Tipping suggestion on receipt

[LSUmiss]

So in the case of servers, it’s more appropriate that the responsibility for paying them falls on the customers?

Well the customers will always ultimately be who pays them since that’s how businesses pay for their employers. But, the post you’re referencing is in response to a pp about exploitive, shady contracts given to cruise ship workers. I’m not talking about working in a regular restaurant.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Wine is the same way.

Nah. Beer all you need is to grab the bottle opener and flip the cap. Or less, if the bartender pours it from the tap.

Wine, you've gotta find the corkscrew, open the wings, position the tip, ensure you have it positioned absolutely parallel to the neck, twist the corkscrew being careful to no go off course, flip the levers to pull the cork, make sure no cork fell into the bottle, get the glasses, get a tray...

 

[sam_gordon]

It seems like the 20-30% were isolated incidents & the consensus was that it was ridiculous. When was it below 15-18%? I’m 40 & in my lifetime, I can’t recall it being less than that. Everything goes up so I’d say holding steady for 40 years is pretty ok.

I'm not much older than you and I remember 10-15% being the standard. Some place was the first to go to 18% then 20%. I'm sure those were called "ridiculous" too. Now look where we are. It's really that hard for you to imagine some place going to 25%? 30%?

If meal costs would have stayed the same and the tipping percentage go up, that would have made sense. However, that's not what happened. Meal prices went up AND the percentage has gone up. THAT doesn't make sense. Since tipping is "supposed" to be a percentage of the food cost, when food costs go up, tips go up even if the actual percentage does not.

 

[disneychrista]

From what I’ve been told, servers in the US get taxed on the assumption that they make 15% in tips. Because of this, unless service is bad I will tip a minimum of 15% for OK service and 20% for good service. To ask for a 30% tip seems absolutely ridiculous to me.

In the U.K. servers are paid the same minimum wage as everyone else and there’s no expectation to tip and usually not even a suggested tip on receipts. Even if we do tip, 10% is generous here. Why are people so happy to tip so high in the US? I’m just curious as surely it would save the customer money if servers were paid a proper minimum wage and tipping wasn’t such a lucrative business.

It’ 8%. And if they keep records that show they made less than that is what they can report on their taxes. Sorry if you makes less than 8% (average) you need to find a different job.

 

[mjkacmom]

I'm not much older than you and I remember 10-15% being the standard. Some place was the first to go to 18% then 20%. I'm sure those were called "ridiculous" too. Now look where we are. It's really that hard for you to imagine some place going to 25%? 30%?

If meal costs would have stayed the same and the tipping percentage go up, that would have made sense. However, that's not what happened. Meal prices went up AND the percentage has gone up. THAT doesn't make sense. Since tipping is "supposed" to be a percentage of the food cost, when food costs go up, tips go up even if the actual percentage does not.

I’m over 50, 15% was always the minimum where I live, at least since my teen years when I started to go out to eat and pay the bill.

 

[RamblingMad]

It’s going up to offset the cost of living. Minimums have barely moved.

We seem to be going backwards on employee pay and benefits. I pay a whole lot more on healthcare today than when I started my career. It’s ridiculous.

 

[skyblue17]

Nearest $5 ? I know people that tip much better than that, especially one guy I work with. He probably rounds up to the nearest $10 or $20 lol. He would call YOU a cheapskate. His line in the sand is far past where yours is. Guess you better stay home until you can up your game. Where does he pick up his prize?

I feel like you're announcing this as if I'd disagree with it. If he has the expendable income to tip that high, and he has no issue with giving it to wait staff, you aren't going to hear me complain. However, it's not socially expected to tip $30 on a $20 bill, so this anecdote doesn't really tie in to the conversation being had here.

 

[Kestryl]

For anyone wondering, “Why is tipping going up?”

In 1996, the federal minimum wage was pushed to $5.15 for non-tipped employees and set at $2.13 for tipped employees.

As of 2019, the federal minimum wage is now $7.25- a 29% increase. The tipped wage is still set at $2.13- a 0% increase.

(Also, $1 in 1996 is equivalent to $1.64 today. So even though the regular minim wage was increased, it’s not even keeping up with inflation.)

 

[tzolkin]

For anyone wondering, “Why is tipping going up?”

In 1996, the federal minimum wage was pushed to $5.15 for non-tipped employees and set at $2.13 for tipped employees.

As of 2019, the federal minimum wage is now $7.25- a 29% increase. The tipped wage is still set at $2.13- a 0% increase.

