding 25 minutes to the school day, tutoring students and eating lunch with them once a week.

therefore it is not that the teachers would not have time for lunch..

from the same link

“We don’t make excuses [for the low test scores], but we do have to talk about reality,” union president Sessums said to the cheers of the crowd. “Children in poverty come to school with a lot of issues.”

Duncan, Gist and Gallo refuse to buy that argument. They embrace a decidedly different view.

Recent research, they say, shows that even the most disadvantaged students can succeed at the highest levels, if educators are willing to abandon ineffective approaches and instead accept changes that work for students. They point to the examples of successful schools across the country that have achieved this — many of which have adopted the conditions Gallo was pushing to transform the high school.

I also do not buy the argument...

 

[tinatark]

This school, as a whole, was failing - the staff knew it and knew the options the superintendant faced - and refused to compromise when she offered a decent plan - $1800 for taking professional improvement courses during the summer, and grant money to pay for part of the additional time they worked.

The article states many of the staff are maxed for their levels- obviously thought they were unfireable, even though they weren't doing their jobs at the level mandated by the state, as evidenced by test results.

The ones who truly care about the students and their educations can, and will be hired back - the others can move along.

There is a principal in our system who is truly doing everything for the kids' benefits - and you can see it, in the students, staff and parental involvement at that school. He has been able to "weed out" the teachers in his words, who "don't love the kids" - has a phenomenal amount of community support, and the school is thriving, thanks to his efforts. He has made presentations regionally about his tutoring program (much like what was asked of the teachers in RI, "at risk" students come in to school early or stay late, and several teachers are there to help them get their work completed/tutor them as needed, he was able to get grants to pay the teachers at year end, but they did it without expectation of pay). I believe (and hope) he will go far in our system, to be able to implement some of these changes from the administrative level.

 

[TheDisneyGirl02]

Thanks for posting the article! It was very informative and gave a lot of facts about the situation!
Now let's see how many posters read it...

Please forgive me - I posted this same post on a different thread about the same subject matter. Instead of retyping the entire thing, I just copied and pasted it since it is relevent over here also.

Very interesting article. It does shed some light on the situation, however in my book it still makes Gallo look like the bad guy. Basically just firing everyone because she couldn't come to an agreement with the union official sounds like she just gave up, something she doesn't want the students to do.

Reading what they expected out of the teachers was kind of confusing.

- Increase school day by 25 minutes
I get that...25 minutes longer a day.

-Formalize tutoring schedule so struggling students have extra help for one hour before and after school.
I get this for the most part - but what they fail to mention is if they would be doing it everyday.

-Agree to eat lunch with students one day a week to build stronger relationships.
I could see this helping in elementary school but not in high school. I was a good student and I liked most of my teachers but I wouldn't want them eating lunch with me.

-Attend two weeks of professional development in the summer at a rate of $30 an hour ($1,800 per year).
I understand this completely - professional development is important for any occupation.

-Stay after school for 90 minutes one day each week to work with fellow teachers analyzing student work and test data and discussing ways to improve teaching.
This states one day a week...but does that mean 90 minutes on top of the extra help for one hour before and after school?

So I have this correct, this would add about 4 extra hours onto the school day at least once a week (25 minutes longer school day, lunch which I approximated as 30 minutes, an hour before and after school as well as 90 minutes one day a week). That is a lot of added time without compensation.

I was salaried at my old job and yes I would work until the job was done. However, then I had the freedom of coming in a little late or leaving a little early to compensate for the extra time. Teachers don't have that opportunity.

It also mentioned in the article that RI will be receiving 12.5 million dollars in inprovement educational grants. With receiving that much extra money in grants, it just amazes me that she couldn't find the money for the compensation. Makes me wonder where that money will be going?

I just find the entire situation very interesting. It seemed like the entire process was too rushed and should have been handled differently.

 

[fac]

Yep, a portion of my check goes into my pension fund every month. It's MY money, not something that was gifted to me.

Just curious, can you explain the formula for the pension? so that I can put aside my money to create my own pension.

 

[muscarello4]

I contribute about $250 per month into the state retirement account. I then earn 2.3% of my salary for each year of service. It I put in 25 years, that is 2.3 times 25 or roughly 80% of my salary (for the rest of my life.) There are other stipulations, of course. Age + years of service must be at least 80, for instance. It is wonderful to not have to worry about retirement, but it IS my contribution that funds the system.

If you want a teacher pension, all you have to do is get yourself into the classroom AND survive for 25 years! Good luck! It's not as easy as it looks! You are either called to teach or you are not. There is really no in between. Those who aren't called to the profession will be in and out within 5 years. (Just look at teacher turnover statistics!)

 

[TheDisneyGirl02]

If you want a teacher pension, all you have to do is get yourself into the classroom AND survive for 25 years! Good luck! It's not as easy as it looks! You are either called to teach or you are not. There is really no in between. Those who aren't called to the profession will be in and out within 5 years. (Just look at teacher turnover statistics!)

ITA! I always tell my dad and sister (who are both teachers) that I would rather hang myself upside-down by my toenails than become a teacher. It's just not for me. I love kids, don't get me wrong but I could never be a teacher.

 

[fac]

I contribute about $250 per month into the state retirement account. I then earn 2.3% of my salary for each year of service. It I put in 25 years, that is 2.3 times 25 or roughly 80% of my salary (for the rest of my life.) There are other stipulations, of course. Age + years of service must be at least 80, for instance. It is wonderful to not have to worry about retirement, but it IS my contribution that funds the system.