(Also, $1 in 1996 is equivalent to $1.64 today. So even though the regular minim wage was increased, it’s not even keeping up with inflation.)

I think what the previous poster was asking was why the percentage needs to increase when the price of the food is already increasing. To make a fair comparison with the numbers you're giving, you would also need to include the increase in the cost of the food.

For example: If a meal at a restaurant used to cost $10 and now it costs $20 for the same meal, then the tip would still have doubled even if the percentage had remained the same. (@15% tip rate it was $1.50 and is now $3.00) So the percentage for the tip does not need to increase since the cost of the food is already rising with inflation.

 

[Searc]

I prefer frugal.

There is a vast different between cheap and frugal.

 

[Searc]

OK, but for those of us that have seen it creep up over time - why has it changed at all? There’s really no reason. The actual tip dollar amounts have gone up as the menu prices have gone up and the nature of the work hasn’t changed.

I guess you’ll just have to take our word for it that the tipping defaults on payment machines in lots of places are now 20/25/30%. How will you react when you do see them and all of a sudden your previously generous-seeming 18% now classifies you as a dead-beat?

I got my hair cut yesterday and my stylist uses a Square type apparatus on a cell phone for payment. The auto tips to choose from were 15%, 18%, 20%, 25% and Other (to put in your own tip amount).

 

[disneychrista]

I got my hair cut yesterday and my stylist uses a Square type apparatus on a cell phone for payment. The auto tips to choose from were 15%, 18%, 20%, 25% and Other (to put in your own tip amount).

At least it started at 15% and included other.

 

[serenitynow]

A quick informal and (worthless) survey amongst an informal group of 29 people I know, showed that the average tip for good service here seemed to be between 15% and 18% percent. A couple people admitted they only tip 20% for excellent service or because the math was easier. Which is mind boggling since every phone has a calculator app - but whatever.

A few people pointed out that the IRS assumes an 8% tip on servers taxes and that in our state server minimum wage was $8.00 an hour. I suspect that the industry pressure to increase tips by printing tip suggestions may work for the mathematically challenged or lazy, but most people tip less, percentage wise, than they claim.

But so long as the food and beverage industry relies on tips as opposed to fees, customers should feel free to tip whatever they feel is appropriate for the services received, regardless of any tip figures suggested on a receipt. As that is the definition of a gratuity paid for services rendered.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

There is a vast different between cheap and frugal.

Some people though don't make the distinction and call everyone cheap when the behavior more resembles being frugal with their money.

 

[Kestryl]

I think what the previous poster was asking was why the percentage needs to increase when the price of the food is already increasing. To make a fair comparison with the numbers you're giving, you would also need to include the increase in the cost of the food.

For example: If a meal at a restaurant used to cost $10 and now it costs $20 for the same meal, then the tip would still have doubled even if the percentage had remained the same. (@15% tip rate it was $1.50 and is now $3.00) So the percentage for the tip does not need to increase since the cost of the food is already rising with inflation.

You’re right, of course. But I think what’s happening with tipping is that many people see that a minimum wage is absolute crap to live off of, and so it goes up. (“Minimum wage for minimum skill!” others cry. Again, even if you believe that argument, it’s still not keeping up with inflation, so it’s worth less now than then.)

I said this earlier (I think), but I would prefer to deal away with the whole tipping structure and just have wages rolled into my meals. The way it’s set up now, it’s just a system of those who tip less taking advantage of those who tip more to make up for them, and meanwhile minorities get caught being undervalued. Example: a Cornell study found that at one restaurant in the south, white servers were tipped more than black servers. A follow-up study in the Midwest showed the same thing. White servers as a whole are tipped more than minority servers. Part of this could be where they work and their access to higher-end which is a whole host of other problems. And then there are servers’ attitudes to customers. A Wayne State survey suggests that a number of servers have discriminated against black customers or have seen co-workers profile customers because they didn’t think they’d get tipped as well. Three Missouri Applebee’s employees were fired over racial profiling, and eventually the restaurant closed. We may want to think that the days of racism and sexism are behind us, but they’re not, and the world of tipping is affected by it.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I suspect that the industry pressure to increase tips by printing tip suggestions may work for the mathematically challenged or lazy, but most people tip less, percentage wise, than they claim.

On the machine that calculate tip post-tax I adjust down a few percentage because I tip off pre-tax not post tax and I'm not going to tip off the suggested, which like I said I don't pay attention to really, because more often than not it's being calculated off of post-tax. It may look like I'm undertipping..but nope I'm just tipping off of pre-tax.

Not that I really care too much but I sure do hope the servers do that kind of math too and don't just assume I'm cheap or stiffing them Of course I'm sure there are folks who think tipping pre-tax makes me cheap or that I'm stiffing but meh.

 

[sam_gordon]

I would prefer to deal away with the whole tipping structure and just have wages rolled into my meals.

I think the only people who disagree with this are the same ones complaining that wait staff get "stiffed" so much.

 

[lifesavacation]

On the machine that calculate tip post-tax I adjust down a few percentage because I tip off pre-tax not post tax and I'm not going to tip off the suggested, which like I said I don't pay attention to really, because more often than not it's being calculated off of post-tax. It may look like I'm undertipping..but nope I'm just tipping off of pre-tax.

Not that I really care too much but I sure do hope the servers do that kind of math too and don't just assume I'm cheap or stiffing them Of course I'm sure there are folks who think tipping pre-tax makes me cheap or that I'm stiffing but meh.

I didn’t even think about the tax. We’re about 8.5% in our area. And I think it’s entirely reasonable to tip pretax.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

You’re right, of course. But I think what’s happening with tipping is that many people see that a minimum wage is absolute crap to live off of, and so it goes up. (“Minimum wage for minimum skill!” others cry. Again, even if you believe that argument, it’s still not keeping up with inflation, so it’s worth less now than then.)

I said this earlier (I think), but I would prefer to deal away with the whole tipping structure and just have wages rolled into my meals. The way it’s set up now, it’s just a system of those who tip less taking advantage of those who tip more to make up for them, and meanwhile minorities get caught being undervalued. Example: a Cornell study found that at one restaurant in the south, white servers were tipped more than black servers. A follow-up study in the Midwest showed the same thing. White servers as a whole are tipped more than minority servers. Part of this could be where they work and their access to higher-end which is a whole host of other problems. And then there are servers’ attitudes to customers. A Wayne State survey suggests that a number of servers have discriminated against black customers or have seen co-workers profile customers because they didn’t think they’d get tipped as well. Three Missouri Applebee’s employees were fired over racial profiling, and eventually the restaurant closed. We may want to think that the days of racism and sexism are behind us, but they’re not, and the world of tipping is affected by it.

On the flipside there's been studies that reflected that black people on average didn't tip as well as white people--part self-fulfilling prophecy that they assumed they would get subpar service, part behaviors, part lack of education in tipping cultures, part issues with stereotypes against blacks (which can affect the level of attentiveness servers give) and other things.

But in all honesty as far as tipping percentage suggestions go I'm not sure that race has influenced that. But perhaps we need a study to look over that (maybe there already is one--that would be interesting to read).

As far as your Applebee's description--it was never confirmed that the franchise location closed as a direct result to the racial profiling incident and what followed it. The mall, where the Applebee's in question was located at, was already set up for forclosure due to default on loans. It does now have a new property owner so it's still around.

 

[Kestryl]

On the flipside there's been studies that reflected that black people on average didn't tip as well as white people--part self-fulfilling prophecy that they assumed they would get subpar service, part behaviors, part lack of education in tipping cultures, part issues with stereotypes against blacks (which can affect the level of attentiveness servers give) and other things.

But in all honesty as far as tipping percentage suggestions go I'm not sure that race has influenced that. But perhaps we need a study to look over that (maybe there already is one--that would be interesting to read).

As far as your Applebee's description--it was never confirmed that the franchise location closed as a direct result to the racial profiling incident and what followed it. The mall, where the Applebee's in question was located at, was already set up for forclosure due to default on loans. It does now have a new property owner so it's still around.

Yes, you’re right that on average black people tip less than white people, and it is just fueling the cycle. It shouldn’t be an excuse to provide subpar service, but apparently it is. Again, if wages could just be standardized and done away with, there wouldn’t be any more comments about how such-and-such group tips less. (I’ve heard multiple times that the church-going crowd is more likely to skip or under tip. A classmate of mine was left one of those fake bills telling her to seek religion. Heck, I was given one during a charity event for Make a Wish.)

There are lots of small studies on tipping and race and psychology/sociology- Michael Lynn from Cornell has quite a few, as well as Zachary Brewster from Wayne State. It’s hard because they can’t survey everyone ever, so the sample sizes seem small. And it’s hard to normalize for different variables (location, whether service was actually good, who was actually involved at any given time). But they do indicate a few problems with discrimination (both against servers and customers).

Thanks for the follow-up on Applebee’s. I had just read that it was closed- guess I shouldn’t make assumptions!