If you want a teacher pension, all you have to do is get yourself into the classroom AND survive for 25 years! Good luck! It's not as easy as it looks! You are either called to teach or you are not. There is really no in between. Those who aren't called to the profession will be in and out within 5 years. (Just look at teacher turnover statistics!)

Thanks. That's my point. A teacher is NOT ONLY getting the money he/she put in from his/her pay check, because if it does, most of the companies will do it. Then there is the medical coverage, right? The fact that it is "earned" because it is really part of the whole teaching package.
Again, I have no intention of bashing any teachers and I am not here to judge whether a teacher deserves the pay or benefits. In fact, if the teachers were doing a good job, they deserve every penny they get and more. But I just hope that when people begin to whin a low paying job, no lunch, unwilling to put in more time, they should list the benefits associated with the low paying job.

No. I do not need a teacher's pension. If your calling to be a teacher refers to someone as a good teacher then I have to disagree. On the other hand, if it meant someone who is willing to take a teaching job, but may or may not be doing a decent job, then it may be true.

 

[fac]

Very interesting article. It does shed some light on the situation, however in my book it still makes Gallo look like the bad guy. Basically just firing everyone because she couldn't come to an agreement with the union official sounds like she just gave up, something she doesn't want the students to do.

I am not sure whether she has other options...In my experience in my earlier post about the administrators with my school district. I have tried not to escalate, and not to file any complaint with the hope of maintaining a good working relationship with the district. At the end of the third month, the superintendent still told me the same lie. I have to conclude that some people cannot be rationalized.

They are going into March, she will need the time to (re)hire the teachers and the existing teachers will have to look for other jobs. I don't know what the morale of the teachers will be.

 

[HsvTeacher]

Thanks. That's my point. A teacher is NOT ONLY getting the money he/she put in from his/her pay check, because if it does, most of the companies will do it. Then there is the medical coverage, right? The fact that it is "earned" because it is really part of the whole teaching package.
Again, I have no intention of bashing any teachers and I am not here to judge whether a teacher deserves the pay or benefits. In fact, if the teachers were doing a good job, they deserve every penny they get and more. But I just hope that when people begin to whin a low paying job, no lunch, unwilling to put in more time, they should list the benefits associated with the low paying job.

No. I do not need a teacher's pension. If your calling to be a teacher refers to someone as a good teacher then I have to disagree. On the other hand, if it meant someone who is willing to take a teaching job, but may or may not be doing a decent job, then it may be true.

My state's retirement system does not work like a 401K in that the state does not match my contributions. I put in a set amount of money each month, and in return for the state being allowed to use it until I retire, I earn a small amount of interest. This money comes out of my salary, thus lowering the amount of my take-home pay. Trust me, it will not be my sole means of retirement income.

I've come to realize that you have obviously had a bad experience with a teacher or teachers in the past, and nothing we can say here will convince you that most teachers are awesome, and we earn every single penny of our pay. The responses I have read from teachers are not a bunch of complaints and whining. We are our just trying to prove our point: We are not cold-hearted, worthless people. But then again, you should not have a problem with me, because I go above and beyond what is required to make sure that my students get what they need from me. I will rest easier tonight.

 

[TheDisneyGirl02]

I am not sure whether she has other options...In my experience in my earlier post about the administrators with my school district. I have tried not to escalate, and not to file any complaint with the hope of maintaining a good working relationship with the district. At the end of the third month, the superintendent still told me the same lie. I have to conclude that some people cannot be rationalized.

They are going into March, she will need the time to (re)hire the teachers and the existing teachers will have to look for other jobs. I don't know what the morale of the teachers will be.

I truly believe that there has to have been another option besides just up and firing so many people. As I have been told, there are always other choices to be made. Maybe Gallo thinks that by firing everyone and starting all over again everything will change - I highly doubt that.

 

[disneyandme]

It is so easy to see which posts are from people who have worked in education and which are not. This super is not taking into account all that these kids bring to school with them. If they are testing below level in math and reading, they came to HS that way. It is hard to teach subject matter when a child is only reading at a 3rd grade level. So, do you chose to teach the material to those who can read it or do you teach reading to those who can't read well enough. Should these kids been identified back in elementary school? Sure, but what are RI rules about that. Did you know that in some states you can not retain a child without parental permission? Even if a child can't reas or do any math. So, if you don't notify the parent and get their signiture by a set date (such as feb.1), then you can't retain no matter what. If the parent refuses- no recourse, if the parent is MIA- no recourse, if the parent is unable to come to school to sign the form ( a face to face meeting is mandatory) due to their job- no recourse. So these kids get passed along. I had kids come to me in 3rd grade who could not read at all and one who didn't know all her letter sounds.
The state came in and took over this school due to lower performance. The state observers were supposed to "find the problem and fix it" over an entire school year. After 3 months of observation, meeting with teachers and students, they concluded that it was not the teacher lack of effort, but the problems the kids brought from outside and the state guideliens tying the hands of the educators. They had to stay for the rest of the year and spent that time helping the teachers as sudo-aides.
Please don't jump to conclusions that it's the teachers. This plan is going to backfire- Even if they hire back the top 50% of the teachers, that leaves half the staff unfilled. Who is going to take this kind of job with a super like this and a board which acts like this? Maybe some new teachers fresh out of school with no experience. Yes, some will do great, but who will mentor the others.
It will be interesting to see how much money this super will save by firing top paid teachers and hiring new teachers who she has to pay far less.